Yet another eBay gripe!

[MackemX]

OK, all the fuss is about people downloading music/films etc and the industry sometimes picks on the little guys by taking them to court (my hero ). Why the **** doesn't the industry kick ebay's ass for allowing them to let auctions that obviously involve selling copies of illegal content continuously happen?

you see a few with the 24hr disclaimers but what about the ones without or the obvious ones that smack you in the face with a wet fish saying it's illegal?

It's too ******* obvious ebay is allowing piracy by letting these auctions go ahead yet it's has been going on for quite a long time now

someone care to explain why the industry doesn't give ebay as much attention when $1,000's of music/video is being sold daily in public view?

[Cole]

I look at it this way: when I go to the large local boot fair, there are usually six to seven stalls selling Pirate DVDs. Not a Police Officer in sight, simply because as soon as a car turns up, off run the pirates. So therefore it was mooted that the organisers for the boot fairs should be the ones to police stuff that is being sold. What was said IIRC is that for the organisers to vet every item would be impossible. Some of the more urgent stuff must be dealt with (firearms, drugs) but can every video tape, cassette tape, CD or DVD be checked? Again, the pirate stalls are usually laid out on a sheet and when the vetting people are nearby, up comes the sheet or ligitimate discs get produced.

In comparison, I just can't help wondering how many people ebay would have to employ to check each and every item considering the magnitude of stuff that gets posted there? I just can't see it being water tight at all; in fact quite the opposite. I believe that they concentrate on the things like firearms and drugs.

But for things like pirate DVDs and CDs, even if using search programs for key phrases or words, if the buyer doesn't even know that the item is pirate, how can ebay?

Having said that, there also may be a reliance on people giving ebay reports of dodgy sellers: there have been a few sellers that I have come across who have disappeared after being rumbled.

FWIW I wonder; for every blatantly illegal sale on ebay, how many got stopped by them. Are there any statistics available on that?

[MackemX]

Having said that, there also may be a reliance on people giving ebay reports of dodgy sellers: there have been a few sellers that I have come across who have disappeared after being rumbled.

FWIW I wonder; for every blatantly illegal sale on ebay, how many got stopped by them. Are there any statistics available on that?

reporting stuff and then seeing action being taken or even getting a response takes them far has always taken far too long in my experience. The latest example was that I reported someone on behalf of a mate for copying my description as it was obviously going to affect my mates items bidding due to being the exact same item and ending just before his. I sent the original complaint on Nov 7th not the 12th and it took them 2 weeks to respond (1 week after the end of the auction on the 13th) and say they were going to do something . another time was when I reported someone for having a 2500+ rating yet 99% of their ratings were no longer members who had ratings or 1 or 2 mostly for buying a sound of a russian car engine for a few cents . I got sick of checking as the guy was still a member with the same rating a few weeks late so I don't even bother now

yeah I know they can't catch everyone but surely the can cut it down so you don't see it as much or more to the point be able to find it as easily. It's the repeat offenders I'm getting at and not just those with 0 ratings posting something illegal. Some of the stats are there as you sometimes come across people with pretty decent ratings selling this stuff all the time

one guy selling Disney DVD backups with a rating of 10 who's just started but surely they should have seen him by now . I'm pretty sure Disney won't be very happy about it

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Walt-disney-Box-Set-A-MUST-HAVE-FOR-XMAS_W0QQitemZ6456868894QQca...QQcmdZViewItem

but here's another with 810 who's feedback is full of 'backup' copies of DVD's

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Charlie-and-the-Chocolate-Factory-Buy-it-Now_W0QQitemZ6455970097...QQcmdZViewItem

fancy the latest albums? This guy still has 45 available . Now tell me that's not taking the piss

