IC7 V DVD2DVD-R

[icemanatvcd]

I heard a lot of good things about DVD2DVD-R, so I decided to give it a go. I used Cliffhanger to test these two apps. I have a slow Pentium III computer with 733Mhz and 512Gb of RAM.

IC7 took about 4 hours
DVD2DVD-R over 12 hours (VBR, 2 passes)

After the end of me test I found no difference in quality even though IC7 undersized (4.09 GB, Who cares if does not use all the disk space, quality does matter).

Both apps were very easy to use.

DVD2DVD-R requires more room on your hard disk.

DVD2DVD-R require your hard disk to be NTFS, it won't work on FAT 32 or 16.

For my money IC7 is a better encoder, VBR is for people who think they are going to get a better quality becuase of extras passes. It ain't so. I think is only a misconception.

I am sure going to upset a few fans of DVD2DVR-R. Let's hear your experiences with DVD2DVD-R and IC7.

Meanwhile I am giving a Constand Bitrate a go on DVD2DVD-R. See if that is any better. I doubt it.

[mrbass]

try Patriot, Gladiator, Bourne Identity ...those movies and audio (main movie only) are 6GB or moree. CCE is clearly superior to IC7 output. No debate about it. I've done quite a few quality comparisions myself.

[dreadogg]

lets see some screen shoots! Its really hard to tell the difference in the screenshots I have seen between CCE and Instantcopy, but there is no doubt they both dominate DVD2ONE/DVD SHRINK.

[mrbass]

ok sure...hopefully within a week I'll come up with some. Depends on how dvd2dvdr goes. CCE will blow out IC7. Now if your movie is only 5GB or something then yes it'll be very close. But 5.5GB or more then you need do get lasik vision like me.
--mr. eagle eyes

[icemanatvcd]

mrbass, Cliffhanger was more than 5.5GB, no difference in quality as I mentioned before. I have a lasik vision like you!

[MackemX]

thread HERE

comparision HERE

two questions that can be asked

1. do you have an fussy eye regarding qualityt?
2. do you have the setup to appreciate the difference in quality?

there are also other factors that will affect opinions such as usertime involved & is it for movie-only or 1:1?

it is hard to get someone who hasn't got the means to see the difference to admit there is a difference so this is why you get DVD2One/DVDShrink etc users comparing their backups to the originals and insisting there is no difference even though others know there is

I just wish people weren't offended when others suggest that they can see a difference cos there is a difference and how much depends on the image you are seeing and how you interpret it (see sig)

the most important thing is that you are happy with what you see and don't make your decisions based on other users opinions as your own opinion is the most important

[mrbass]

I agree MackemX...many will see screenshots and say "hmmm well screw that if it takes me 33 hours for CCE encoding on my PIII 450MHz computer than I'd just rather use Instant Copy". So if you don't think there is a difference there's no point in arguing about it. To that I'll say "By George, yes your right, there isn't a difference...just like to Japanese all rice tastes the same."

Kinda reminds me of baseball cards I collected when I was a kid....see see I have so and so rookie card ..see see....who flipping cares. To each their own.

[JWhit]

I use both programs. IC7 for tv series type stuff and extra DVD material. I stick with DVD2DVDR for the main movies. I can tell a big difference in quality from the 2 programs when viewed on my 50" HDTV. However, when played on my 25" Sanyo tv, they look about the same. It does make a difference on what you play it on. Main thing is if you are happy with the way it looks on your tv, then keep doing what you are doing.

[MackemX]

this is why you get DVD2One/DVDShrink etc users comparing their backups to the originals and insisting there is no difference even though others know there is

this is a typical example of the quality opinionated posts Here that puzzle me cos you don't know what to say

he disagrees with someone else but at least he states that's it's his opinion and he's happy so fair enough

but if I was to disagree with him then that's what starts the flame wars as people get upset when their opinions are questioned

I bet people would still have differences of opinion regarding quality backing up a DVD5 (single layer) with different apps

[icemanatvcd]

MackemX, no need to get upset here. Just calm down buddy.

1. I don't have fussy eyes regarding quality. I am very picky.
2. I do have the setup to appreciate quality.

Since I like quality I only do movie only. Don't care about the extras or menu.

I totally agree with you that there is a huge difference in quality between apps like DVD2One/DVDShrink and IC7/DVD2DVD-R. I don't think many people would argue about that question of IC7/DVD2DVR-R is a debatable one. I never use DVD2One or DVDShrink. Tried once or twice and delted off my computer.

