Rendering should yeild smaller, not larger files right?

[InFlames814]

So I'm trying to put a tv show I downloaded onto dvd. In order to fit all the episodes I went to render them to mpeg2 file with Vegas but the resulting file was 10GB. I asked someone on youtube that posted a tut vid if rendering would reduce the size and he said yes, but there are only 26 episodes of the show and all of them are a total of about 4.5GB.

I was trying to split it up to 13 episodes per disc but when I joined the episodes all I added were markers to later make Play All and Episode Select options in Architect. If half of the episodes should only be around 2 GB and rendering to mpeg2 should reduce the size, how did I get a 10 GB file?

[mats.hogberg]

Rendering should yeild smaller, not larger files right?

Wrong.
Well, it depends on what format the source file was in before you encode them to mpg. But if they are some DivX avi kinda files, expect 3-4 times bigger when reencoded to DVD specs mpg.
Realisically, put no more than 2 hours of video on a DVD-5. (Even if you can cram 6-7 hours on a disk if you settle for VCD quality.) Source file size is irrelevant.

/Mats

[guns1inger]

You really need to do a lot of reading if you want your questions answered. You need to learn about

Bitrates
Compression
Authoring
Quality vs Size
and so much more.

A potted answer : Size = running time x bitrate. When you are working with a video, running time is a known amount. The question then becomes what bitrate do I need to use to fit that running time into the space I have.

A typical DVD5 holds 4.38 GB of data, and depending on the quality of the source, and the quality of the output that you want, hold between 100 and 180 minutes of video at full-D1 resolution. That is, 3 x 42 - 50 minute episodes, or 6 x 26 - 30 minute episodes.

You can always fit more, however you can only do so by reducing resolution and bitrate, and therefore quality.

Start by reading What is DVD (top left corner), then stop using Vegas for converting downloads. Vegas is for working with quality video, not playing with downloaded crap. You will find life much easier if you use something like ConvertXtoDVD or FAVC.

Finally, accept a few truths

1. Your downloads aren't DVD quality, or even near DVD quality
2. More than 3 hours on a DVD means a major drop in quality. Not a little, a lot. If you downloads are the typical 350 MB per episode variety then 3 episodes to a disc will be OK, but more than that will be noticeably lower in quality.
3. Sensible people don't convert these files any more. They buy a cheap DVD player with Divx/Xvid playback. Then they can fit 12 x 50 minute episodes to a disc as data, and not lose what quality remains.

[InFlames814]

Thanks for the info, I'm really new with authoring DVDs for actual videos so I don't know much in that respect. Sorry if I'm a major hindrance. 3 episodes per disc seems like a waste though...before I talked to a friend in school today I didn't even know about dual layer discs, but are DVD-18s the only way I could fit more without losing quality? I'd rather not have 10 discs for one show, but maybe that's just naivety wishing for convenience. When I get home I'll have to check and see if my player has DivX playback...

I realize that they aren't DVD quality files but I was also using Vegas to put the episodes together for a Play All option as well as Episode select. Is that just aiming too high?

[redwudz]

Actually a DL burnable DVD is a DVD-9. or about 8.5GBs. DVD-18s are a double sided, double layer disc, if you can even find them.

It all has to do with bitrate vs playing time vs media size. A bitrate calculator will tell you the bitrate required to fit the amount of video you want to a given media size.

What I would suggest is to make up a short representative clip, maybe a few minutes long and encode that with a few different bitrate settings. You will find most times that if you drop the MPEG-2 bitrate down below 3000Kbps the quality will decline rapidly. The maximum DVD bitrate is about 9500Kbps. Below 3000Kbps, you can use a different DVD format, 1/2 D1 and still retain some quality. Below 2000Kbps, then you are looking at VCD quality, at a bitrate of 1150Kbps.

But if you start out with VCD quality, you don't have much to lose, except your eyesight.

On the other hand, if you start out with high quality, like a DVD rip, you can drop the bitrate fairly low and it may still look good. And you have to realize any re-encoding will lose some quality, no matter how high a bitrate you use. The worse you start out with, the more obvious the lose will be.

That's one reason to avoid conversions if possible.

That's the short version and JMO.

And welcome to our forums.

[mats.hogberg]

I've given you some estimates, and they still hold. DL DVDs hold double my figures - There's no such thing as DVD-18.
For DVD res (720x480) 4.000 kbps is absolute minimum - 6.000 kbps min recommended. 4.000 kbps means 2.24 hrs to a DVD-5, double that on a DVD-9.
FAVC can do 1/2 D1 (352x480) which allows for lower bitrate - perhaps down to 2.500 kbps min. That will buy you yet another hour on a DVD-5.
But as guns1inger says - get an AVI capable player, fit more to a disk, and have it in the highest quality possible, and you don't have to convert. Well worth the $50 or whatever they are at now.

/Mats

[guns1inger]

A good authoring tool can do a play all without the need to put all the files together into a single file

[InFlames814]

I'll have to take a trip to Staples and grab some DVD-9s then...I only have DVD-5s on hand, but I don't need them right now so maybe I can run some tests with a few.
Honestly 2.500 with FAVC would work for me. I'm not doing this for anyone other than myself so I'm not obligated to make it top end quality and as long as there's some quality I can be happy until I learn more. With a DVD-9 that's about 6.48 hours and I only need about 5.5 to get the amount of eps I want per disc...

A good authoring tool huh?.. What would you recommend? As Of now I have Architect 7...

At any rate, major thanks for helping me with all this.

[guns1inger]

FAVC authors for you, with simple text menus if you wish. DVD Architect 4 shipped with Vegas 7. There is no architect 7. I suspect it will probably complain about the VOBs created by FAVC, but you never know.

If you are going to spend money on DVD9s, buy only Verbatim +R DL blanks. Anything else is a waste of money at this time. If you aren't prepared to pay the extra for quality discs, stick with DVD5s. It's cheaper in the long run.

[InFlames814]

7... Oh yeah, sorry I meant 4, I was thinking about Vegas. I have a one track mind. I was going to grab the Memorex DL blanks but Verbatims are only $1 more so I can get those.