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MP3-TOP-65-ALBUMS-30-COMPILATIONS-TOP40-SINGLES_W0QQitemZ4798390...QQcmdZViewItem


it doesn't take much to find them and I'm just one person spending a few minutes only using the word 'backups' as my search word . I'm pretty sure there's far more worse offenders/items on ebay than those few I've shown here

it may be 'legal' to sell backups in certain countries but here's ebay's policy regarding selling backups. It quite clearly states they do not allow it yet it's simple to find examples of it happening so they have no excuse for letting people get away with it over and over again. Surely they can employ a few people to do just this, search for people selling stuff against their policy and take action. I've see plenty of items being sold that are not even available on any media but are TV transfers

Or is the fact they don't want to do it due to the commision they get if they just conveniently 'overlook' it

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/replica-counterfeit.html

Counterfeits, unauthorised replicas (such as counterfeit watches, handbags, or other accessories) or unauthorised copies (such as copies of software programmes, video games, music albums, movies, television programmes, or photographs) are not permitted on eBay. Unauthorised copies include (but are not limited to) copies that are pirated, duplicated, backed-up or bootlegged. It is illegal to sell unauthorised copies of media.

like I said, why doesn't the industry put a little effort into kicking ebay's arse for allowing this to go on in open public view?

they should also be taking ebay to court for allowing them to sell this stuff, whatever it is. I bet that would soon shake ebay into dealing with it more effectively . It only took me a few minutes to find those remember so it's not exactly an impossible task for a specialised team to weed these auctions out .

The wages for employing a team shouldn't be an issue as ebay make millions a year anyway. It's more to do with the revenue of $100,000's they would lose if they did do it

don't get me wrong I like ebay and enjoy using it but it's just funny how I'm yet to see the industry saying anything publicly about what goes on with ebay and how much ebay costs them in lost sales etc (or have they? )

[Cole]

it doesn't take much to find them and I'm just one person spending a few minutes only using the word 'backups' as my search word. I'm pretty sure there's far more worse offenders/items on ebay than those few I've shown here

I quite agree, and how many people would you need to deal with all of these. There must be such an avalanche of stuff; not just DVDs etc, and vetting everything must be nye on impossible. The only effective way to deal with the problem realistically is to shut ebay down.

[MackemX]

you obviously can't vet everything but you could still vet the obvious stuff. I would dare say you could find at least 10-20 an hour so a team of 10 people would be 100-200 items an hour. It's not many at all but it would stop the blatant ones and at least show ebay are doing something about it. If I was paid on commision I'd be finding well over 30 an hour

as I said, ebay don't want to do anything as it will cost them a lot more in loss of commisions rather than what it would cost to pay a team to snoop around . I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to do it if I was an ebay co-owner. I also bet ebay have a good idea of how much it would affect profits if they came down harder on this stuff

another thing to look at is that the people who buy this stuff and the people that sell it won't want ebay to do that anyway . Judging by the lack of input regarding this 'gripe' most people here could be buying or selling the stuff and don't want anything to happen either

my main point isn't really that ebay aren't doing anything but rather the fact that the industry are not 'forcing' ebay to do anything. They don't do that but they will take a 13yr old kid to court for downloading some pop songs in kazaa . I'd say ebay are 'hurting' the industries a helluva lot more than they claim regarding any one average individual

[jimmalenko]

After reading this thread, and the previous (two ?) other ebay threads, and after conducting onerous independent research I have devised a foolproof / idiot-proof method so that you can never experience any issues with ebay ever again:


... stay ...

... the **** away ...

... from ebay. The end.


Quite simple, really

[MackemX]

hmmm, did you miss the part where I said I like using ebay? :P

again, it's ebay issues I'm raising but it's more to do with why the industry doesn't say anything about it to them

anyone care to explain why or am I just thinking alone here?

I just found a story from 2002 but why the hell didn't they bollock ebay for letting them do it? Ebay were 'delighted' about not being dragged into it . Has anything happened in the last few years that anyone knows about though as this is very old news

MPAA (Movie Picture Association of America) has sued several American eBay sellers for allegedly selling pirated DVDs through the auction site. Association claims that individuals, from eight different U.S. states, have sold totally over 1,000 pirated DVDs during the last 30 days.

Auction site eBay is not involved with the lawsuit, but according to its spokesperson, it is "delighted" that copyright owners have directly responded to illegal material sales in its service and have not dragged it into the process.