I am not offended when others suggest that they can see a difference cos there is a difference that is why I started this post to learn and listen to other people's opinions. You are rignt your own opinion is the most important one. It does not hurt the listen to other people's opinion. I have shown people Cliffhanger from both IC7 and DVD2DVD-R and none of them could see any difference. I have seen your pics, they do backup what I have said here.

As far mrbass is concerned let me see your results for your claims on those movies you did. You said there is a difference, what how much, 2%, 10%, or 20%..........? If there is a difference of 5%, do you think it is really worth it? How many passes do you do? Be a bit more specific, back it up with some evidence so no one will doubt you.

[MackemX]

MackemX, no need to get upset here. Just calm down buddy.

Dude, that thread weren't aimed it you as in yourself, it was everybody in general

I totally agree with you that there is a huge difference in quality between apps like DVD2One/DVDShrink and IC7/DVD2DVD-R. I don't think many people would argue about that question of IC7/DVD2DVR-R is a debatable one.

My point in the previous post was that people do actually disagree about the quality diff between apps like DVD2One/DVDShrink and IC7/DVD2DVD-R , that's why I linked to that other thread cos if I disagreed with that guy he would probably get upset

as for diff between IC and DVD2DVD-R regarding larger movie only that is a very difficult subject but basically the higher the % the smaller the difference, and the user will decide his cutoff point

this is my rough opinion of what % CCE, IC and DVD2One need to be to produce roughly the same quality image and it's open to debate

e.g. at 70% for CCE, IC needs 74% and DVD2one need 79%

[calx]

How about a comparison between CCE and Main Concept for DVD2DVD-R

[rdalcanto]

Is cliffhanger 5.5Gb before stripping away extra audio tracks? That is not a big movie if it is. Harder to see differences there. With a 50inch HDTV and a great DVD player, I can tell a big difference between DVDs from different studios (just like there is a big difference in quality between different HDTV programming). Therefore for me, DVD2DVDR is worth the time.

Rick

[HideOut]

What encoder does DVDshrink use? I used to use CCE but its soooo damned slow. I have a relatively decent PC (xp2000 OC'd mildly, 768MB DDR, etc) Instant copy and DVD2one are much faster with 2one being lesser quality. WOuld help perhaps if you could adjust the quality settings in 2one like you can IC. DVD2DVDr is just slow. I used to do SVCD with CCE and it was nearly 12 hours a movie with 3 pass VBR. Wish someone could get the speed and quality at the same time. Then i'd be more into paying $$$ for it. I just clone way to many DVDs to use a 12 hour program. Done something like 400 or so in the last 2 months. Whats getting more expensive is the drive space. Ive not deleted a completed movie in 3 months...2 TB nearly now.

HideOut

[defense]

try Patriot, Gladiator, Bourne Identity ...those movies and audio (main movie only) are 6GB or moree. CCE is clearly superior to IC7 output. No debate about it. I've done quite a few quality comparisions myself.

I've stppped commenting on these posts because people can't get it to sink in their skull.

Pretty hard to believe when the concept is very simple. ALL of these 1 step programs including IC7 can't hold the jockstrap of CCE when used with DVD2DVDR, DOITFAST4U or DVD2SVCD. The ones who cry about encoding time and say they see no difference should continue doing what makes them happy. But if ANYONE thinks IC7 is even a tick on the sack of a dog....they are sadly mistaking (PERIOD!)

will these posts EVER end? They are truly laughable.

[icemanatvcd]

Thanks for that MackemX. Very nice graph to illustrate your point of view. I appreciate your time and effort. I would have the green line meeting blue line about 86%.

As far HideOut quality does not seem to be a matter just quick processing. Goodluck with your methods, when you do upgrade your equipment then you will appreciate quality and feel a bit sorry!

Defense does not seem to agree with anyone. As many people will agree that there is minimal difference between IC7 and DVD2DVD-R (Note it is minimal difference).

