Any Terrapin VDR Owners Please Read

[koi kichi]

I'm after some advice as to whether or not to buy the Terrapin. I currently own a Harmony VDR which is a re-branded Likko and I'm having major problems with audio synch whilst copying dvd's. Can anybody shed any light on exactly how good this unit is, I've read the review on this site and was impressed with what I read. If anybody can help, it would be much appreciated.
Many thanks.

[jimmysmithson]

I don't own any of the vdr available, but am considering buying a terapin vdr.

I have emailed stores asking about any audio sync problems with the terapin, and have been told that using s-video input instead of composite/rca has a better result. I have no idea if this is true or not as I cannot test it out, but just try it yourself.

Could you tell me a bit about your vdr. Is it any good (apart from the problem you're having)? Should I consider one instead of the terapin?

[koi kichi]

Check out this page:
http://www.lik-sang.com/catalog/product_info.php?category=9&products_id=811&PHPSESSID=...44a4ed2b125111

This is basically the same model, just rebadged (I think), it certainly looks exactly the same.

I don't know where you are, I'm in the UK and the choice is very limited.

As for operation, it really couldn't be easier, simply insert the cdr, select whether you want vcd,svcd or cda, and press record. When finshed simply press stop and finalize, to close the disc off before playing.

Unfortunately the major downfall was the audio synch problem, I'd say I had to ditch about 90% of my recordings as they were hopeless to watch, to make matters worse the retailer made no effort to sort the problem out and it's now been returned to them for a refund.

Hope this helps, any more info needed, just email or post here.

[jimmysmithson]

Thanks for the info.

I'm also from the UK.

I've read loads of reviews for the terapin vdr and am still unsure whether to get one or not. But from what i've read it seems to be the most reliable machine.

The other (Likko, Amoisonic, etc) just seem to be cheap shit from China!

If you're wanting to buy a terapin vdr from within the UK go to

http://www.lynxdvd.co.uk/store/

and click on videocd recorder on left hand side

or

http://www.multizonedvd.co.uk/acatalog/index.html

and click on DVD recorders

Both places offer the terapin vdr for about £390. Lynxdvd are giving 50 free 700MB/80min cdr's away with the machine, and acording to them the unit is called Jupiter! and lynxdvd offer all three colours to choose from.

It was lynxdvd that I emailed to ask if there were any sync problems with the terapin. They replied and told me that they not encountered any problems themselves, but had been told by customers about it. They said that using the s-video input its not notible as opposed to using a/v inputs.

At the moment the terapin is my first choice, at Lik Sang they're selling the new firmware upgradable Likko machine that may be better than the others (i'm waiting for the review to be put on this site). So until I see the review i would go for the terapin.

Hope this helps you. I don't think there is a way to fix your audio sync problem, so I would just get a different vdr.

[koi kichi]

Cheers for that info, I spoke to Lynx last week and I'm due to phone them Friday as they're testing the quality of a dvd to vcd recording. The only thing that bugs me, is that all the Terapin info states 74 min cdr's, even the distributor in Ireland said they can't use 80 min, but Lynx said they can with no problems - suppose we'll have to wait and see.
If you're in no hurry to buy one, sit tight - as soon as I've got a refund on the one I've returned I'll be buying one and I'll let you know what it's like.

[thxkid]

I bought a terapin.
1. Yes you can use any 80min. CD-R or CD-RW
2. Only about as good as VHS in picture quality
3. No out of sync when played back on the terapin
4. Will record Audio CD's also at 1x only.
5. No eject on remote or power
6. Will bypass macrovision no problem

Tried on the following DVD players

Apex 500w, 600a, 660, some out of sync problems
Panasonic RV31 and RA60, played perfect, matter of fact the RA60 played it without any of the usual Macro blocks.
Toshiba 2050 CD-RW Only, played good

Conclusion, I don't like VHS anyway so I took it back and will wait for a home DVD recorder
By the way paid $199 at Sams club for a Lava colored terapin

[jimmysmithson]

So you're gonna get one if the results are good?

In all of the reviews i've read on the net, none of them have said anything about any audio sync problems with the terapin, but you never know.

Also, do you know whether lynx inetrnational will replace a defective machine or would it have to be sent back to the manufacturer?

On their website there is a notice that says something about all machines they sell are bought from within the UK or something.

Hope you get good results and buy one!

Thanks

[koi kichi]

I'm going to buy one just on the strengths of the reviews. I need one - I've been without for 24 hours and I've already got the shakes!!!

THXKid - Is there a scart socket on the back for an input, or would I have to stick with composite?

[jimmysmithson]

I wrote to terapin asking about the scart connector that it says on their webiste european machines have.

The machine doesn't have a scart connector. All you get is an adapter for connecting a composite a/v cable to a scart socket (like what are sold at Lik Sang). Thats all it is.

