Digital Camcorder?

[booboobubber]

Hi I hope you can help. I own an old analouge Camcorder and would like to transfer my footage onto CD. I currently do not own a computer that can do this although I have captured a small amount of home video on the work computer using its TV card when my boss is not looking.

I have been saving for my own computer for what feels like an eternity and I am just about there. The advice and recommendations I have been given in computer stores has been very different so I am now very confused. One salesman has suggested that I buy a digital camcorder and transfer my analouge video to DV tape via the digital camcorder. He seems to beleive that my computer requirements will be less complicated and my capturing will be simpler. He says that most new computer packages are coming out these days with firewire ports.

Does any one agree with this sales man?

If so is there any special features I should look for in a digital camcorder?

My main reason for wanting to capture my old analouge home videos is to preserve them as some of my tapes are reaching 15years old. I would like to do some editing as well but that would be just for fun.

[Thorn]

Umm, was he trying to sell you the camcorder too?

While dv may be simpler to capture (not really sure what I think about that) the first thing I would think of is how much that camcorder will cost you, in addition to your computer. I don't think if you can get ones with passthrough for less than a few hundred.

You can get a capture card for your computer for $50-100 and capture the signal in analog mode. For best quality (and you may want to play with it for optimal quality) you'd need some time and some hard drive space. There are ways to capture and encode quicker (and with less disk space) if you're willing to sacrifice some quality.

If you don't really have a need for a new camcorder then you may find the money better spent on a better computer (or not spent at all). However, if you want to archive the video to DV tape now and get a computer later (or even just have a desire for a new camcorder) this may be a good option. I'm not an expert on that as I don't transfer any analog media into my camcorder (since it doesn't have analog input...).

Also, it's hard to prescribe anything when you don't say what format you want on that cd... do you want it as a VCD (often playable on a dvd player) or as a divx file (better video quality for the same space, but it only plays on computers) or what.

As for DV camcorders, one of the more important features would be analog pass-through (where it would take analog video and convert to DV in real-time so you could capture the DV as it plays. Other features to measure include optical zoom, lux rating (the dimmest light it can still see in) and such. There was a thread on that not too far back, but I don't remember which one. Anyway, I'm just throwing out a few thoughts, so hopefully someone else will give a more coherent thought to it.

[booboobubber]

Thanks for the quick reply.

My main concern with my VHS-C tapes is that as some of my tapes are reaching the 15 year old mark, which is the same age as my video camera which is still working fine, that my tapes are going to or already have deteriate. When I first started looking into buying a computer to capture my tapes to it was with the intention to transfer my home vids from VHS-C to CD as SVCD or to DVD if I choose to get a DVD burner. My confusion started first with some sales men highly recoomending DVD as the format to convert to and others suggesting SVCD on CDR media as being the most compatable. Then just when I thought I couldn't be anymore unsure of the right choice to make with my computer purchase another salesman suggested Mini dv as being the best format to transfer my VHS-C tapes to. He suggested I buy a digital camcorder and tranfer my tapes to the dv tapes through the camera and from those tapes capture to my computer and edit if I need to.

Which is best? VHS-C to SVCD on CD-R or
VHS-C to DVD on DVD-R or
VHS-C to MINIDV tape

[vandakeg]

If all you're looking for is archival of your home videos, I'd say go with the digital camcorder. You're probably going to have to spend $500-$600 dollars for a decent camcorder w/ analog pass-through (btw, you don't need mini-dv, digital 8 will give you the same quality at a cheaper price).
The benefits to storing on DV are:
1. You lose no quality.
2. You can easily import the video into a computer (if you choose to get one later), for editing or DVD Authoring.
3. DV tapes hold approximately 15gb of video data per 60 minute tape.

The only cons I can see to this option are:
1. You don't get a new computer!
2. DV tapes aren't as cheap as DVD or CD media.