[MackemX]

The ones who cry about encoding time and say they see no difference should continue doing what makes them happy. But if ANYONE thinks IC7 is even a tick on the sack of a dog....they are sadly mistaking (PERIOD!)

will these posts EVER end? They are truly laughable.

yet another narrow minded viewpoint .What's laughable are that people can be so narrow minded when it comes to the quality subject of backing up DVD's. You also hear the 'DVD2One ROCKS!' quotes but you also get the Diehards from the other end of the quality scale

everyone is entitled to an opinion but when you are laughing at quite a few people and you are in the minority laughing at them then I know I will believe

taken from another post

It ruffles my feathers when people who think that the app they use is the one everyone else should use and if they don't they are just wasting their time etc

basically you have the DVD2One etc users in the North Pole, the CCE etc users on the South Pole and the IC users on the equator

using mostly IC I'm roughly around the equator but I ain't afraid of expeditions to the North and South Poles depending on circumstances but I do feel some users cannot understand why others live where they live or don't travel, in other words narrow mindedness

I agree IC is crap and at 85%+ you can still see a huge quality difference during normal playback :P

p.s. I agree icemanatvcd, IC is probably closer at the higher levels but I just did a quick guestimate graph using Excel

[defense]

@MackemX, your post is not narrow minded, but rather ignorant. Your response shows your not in the narrow minded category, but the ignorant category. I will explain. I haven't looked at that B.S graph because it means absolutely zilch. Unless you've tried tests on HUNDREDS of different DVD's, then that chart can go where the sun doesn't shine.

What's more obvious and FACT is that every damn one of the people who were harping about how great DVD2ONE was, and how they got the best deal in the world..were the same ones CRYING when IC7 came out because they then felt they got ROBBED. The only thing the "majority" of the people agree on is what they really "WANT" to believe, as opposed to conducting their own tests to find out what is really truth.

I have conducted samples and NONE of the 1 step programs are in the same "sentence" with CCE. Playing DVD's back on high end equipment is also a variable, and i'm sure the "MAJORITY" do not own countless thousands of dollars in equipment. For these reasons, I said if people don't honestly see a difference then by all means use what method works best for you.

Yes, "I" find it laughable that people continue to sound like idiots when they proclaim DVD2ONE the absolute "BEST" program out there with ONE test, and then two weeks later, the same PEOPLE are crying and whining about how IC7 is so much better and how they feel cheated they purchased DVD2ONE.

I think you better do a little research jitterbug and find out where the "REAL" Majority stands. As I said, IC7 is just a tick on the sack of a dog. The ones who may not SEE a visual quality difference now, WILL on many movies SEE a quality difference when they get that pay raise and upgrade their equipment. 8)

[Faustus]

Personally to this day I'm still using DVD2SVCD with special settings to do movie only DVDs, on my XP2200+ it only takes about 4 hours and the quality is the best out there. CCE is a pro grade product and thought the others are fast even in my short attempts to play with them it became obvious there was a major difference between them.

Some can't see the difference, thats awsome, if I couldn't see it I would use it too, but I can and I guess I'm way to picky. So CCE it is for me, and will continue to be until something as good comes along.

Admittedly I have no tried IC7, but I have been meaning to give that one a go, it sounds like it might be a good balance between both ends of the specrum.

[Bel]

Well, I gave IC7 my first go the other day on a babylon 5 backup. Now, I normally do these episodes only with CCE and AVISynth, cutting the VBR average down to about 3000kb/s and then authoring with Maestro. I figured I'd give IC7 a whirl, and see if I noticed a quality difference, because it takes me quite awhile to do it the other way (albeit with excellent quality for the average kb/s.

I did a whole disc backup with IC7 and thought that on the whole it was really not bad for how simple it was. For smaller DVD-9's, I think I'll definitely keep using it. That being said, the quality was nowhere near what I got with my CCE 3-pass VBR. The picture was extremely grainy, almost like 6hour speed, vhs recorded stuff. Also, I thought it was a less bright flatter picture. It ended up not being good enough for me, and I reencoded with CCE last night. I know, its not a fair comparison because the IC7 copy included all the extras, and I may mess with the movie only hack a bit to see if it gets better. However, my first impression is that CCE gives much better quality at low bitrates.

