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  1. Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Arizona, USA
    Search Comp PM
    I'm in the middle of converting old cartoons to VCD. I did a search out there and kinda tried everything (including some stuff that took 20 hours to encode) Anyway, I am smart deinterlacing and denoising in Vdub, also denoising in (frameserve)TMPGEnc and soften blocks at 35. I capped at 352x480 and am letting TMPG do the resize.
    TMPG settings are as follows:

    object TMPEGConfigFile
    MPEG.Text = ''
    MPEG.WizardCategoryName = ''
    MPEG.WizardSubFormatName = ''
    MPEG.WizardCaption = ''
    MPEG.WizardDescription = ''
    MPEG.OutputStreamType = MPEG_OutputStreamType_System_VideoAudio
    MPEG.OutputStreamType_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.StreamType = MPEGVideoEncoder_StreamType_MPEG1
    MPEG.Video.StreamType_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.Width = 352
    MPEG.Video.Width_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.Height = 240
    MPEG.Video.Height_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.YUVFormat = 1
    MPEG.Video.YUVFormat_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.DC_prec = 2
    MPEG.Video.DC_prec_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.VideoEncodeMode = MPEGVideoEncoder_VideoEncodeMode_Interlace
    MPEG.Video.VideoEncodeMode_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.FrameRate = 4
    MPEG.Video.FrameRate_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.AspectRatio = 12
    MPEG.Video.AspectRatio_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.RateControlMode = MPEGVideoEncoder_RateControlMode_VBR_Auto
    MPEG.Video.RateControlMode_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.MaxBitRate = 0
    MPEG.Video.MaxBitRate_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.MinBitRate = 0
    MPEG.Video.MinBitRate_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.CBR_BitRate = 1150000
    MPEG.Video.VBR_MultipassVBRAlgorithm = MPEGVideoEncoder_MultipassVBRAlgorithm_2PASS
    MPEG.Video.VBR_AvgBitRate = 1150000
    MPEG.Video.VBR_MaxBitRate = 1150000
    MPEG.Video.VBR_MinBitRate = 0
    MPEG.Video.VBR_MaxPassCount = 0
    MPEG.Video.VBR_Quality_P = 0
    MPEG.Video.VBR_Quality_B = 20
    MPEG.Video.VBR_EnablePadding = True
    MPEG.Video.MVBR_MaxBitRate = 1150000
    MPEG.Video.MVBR_MinBitRate = 0
    MPEG.Video.MVBR_Quality_P = 0
    MPEG.Video.MVBR_Quality_B = 20
    MPEG.Video.MVBR_EnablePadding = False
    MPEG.Video.AVBR_Quality = 90
    MPEG.Video.AVBR_MaxBitRate = 1300000
    MPEG.Video.AVBR_MinBitRate = 0
    MPEG.Video.AVBR_EnablePadding = True
    MPEG.Video.CQ_Quality = 75
    MPEG.Video.CQ_Quality_P = 0
    MPEG.Video.CQ_Quality_B = 20
    MPEG.Video.CQ_MaxBitRate = 1150000
    MPEG.Video.CQ_MinBitRate = 0
    MPEG.Video.CQ_EnablePadding = False
    MPEG.Video.VBVBufferSize = 0
    MPEG.Video.VBVBufferSize_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_SeqHeaderInterval = 1
    MPEG.Video.GOP_SeqHeaderInterval_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_I_FrameCount = 1
    MPEG.Video.GOP_I_FrameCount_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_P_FrameCount = 20
    MPEG.Video.GOP_P_FrameCount_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_B_FrameCount = 3
    MPEG.Video.GOP_B_FrameCount_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_BitStreamForEdit = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_BitStreamForEdit_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.GOP_MaxFrameCount = 0
    MPEG.Video.GOP_MaxFrameCount_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeMatrix_Intra_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeMatrix_NonIntra_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.Profile = 4
    MPEG.Video.Profile_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.Level = 8
    MPEG.Video.Level_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.VideoFormat = 2
    MPEG.Video.VideoFormat_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Video.DisplayWidth = 0
    MPEG.Video.DisplayWidth_ReadOnly = True
    MPEG.Video.DisplayHeight = 0
    MPEG.Video.DisplayHeight_ReadOnly = True
    MPEG.Video.MotionSearchSpeed = MPEGVideoEncoder_MotionSearchSpeed_Slow
    MPEG.Video.MotionSearch_AlwaysHalfPel = True
    MPEG.Video.UseFloatDCT = True
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeMode = True
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeModeVal_Intra = 35
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeModeVal_NonIntra = 35
    MPEG.Video.YUVBasicYCbCr = False
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeMatrix_Intra = {
    08202020202020202020202020202020202020202020202020 20202020202020
    20202020202020202020202020202020202020202020202020 20202020202020}
    MPEG.Video.QuantizeMatrix_NonIntra = {
    10101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010 10101010101010
    10101010101010101010101010101010101010101010101010 10101010101010}
    MPEG.Audio.StreamType = MPEGAudioEncoder_StreamType_MPEG1_Layer2
    MPEG.Audio.StreamType_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.SamplingFrequency = 44100
    MPEG.Audio.SamplingFrequency_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.ChannelMode = 0
    MPEG.Audio.ChannelMode_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.CantUseMono = False
    MPEG.Audio.BitRate = 128000
    MPEG.Audio.BitRate_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.CalcCRC = True
    MPEG.Audio.CalcCRC_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.OriginalFlag = True
    MPEG.Audio.OriginalFlag_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.CopyrightFlag = True
    MPEG.Audio.CopyrightFlag_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.PrivateFlag = True
    MPEG.Audio.PrivateFlag_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.Audio.EmphasisType = 0
    MPEG.Audio.EmphasisType_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.System.StreamType = MPEGSystemEncoder_StreamType_MPEG1_VideoCD_Illegal
    MPEG.System.StreamType_ReadOnly = False
    MPEG.System.CommentText = ''
    MPEG.System.EnableCommentText = False
    end

    I'm arranging the video centered 328x216. So the filesize isn't so big.