[Thorn]

If you're not deadset on getting to CD right away then a DV camcorder could be a great option. Here's another thought, but I don't know if the technology is right yet: I think Hitachi is making a camcorder that records on DVD-RW (maybe DVD-R). Unfortunately I think it uses 8cm dvd discs so I don't know if that would work in your DVD player or if it even has analog inputs. If it did work, however, you could go right to disc with no computer... could be cool. On the other hand, with a DV tape you could make another copy onto VHS tape to watch if you didn't get a computer right away.

In case you didn't notice, everyone has a different opinion on what's best, and I've got more than one myself

[booboobubber]

I was thinking of buying a computer that was fitted with a Pinnacle studio Deluxe capture card to capture video from my VHS-C camcorder but it has been suggested that I could upgrade my camcorder to a minidv video with analouge pass through and just capture using a standard firewire port. A lot of computers have have looked at in the stores come with a firewire port as standard. If I was to purchase one of the cheaper MiniDV videos and a computer that comes with a firewire port as standard the price works out much the same as it would if I just purchased the computer and had pinnacle studio deluxe installed.

Would buying a MiniDv video with passthrough be a better option or would I acheive better results capturing my VHS-C directly to PC using the Pinnacle card and upgrading to a MiniDv video at a later date when I could afford to buy one of the more expensive ones?

PS.... the cheap MiniDV I looked at was a panasonic(don't know the model) and it did have pass through for analogue but not a lot of other fancy features.

[yg1968]

It depends what you are ready to spend on. A digital camcorder with passthrough is great for capturing. It is also great for filming! I haven't regreted buying one despite the fact that it is more expensive. However, if you don't need a camcorder, it is an expensive option. A DV camcorder captures in DV which can be transmited through a firewrire port. avi. As far as software, Windows movie maker can capture DV, so there is no need to buy software for capturing. If you don't mind the price, a miniDV camcorder is certainly one of the best options available for capturing.

For encoding to mpeg, TMPGEnc is one of the best programs to use. Obviously DVD is better than SVCD or VCD but again, it is more expensive. If you buy a DVD burner, it will come with software. Perhaps, you should start with VCD or SVCD and then when you are used to it, move up to DVD. Don't forget that some DVD video players do not play VCDs or SVCDs. For DVDs, there is two competing formats DVD+R and DVD-R. You are better off getting a Sony DRU-500 which records both formats.

Yet another option is to get a set top DVD Video burner. It is probably the easiest and fastest option. But it is harder to customize the menus on your DVDs with the set top recorders.

See this website for more info on DVD burners:

www.dvdplusrw.org

[stromberg70]

If you want to transfer your old analog video tapes to CD, I suggest that you buy a device called Instant VCD. It is a device that plugs into a USB port on your computer. The device also comes bundled with the software Ulead Videostudio Basic. With this software you can also do basic video editing and burn your analog video to CD. I bought mine at my local computer store for about 60 bucks. If you are interested in purchasing this device, go to the manufacturers website, www.adstech.com.

[pijetro]

I'm in the exact same boat as you are, except I went through the painfull process of learning everything from captures to VCD to SVCD. My VHSc tapes were precious to me. In the end I finally realized, to get the closest quality you can to your original source, you've gotta get the DVD bitrates. IMHO, the pinnacle route is nice, but perhaps proprietary.

IMHO, it funnels down on two choices. Buy a decent capture card, and burn on DVD's, or enjoy the camcorder. At worst, if you don't burn DVD's, you'll have something archived for when the burners fall in price and the tapes won't loose quality. The good thing about miniDV is that you can play out of the house (unless you live in front of the computer). Both miniDV and DVD-r look to be promising for the future, as for SVCD???? Great for ripping DVD movies, but won't be up to snuff for your analogue captures. I'm leaning towards the camcorder. It's your money. Read some more posts, and hopefully you won't get screwed when you buy your camcorder.

Good luck!!!!!

[Thorn]

I hope I'm not just babbling at this point, but here's something else that might be of interest. There are settop dvd-recorders that would essentially allow you to record directly to DVD. Unfortunately they're about $700-$1k so a pc would be cheaper.