[MackemX]

@MackemX, your post is not narrow minded, but rather ignorant. Your response shows your not in the narrow minded category, but the ignorant category. I will explain. I haven't looked at that B.S graph because it means absolutely zilch. Unless you've tried tests on HUNDREDS of different DVD's, then that chart can go where the sun doesn't shine.

the chart is a rough example showing that the difference gets smaller the % of the original size is retained. In no way does it reflect results but it's just showing an example the will give people a general idea
sadly mate, you again are the one who is ignorant and narrow minded

What's more obvious and FACT is that every damn one of the people who were harping about how great DVD2ONE was, and how they got the best deal in the world..were the same ones CRYING when IC7 came out because they then felt they got ROBBED. The only thing the "majority" of the people agree on is what they really "WANT" to believe, as opposed to conducting their own tests to find out what is really truth.

again, IC is not in the same group as the others it's in between those and CCE, but nearer CCE

I have conducted samples and NONE of the 1 step programs are in the same "sentence" with CCE. Playing DVD's back on high end equipment is also a variable, and i'm sure the "MAJORITY" do not own countless thousands of dollars in equipment. For these reasons, I said if people don't honestly see a difference then by all means use what method works best for you.

I do see a difference between the all ranging form the original right down to DVD2One and it's quite a variation but CCE ain't the magical tool you appear to make it out. Like I said at levels of 85% and above to see the difference on your setup during normal playback and for it to be enough to p1$$ you off is basically not worth the time/effort

Yes, "I" find it laughable that people continue to sound like idiots when they proclaim DVD2ONE the absolute "BEST" program out there with ONE test, and then two weeks later, the same PEOPLE are crying and whining about how IC7 is so much better and how they feel cheated they purchased DVD2ONE.

what's has that got to do with anything?

I think you better do a little research jitterbug and find out where the "REAL" Majority stands. As I said, IC7 is just a tick on the sack of a dog. The ones who may not SEE a visual quality difference now, WILL on many movies SEE a quality difference when they get that pay raise and upgrade their equipment. 8)

by you saying IC is just a tick on the sack of a dog just shows how narrow minded you are and if you actually said that at higher levels the difference is not as noticable but at lower levels the difference increases then maybe I would respect your opinion but basically your talking crap

the way you are bleating on about CCE is exactly the opposite of the DVD2One users saying it 'Rocks'

no doubt you will come back with anothe CCE is it's own little world malarky but I fell that the majority of users will realise how the gap at larger reduction levels is quite noticable and large and progressively get's smaller the smaller the reduction

sadly you do not and just assume that not even IC is not as good as a tick on a dog's sack which I and probably the majority of users who can see the difference know is complete BS because the difference is not consistent but increases the more you reduce

the whole purpose of the daft little graph was to show that rough difference and icemanatvcd actually saw the point of but you obviously didn't

if you'd said actually IC falls away steeper than what it does then maybe I would have seen some reason behind your post but nope, not a chance

Pretty hard to believe when the concept is very simple. ALL of these 1 step programs including IC7 can't hold the jockstrap of CCE when used with DVD2DVDR, DOITFAST4U or DVD2SVCD. The ones who cry about encoding time and say they see no difference should continue doing what makes them happy. But if ANYONE thinks IC7 is even a tick on the sack of a dog....they are sadly mistaking (PERIOD!)

will these posts EVER end? They are truly laughable.

like I said, sounds rather narrow minded to me cos you basically say that CCE is out of this world compared to the others and even more so regarding IC which I know and no doubt a few others know is complete and utter crap cos the difference depends on the mainly the reduction of size

However, my first impression is that CCE gives much better quality at low bitrates.

this is very good statement and depending on the original bitrate then the difference will be bigger and more than obvious or smaller and not as apparent but still there enough to notice even on the poorest of playback systems

[defense]

MackemX, I'm not going to get into a debate over which is better because I see that this post is going to turn into a war of the greater backup solution. I think flaystus said exactly what I wanted to say and said it much more concisely. I also read a post where flaystus had asked Baldrick to have a "sticky" for the most FAQ's which he created, and one of those questions which is most commonly asked was which program is the "BEST."

As he said, there is really no "BEST" in "MOST" occasions, as the end product will be viewed on countless different systems and appear to be a better quality to some, then to others. The point is that these type of posts have become too commonplace and to be quite honest, the majority of them are just ridiculous, not to mention, redundant. I think your choice of words by calling me "narrowminded" when I have SOLID FACTS to prove and backup my statements is once again, "ignorant" on your part.

You do know the definition of narrowminded, right "mate?" I do believe many people who post on this forum make statements which would be "narrowminded" but I am not one of those people. I look at "ALL" aspects of a situation, and don't derive my own conclusion until I've had the time to conduct MANY tests, as well as read countless posts.

