30min: 60min vcd, 70min dvd but 135min in svcd

[Will Hay]

How come, when I encode using TMPGEnc to svcd a 30 min clip takes nearly three hours yet encoding in dvd or vcd takes around the hour mark?
I would have thought the dvd encoding would take the longest amount of time.
Will
--
CladDVDXP, DVD2Avi, TMPGEnc
WinXP Pro
Elite K7S5A
ATI 64mb DDR Radeon ViVo
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30gb IBM GXP Deskstar
2 x 80gb Maxtor D740X on RAID 0
SB Live 1024!

[hwoodwar]

It's got to be something different in your settings for SVCD, possibly on SVCD template motion search precision set to high or highest quality.

You could test this by:

1. Use the project wizard and load one of your 30 minute files to the "DVD" template
2. On the Filter setting page click other settings
3. On the Video tab change the resolution to 480 x 480
4. On the Video tab change the setting on rate mode control to a 2520 bitrate or average bitrate
5. Go through the rest of the prompts with the defaults and run TMPGenc on the file.

If that in turn takes about 60 minutes to encode then there is definitely some different settings in your SVCD template that is slowing it down.

Another thing just occurred to me. Could the files you select for use as SVCD be, being resized to SVCD resolution, while the files you select for DVD or vcd, already be at the proper resolution?

[Will Hay]

Another thing just occurred to me. Could the files you select for use as SVCD be, being resized to SVCD resolution, while the files you select for DVD or vcd, already be at the proper resolution?

Yep, that sounds like it.
I captured at 352 x 288 using the picvideo codec, and note from TMPGEnc that the vcd template is 352x288 and the dvd template are 352 x 288 (low quality) and 352 x 576 (highest quality), yet the svcd template is 480 x X.
Think that's it, yes?
Does that mean, if I want to output to scvd, I should capture at 480x576, rather than 352x288, and similary is I want to capture to high quality dvd capture at 352 x 576?
Thanks,
Will

[Will Hay]

I just did a little test using the dvd templates, with a 65min 352 x 288 capture.
The low res dvd template (352 x 288) was gonna' take 95mins and the highest dvd setting would be 210mins.
That must be the answer.
So, should I capture at a screen size depending on how I want to encode it?
Thanks,
Will

[Gazorgan]

If your ultimate output is SVCD, then capture in 480x480. This means your encoder isn't going to have to crop( if it's bigger than 480) or interpolate and create (if it's smaller than 480) you video. If you going to letterbox it, then capture in the ultimate 480x??? resolution the video will be not counting the black bars.

I personally capture in 480x360 (maintains the 4:3 aspect ratio) then put 60 worth of black bars on the top and bottom for SVCD and voila'. 480x480 capture works better, but my ultimate destination is usually XviD, not SVCD.

[hwoodwar]

First off on my original post I did not realize you were on the PAL TV standard. 480 x 480 is standard NTSC SVCD resolution. 480 x 576 is standard PAL SVCD resolution. Therefore if you were following my steps, in step 3 you should have made the resolution 480 X 576. Considering the above mentioned mistake I made, if you are still sure you are resizing to SVCD resolution then here is my take on capturing resolution.

You should always capture at, at least the resolution of the standard you want to encode to. I think almost everybody agrees with "at least."

I have seen two additional opinions that seem to have widespread support.

1. For VCD only you should capture at 352 x 576 for PAL (352 x 480 NTSC) and then let your encoding program resize. This has something to do with catching "both fields." You can probably find something about this concept by using the search function in these forums, or the guides.

2. Capture everything at a higher, but standard resolution and resize. Again, You can probably find something about this concept by using the search function in these forums. As you have seen the resize adds additional encoding time.

Also, if you are capturing at a resolution less than the standard, you are loosing resolution and clarity because when you upsize (maybe not the right word) you do not gain any resolution.

I create more CVDs than any other standard. Since CVD resolution is 352 x 480 (NTSC) that is the resolution I usually capture to. If after I have captured to avi I realize the quality of the avi, "is not that good" than I encode to VCD format to save space on a CD. This falls in line with item (1.) above. If the captured avi is good quality I then encode to the same resolution, which is the CVD standard.

[Will Hay]

For VCD only you should capture at 352 x 576 for PAL (352 x 480 NTSC) and then let your encoding program resize.

Even if the vcd template I use for encoding *is* 352 x 288?
I've done all my vcd's at 352 x 288 *lol*
Will

[vitualis]

Yes, Silky... If you do more reading and less laughing, you'll find out why it is highly recommended that you capture at the full vertical resolution.

Regards.

[Will Hay]

Yes, Silky... If you do more reading and less laughing, you'll find out why it is highly recommended that you capture at the full vertical resolution.

Point taken, although I make no apologies for my nature, laughing isn't a crime on my planet
I tried a couple of test files last night (FreeVCR, PicVideo Mpeg Lossless Codec), and what with expecting a dvd-r drive Monday I tried a capture at 352 x 576, exactly 600 seconds to..
a) determine the file size and...
b) have a look at the quality.
Whilst I didn't run the file through TMPGEnc I was suprised at the output. Having never done this before I noticed the black bars top and bottom of the image were at least the size of the image in the middle and, probably due to my Duron 800 (which will be evolving into an Athlon 2000XP Monday) the image wasn't that good.
Having read the forums I'm guessing the image will correct itself when I either watch the image using dvd software or output to dvd-r and watch on my standalone dvd player.
Will

[vitualis]

If you've got black bars when you're encoding with TMPGEnc (and you captured full frame material), it means that your aspect ratio settings are wrong...

No cropping should be needed.

Regards.

[Will Hay]

If you've got black bars when you're encoding with TMPGEnc (and you captured full frame material), it means that your aspect ratio settings are wrong...

No cropping should be needed.

My post may not have been very clear but the black bars appear after capture (using FreeVCR), I hadn't run the file through TMPGEnc yet, I'll try that tonight.
Thanks,
Will

[vitualis]

Are there black bars on the original material?

Full frame material captured at 352x240 should appear as full frame.

Similarly, full frame material captured at 480x480 (or indeed, ANY framesize) should appear full frame as well...

Regards.

[Will Hay]

Are there black bars on the original material?

No, I captured directly from full screen digital tv.
I'm going to do some testing this weekend and will report back, if you could oblige
Many thanks,
Will