[ktnwin]

I agreed with Thorn, why don't you spend the money on a set-top DVD recorder and transfer your VHS tape to DVD-R discs. That's quick and easy, no hassles with capturing, converting, authoring and burning.
I have gone thru all that and my next step is to buy a DVD writer to create DVD instead of X/S/VCD discs. I am thinking between 300$ and 800$. The second one is much quicker and easier to deal with.
If I had no PC, no DV camcorder, shedding close to 800$ would be my immediate choice.

[booboobubber]

Is it true that mini dv tapes won't deteriate over time like VHS-C tapes do?
And if I transfer my VHS-C tapes to digital tapes how long could they be stored before they lose quality?

[vhelp]

booboobudder,

unfortunately, they too also deteriorate. After all, they are tape!! just like
VHS tapes. People get confused in the excitement of Digital formats and
how it's quality wont be lost - but that's in the digital sense, NOT in the
media that IS holding/storing that info. If you stretch your miniDV tape,
I'm quite sure you'll be surprised that the results you get when you played
back that miniDV tape, be it through firewire or analog capture.

-vhelp

[booboobubber]

So if DV tape also deteriates as VHS-C tapes do then would it be a better choice to just capture my VHS-C tapes to a computer and burn them to SVCD or DVD rather then taping them to Mini DV tape first and then capturing to a computer using a firewire port?

[vhelp]

booboobubber,

relax. Don't get caught up in the Tape thing. It will do find for many months
down the road. You aran't planning on storing these tapes for YEARS...
Right??

That's what we're talking about here. Tape vs. Tape for LONG periods of
years for storage.

Are you planning on taking footage onto miniDV tapes and then STORE them
for years to come?? Hope not. DVD burners are basically the replacement
for that route and then some.

-vhelp

[booboobubber]

The problem I'm having at the moment is with deciding whether I would be better off buying a computer that I can capture my VHS-C tapes to and then burn them to either CD or DVD or buy a Mini DV camcorder and transfer my VHS-C recordings to Mini DV to be stored for a year or so until I can afford a good computer.

At the moment I can afford either a good quality Mini DV or a good computer with a DVD burner. I do plan on eventually buying both but at the moment can only afford one or the other if I was to get the best available at the moment.

My VHS-C camcorder is still working fine at the moment. The trouble with tech stuff is as soon as you buy something there is something even better and cheaper on the market. So would it be wiser to buy the Mini DV and wait for the computer when prices come down on DVD burner etc.... or buy the computer and wait for further advancements to the Mini Dv camcorders.

Either way they are both only going to get better and cheaper in the future but if you had the money to spend on one today which do you think would be money better spent?

I'm a woman and find it very hard to decide. Just when I think I have decided I change my mind again. It's a pain.

Any opinions would be appreciated.

[vhelp]

booboobudder,

I don't think a year or so will hurt your miniDV tapes quality. More like
maybe 5 or 10 years, but not 1 or 2 - I don't think.

But, i have a few miniDV tapes that I've had since I first got my Canon
ZR-10 DV Cam since the earlier part of this year. I've made a number of
recording to miniDV tapes, and a umber of them I've kept for archival
purposes (DVD writer or I perfect my encodng skills to a level I can accept
w/ out any regrets)

I had, since bought many miniDV tapes, since they are cheaper to buy when
in packs like 6pks for $27 - a good price at the moment. I have nearly
so far, 100 miniDV tapes and counting, soon as I can get the CAM fixed.
It still works and all, but it records/plays w/ partials videos, or when it is
recording to tape, though tape is showing recording, when I finally do get
to play them, some scenes cut out and play what was played prior to THAT
recording, and/or cuts in one scene and/or another - kind of weird but I
did narrow it down to my dropping the unit while recording/playing 3 or 4
too many times.

So, be very careful w/ yours, if you get one.

-vhelp

[vhelp]

.
.
I didn't finish reading your post, and pressed the submit button too quickly.

