9gb .ts > 4gb .mkv

[NotSoEasy]

Would like to convert a 9GB .TS file (1080i) to a smaller 4GB .MKV (1080) keeping AC3
Pretty much just need to shrink this file down. Have a couple others that are around the 15GB mark that I would like to shrink down to 4GB as well.
Tried Handbrake but not getting the results I like but maybe just not using right settings ?
Maybe need to get away from one-click software ?

Format : MPEG-TS
File size : 9.00 GiB
Duration : 1h 32mn
Overall bit rate : 13.9 Mbps

Video
ID : 64 (0x40)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@High
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Custom
Codec ID : 2
Duration : 1h 32mn
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 12.8 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 38.8 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Standard : Component
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.206
Stream size : 8.30 GiB (92%)

Audio
ID : 65 (0x41)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension : CM (complete main)
Codec ID : 129
Duration : 1h 32mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 384 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : -730ms
Stream size : 255 MiB (3%)
Language : English

[jman98]

What do you mean that you're not getting the results you like? Is the file small enough but poor quality? Is the file bigger than you want but the quality is fine? Is it a combination of both?

Basically size = bit rate * length
so you can get the size you want by using the correct bit rate. MeGUI can encode to specific bit rates, but it's not as user friendly. You really need to be good with AviSynth to use it as my personal experience is that MeGUI can't correctly generate the AviSynth script it needs and you'll have to know enough to fix it by hand. Since you haven't explained exactly what you don't like with Handbrake it's hard to know if Handbrake could do the job for you or not.

[NotSoEasy]

Sorry. Should have explained better about Handbrake.
The size goes over a tad which is OK to a point but I would like to get as close to 4GB as possible.
While that was OK, I did notice that extra 8 pixel line at the bottom of my encode. I notice Handbrake says 1920x1088 as source.
Another is the framerate option. I kept it same as source (29.970) but wondering if I should knock it down to 23 ?

I'm using HIGH PROFILE
Also. Should I be using decomb or deinterlace ?

[edDV]

Sorry. Should have explained better about Handbrake.
The size goes over a tad which is OK to a point but I would like to get as close to 4GB as possible.

The Video tab in Handbrake allows setting a target file size, an average bit rate or Constant Quality modes.

While that was OK, I did notice that extra 8 pixel line at the bottom of my encode. I notice Handbrake says 1920x1088 as source.

The Picture tab has a cropping tool. Take 8 lines off the bottom.

Another is the framerate option. I kept it same as source (29.970) but wondering if I should knock it down to 23 ?

This depends whether the source is telecine or interlace.

If telecine use the Detelecine video filter. The result will be 23.976 fps.

If interlace, use the Deinterlace filter. The result will be 29.97 fps.

[NotSoEasy]

I had another go at it and my settings were as follows:
SIZE was set to 3999 and my result was 3.99GB
For picture size I set to custom and MOD of 2
I then unchecked "keep aspect ratio" and set them all to 1920
Then custom on cropping and removed 8 pixel from bottom.

My result is pretty good I guess. Did NOT mess with any telecine or decomb or deinterlace. Perhaps I should have at least done deinterlace ? Although it looks like my framerate changed anyway ... ?

Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 2
File size : 3.99 GiB
Duration : 1h 32mn
Overall bit rate : 6 163 Kbps
Writing application : HandBrake 0.9.5
Writing library : libmkv 0.6.4.1

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 32mn
Bit rate : 5 775 Kbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.116
Stream size : 3.67 GiB (92%)
Writing library : x264 core 112
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=hex / subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.00 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=2 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=23 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=50 / rc=2pass / mbtree=1 / bitrate=5775 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=3 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Language : English
Color primaries : BT.709-5, BT.1361, IEC 61966-2-4, SMPTE RP177
Transfer characteristics : BT.709-5, BT.1361
Matrix coefficients : BT.709-5, BT.1361, IEC 61966-2-4 709, SMPTE RP177

Audio
ID : 2
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension : CM (complete main)
Codec ID : A_AC3
Duration : 1h 32mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 384 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 255 MiB (6%)
Language : English

[edDV]

The source 29.97 fps file specs above could be telecine or interlace. You need to step through to find the telecine sequence*. Otherwise, use the deinterlace filter.


* Three progressive frames followed by two mixed frames (fields from different frames).

[NotSoEasy]

How would I go about finding this out ?

[edDV]

How would I go about finding this out ?

Step through the video frame by frame.

VLC using frame advance tool...

This one

[NotSoEasy]

The source 29.97 fps file specs above could be telecine or interlace. You need to step through to find the telecine sequence*. Otherwise, use the deinterlace filter.


* Three progressive frames followed by two mixed frames (fields from different frames).