[animepinoy69]

So far I'm very satisfied with my Terapin VDR (got one 2 weeks ago). Their help desk rep informed me that Terapin VDR produces VCD v1.1 and that the reason why most DVD player reads it as a CD-R not a VCD. He added that most DVD players (with VCD playback only, no CD-R/RW playback) can only recognize VCD v2.0 encoding.

So, I had this idea to transfer the VCD to MPEG using VCDGear (downloaded from VCDHelp of course) then burnt the MPEG to VCD v2.0 using NERO (followed VCDHelp instructions of course :) ) using a regular CD-R (memorex 80min) -- well....this DID NOT work :(

But, I'm wondering if it didnt work because I used a regular plain CD-R and not a consumer CD-R.

Question: Can anyone tell me if someone tried the above but using a Consumer CD-R (CD-DA) and had a success in playing it in DVD players with VCD playback only????

Please let me know before I start investing in consumer CD-R. Thank you!

I've had a Terapin for about two weeks now, and I haven't had any problems with any of my DVD players recognizing the VCD's it makes. I've used regular and music CD-R's.
The picture quality is actually *better* than I thought it would be after watching the demo disk. The better the quality of the source the better the quality of the recording. Even so, I've copied some old VHS EP recordings that came out watchable.
Because the unit doesn't have a timer, I tape on SVHS and copy from that. Results are generally very good, even using the SVHS Economy Tape mode.(SVHS on a VHS tape) Generally the quality of the video signal on a given cable channel is more of an issue.
The only real complaint that I have is audio sync problems with newer Apex DVD players. I've seen this on an Apex AD-1500, and an AD-5131, though the AD-600a does not exhibit this problem. My JVC, Pioneer LD-909 & DV-333, and Daewoo DVD5700 play w/ no sync problems.

A quick update - I received my Terapin a couple of days ago, and the quality to soooo much better than the Harmony/Likko etc.

I recordered an INXS concert from DVD to VCD to check the quality, on the Harmony is was too blocky to watch, with the Terapin, it's a different story, I can't believe the Terapin can be so much better.

I bought from www.lynxdvd.co.uk/store and the service was excellent, I was told it would be about a week for delivery, when I finally ordered the colour I wanted, it was here in 4 days, they even insisted that delivery would be before 12 noon, even though I reallly wasn't bothered.

So it's a thumbs up for the Terapin and a big thumbs up for lynxdvd, it makes a nice change to deal with people who care what happens after they've got your money.

[thxkid]

I have had some problems with the APEX DVD players reconizing the MPRG 1.1, but not my Daewoo 5700 or toshiba 2050, so to get around the problem I record the program with the terapin using a CD-RW then use the CD to CD copy in NERO, but only burn at the 4x, I tried it at 8x and 12x with horrible results, every CD-RW I recorded on the terapin then copied off to a standard 80min. CD-R using NERO at the 4X speed has worked perfect in any DVD player I have tried it on, that includes

APEX 500w, 660, 600a, 1500
Daewoo 5700
Toshiba 2050
Pioneer 343, 341
Panasonic 31 and the new 61 model

[yumagah]

I've been using an Amoisonic MK2 for a while now and the SVCD
quality is so much better than VCD that I don't think I'd like the Terrapin, unless you can get it really cheap.
The disks made by the Amoisonic play on everything I've tried them on with no synch problems. Once in a while a RW disk that has been used before will develop some synch problems, but never on an ordinary recordable disk. The Amoisonic also has better quality construction than the Terrapin, it doesn't look or feel cheap.

[smudgermac]

I have been considering a Terapin VDR, but I am concerned about the VCD 1.1 only encoding. I have been trying to burn VCDs on an iBook using Toast titanium - which also only burns VCD 1.1 These VCDs play ok on soft DVD players on PCs and Macs, and I suspect DVD players that are VCD and CDR compatible (none of the units I have access to play CDRs !) they do not play on Cd-i players, which are the main target players for my burned VCDs (don't ask - they were cheap and I have several of them!)

If I use Nero on a PC to burn VCDs, they create VCD 2.0 with pbc and they work perfectly on the CDi players. The CD-i players should play VCD1.1, but I suspect Toast is not copying the relevant CD-i helper files properly (despite showing up in the relevant directories)

The acid question is, has anyone proven that Terapin burnt VCDs play on Cdi players ?