I think:
* I would buy the PC system now.
* perfect my capturing and encoding skills now, so that. . .
* then, get a miniDV cam (prices should be lower by then) . . .would be
.. ready to encode your DV footage.

Perhaps you would do better to start getting your hand dirty w/ some
encoding skills now. Wont do you no harm.

-vhelp
PS: its ok to change your mind today, tomorrow, or as many times as you see fit!

[fonoop]

I'd agree with Thorn, buying a set-top dvd recorder is a much easier option to buying a computer with a dvd-recorder. The quality is the same and it saves alot of time. Think about, steps for computer:capturing, encoding, burning. This will take you about 3 times longer than just simply recording it in real time. The model I have, the panasonic dmr-e20 is down to $615. The quality on sp (2 hours) is the same as what you put in. So, i put in my vote for that.

[xed]

There are several important issues that may have been overlooked.
The first issue that fewer and fewer digital camcorders nowadays support analog video inputs. Sony, for instance, has yanked analog video inputs form their Digital 8 camcorders. Other m'fers have started doing the same thing.
The other iimportant issue involves sync.
If you want to capture an analog VHS source into a DV capture card on your computer, you might well have to spend plenty of buck to get a digital time base corrector. TBCs are not cheap. They can run > $1000.
The reason you might need a TBC is that the analog sync track of VHS videotapes tends to degrade over time. As the tapes age, the sync track can fail to lock in properly and this is why older analog VHS tapes tend to show hash on the top or bottom of the sreen,and also why the picture sometimes drops out entirely for a moment. This is the sync track degrading due to thermal stretch and compression with temperature cycles as the tape ages).
The problem here is that a DV capture card requires a rock-solid video sync signal. Old VHS-C videotapes may welll have degraded sync tracks such that the DV capture card cuts out unpredictably during capture. In that case, your _only_ option involves paying some serious scudi for a digital Time Base Corrector to stick in between the VHS-C camcorder and the computer DV cpature card.
The advanatage of a digital cmacorder, IF it has analog video inputs, is that digital camcorders typically all have time base correctors built in. This means that you will NOT encounter capture failure even if your VHS-C videotape is so old that hte playback temporarily wigs out.

[booboobubber]

Thanks xed, but I'm a little confused by what you have just explained. If I was to buy a computer fitted with say the Pinaccle Studio Deluxe which allows both analogue and digital and than captured my VHS-C tapes directly to to the PC using the analogue input on the card could I possibly experience the problems with time base that you have desdribed or does that only apply if I was trying to capture my analogue via a firewire port some how?

If it is the case that capturing analouge via any input, TV card etc can cause the above mentioned problems and the need to buy a TBC than would you suggest a Mini DV with analouge input and TBC a good first choice for purchase?

[xed]