OK I think I have found this. Not happening ALL the time but did go frame by frame and saw it happen in that sequence the few times I did it. Should it happen throughout (3-2 , 3-2 , 3-2 ...) or every so often ? I was seeing it happen in sequence then could not for about 20 or so frames.

OK. I just found the MPEG2Repair file for it and it reads ...

Info: End of MPEG2 sequence:
Info: 1920 x 1080, 29.97 fps (with telecine flags), 38.81 Mbps (Header), 13.16 Mbps (Average).
Info: AC3 Audio. 3/2 Channels (L, C, R, SL, SR) + LFE, 48.0 kHz, 384 kbps.
Info: Found 136162 video frames since start of sequence.
Info: 0 video frames found with errors.
Info: 0 audio frames found with errors.
Info: 0 corrupted video bytes in file.
Info: 0.000000 seconds of video timestamp gaps.
Info: 0.000000 seconds of audio timestamp gaps.

So I guess it is telecine

[edDV]

Always except for commercial breaks. Depends on source content.

[NotSoEasy]

Well this was a cap from INHD so no commercials.
I'm going to try another encode and select detelecine and see how it looks.

I play this through my WDTV and I think it transcodes (right word?) interlaced video ?

[edDV]

Well this was a cap from INHD so no commercials.
I'm going to try another encode and select detelecine and see how it looks.

I play this through my WDTV and I think it transcodes (right word?) interlaced video ?

If the video is hard telecine (typical for TV movies or dramas) then the "Detelecine" filter will remove the repeat fields leaving 23.976 fps progressive video in the h.264 file.

Sports, talk shows, reality/variety shows and news are typically 29.97* fps interlace.



* 720p will be 59.94 progressive for all content.

[NotSoEasy]

Well it looks like my result was just that, 23.976 fps and will "assume" progressive ?
Again. Did not filter in any way. Fact I left fps default (source) even though it allowed me to change to whatever I wanted.
I think my result is good enough. I'll have to watch later tonight on my 60" through my WDTV Live+

I do thank you for all the help and info

[edDV]

Here is how ATSC / NTSC 480p/720p film source is broadcast* and decoded.




* Direct broadcast of 23.976 fps film source is allowed under ATSC but is not currently being done.

[edDV]

Well it looks like my result was just that, 23.976 fps and will "assume" progressive ?
Again. Did not filter in any way.

No, your source was 29.97 fps with hard telecine. The x264 encoder used in Handbrake cannot handle interlace video. Unfiltered it will simply weave telecine fields to make 29.97p frames. The result will be three clear frames followed by two mixed frames with even/odd lines from different source frames.

Example for fixed camera


Example for panning camera. Note the double vision.



If you use the Detelecine filter, you get 4 clear frames at 23.976 fps.

[edDV]

Well this was a cap from INHD so no commercials.
I'm going to try another encode and select detelecine and see how it looks.

I play this through my WDTV and I think it transcodes (right word?) interlaced video ?

If your source is hard telecine and you don't filter, the x264 encoder will output 29.97p with mixed frames. These will be detected as 29.97p by the WDTV.

If instead you use the Detelecine filter, the x264 encoder will output clear 23.976p frames. These will be processed as film by the WDTV depending on your output setting. For example of you set the WDTV to ouput 1080p @ 59.94, the WDTV will add repeat frames 3:2 to make 59.94 fps. If you set the WDTV to output 1080i @ 29.97 fps, the WDTV will re-telecine for 29.97 fps.

[NotSoEasy]

OK so I'm a little confused here. You say without filtering, my result should be 29.97p but mediainfo reports
Frame rate : 23.976 fps Scan type : Progressive

[edDV]

OK so I'm a little confused here. You say without filtering, my result should be 29.97p but mediainfo reports
Frame rate : 23.976 fps Scan type : Progressive

Not entirely clear to me that the file info in post #1 is the same as post #9 that is they refer to the same source file.

How did you capture this file?

Mediainfo is not reliable identifying hard telecine vs. normal interlace video. I'm not sure if MPEG2Repair can be trusted either. There are three ways to interpret the mediainfo data.

1. Hard telecine 1080i (most likely from INHD). Solution would be the Detelecine filter. Result would be 1080p @23.976 fps.

2. Interlace 1080i. Solution would be Deinterlace filter. Result would be 1080p @29.97 fps.

3. Soft telecine 1080p @23.976 with pulldown flags (common for DVD but not common for TV captures). This type of file is already progressive and 23.976 fps so needs no filtering.

The only way to be sure is to step frame through the source file in action scenes using VLC or an editor. If you see field split on every frame, the source is interlace. If you see the 3 progressive then two mixed fields, then the source is hard telecine. If you see no field split, the source is progressive.

Exceptions are many. TV shows can be a mix of interlace, telecine and progressive. Converted PAL source (e.g. BBC or China/India) follow a different set of rules.

