buy a S-VHS VCR or not?

[broadway]

I'm planning on backing up my VHS tapes (both taped off-the-air and commercial tapes) to DVD-R using a DVD recorder.

Is it "worth" it to buy a S-VHS VCR just for this or will my current VCR be okay?

P.S. I know I will have to buy a device to handle the Macrovision on the commercial tapes.

Thanks in advance.

[Bob W]

I bought this JVC VCR which has a time base corrector and active video calibration and trust me it makes a big difference compared to the low cost junk we buy at WalMart. It was only $149 and was delivered in one day. It has s-video out on the back and the front FYI.
http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail.asp?action=detail&dpno=291073#scroll

[BobK]

Did S-VHS give better quality even if the tapes were originally recorded on a standard VCR (non-S-VHS)?

[hech54]

You get S-Video out on an SVHS machine....one more selling point.

[Tom81]

A good quality vhs deck will not be surpassed by an svhs machine playing vhs.
On many dvd recorders the composite input splits the signal y/c just the same as svhs input does.

[wulf109]

Bob W is correct the TBC makes all the difference in the world. I have two JVC 9500's and have transferred many old VHS tapes with them. They cleanup picture problems very well.
If your transferring VHS tapes a TBC is a must have option.

[webeye]

I bought this JVC VCR which has a time base corrector and active video calibration and trust me it makes a big difference compared to the low cost junk we buy at WalMart. It was only $149 and was delivered in one day. It has s-video out on the back and the front FYI.
http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail.asp?action=detail&dpno=291073#scroll

Note.....this unit is refurbished.....could be a unit returned for any number of reasons.

[vhelp]

hi broadway,


before investing in expensive toy I would first continue as you were w/
capturing from these devices w/ your VCR.

But, my recommendation would be to just get a decent S-VHS deck, like
those by JVC. I have a JVC S-VHS HR-S3910U w/ S-Video in/out.
IMO, this unit output pretty good quality. Doesn't have one of those TBC's
built-in though, but that's ok, becuase:

* A, most of my VHS are either in good or great shape, and
* B, I already have a stand-alone model, the TBC-100 +/- $250

But, since you have yet to have issues w/ your VHS transfer projects, I
would not start you off w/ spending $$$.$$ dollars. You probably haven't
even started yet and we're all pushing to to send hehe.. Anyways..

If cash is an issue, then find a good S-VHS and start w/ that.
Also, (and very important) we dont' know what you skill level is. You could
be a complete novice to all this, and if we start pushing you w/ all these
weird gizmo's, that's just gonna add to the nonense

Important things. . .
* mobo and capture card (must work in concert w/out issues)
* Good capture card, but minal is ok, provided system stability and OS.
* No IRQ or other issues
* VCR - good brand S-VHS w/ S-Video in/out (min. w/ an OUT)
* Your Source tapes. Best condition, not aged and word w/ multi playing time
...and should have ben recorded in SP mode.
* User skills level - known processes and techniques (from VHS to DVDR)
* Ability to work alone
* other stuff her, but I'm pretyt worned out today, plus I'm making dinner.

From the Video Workstation of,
-vhelp 2075

[lordsmurf]

The built-in TBC and stand-alone TBC do different things. I have both for that very reason.

[broadway]

vhelp, that comment about ability to work alone really struck a funny bone.

anyhow, "vhelp" is right.
I haven't begun this adventure yet.

I like to do my research up front. Not one for experimenting.

so, are there any issues I should know about with putting an external TBC in series with the JVC S-VHS which has the internal TBC?

this project is turning to be more and more a money pit

[FulciLives]

I bought this JVC VCR which has a time base corrector and active video calibration and trust me it makes a big difference compared to the low cost junk we buy at WalMart. It was only $149 and was delivered in one day. It has s-video out on the back and the front FYI.
http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail.asp?action=detail&dpno=291073#scroll

As someone else pointed out this is for refurbished units.

To buy a brand new one here is a link:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=getItemDetail&Q=&sku=242445...#goto_itemInfo

Granted the price tag is $269.95 but it is cheaper than the consumer based 9000 series by JVC and this unit is actually an industrial model so that plus the fact that it has a TBC makes the price pretty reasonable if you ask me.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[videobruce]

These "professional" units from JVC and Panasonic are just consumer models with grounded AC line cords and BNC connectors with a higher price tag as compaired with the consumer model.
Been that way for the last 20 years and hasn't changed!