This goes into more detail than you might prefer about the problem of capturing analog video into your computer from a source with dicey sync.
Analog TV is an analog format. That means that all the signals exist as continuous voltages. NTSC video format uses 60 interlaced frames per second and 30 fields per second consisting of alternate scan lines.
In order to synchronize the interlacing of the scan lines, NTSC video employs a vertical blanking interval between fields. This vertical blanking interval contains the information necessary to syncrhonize the vertical retrace of your TV screen. Essentially what your TV does is to use the electron gun to trace alternate scan lines down the screen once, then retrace and trace again using the next set of scan lines. There are 525 scan lines in NTSC video, so the electron gun first paints lines 1, 3, 5, 7 etc, then retraces and paints lines 2, 4, 6 etc.
The vertical blanking interval is synchronized by using the rate of our American AC 2-phase power lines. Our American AC 2-phase power lines are spec'd at 60 Hz + or - 1%. So in effect, NTSC video allows the power company (COnEd, or whomever) to generate the sync signal for our TV sets. (This incidentally is why PAL format video uses 50 Hz with a different number of scan lines. PAL video also uses the British power companies to generate the sync signal, in their case at 50 Hz since the Brits use 50 Hz 220 volt power as opposed to American 60 Hz 110 volt power.)
The oint is that the sync signal is stored as an analog voltage on analog VHS tape. This sync signal degrades over time. The analog tape voltages are stored as percentages of ferrite particles oriented in a particular direction; as the videotape heats up and cools down, it moves closer to and frather away from teh Curie point, thermalizing I(randomizing) the direction of the ferrite particles. Eventually thermal noise swamps the analog signal recorded on videotape and the sigtnal gets so faint it doesn't register properly.
Here is specifically how a degraded sync track on an analog videotape will cause your analog DV capture to shut down:
Your analog DV capture card typically requires a signal with a proper vertical blanking interval. If the DV capture card does not get that proper VBI, it will not be able to decode the analog NTSC video signal properly in order to digitize it. Why?
Here is what happens when a DV capture card digitizes your NTSC analog video signal:
The first interlaced set of scan lines is read as a set of voltages which are then converted to number via a high-speed analog-to-digital video converter (a flash ADC). These numbers are stored in a frame buffer. The next set of interlaced scan lines is also converted, stored in a second frame buffer. These frame buffers are then written out as binary numbers to digital video tape.
It is crucial that the DV capture card know when each interlaced frame begins and ends. How does it know this? By reading the sync signal contained in the vertical blanking interval recorded on your analog VHS tape.
If the sync signal becomes corrupted, your DV capture card will no longer be able to detect where the interlaced frame begins and ends. Since the frame buffer of your DV capture card is not very large, failure to detect the proper start or end of the interlaced analog video frame will result in a buffer overrun. At that point your DV capture card wil report an error condition and automatically halt capture.
---
In practical tuerms, this means that if there is any degradation in the analog sync signal recorded on your VHS tape (even degradation so slight you can't see aproblme) your DV capture card will report an error condition to the computer and the computer will halt capture.
---
Why does inserting a tibe base corrector correct this problem?
Because a TBC regenrates the sync information. In fact a TBC strips out the vertical blanking interval containing sync info and inserts new fully regenerated sync info.
As a practical matter this means that even if your analog VHS videotape is so badly degraded that the playback goes compeltely haywire to the oint where your VCR or VHS -C camcorder picture goes nuts for a minute, the TBC will generate rock-solid sync info and your DV card will still capture the video (albeit with some garbled video).
---
If you don't understand any of this, it doesn't matter. Bottom line: trying to capture to a DV input card from any VHS deck or VHS analog camcorder without a digital time base corrector will probably not be successful for more than a couple of minutes at most.
This means that DV capture cards are not very useful with VCRs unless youinsert a TBC twixt the VCR and the DV capture card. Caveat: some newer VHS VCRs include built-in time base correctors. For example, my Toshiba M785 VHS VCR includes a built-in time base corrector. This means taht I can capture to a DV card from my VHS VCR. However, most VHS VCRs and certainly all consumer-grade analog VHS camcorders will not work successfully with a DV capture card for more than a few seconds or a couple of minutes at a time, in all likelihood.
If this sounds like a scam, you're right. DV capture cards shoudl include built-in TBCs. Most don't. That's a serious failing in the manufacture and design of DV capture cards. (But you already knew DV capture cards were designed by idiots by reading this forum, didn't you?)
---
Most digital camcorders contain built-in time base correctors. Therefore they do not shut off if the video signal gets corrupted. I know this for a fact because I have used my digital camcorder to capture the whole urn of Babylon 5. Even when the cable signal goes out entirely, the camcorder continues to capture the video. Try that with a DV capture card.
---
As for the robustness of digital video tape, or lack thereof, bear in mind that digital video works in an entirely different way from analog video. All a digital camcorder needs to do is disintiguish a 1 from a 0. As long as it can do that, the digital video signal will play back correctly. Analog videotape must record a wide range of varying voltages. As they degrade, the quality of the sync and of the picture gradually degrades on a VHS-C camcorder, or a VHS VCR.
However, digital videotape is *much* more sensitive to crud on the video heads, in my experience. You have seen the results of this if you watch commercial TV. Most network TV programs are recorded on DV format tape, and if you watch network TV you will noticed that the video occasionally breaks up into sqare multicolored blocks and the audio momentarily drops out. This is crud buidlup on the heads of the DV video deck at the network affiliate. I know because when too much oxide junk builds up on the heads of my digital camcorder, I get exactly the same problems. The solution is to use a head cleaning tape.
Digital video tapes use a different and higher coercivity than analog videotapes in order to accomodate a much high information density. This is the reason why digital videotapes are relatively more sensitive to the buildup of oxides on the camcorder head.