I never bashed IC7 as I did "DVD2ONE" because the quality of IC7 was better in my opinion. However, it was not anywhere near the 85% you derived. On movies where the main PGC was at or exceeding 7 GB's, IC7 had clear, visual artifacts, while a 2 pass VBR in CCE had no artifacts and looked like the original. Those are the "facts" and I am extremely picky when it comes to quality with ANYTHING, and IC7 is no exception.

what's has that got to do with anything?

It has a lot to do with this thread. What it goes to show is that people will unfortuntely, more often then not, ask a question which they ONLY want to hear the answers they are looking for. DVD2ONE is just one example, while IC7 and DVDSRHINK are others. The "point" though is that people jump the gun much more quickly then they should.

They want to believe a "one step" proggy is the answer, and if someone responds with the answer they are looking for, they have an orgasm. But all hell breaks loose when they decide they wanna live in Fantasy Land and attempt to discredit the person or persons who have negative critiscim on their beloved product.

Bottom line is that IC7 is not in the same league as CCE. The proof is in the pudding. If people want to continue to live in Fantasy Land and say they see no difference on ANY of their movies, then I hope they continue to enjoy using their wonderful IC7 program.

[thippe]

i've gone w/ IC7 just cus i havnt had the patience to mess w/ dvd2dvd-r's settings. Anyone have an .ini file i can have?

[MackemX]

MackemX, I'm not going to get into a debate over which is better because I see that this post is going to turn into a war of the greater backup solution.

no war

As he said, there is really no "BEST" in "MOST" occasions, as the end product will be viewed on countless different systems and appear to be a better quality to some, then to others. The point is that these type of posts have become too commonplace and to be quite honest, the majority of them are just ridiculous, not to mention, redundant. I think your choice of words by calling me "narrowminded" when I have SOLID FACTS to prove and backup my statements is once again, "ignorant" on your part.

yes their is a best and that is CCE, all I disagree with you is that put CCE at such a high level and so close to the original and that IC cannot even achieve anything worth writing home about
where are these SOLID FACTS?, Dude, I noticed in your profile you have a $50 DVD player as your DVD player, that says a lot to me unless of course it's incorrect :P

You do know the definition of narrowminded, right "mate?" I do believe many people who post on this forum make statements which would be "narrowminded" but I am not one of those people. I look at "ALL" aspects of a situation, and don't derive my own conclusion until I've had the time to conduct MANY tests, as well as read countless posts.

again what tests and where these done on your $50 DVD player?

I never bashed IC7 as I did "DVD2ONE" because the quality of IC7 was better in my opinion. However, it was not anywhere near the 85% you derived. On movies where the main PGC was at or exceeding 7 GB's, IC7 had clear, visual artifacts, while a 2 pass VBR in CCE had no artifacts and looked like the original. Those are the "facts" and I am extremely picky when it comes to quality with ANYTHING, and IC7 is no exception.

I would call the tick on a dog's sack as bashing

It has a lot to do with this thread. What it goes to show is that people will unfortuntely, more often then not, ask a question which they ONLY want to hear the answers they are looking for. DVD2ONE is just one example, while IC7 and DVDSRHINK are others. The "point" though is that people jump the gun much more quickly then they should.

They want to believe a "one step" proggy is the answer, and if someone responds with the answer they are looking for, they have an orgasm. But all hell breaks loose when they decide they wanna live in Fantasy Land and attempt to discredit the person or persons who have negative critiscim on their beloved product.

Bottom line is that IC7 is not in the same league as CCE. The proof is in the pudding. If people want to continue to live in Fantasy Land and say they see no difference on ANY of their movies, then I hope they continue to enjoy using their wonderful IC7 program.

but I do see a difference, the thing is it gets so small at the higher levels of 85% or above unless you use PAUSE/ZOOM you will barely if at all notice it during normal playback. I can see why some people say that they see very little difference between DVD2One etc and the original because their setup is holding back on the full potential of the original. Even if you said 90% or even higher say is virtually impossible to distinguish during playback then maybe I would agree with you in some sort of way but sadly you don't

so I withdraw everything I said cos I can't be ar$ed cos I've seen a few of your posts previously and I now know I'm not getting anywhere

[defense]

lol..Mackem, again you show your ignorance. Not only in one way, but in a few. What do my posts have to do with this one? I've seen a few of your posts too and you have a tendency to say meaningless crap, just as you have here. This very post has you going back and forth with meaningless garbage with someone else.