BTW, I have been using SVHS for the last 12 years for time shifting and archiving.

[FulciLives]

Well the link I provided in my last post above was for the JVC SR-V10U S-VHS VCR which is a "professional" unit. The price at B&H is $269.95 and it seems to be very similiar to the "consumer" 9000 series in that it has a buit-in TBC and DNR and adaptive picture control, flying erase heads and blah blah blah.

The description at B&H doesn't tell you much. I got more info on it by downloading the manual from the JVC website.

It seems that the "consumer" 9000 series might actually have a couple more features not present on the SR-V10U but they are a mightly close match and the SR-V10U is $90 cheaper than the HRS-9911 S-VHS VCR

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[videobruce]

Does the SR-V10U have a tuner? Many of the older "pro: versions didn't.

[FulciLives]

Does the SR-V10U have a tuner? Many of the older "pro: versions didn't.

Yes it does!

If you are interested in it go to the JVC website and download the PDF manual. Much more info there than on the B&H website. Plus I think the B&H website claims it has no cable box control or something like that but according to the manual it does.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[donpedro]

The built-in TBC and stand-alone TBC do different things. I have both for that very reason.

Can you elaborate on this ?

[DaveS]

this project is turning to be more and more a money pit

It can be...suggest set up a budget in advance & also think about when you've reached your goal vs. when you are past that and just tweeking for 'art's' sake (although I haven't figured that out yet either)

[thinkert]

I have a question for all you S-VHS experts (I'm looking at YOU, lordsmurf! ). Since we're on the S-VHS subject, the unit linked to above has this as a feature:

"Super VHS ET Recording: JVC's breakthrough Super VHS ET (Expansion Technology) eliminates the need to use exclusive, hard-to-find tapes for Super VHS recording. Now you can record high-resolution Super VHS signals on the ordinary VHS tapes you can find in any store. "

Is there anything to this, or is it basically just marketing pap?

Thanks.

[vhelp]

hi thinkert,

my JVC S-VHS HR-S3910U has this feature Super VHS ET plug n play
nonsense, but to be honest w/ you, it's more hype than reality. If you got a
S-VHS unit, USE the SVHS tapes for it.. and not depend on "simulation"
techniques - - otherwise known as "nonsense"

-vhelp 2084

[FulciLives]

I have a question for all you S-VHS experts (I'm looking at YOU, lordsmurf! ). Since we're on the S-VHS subject, the unit linked to above has this as a feature:

"Super VHS ET Recording: JVC's breakthrough Super VHS ET (Expansion Technology) eliminates the need to use exclusive, hard-to-find tapes for Super VHS recording. Now you can record high-resolution Super VHS signals on the ordinary VHS tapes you can find in any store. "

Is there anything to this, or is it basically just marketing pap?

Thanks.

This is an "old" trick. In the old days people would actually DRILL A HOLE in the VHS shell. A blank S-VHS has an extra hole on the case and this is how a S-VHS VCR knows that you have inserted a S-VHS blank. Like I said in the old days people would drill a hole in a normal VHS shell to trick a S-VHS VCR into thinking a S-VHS tape had been inserted so as to save money and record in S-VHS but on a cheaper regular VHS tape.

Anyways I don't know if the S-VHS ET thing simply does that (allows S-VHS recording on a VHS tape) or if it actually tries to do more i.e., somehow "adjust" the recording knowing that it is putting a S-VHS signal on a VHS tape.

The down and dirty gritty details ... I've tried it and S-VHS ET does appear to have all the picture qualities of S-VHS but the trade off is that the picture is very grainy. So yes you get the benefits of the higher resolution and less color bleed etc. but at the expense of grain.

In short I don't like it. If you want the quality you are gonna have to "bite-the-bullet" and buy S-VHS blank tapes.

S-VHS blanks can be expensive ... especially when you buy then in a retail store (and very few carry them) but on-line you can get them down to around $3.50 to $4.00 whereas the last time I bought a 2 pack at BEST BUY it was like $12 or $13 total for the 2 pack of T-120 S-VHS blanks.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
I had my first S-VHS VCR back around 1994 ... long before the ET thing ... but I never did the drill hole trick myself. A few people reported having problems with that ... loose plastic shards either getting into the tape case and scratching the tape or worse yet lodging inside the VCR and causing all kinds of havoc SO I never tried it.