[booboobubber]

Thanks for your reply xed, but your answer was a little hard for a dummie like me to really come to any conclusion whether one capture method is better than the other in regards to capturing analogue direct to PC or Via a Mini DV camcorder with passthrough. I'm sure the answer is in your post but I just can't find it.

I'd like to thank everybody who has responded to my post. Every reply has given me information that has really helped me with my research into my impending purchase. I still don't know what I'm going to buy yet but I'm certainly a lot better prepared than I was prior to this post.

Any further advice would also be very appreciated.

Thanks again.

[yg1968]

Xed,

I haven't heard of Sony yanking its analog in. As far as I know, most Sony miniDV or Digital 8 camcorders have a passthrough feature. The TRV-140 does not have it, so avoid it but the others usually have it. For example the following Digital8 camcorders have it: TRV-240, TRV-340, 740 and 840. Most (if not all) Sony miniDV camcorders also have it: the TRV-18,25, etc.

See their website: www.sony.com and look for the passthrough feature in specifications. The only one that I could find that does not have it was the TRV-140 (so again avoid that model).

[yg1968]

booboobuber,

You may want to consider the Digital 8 TRV-240 or the miniDV TRV-18. You can always get a DVD burner later. The Digital 8 or miniDV tapes will last long enough for you to transfer them to DVD once that you get around to buying one. DVD burners prices are expected to drop in the next couple of years. (Incidentally, Digital 8 uses DV).

Perhaps, you can go to a superstrore (where you are allowed to return the Sony digital camcorder no question asked) and essentially try it out. I doubt that you will return it.

P.S. As mentionned above, avoid the TRV-140 as it does not have pass through.

[G-man]

Canon ZR-40 has required analog inputs (and proper pass thrus for later) and can be had for under $500 via mail order. Sams Club sells DV tapes for a bargain in packs of 4.

Buy a Digital Vidcam, copy your tapes and wait. And make more video tapes while you are waiting ......

In another couple of years the whole process of putting Video onto DVDs will get much cheaper and easier. In a few years you will be able to buy a DVD recorder for under $400 or a PC that can do fancy video editing and burn DVDs for under $800. Remember how expensive PCs and CD burners USED to be?

I vote for patience ........

[TOMMO]

It is totally understandable that you are confused, there are so many aspects to consider. All of the recommendations put forward are sound and would work for you. But look at at it this way.

I am not in favour in all in wonder type capture cards. Dedicated capture cards do a better job. If you agree, then you have to consider what are the puchase options. Pinnacle capture cards such as the DV500plus etc. These can capture analogue and DV. But they are good, come with good software and work very well. However they are relatively complicated. They also are expnesive. I think around £500. I have used similar and have produced VCD and SVCD. For home movies, the ONLY satisfactory method was SVCD.

Other option. Buy a Digital 8 camera, and a firewire card. My TRV120E cost £350 and the Firewire card was £47. Hey presto, connected the two up and went on to capture without any problems, quality was great. By my calculations you have saved £100, which would go along way to buying a DVD burner, -R format or +R, which ever you fancy, I decided to go the +R route with the Philips DVDRW228 and have not regreted it. Quality of home movie from DV is great written as MPEG2. Even the Analogue is good as DVD.

Having seen the results of both, I would not hesitate in going down the DV and firewire route, making sure that the DV camera can either accpet your tapes or have a working pass through port.

