archiving to DVD-R and/or -RW, too bleeding edge for now?

[cwerdna]

Ok, so this might sound like sacrilege for this forum, but here goes...

I picked up a Pioneer DVR-220S standalone DVD recorder to occasional archiving stuff I really want to keep to DVD from my DirecTivo (probably no more than 2-3 hours/week on avg of burning; maybe ~1 hour/week of actual archiving). I figure I may as well get out of the stone ages (been archiving to VHS), have the benefit of better picture quality and be able to accommodate those w/o VHS VCRs (sometimes I loan shows to coworkers/friends).

I haven't even opened the box nor the media I bought (a bunch of MIT Maxell DVD-R and DVD-RW discs) but I'm really having second thoughts. Judging by people's experiences here, at www.avsforum.com and from of a friend who has 5 different DVD burners (2 Plextors, a NEC and some others) it seems REALLY bleeding edge.

My main issues are:
- seemingly very hit/miss compatibility of media w/recorders (for example, some people reported that they had Maxell 8x DVD-R media that didn't work at all w/their Pioneer 220).
- because of above, I basically will need to watch my burned discs immediately to ensure that the recording was fine and there are no pauses, dropped frames, major glitches due to bad burn, bad media or read errors
- related to above, it's tough to buy media since the actual maker can very a lot within even a brand and who knows how compatible/good it'll be
- longevity of media and recordings are unknown [some people have issues where their discs are suddenly unreadable after <1 year; some have checked their recordings were fine originally, some not]
- very hit/miss compat w/various DVD players of burned discs (not as big an issue for me; the VHS-less people usually have multiple DVD readers/players)

With my archiving to VHS, I've never had to worry about recordings being "bad". If I check the tail end, it's usually good enough. I don't really have time to re-watch everything I burn immediately. I've not had longevity probs w/VHS either. I have some tapes w/recordings made >>10 years ago and they're still fine. If stuff I burn to DVD-R* is unreadable before say 7 years, it's useless to me. I may as well not archive to DVD at all.

I have data CD-Rs and so far haven't had any data loss due to age (yet) that I know of. FWIW, I've had a CD-R burner in some form or another since the old 2X Sony CDU-920S and haven't had any major issues w/media compatibility (most of my media was Imation, Kodak, TDK and Sony).

Anyone here have very "long term" (relatively speaking) experiences w/burning video to DVD-R or -RW? Think I should return my recorder until this stuff is less bleeding edge?

[budz]

No one really knows the longevity of a dvd disc. Use good quality dvd media such as the MADE IN JAPAN discs. I have RICOH (MADE IN TAIWAN), TAIYO YUDEN (MADE IN JAPAN), MAXELL (MADE IN JAPAN)and even RITEK discs that I burned 2 years ago and they work perfectly fine. They say to keep the discs away from heat and humidity which can prolong the life of the disc. I record with DVD-RW with my 220 then to author I use TMPGE DVD AUTHOR on my pc to burn to DVD-R or DVD+R.

Using the 220 recorder is the easiest thing compared to using a device to capture video then to encode. The cost for using a capture device can be expensive along with using software to encode. I have a CANOPUS ADVC-100 that I first bought to capture video from my vhs and beta collection. Standalone recorders at the time were very expensive so I got the ADVC-100. Use good quality dvd media and you won't have problems. Use the VIDEO MODE when you record with the 220 recorder.

When I mentioned in one of my posts that the MAXELL DVD-R 8x media did not work with the 220 recorder, there were others who could. At that time I feel there was a quality control problem with MAXELL because others had problems burning that media with their computer dvd burners. Try out the recorder and if you're not satisfied with then return it to Wally world. They have a 90 day return policy. Good luck!

[lordsmurf]

You never want to archive to phase-change media (RW discs). They die super-fast. Temp use only on that media.

[oyster]

You never want to archive to phase-change media (RW discs). They die super-fast. Temp use only on that media.

Is DVD-RAM different from this point of view? I've heard that it's a very reliable media for data backup and archiving.

[lordsmurf]

It's supposed to be, but I'm not convinced of that. I've heard of studios have issues with archives made to DVD-RAM when it first came out, though I'm not sure how reliable that info is. Dye should be far more stable.

[oyster]

It's supposed to be, but I'm not convinced of that. I've heard of studios have issues with archives made to DVD-RAM when it first came out, though I'm not sure how reliable that info is. Dye should be far more stable.

Yep, safer than RW but still not the ideal long-term choice. I've found more about this topic on this interesting document: http://www.itl.nist.gov/div895/carefordisc/

[Racer2x]

If you bought a Pioneer, I would consider it a good move. From all that I've seen, these are great recorders. I started out, doing PC caps, using an ATI Radeon 64 VIVO, and NEVER got that damned thing to work the way they said it would. I fought with that thing for several years, till these set-tops dropped to reasonable prices, went out and dropped a few buck on an ILO (Walmart housebrand). I shoulda spent the extra, and bought a Pioneer. I went through 3 ILOs, till I gave up (They kept dying on me. Would no longer recognize burnt discs, then wouldn't recognize ANY discs, THEN finally started flubbing up, during recordings). Curretly, I am saving for a Pioneer, with a harddive.
Don't be too nervous. Take the plunge, and enjoy the Pioneer.

[piano632]

Never heard of any problems with dropped frames/glitches on Pioneer recorders. Why do you need to use 8x media when you can get 4x media cheaper? It's still way better than VHS quality.

I see Mitsui (MAM-A) is coming out with Gold Archive DVD-/+R
http://www.mitsuicdr.com/about/press_releases/2005/Gold%20DVD%2005-12-05.html
http://www.mitsuicdr.com/Archive_gold_image.html
Not exactly cheap, but may be good for those important recordings.

[cwerdna]

Never heard of any problems with dropped frames/glitches on Pioneer recorders. Why do you need to use 8x media when you can get 4x media cheaper? It's still way better than VHS quality.

I didn't need 8x media. 50 pack of 8x DVD-R Maxells were $18 on sale which seemed like a good deal to me.

The dropped frames or glitches I'm talking about might be due to a bad burn, bad spots on the disc or eventually due to high errors rates (over time).

[lumis]

here's what i do.

1) record what i want to pioneer dvd record on to a dvd-rw (maxell)

2) extract contents of dvd-rw to computer, edit, make dorky menus.

3) burn to high quality dvd-r (i.e. made in japan, maxell, TYG01)

it might be a little more time consuming, but i feel better about having good menu's with good chapters and having an actual dvd burner (yes i know its a burner inside the recorder) burn my dvd-r..

if you use good quality media (taiyo yuden) & a good burner (in my case pioneer 109), i think your recordings (taken care of well) will last as long as you do.