    The blocks are horrible. Hardly any smoothness. Cartoons seem to be alittle trickier than "regular" encodings.

    Suggestions?
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  2. Member
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    PokeMP3
    Search PM
    what i usually do is loading in TMPG, let it filter; and code.

    i think you're pushing the file size to much; at that rate in MPEG1 it should be 1mbps; just like the vcd standard 352x240 (288 if you have 25fps)

    if this is too much; i suggest going avi and take the divx codec or something.

    good luck
    |\ _,,,---,,_
    /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_
    |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-'
    '---''(_/--' `-'\_) NdZ
    (use FixedSys)
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  3. Member DVO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Sweden
    Search Comp PM
    There are some codecs designed for cartoons for AVI and Quick time making use of the smilar colors. Don't have the names in hand...
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  4. hmm... dont know of the avi and quicktime codecs that DVO was talking about, but I'm interested.

    While it may fall short in other areas, RealVideo 8 is great for cartoon/anime encodes. If you aren't specifically aiming for VCD then I suggest using it. A bitrate of 500 will be pretty decent quality and at 1000 it will look perfect.

    Personally I use RealVideo for 320x240 material and DivX5 for 640x480 encodes.
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  5. This is from the guide named "How to capture using a Dazzle Capture Card" under the HOW TO CAPTURE section of this website:

    http://www.vcdhelp.com/dazzlecapture.htm

    ...and it reads....
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    TMPCENC AND ANIMATED FEATURES

    This is pretty interesting, for this section take everything i have mentioned above and throw it out of the window!!! For some odd reason on more bland drawn cartoons with not many details(ex GI.JOE, The Simpsons,
    the older Transformers cartoons, etc) if you come close to blasting each of the noise filters, it actually made the picture look 100 times better then what i ran in!!! I could not believe it. I would set the STILL and TIME settings anywhere from 80-100, and the range 3-4. Macro blocknoise close to 100(but its still ok to leave this at 35, as i found out later the close to 100 setting isnt needed for it). My clips became very vibrant and rich in color, some minor detail was lost, but it made the picture look as if i just taped it from a high source and not taken from 14-16 year old Beta/ex rental tape--to put it simply, it looked better then the original!!! Again blasting the filters like this only seems to benefit older cartoons.
    ANIMATED features with a lot of detail (ex Akira, ghost in the shell, heavy metal,etc) i would follow the settings i mentioned above that i use for movies, as blasting the filters with these types of animated cartoons will cause it to look like havoc.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    There was an article I read once explaining why there is more blockiness when encoding cartoons......I wish I could find that article again.

    Also.....increasing the bitrate doesn't help the blockiness too much. I tried making an SVCD out of the "How the Grinch stole Christmas" cartoon using a high bitrate, and the final output was still somewhat blocky. It was less blocky than a VCD, but still blocky. This is one of those issues where you really have to understand how MPEG compression works to be able to get a nice quality output file.......WAIT !!

    WAIT!....HOLD THE PRESSES!....I just found something....
    In TMPGEnc, click on the SETTINGS button, click on the QUANTIZE MATRIX TAB, under the 2 matrices there is a pulldown box. Change that pulldown box from DEFAULT to CG/ANIMATION. That might do it!

    Let me know if that improves the quality.

    P.S. - thegig: What cartoons are you encoding? I'm just curious, because i'm collecting a lot of old cartoons. I'm not encoding them, just
    downloading and burning.
    ~Urbs~
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  6. Member
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Maryland, USA
    Search Comp PM
    thegig,

    I might be able to help you out. But first, is your video noisy? Do you want to watch these on your DVD player?

    An xVCD @ 352x240 2300kbit/s might be your answer for a really noisy source where blockiness is rampant. This is how I encode my noisy videos and works quite nicely.
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  7. Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Arizona, USA
    Search Comp PM
    The types of cartoons I am encoding are pretty new (All Disney cartoons, and some straglers like Fern Gully and the such all VHS). The wife mistakenly got rid of some of the old cartoons from the seventies/eighties that I had about 6-7 years ago while clearing out my attic(oops) Like Superfriends and Scooby do etc. The video has some noise, but the biggest problem are the blocks. Doesn't matter if its a high motion scene or low motion, the characters have blocks all around them. I did use the CG animation, but it really didn't help. I'll try the suggestion Urbs had and see what happens.

    Might be a couple days, my sound card took a dump.
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  8. Member
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Maryland, USA
    Search Comp PM
    If you are shooting for VCD, then you will never get rid of the blocks completely. Ok, here is what I would do. Try encoding using this template I made. It will produce a 352x240 xVCD @ 2300kbits/s w/128K audio. You shouldn't need more than 128K of audio if your source is VHS. I think you will find blocks to be at a minimum.
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