[booboobubber]

WOW, these relpies have been fantastic, but my head is just spinning with all the options I have in front of me. After a lot of consideration I have been leaning toward getting myself a good DV camcorder and then buying my editing computer in the future. But, although one salesman supported the theory of capturing my VHS-C tapes to DV and than to PC via firewire, every other DV camcorder salesman highly recommended not to use that feature of the DV camcorder as I would be disappointed in the quality captured. To be honest most of these guys selling this stuff in the stores I have been to don't have any experience with video capture but one store I went to the guy sold both computers and DV camcorders. His reccomendation was to buy a computer and the canopus DVC100 to get the best quality capture of my analougue video. His opinion was that if I used a DV camcorder for capture the picture quality would not be as good. Now, in his store he only carried one DV camcorder a sony $2500AU that had analogue passthrough. He had other cameras that he believed were better but did not have the passthrough feature and they were a lot cheaper.

So does anyone know if it is true that you pay more and sacrafice features to have passthrough?

Is it really better to capture analogue using a capture card like the Canopus DVC100 rather than a DV camcorder?

Or is this just another salesman srewing with my head?

[vhelp]

booboobubber,
basically, we're all just screwing w/ your head. But, in reality,
those store salesman don't know didly-scquatt about video capturing/encoding, and most of all "what aquality really is"
when it comes to capturing/encoding/authoring and then finally,
playing on your DVD player. When you are searching for the best setup
you can afford, best not to bother w/ salesman, cause most likely, none
of them have ever picked up a capture card, well, other than to price it
and point to it... the most expensive one that is. . .

Here's something to think about.
* you buy the camcorder, you play around w/ it for a while - a day, a week
or a month, who knows. Then, you start telling yourself, "now what?"
You can't really do much except take footage w/ the camcorder. The
actuall learning curve is not that great vs. the capture, encoding, and
finally, authorizing to CDR media for final play (and enjoyment)
* or, better yet...
You could buy the pc, maybe even a capture card, and LEARN the process
of capturing, encoding and authoring... working out the bugs in your
process, all the while, picking up tips from this FORUM. Buy the time
you ARE ready ($$ financially) to afford the camcorder (which by the way
will be a little bit more cheaper by then) you'll have a better chance at
your video endeavors.
You'll undoubltly find bugs in your PC setup, and that takes times to
workout and/or figure out in fixing. You'll need to get this area worked
on first. If you go with the camcorder first, as I stated above, in add
ition, you'll be even more frustrated, cause IMO, buying the camcorder
first:
- is a waist of time, since you can't really do anything but take videos
- will add more to your frustration
- will quickly come bored w/ it in no time, and wish you got the pc 1st instead
- ...and then some

Well, my opinion is to get a good PC first, and learn the process by
doing, NOT READING the many posts here, cuase it doesn't work that way,
when you don't have a PC in front of you to test all that this FORUM has
to offer you in knowledge.
Then, get the camcorder. Mind you, you wont be a wiz at the video encoding
and authoring, but you'll have a better chance at less frustration and
be more tuned to excitement vs. boredom and giving up.

I'm thinking that you already have your mind set on getting a camcorder.
Oh well. ...I warned you. Can't say I told you so. 8)

-vhelp

[booboobubber]

Thanks vhelp, your probably right the computer would be more fun and as I have a VHS-C camcoder that still works it would probably be the smarter choice. I'm a woman that has a hard time making a desicion. Your right I was leaning toward the DV camcorder, I have a 2 year old and I love taking video of her and I figured as DV is better quality I should upgrade and take advantage of the analogue input to store my VHS-C tapes on DV for future capture to PC. I have had some experience with capturing, editing, converting and burning to VCD using my work PC which is fitted with a TV card. The X/VCD's I produced were pretty good but as the whole process is pretty time comsuming I wasn't getting much work done. Besides my boss has concerns about the toll it has on the harddrive so that was the end of that.