More proof that DVD+R is garbage.

[Valnar]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=51831

Flame away DVD+R zealots.

Robert

[orbital517]

How many people would EVER expose a DVD disk to direct sunlight for 20 days????? If you did, I feel for you.

[LanEvo7]

It didn't say 20 days, it says UV radiation equal to 20 days of sunlight in Germany.

But if your burning DVDs you should keep it in a cool dark place. Maybe this means +r might degrade faster.

[hde]

lol, I guess I'll sell my DVD+RW drive then and by a - one. Because I can't keep my disks in all this sunlight. Do you realize how much radiation that is ?

[newnoiseimage]

well, that convinces me. i knew storing my +r burns next to my nuclear power generator was a bad move. hey i have an idea, use what works for you, if +r sucks then why are they manufacturing more +/- r drives. i am sure that there is something better to argue about.

[thxkid]

I won't even go to the link, just because its just another stupid -R fan smashing away on crap he don't know anyway, please stay away from +R's justs leave more for me to buy and burn perfectly every time and with 100% playback on anything I try them on.

[Valnar]

He he.

Of course this was meant to be a flame. It's hard for people to stay away from these posts.

But they make valid points. I still trust my DVD-R's more. 8)

Here is another DVD-R supporting arguement on the media quality.
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39575
See the fourth post.

We all have to remember. It's not about what plays in your DVD player immediately after the burn, but if the disc still plays in 10 years. We'll all have to wait and see.

-Robert

[Valnar]

hey i have an idea, use what works for you, if +r sucks then why are they manufacturing more +/- r drives.

You do realize that has nothing to do with anything, right? They manufactured more VHS players over Betamax players, but that hardly made VHS better. And they made more VHS players than Laserdisc players, but that didn't make VHS better either.

Popular and quality seldom go together.

/rant off

I just had to get some juices flowing!

-Robert

[Faustus]

I must also point out that with a recent test performed by me I found that -R disk cannot survive being dipped in molten lead. Its a same really I expected more from the media manufactures.

Neiter format is crap, its just a questions of prefference.

THXKID, I'm glad you love your +R drive, leaves more disk for us - people!

[Bob W]

For me it's simple, I buy the lowest cost media with the fastest speed and that's why I use DVD-R more than I use DVD+R.

[WeedVender]

No one likes spam...

Whats the point. Its pointless. Make a debate on something that actually affects people. Not on some plastic media that expires in 5 years.

Anyway, I use the same methods to erase CDRW media.

[jsnkc]

It is just a known fact in the industry that the +R format will not be around much longer, it had a little spark when Micorsoft started to support it, but that will soon dwindle away just like the format. the -R format is the industry standard, most compatable and most widely used format across the world, and for good reason, it is better

[jgcarp22]

It is just a known fact in the industry that the +R format will not be around much longer, it had a little spark when Micorsoft started to support it, but that will soon dwindle away just like the format.

Can you post some links to back this claim up?

[VinnySem]

It is just a known fact in the industry that the +R format will not be around much longer, it had a little spark when Micorsoft started to support it, but that will soon dwindle away just like the format. the -R format is the industry standard, most compatable and most widely used format across the world, and for good reason, it is better

Yet more baseless facts from this guy. How can you state something as fact without supporting evidence? And don't give me "I'm a ten year professional" bullshit. Documented empirical evidence to support your claim. Otherwise it's mindless banter from another opinionated closeminded moron.

[vric]

it's a fact that -R is way more popular then +R.. but microsoft have big buck and small brain.. if they deceide +R win, it will win.. sad but it's microsoft.

anyway, I don't think any format will win.. both can exist simply becose both can be read by the same player (it's not like the old beta vs VHS) both can be read by the same unit and there is no reason a format need to win this battle..

+R user are happy and -R user are also happy... stay like this.

[version20]

First of all, the referenced thread was hardly proof of anything other than some people are retards...

and speaking of retards - vric, what does microsoft (a software manufacturer) have to do with the success of dvd+r or -r? They dont make burners, and both formats work with windows simply depending on which burner you purchased.

I bet someone out there has even used a dvd+r burner under linux *gasp*

-v20

[vric]

First of all, the referenced thread was hardly proof of anything other than some people are retards...

and speaking of retards - vric, what does microsoft (a software manufacturer) have to do with the success of dvd+r or -r? They dont make burners, and both formats work with windows simply depending on which burner you purchased.

I bet someone out there has even used a dvd+r burner under linux *gasp*

-v20

thanks for calling me retards... your opinion is very importent to me

[Gil T Pleasure]

anyway, I don't think any format will win.. both can exist simply becose both can be read by the same player (it's not like the old beta vs VHS) both can be read by the same unit and there is no reason a format need to win this battle..

I agree. I think both will coexist until something bigger and better comes along. Someone once said, "the success of one format doesn't necessarily mean the death of the competing format." (or something like that )

[jsnkc]

Yes, I'll get some for you guys tomorrow.

[LanEvo7]

and speaking of retards - vric, what does microsoft (a software manufacturer) have to do with the success of dvd+r or -r?

Just because two companines aren't directly related, doesn't mean one's change won't affect the other. If Microsoft came out tomorrow and said we will not support -R on any future operating systems and all further updates on current operating systems will not recognize -R drive, how do you think the market for -R will go? Lets face it, the majority of people use a Microsoft operating system. If Microsoft came out and said that statement, people who already have -R will be furious, and people who is thinking about buying a dvd burner will go +R to avoid any future hassle.

[tjtoed]

The chance of Microsoft coming out and saying that is pretty small and why would they???