Most of the individuals named in the lawsuit have remained silent in the public, but some of them have come forward to the press and have claimed that they've been merely re-selling DVDs that they've purchased from so-called "eBay Power Sellers" that have claimed that their products are legal and official Asian releases of hit movies, not yet released in the States.

here's another guy claiming to be from Disney but I find it hard to believe it's genuine

http://forums.ebay.com/db2/thread.jspa?threadID=410482115&tstart=0&mod=1131924151239

Hi my name is Chris/ Cgray233 I work for a company that is contracted by the Disney Corporation to help regulate the sale of bootleg copies of Disney DVDs. I am writing to ask you all to post any sellers names that anyone has had problems with regarding copies or you can email my directly. I will be in close contact with Ebay monitors in the next few weeks and searching pages for overseas sellers and Bootleggers. Also a piece of Disney friendly advice, please make sure that the new DVDs that you bid on have a security seal on the top portion of the DVD. Hopefully we can get this problem taken care of in the next few months.

Sincerely, Chris/ Cgray233

an even older story but it obviously ebay now do allow the sales on recordable media so how come the change?

http://news.com.com/2100-1017-238556.html

Last fall, eBay bowed to pressure from software manufacturers and banned the sale of software and music on recordable compact discs and backup software packages to stem illicit sales. The move followed a survey by the Software & Information Industry Association (SIIA) that indicated that 60 percent of the software titles on eBay, Excite Auctions and ZDNet auctions were pirated.

[jimmalenko]

hmmm, did you miss the part where I said I like using ebay? :P

obviously ... hence all your gripe threads

Did you miss my easy-to-remember rhyme ?

[MackemX]

whatever :P

I'm just trying to start a conversation (rather than some lame thread I would normally start) but obviously everyone here is happy buying/selling counterfeit goods on ebay. All this while the industry does nothing and occasionally picks on young kids

p.s. If I'm pissed at anything it's more the fact that mysql isn't working properly!

[hech54]

I also love Ebay. It is the BEST place to find original rare recordings....for both video and audio.
If you see someone selling bootleg crap....turn them in to Ebay and move on....that is what I do.

[MackemX]

I also love Ebay. It is the BEST place to find original rare recordings....for both video and audio.
If you see someone selling bootleg crap....turn them in to Ebay and move on....that is what I do.

yeah, it's cool for stuff like that and I've used it a lot in the past 8). I've bought quite a lot of stuff I couldn't afford as a kid for example. I think ebay is now a sellers place as you get people overbidding for stuff. If I really want something I just hang around until the last 10 seconds and put in the max I will pay. If you put a bid in early you just get some idiot outbidding you and bumping up the price needlessly . All you need is 2 idiots having a bidding war while you hang around waiting to bid and it spoils the whole thing

don't get me wrong as I'm not bothered about people selling bootleg crap. It's the fact the industry don't seem to be bothered to kick ebay's ass for allowing it to go on so blatantly yet they go to such lengths to track p2p users etc

[MackemX]

OK, all the fuss is about people downloading music/films etc and the industry sometimes picks on the little guys by taking them to court (my hero ). Why the **** doesn't the industry kick ebay's ass for allowing them to let auctions that obviously involve selling copies of illegal content continuously happen?

you see a few with the 24hr disclaimers but what about the ones without or the obvious ones that smack you in the face with a wet fish saying it's illegal?

It's too ******* obvious ebay is allowing piracy by letting these auctions go ahead yet it's has been going on for quite a long time now

someone care to explain why the industry doesn't give ebay as much attention when $1,000's of music/video is being sold daily in public view?

