Princo 4x, Pioneer DVR-104, Blaaah!

[Flip Flop Frog]

For ages I always bought Princo 1x DVD-Rs... The plain white topped ones... and they have generally neen pretty good and rather reliable.

The other day, got to my local computer place and decided maybe I'd pick up some 2x or 4x this time around... Sure enough they had a spindle of 50 Princo DVD-R at 4x on for a pretty decent price... only a few bucks more than the spindle of 1x... So I was rather happy knowing that the Princo's had worked before, no issues, and now I could cut them in like 15 minutes rather than 1 hour.


So I womble home, sit down, prepare the contents for my DVD into my folders and organize things as per norm, crack open my new shiny spindle of 4x Princos, and slip one into the machine... I click "RECORD" in Toast 5, wait a few seconds, and am suddenly shocked... My DVDs are showing up as 1x inside toast... And I can't select 2x or 4x...


My first step was to try one of my extra Maxell DVD-Rs and see if it could burn at a fasters speed, thinking it was the drive, or the software, but nope... it registers as being 4x as it should...


Next step was to search google and see if anyone else had similar problems... And sure enough I found that lots of folks have problems with many different media showing up properly on their burners... including princo.


In an attempt to shorten this, and get the point, why the heck are my 4x Princo's only showing up as 1x.... Did the store attempt to screw me for the DVD-Rs by giving me 1x and telling me they were 4x? Is it my drive, Pioneer 104? What is it?


Just to rule a few things out, I already made sure I had the latest firmware to enable 2x and 4x media...



Someone lend a little help?


Thanks....

[Evor]

They definately wont burn at 4X as the 104 cant do this the firmware upgrade was to stop the drive from packing in but you should be able to do 2x

[thr33ve]

I don't offhand remember the link but on the DVR 104 with firmware update 4x media burns at 1x. The 104 is only a 2x drive, the firmware update makes it compatible with 4x media, ie it won't crap itself, but it doesn't make it any faster...

You probably just want to stick with 2x media.

[Flip Flop Frog]

To make matters more interesting... the 4x Princo discs won't even burn at 2x... my drive does burn at 2x... that I know for sure....


Any ideas?

[thr33ve]

Go to http://www.apple.com/hardware/superdrive and look under the FAQ section on the right hand side of the page. There it explains that 4x media (any, including the Princo that you use) only burns at 1x using the superdrive. Only 2x media will burn at 2x speed.

[galactica]

Right, here's the reason..... Your drive is not a 4x drive! Did you expect this to work???

PIONEER DVR-104 Specs:
Write speeds
DVD-R: 2X CLV, 1x CLV
DVD-RW: 1X CLV
CD-R: 8X CLV, 4X CLV
CD-RW: 4X CLV

Note the DVD-R is 2x max! This is exactly what happens when a 4x disk is put into a 2x writer. Thus, the max speed for you is to get the 2x disks which you will be able to burn at 2x.

All you did was just confirm the fact that you dont have a 4x drive.

Id take the disks back, say they didnt work with your drive *which they dont* and get the 2x kind and you will be happy.[/b]

[lordsmurf]

You need to upgrade the drive to firmware that uses 4x discs at 2x speed. The method I suggest is the cleanest:

Take the drive out and put it in a PC. Use the BIOS wipe from http://www.dvd-recordable.net. Exact page is
here.

After wiping, upgrade to 1.41 Pioneer official.

The OEMs like Apple, Compaq, Sony and Packard Bell do a shitty job of supporting DVD-R users. Their "new" firmware is often old.

This method works fine. I've done it numerous times on 103 and 104 drives.

If you (or anybody else) doesn't want to mess with it, mail the drive to me, and I'll do it for a small fee (enough to buy lunch and mail it back).

In general, 4x discs are better than 2x discs, especially on cheapos like Princo. The balance issue is why discs have errors at the end. A 2x burn on a cheapo 4x discs will often be flawless. I would keep the discs and fix the drive.

[Flip Flop Frog]

Now although I'm generally good with computers, you're going to have to help me out with this a bit....


What is the URL for the BIOS whipe? Straight to the file if possible...


And what is the URL for the 104 latest firmware that allows 4x discs to be burned at 2x?


Thanks a lot...

[lordsmurf]

Now although I'm generally good with computers, you're going to have to help me out with this a bit....What is the URL for the BIOS whipe? Straight to the file if possible...And what is the URL for the 104 latest firmware that allows 4x discs to be burned at 2x?Thanks a lot...

Exact page is here.

Look for BIOS wipe file: "DVR-104 Bios Downgrade" on page 2.
Look for 1.41 FW file: "A04 Official Version 1.41" on page 1.

I cannot directly link to the files. That will have to do.

[galactica]

Keep in mind though that this will only allow you to burn 4x at 2x not 4x at 4x.

No matter what you do you will never be able to get your drive to burn at 4x.

Instead you should just get 2x media

[Flip Flop Frog]

How long is this firmware downgrade supposed to take?


It's been running for quite some time...

[lordsmurf]

Instead you should just get 2x media

Well, 4x media balances better than 2x media. When cheap media is a "bad burn", it's normally because of balancing errors.

Defeating this is simple: use higher-rated media (4x) and burn slower (2x).

Cheap 4x media is sometimes cheaper than mid-grade oir high-grade 2x media.

[lordsmurf]

How long is this firmware downgrade supposed to take? It's been running for quite some time...

I've seen it go on for 30 minutes. It may fail a few times. Just stop it, reboot, try again. It'll catch within 10 tries.

Remember, this is hacking. :P

[Flip Flop Frog]

This is what it output:


Pioneer DVD-R/RW Firware Update Program for DVR-104

Now IDE Drive Checking...

ID = 0 --> Error: No CD-ROM Drive found
ID = 1 --> Error: No CD-ROM Drive found
ID = 2 --> Pioneer DVD-RW DVR-104 A227 02/06/03
ID = 3 --> Error: No CD-ROM Drive found

Enter Target ID --> 2

Now rom contents checking...
Now update mode setup executing... --> Complete
Now update binary file loading ... (r4100083.098) --> Complete
Now firmware(kernal) rewriting...--> Complete
Now update binary file loading... (r4100103.120) --> Complete
Now firmware rewriting...

(insert blinking cursor here)


It's been going on for 2 hours now just like that...


Is it safe to just shut the computer off? And try again... Or is it going to fudge the drive?

[galactica]

Instead you should just get 2x media

Well, 4x media balances better than 2x media. When cheap media is a "bad burn", it's normally because of balancing errors.

Defeating this is simple: use higher-rated media (4x) and burn slower (2x).

Cheap 4x media is sometimes cheaper than mid-grade oir high-grade 2x media.

Intersting, I did not know this... thanks lordsmurf


Flip Flop Frog
Sorry man, this is one reason I dont like to run firmware hacks. Id rather get a drive that can "normally" handle what im asking of it than go this route. But perhaps it will work out for you. Its been 1 day since then, hows the progress?

[lordsmurf]

Sorry man, this is one reason I dont like to run firmware hacks. Id rather get a drive that can "normally" handle what im asking of it than go this route.

We can thank all the damned OEM's for this mess. Packard Bell, Sony, Compaq, Apple.... why the hell didn't those guys just leave the Pioneer firmware intact?

Especially since most of them are slow and/or bail out whereas Pioneer is there for us on these matters.