720p/480p source is handled differently as well but that is a separate issue.

[NotSoEasy]

Thanks for that explanation. That helps ... a little Video can be confusing sometimes.

Post #1 is the SOURCE info as per Mediainfo
Post #9 is also the SOURCE info as per MPEG2Repair

Post #5 is the resulting MKV file after conversion through Handbrake as per Mediainfo

I'm going to do another encode and option Detelecine filter

[edDV]

This is why we normally ask for a motion sample of the source file.

Instead I'm trying to teach you to fish.

[NotSoEasy]

Motion sample, as in pictures like you posted or a chunk of the source file ?

[edDV]

chunk of the source file (with motion).

[NotSoEasy]

How would I go about doing that ?

[edDV]

With an editor. Here is a simple one to edit transport streams at the GOP level.
HDTVtoMPeg2

Cut out a short action clip (30MB max) and post here. Save as *.TS

You didn't mention your capture method.



I used the VLC frame by frame advance button to step through the clip. For hard telecine you will see three progressive frames followed by two mixed frames such as this one.



Cropped

[edDV]

Here is what Mediainfo reported for this hard telecine clip. This is very similar to your post #1.

General
ID : 1 (0x1)
Complete name : Z:\0\120303115616.m2t
Format : MPEG-TS
File size : 128 MiB
Duration : 1mn 15s
Overall bit rate : 14.2 Mbps

Video
ID : 2048 (0x800)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@High
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Default
Codec ID : 2
Duration : 1mn 14s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 13.1 Mbps
Nominal bit rate : 20.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.210
Stream size : 117 MiB (91%)

Audio
ID : 2049 (0x801)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension : CM (complete main)
Codec ID : 129
Duration : 1mn 15s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 384 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : -254ms
Stream size : 3.46 MiB (3%)
Language : English

Text #1
ID : 2048 (0x800)608-1
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : EIA-608
Muxing mode : A/53 / DTVCC Transport
Muxing mode, more info : Muxed in Video #1
Duration : 1mn 14s
Stream size : 0.00 Byte (0%)

Text #2
ID : 2048 (0x800)1
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : EIA-708
Muxing mode : A/53 / DTVCC Transport
Muxing mode, more info : Muxed in Video #1
Duration : 1mn 14s
Stream size : 0.00 Byte (0%)

[edDV]

After using the Detelecine filter in Handbrake, Mediainfo reports a 23.976 frame rate for AVC encode.
I used the Constant Quality RF:21 setting.

General
Complete name : S:\120303115616.mp4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42
File size : 67.9 MiB
Duration : 1mn 16s
Overall bit rate : 7 448 Kbps
Encoded date : UTC 2012-03-03 21:08:28
Tagged date : UTC 2012-03-03 21:11:47
Writing application : HandBrake 0.9.5 2011010300

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Main@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 1mn 16s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 7 191 Kbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Minimum frame rate : 1.051 fps
Maximum frame rate : 29.970 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.145
Stream size : 65.6 MiB (97%)
Writing library : x264 core 112
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=2 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x1:0x111 / me=hex / subme=6 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.00 / mixed_ref=0 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=0 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=2 / b_pyramid=2 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / weightb=0 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=29 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=40 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=21.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=3 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Encoded date : UTC 2012-03-03 21:08:28
Tagged date : UTC 2012-03-03 21:11:47
Color primaries : BT.709-5, BT.1361, IEC 61966-2-4, SMPTE RP177
Transfer characteristics : BT.709-5, BT.1361
Matrix coefficients : BT.709-5, BT.1361, IEC 61966-2-4 709, SMPTE RP177

[NotSoEasy]

Sorry haven't replied in a few days. Dealing with a major issue with a crashed HDD that stores pictures I can never get back.
It seems though that I have got it down and detelecine filter and decomb filter have created a nice output file.
I set them both to "default" as custom, I had no idea what to put. I assume a # ?

To answer your question of how I captured the stream in the first place. I did not capture it. I "found" it online.
Just an old 80's movie that has yet to even get a DVD release ....

[edDV]

Sorry haven't replied in a few days. Dealing with a major issue with a crashed HDD that stores pictures I can never get back.
It seems though that I have got it down and detelecine filter and decomb filter have created a nice output file.
I set them both to "default" as custom, I had no idea what to put. I assume a # ?

To answer your question of how I captured the stream in the first place. I did not capture it. I "found" it online.
Just an old 80's movie that has yet to even get a DVD release ....

Use detelecine or decomb but not both. If you know you have the telecine sequence to 23.976, use detelecine. If you care less about quality or deinterlace, but want a less quality result try decomb.

[NotSoEasy]

Thanks for all your help. I really appreciate it.

Now on to trying to recover my pictures ...