I was checking out a sellers ratings and surely this item is taking the piss and was illegal?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=41521&item=6478254755

[MackemX]

http://search.ebay.co.uk/search/search.dll?from=R40&satitle=lost+series+2

bear in mind this is the UK Ebay and I'm pretty sure you can't buy the Lost Season 2 DVD's just yet so is this legal?

and look at this item description

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LOST-SERIES-2-LEGALLY-GET-THE-LATEST-LOST-EPISODES_W0QQitemZ5671...QQcmdZViewItem

what if someone made a list of the 1,000's of obvious copyright breaking items and then took Ebay to court. Would Ebay not get a Cease and Desist placed on them for allowing so many illegal activities to go on?

just seems silly that they will chase down kids or single mums to take to court yet Ebay just washes their dirty laundry in public

[MackemX]

what if someone made a list of the 1,000's of obvious copyright breaking items and then took Ebay to court. Would Ebay not get a Cease and Desist placed on them for allowing so many illegal activities to go on?

hmm, looks like it's been done already and it was rules in Ebay's favour due to the Communications Decency Act of 1996

what kind of rule is that then? as it says Ebay is an internet service and is not responsible for the content posted on it by 3rd parties. So by that ruling it means that if I had a website that was an 'internet service', I could then allow people to post ways and means to obtain illegal content and not be held responsible?

What is exactly is an internet service though, is it something you charge people for or is a site like Videohelp and internet service?

eBay, Inc. Orrick defended eBay in a first impression "private lawyer general" lawsuit filed by a California resident seeking to hold eBay liable under California's unfair competition statute on account of use of the site by users to list for bid allegedly bootlegged and unauthorized sound recordings. The plaintiff in the case sought a ruling that, if granted, would have required eBay to monitor the hundreds of thousands of listings for music and sound recordings that appear on its site on a daily basis. eBay prevailed in the action, obtaining dismissal of the case on summary judgment. eBay successfully argued that it enjoyed immunity from such suits under the Communications Decency Act of 1996. The court's ruling in eBay's favor established that an Internet service, such as eBay, enjoys immunity from lawsuits that seek to hold the service liable on account of speech or content posted on sites by third parties.

* In Hendrickson v. eBay. Orrick lawyers successfully assisted eBay in preparing a defense to copyright and Lanham Act claims related to user listings alleged to be infringing various copyright and trademark rights. This case had numerous significant holdings applicable to Internet companies under the Lanham Act and the DMCA.

you can read more here

http://gozips.uakron.edu/~dratler/2003cyberlaw/materials/ebay.htm

[Doramius]

Maybe the RIAA & MPAA is devoting most of their time to Michigan. :/ :P

[smearbrick1]

Meanwhile, I can't sell the software that I have no use for that came with my old Dell computer (that I parted out). Ebay keeps whacking the auction because of the potential of piracy in OEM software.

******* fuckers.

[Noahtuck]

Maybe the RIAA & MPAA is devoting most of their time to Michigan. :/ :P

[Doramius]

Meanwhile, I can't sell the software that I have no use for that came with my old Dell computer (that I parted out). Ebay keeps whacking the auction because of the potential of piracy in OEM software.

******* fuckers.

This is why I tell people............

BUILD YOUR OWN DAMN SYSTEM!

Don't buy Dell, Gateway, HP, Compaq, or any other premade company specific machines. You want a warranty. I got a warranty on each of my items. You want Tech. Support. Dammit, I have Tech. support for everything in my system. I can use my software on any PC I build regardless of the MoBo and whatever else.

It's not that the systems are bad (well in a way, yes they are), but you can't get s**t if you try and sell them or the software. Why do I need a Dell XP OS for a Compaq PC? Why waste the time trying to get it to work properly?

[/rant]

[MackemX]

are there any alternatives to Ebay in the UK?

[Doramius]

The London Art auction. :P

[waheed]

are there any alternatives to Ebay in the UK?

Not popular at all but there is:

http://uk.ebid.net/

[Doramius]

that's like BIDZ.com in the US. really crappy if you ask me.

[Treebeard]

http://www.epier.com/


never used it though

[Doramius]

There's tons of them.

liquidation.com
bidoutlet.com
auction-warehouse.com

these 2 I don't go to, but have visted in the past.
Ubid spams like crazy, and the other one is a pain in the a** to use and has given people so many problems.

auctionaddict.com
ubid.com