As far as my standalone player.....my dear boy.....lol....what does the price have to do with the quality of player I have? I did hours of research on this site before getting that player. It plays EVERYTHING and would probably play a pancake. It has progressive scan and dollar for dollar It's probabaly the best player on the market. Maybe one or two others are in the same league.

Now since quality is always synonomous with price to you, what do you make of the fact that I gave my cousin a Sony DAV-S880 which is a pretty expensive player. I think they go for around $700. I didn't pay for it and my cousin needed a DVD Player and that "expensive" player was not nearly as versatile as my "cheap" player.

As far as the rest of my system goes, I have about $5,000 invested. My JBL surround system, (which i'm sure is shabby too many) was over $2,000 alone. Interestingly enough, my cousin has a 5.1 B&W surround speakers w/ which retail for about $8,000. He got a pretty good deal, but still paid a ton for them...and anyone who hears both of our systems, thinks mine sounds better.

I put the money where I thought it was worth it. I still can't believe how inexpensive it was, and i'm not sure where your seeing it for $50, but I don't buy things off of Ebay.

Bottom line is that CCE is as amazing as I make it out to be, and I can see noticeable differences in quality WITHOUT zooming. The tests i've conducted are on movies which are about 7GB's or more. That's where the boys are seperated from the men....testing a 4 GB movie doesn't do prove anything to me. I want original like quality for ALL movies, not movies which quality suffers due to the size.

[mrbass]

Man I love these forums over here on dvdrhelp. We live in a politically correct time where anything you say can be used against you in a court of peers.

I think Defense has a good point which I think is being misunderstood. All he's saying about all these "Best this, best that" posts is that some say blah blah blah is just as good as blah blah blah. He's saying to that person they is the "truth". But technically is false as $58 CCE is superior.

At the same token TMPGEnc is clearly superior for encoding MPEG-1 VCD compared to CCE. Did that stop some from using CCE to encoding VCDs..no it did not as all have their free agency.

[MackemX]

yes their is a best and that is CCE, all I disagree with you is that put CCE at such a high level and so close to the original and that IC cannot even achieve anything worth writing home about
where are these SOLID FACTS?, Dude, I noticed in your profile you have a $50 DVD player as your DVD player, that says a lot to me unless of course it's incorrect :P

there's no arguing that CCE is the best overall but what defense is yet to sadly admit is that the lower the reduction, the nearer IC get's to CCE's level of quality

I ain't gonna bother replying to defense's post regarding home entertainment systems cos it's each to their own regarding the quality of output but all I initially disagreed with was his very low opinion of IC so I'll leave it at that

now obviously quality is just one of a few factors used when deciding which tool to use and he's happy using CCE and I'm happy using whatever tool is needed for the project and that includes CCE

I'm actually very fussy about quality and I'll firstly watch the original anyway as I want the highest possible quality. On subsequent occasions such as movie evenings I'll may again pull out the original cos nothing can beat that. On less important occasions I can put up with the slight degradation of quality that the backup tools give so I guess that's why I now don't use CCE on all the projects

[tinkerbellsmyhoe]

ok first time i have stepped into these lame arguments. i think it is funny that everyone agrees that this is all based on the individuals opinions and time/effort involved.
but what about cost involved? no one really takes that into consideration. what is a LEGAL copy of CCE going for these days? and what is a LEGAL copy of IC7 going for. i know ic7 is 20 bucks because i bought it. i have no idea what CCE costs but i know it isnt cheap.
if the debate is this close, wouldnt the one that has the best benifit/cost ratio win hands down?
wouldnt that then put the "wars" closer to ic7 and every free tool?
if CCE cost 1950 http://tangentsoft.net/video/mpeg/reviews/cce-sp.html and it gave x quality output, then:
x/1950=ratio
if ic7 gave y quality output then:
y/20=ratio
and if dvdshrink gave z output then:
z/FREE=ratio

from this...wouldnt the numbers have to be x>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>y>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>z
for anyone to actually purchase CCE for home use?
commence flaming in Tminus 5,4,3,2,1...................

[mrbass]

http://www.visiblelight.com/mall/products/cinemacraft/CCEB.asp
CCE Basic can do 2 pass VBR and is $58. Only $10 more than than the $48 TMPGEnc http://www.pegasys-inc.com/

[MackemX]

yep, CCE is great for movie only but you can forget the legal costs of using CCE for full 1:1 backups

is it $15000+ for one of the authoring programs I wonder?

or what other authoring options are there that can reproduce the original DVD structure with serious authoring?