They would be losing at least half or more than half of their users from ever upgrading to the new Microsoft OS.

I think both formats will be around and supported for a long time as there are plenty of people like us to support both formats.

It is stupid to argue about something that is a personal preference!!!

[LanEvo7]

Microsoft would never say that, I was just saying that to prove a point.

[Doggiedaddy]

No wonder there are threads all over complaining about flaming in the forums. I have some HP 200i and a couple of Pioneer DVR 105's and buy which ever media I can find @ the time for the best bang for the buck [both work well for me] All of our personal DV treasures will be moved to Blue Ray or what ever flavor of the month is out there by then for sure.

PS: Who cares if the backed up copy of what will be a long outdated DVD media plays in 10 years anyway. If any of it matters it would only be the OEM Disc, maybe as a retro-classic form of entertainment media of long ago listed on EBAY. More than likely in the same category of an 8 track tape is now, by then.

justmy2cents
Dd

[taz291819]

What Microsoft is planning on implementing into the next version of Windows is a "Drag-n-Drop" feature for DVD+R/RW like currently is available for CD-R/RW. This is basically DLA being implemented directly into Windows. As some whom have tried it know, if you install DLA software under WinXP and have a DVD-burner also, the software causes major problems (actually more of an inconvience) with other media drives. I personally know of the DLA software problems under WinXP because I had Stomp DLA installed in the past. With regards to the Microsoft comments, I had read this on another forum (I believe it was Dell's site). But now, who really uses "Drag-n-Drop" under Windows for a DVD? Obviously this would be for data discs because I doubt dvd-authoring will be incorporated into Windows anytime in the near future (or I may be wrong about that). Anyways, I don't think DVD-R owners need to worry about what Microsoft is going to do with Windows because DLA is not that big of a deal. I personally believe the +VR feature of DVD+R/RW is more important than DLA.

A happy owner of a NEC ND-1100A

[vitualis]

Obviously, some people can't see past the flames...

Actually, that referenced thread is rather interesting. It seems like that the -R media is more robust against UV radiation damage than the +R media. I would be interested to know why.

Regards.

[Bob W]

Obviously, some people can't see past the flames...

Actually, that referenced thread is rather interesting. It seems like that the -R media is more robust against UV radiation damage than the +R media. I would be interested to know why.

Regards.

Yeah that is weird and after reading that I moved my DVD storage rack to the back of my room away from the window.

[disturbed1]

I'm Pro DVD-R, or however I'm branded,

but I wouldn't even use that for my gospel.

Agreed with vitualis, is interesting, I guess one could compare the findings to the likes of storing your DVDs on a shelf in front of a window.

But it seems pretty much common sense to me, that you should keep all types of media away from heat, and sunlight.

------------------
That's funny, Bob posted seconds before I did, had the same idea about the window, guess I'm lucky my entertainment room is the basement, dark and cool.

[VinnySem]

There is a big difference in having a personal preference and presenting as fact that one format is better than the other. Personal preference can only be based on YOUR OWN experiences with EACH media. If you've not tried both formats, how can you have an opinion on both? It defies logic.

A fact is only valid if backed up with accurate imperical data. I've not seen ANY such data for either -R or +R.

Now, my PERSONAL PREFERENCE, is DVD-R. I have tried both, I have a Sony dual-format burner. I prefer -R for a few reasons:

1) Media is still less expensive. There are more bargain brand -R media to be had than +R. There are a few stores, such as BestBuy, that sell each format from the same manufacturer at the same price. But from what I've seen, these instances are few.

2) From my experiences with my Sony burner, it seems that "test mode" burns are not supported by +R media. After a recent rash of coasters with Verbatim +R media that cost me damn near 3 bucks a piece, to me that is a deterrent for purchasing +R. I'll spend the extra 20+ minutes doing a test run rather than waste a disk.

Now, don't get me wrong - there are definite benefits to +R. For one, ALL +R media is 2.4X write speed. No matter which brand you buy, you will always be able to burn a full disk in around 20-30 minutes. There are not the uber-bargain 1x only media that -R has. Also, the +R burners burn CD-Rs at higher speeds than -R. My old Pioneer 104 only burnt CDs at 8X, forcing me to keep my 24X Sony CD-RW.

[hxc3634]

I like DVD-R because it's cheaper but I like DVD+RW because it's faster. DVD+RW is good for regular system backup.I don't know why it's difficult to find cheap 2x DVD-RW.

[LanceSteel]

Obviously, some people can't see past the flames...

It's nice to see there are others that can put emotion aside and look at the data given.

Actually, that referenced thread is rather interesting. It seems like that the -R media is more robust against UV radiation damage than the +R media. I would be interested to know why.

I find this very interesting. I'm currently chemistry grad student and although this is a organic chemistry issue (which I'm not an organic chemist) I do know a little about why the dyes degrade. As everyone knows, UV radiation has a shorter wavelength and thus higher energy than that of visible light and much higher energy than IR. I don't know what wavelength of UV light is used during the burning process for a dvd-r/+r but I believe that it is somewhere on the edge of the visible/UV boundry (maybe even more into the UV area.) The molcules used in the dye go through a convertion from one form to another, hence the change in reflectivity. Well what happens when to put it in sunlight? Sunlight, as everyone knows as well, contains all wavelengths of light some with as much or more energy than that of the laser used in burning the disk. Leaving it in the sun more than likely converts all or most of the dye to the reflective form or, if the EM radiation is powerful and of high enough energy, the dye may be broken down completely.