VBR settings for very good vs compatible burned DVD

[P_Cherry]

Hi,
which MINIMUM, AVERAGE and MAXIMUM bitrate do you recommend for very good quality and on the other side for maximum compatibility with even old DVD players too ? Of course it will be burned DVD not pressed commercial one....

I use VEGAS 6 for editing and encoding and DVD Architect for authoring.

Thanx
Peter

[reboot]

8500 max (plus audio), to no more than 9000.
Average as high as you can, and still have your video fit on disk, thus a bitrate calculator really helps. Minimum no less than half the max, or the same as the average, which ever is greater.

[gadgetguy]

Minimum no less than half the max, or the same as the average, which ever is greater.

That will negate the advantages of VBR. You can't give more to the scenes requiring more than the average, if you can't borrow from those requiring less than the average.

[reboot]

True...just guidelines.
Many people set min to 300, which is far lower than the actual bitrate needed, but I find better quality by keeping min higher, although lower than average, but not usually by much.
eg. If my average is 5350, max is 8500, I set min at between 3000 and 4250, depending on type of video (action flick, or drama etc.)

[Paul_G]

I just do not get it. People go on about a low min bitrate of say (300-500) but others mention the min bitrate of 2500 and higher (same with other sites).

Can someone please explain as it really is confusing me.

[gadgetguy]

read this
www.mediachance.com/dvdlab/tutorial/bitrate.html

[monzie]

AFAIK the MINIMUM is just a marker/parameter value and does NOT mean it will used when encoding if set really low (like 300-500).....ditto the MAX (but limited to NO MORE than this value) the true 'encoding' value is the AVE but the min/max values allows for lower/higher bitrates to be used when possible/required (eg 'titles' and 'black' scenes are encoded near the MIN...whilst 'action' scenes will be encoded towards the HI....the AVE sets a 'constant/typical' value in 'normal' scenes/frames etc)...

Personally I use 1000min and 7500max (with a calculated AVE)..note that I use 7500max to negate playback probs on my DVD players which can be picky over the DVDr MEDIA and the max bitrate used which can cause stuttering on some players using certain media and bitrates...so I COMPROMISE at 7500max to ensure all players will handle the DVDr's (but it possibly MAY decrease the final quality...but if it does I've never noticed...like all things DVD/mpeg etc.. 50% is down to 'can you tell/do you care'?)

Self experiment for 'your' equipment is truly the best way....oooohhhh :-]..seriously though, experiment a little with mins and maxs and then find a compromise that suits you...and be warned not all DVD players 'like' all media....and some may 'choke' (stutter/pause/skip) at to high a max on certain discs....but then again I cant be bothered/afford to hunt out top quality DVDr media..I tend to grab what (cheapo media) I know works on my 4 standalone players

HTH

[guns1inger]

Don't double post - pick one forum. If it's wrong a mod will move it.

[P_Cherry]

Ok. Thanks and sorry for double posting.

So AVERAGE rate I will set according bitrate calculator.....

But what do you mean is MAXIMUM on DVD+/-R for any (old) standalone DVD player (6000, 7500 kbps or more) ?

[guns1inger]

The maximum, for any DVD player that legally shows the DVD logo, is 10080 kbps. They must be able to handle this data rate for a sustained period to be compliant with the DVD spec. Again, this data rate is for video and audio combined.

Personally, I go to a max of around 9600-9800 (audio and video), and have never had a problem across a range of kit of varying ages. Your encoder will only hit the max if it needs to, so set it as high as you need to or feel comfortable doing. As most of my work is with 192kbps AC3, I am happy setting a max of 9400, and a minimum of around 4000 (assuming space permits). The difference between your minimum and your average should be no less than the difference between your average and your maximum. If it is, then the maximum may never be used in an effort to maintain the average.

The other thing to bear in mind is that older players (>4 - 5 years old) are more likely to have problems simply reading DVD-R/+R disks than any issue caused by data rate.

[Paul_G]

Thanks for the replies

[P_Cherry]

Thanks also. You are talking about difference between MINIMUM and AVERAGE should not be greater than difference between AVERAGE and MAXIMUM......but why SONY use MINIMUM only 1 200kbps in its VEGAS Template for Architect....??? (Minimum 1200 Average 6000 Max 8000)

[monzie]

Start your own thread and all will be revealed.....(if your lucky).....and our different standpoints on this issue............personaly it sounds like BS about the MIN value being connected to the MAX / Ave value........but your never to old to learn...but its bollox.

[spectroelectro]

The trick to getting the best possible video quality from a VBR encoded MPEG-2 file is to choose generous values: 1000 or 2000 min, 5000 av, 8000 max. Then squish the encoded file down using ReJig. I've found that ReJig can squeeze mpeg-2 files by up to 30% with no video artifacts. For reference, I find that a typical color 45-minute TV show takes up about 1.8 gigs with 2000/5000/8000 encoding using TMPGenc, but 1.6 gigs with 2000/5000/8000 MainConcept 1.4 encoding and 1.48 gigs with the Full D1 SP setting of my JVC DR M10. The result looks identical. All files can be ReJigged down by at least 20% without introducing any visible compression artifacts.

For Half D1 the min, av, max bitrate requirements drop dubstantially and on a regular analog TV the resulting DVD looks identical. For Half D1 300 min, 3000 av, 6000 max works very well and this can be ReJig'd down another 20% without artifacts. The result is a Half D1 MPEG-2 file that can fit on a single 703 meg CD-R. You can put 6 of 'em on a single DVD-R and it'll look identical to a regular Full D1 DVD encoded with a grotendous bitrate like 8000 CBR...but you really have to know what you're doing to make that work.