[lordsmurf]

I use ET mode on TDK EHG tapes and JVC broadcast VHS tapes, and it's fine for ¼th the cost. Resolution about 300x480, close to broadcast res.

[FulciLives]

I use ET mode on TDK EHG tapes and JVC broadcast VHS tapes, and it's fine for ¼th the cost. Resolution about 300x480, close to broadcast res.

Well I've tried S-VHS ET using high quality VHS blanks and this was with a JVC HR-S5900U and as I said the image quality was very grainy compared to using a real S-VHS blank tape.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[thinkert]

Thanks, vhelp, lordsmurf, FulciLives for your answers. I appreciate it.


ThinkerT

[lordsmurf]

The JVC HRS9000 line are professional units.

"Industrial" means it's used in surveillance, often in places like banks. Cameras in ATMs, etc.

"Professional" means it's used for video playback application, often in a cable company of small studio settings.

Trust me... I've seen several small studios... and a JVC 9800 is far better than the "pro" rack-mounted machines I'd seen. My first studio visit I expected cool toys, but left thinking "that's it?"

[thinkert]

One more question that I wasn't able to find an answer for with a quick search on the web: Do S-VHS tapes degrade at the same rate as standard or high-quality VHS, or are they more resistant to degrading, with their higher density?

Thanks.

[lordsmurf]

One more question that I wasn't able to find an answer for with a quick search on the web: Do S-VHS tapes degrade at the same rate as standard or high-quality VHS, or are they more resistant to degrading, with their higher density?

Thanks.

They last longer, can be used more, and look better. Tapes just the same size as VHS. Entirely different composition of materials.

[piano632]

I have used a JVC HR-S9600 for a few years. I can say that S-VHS ET on my machine (using high-grade or pro-grade) is close in image quality to actual S-VHS tapes which cost twice the price. However, the audio quality sounds clearer on the higher grades. The 9000 series has image enhancement circuits like DNR (digital noise reduction) and Digital R3 (edge detail enhancement). It also has Active Video Calibration (which tests the tape for a couple seconds before recording to equalize the video signal to the specific tape being used). Has a time base corrector (playback only) to stabilize jittery tapes. The 9600 has the best tuner I've yet seen on any piece of consumer equipment (even better than the one in my DVD recorder) - it even makes cable TV look clear and sharp. It also plays back VHS and S-VHS tapes with the best picture I've yet seen from either of those formats. Sometimes you can see the machine actually "focusing" the picture as it starts to play back, adjusting to get the perfect balance. The machines below the 9000 series aren't quite as good, but of course they cost less too. If you can afford it, I'd try to get one of the 9000 series machines. These things used to cost $1000 some years ago - now you can buy them for $400 new.

[psychotronicfilms]

One more question that I wasn't able to find an answer for with a quick search on the web: Do S-VHS tapes degrade at the same rate as standard or high-quality VHS, or are they more resistant to degrading, with their higher density?

Thanks.

HI. I'm new here, and this is my first post, but I wanted to mention that as someone who has been using S-VHS for years (and recently S-VHS ET), one thing to keep in mind is that when using the ET recording capability, if you leave the unit in Pause for more then just a few seconds, you may notice a BIG problem later during playback at that point.

While it's never a great idea to let a tape sit idle on the heads, on most standard consumer VHS machines or when using actual S-VHS tapes on decent consumer or Pro-sumer models, there's likely to be no glitch of any sort if you wait out a block of two minutes worth of commercials.

However, on every JVC S-VHS deck I've had (three so far), when recording using ET, even 30 seconds worth of Record/Pause winds up leaving a noticeable glitch and roll of visual static. They make mention of this briefly in the fine print of the manuals, but don't go into specific detail.

I've also found that while S-VHS tapes hold up better through multiple gens than standard VHS, as you go down a few times, you'll start to notice a lot of drift and oversaturation in the colors, as opposed to a more evenly distributed degradation of picture quality.

I hope this helps, and I look forward to participating more on these boards in the future.

[Dr_Layne]

Any opions on the JVC HR-S10000U SVHS deck?

Steve

[huntr]

Just looked up the JVC homepage and the only available 9000 series is HR-S9911U. Does anybody have that machine? What's your thought and would like to hear your feedback before I can buy it. The retail price is $600.00.

Thanks!