[madrockr]

I also thought about buying a Terrapin, but having nowhere to go to see one that was actually used to demonstrate the quality of the recording I decided to consider another way. I bought the DVC II, I already had a TDK burnner and so I was ready to try this out. I took a laser disc of Star Wars and encoded it as a DVD through Moviestar which came with the DVC II. Then I used TEMPG and converted to VCD quailty. I compared this copy with the professionally done VCD and was very much surprised at the result. My copy was so clear that it was actually better then the VHS tape. I did the same with taking VHS tapes and convertung to VCD, they were great copies. As for recording TV programs, cable or sattelite I first record to a TIVO and then to a VCD, I have been very happy with the quality I was a ble to attain until I bought my Pioneer A-03 DVD recorder. Now I only make copies to DVD-R, unless I just want a copy of a TV show then I do it in VCD mode. I guess that I am haapy that I bought something that was upgradeable. Anyway this is just my two cents. 8) 8) 8)

[mwhecloc]

I also have a tx-0002 VCD Recorder. I can't seem to record any more that 39 min.s before the recored starts acting up. I guess I'll call them monday and send it back. Video freezes, and the audio track is way off. Anyone that has any ideas why this is happening please contact me at mwhecloc@yahoo.com. Thanks.

[AntnyMD]

I received my Terapin from a store in Texas (they were the cheapest on Yahoo, plus they shipped for free, no sales tax, and a free legal copy of PowerDVD ... plus a free consumer CD-RW and ten of the cute Terapin-branded CD-Rs ... total for all, US$279).

I'm generally a lot more pleased with the Terapin than I thought I would be. Here are a few things I noted on my experience:


\ease of use\
This remote is freaky! Its not comfortable for my average size hands, and the button placement is not intuitive. I'm used to it now, after two days, though. There is no POWER or EJECT button on the remote. Not good. However, since it isn't laid out so well, its probably a good thing they're missing ... might hit it accidentally.

The remote interacts with the Daewoo 3000N player that came the same day (see my review elsewhere). They do not play well together when it comes to the remote! The Daewoo remote does unexpected things to the Terapin, too!

Once I got over my remote control issues, I found the Terapin VDR incredibly easy to set up and use! I recommend using the S-Video input rather than the Component Video input (see below). Since you can't make a direct digital audio recording off a DVD with this thing, just make sure to crank up the audio input level to the max. I accidentally adjusted the nob not knowing which was UP, and ended up with a "coaster" ... there was video, but no audio!


\audio quality\
No problems here. Crank the audio level all the way to the right, and you're good to go.


\video quality\
Ah ... Well, my initial intent was to record lots of television shows to VCD until the DVD of them came out, if ever. This is not going to be possible, because using the Component Video input results in terrible quality recordings, equal in quality to a capture using the Dazzle DVC1 at their VCD standard setting. Barely watchable! Also I've discovered if you use the Component connection as your video source, audio goes out of sync almost immediately.

There's a dramatic and improved difference when using the S-Video input. Picture quality suddenly soars, and audio sync issues go away.

The overall quality when using the S-Video input slightly surpasses the best VCD standard encode I'd made with TMPGEnc previously. The advantage of the Terapin is this is real time encoding -- the advantage of TMPGEnc is that you can play with settings.


\different kinds of media, media length and audio sync issues\
All the Terapin documentation stresses use of consumer CD-R/RW media, 74minute versions of those, and Terapin-branded media. Of course, I owned much, much more computer CD-R/RW, and all 80minute length!

I was concerned on my first two encodes that the audio went out of sync at the very end of the disc, even on S-Video sourced encodes, when I used the disc to capacity. When this happened on the third disc, I started to notice a pattern: all the discs went out of sync in the same place, even though the film sources were different. The discs went out of sync when the encode surpassed the 75 minute mark on my 80 minute discs (branded Sony and TDK). Stopping around 74 - 75 minutes shouldn't be a problem, because natural breaks in action in movies usually occur around the 60 minute and 70 minute timings, I've found (not always though).

I am just now testing a consumer CD-RW and I'll exceed this 75 minute "barrier". I'm testing it on the Component and the S-Video inputs .. If my experience is anything different than I've already reported, I'll update this post.


\compatibility of discs on Terapin and non-Terapin VCD players\
I tested Terapin-made discs on the Terapin itself, the Daewoo 3000N DVD/VCD/DVCD/SVCD/MP3/CD player, the JVC XV-523 DVD/VCD/CD player, and a Napa DAV-311 (aka Waitec; aka Tanky) VCD/MP3/CD player.

On long encodes, those beyond 40 minutes in the first track, the Terapin choked on its own discs! Stuttering, drop outs and freezes occured on every disc I've made! Bizarre. It was as if I put in the dirtiest, scratchiest disc I could find. I was shocked!

Multi-track long encodes played perfectly fine in the Terapin, however. I'm still perplexed by that one.

On the Daewoo, the Terapin made discs experienced the sync issues after the 75 minute mark on all discs. This DVD player is the one I use for the S-Video output to make the Terapin recordings. Otherwise, discs play fine and look good.

The JVC experienced sync issues after the 75 minute mark also, but played the Terapin made discs in a much more clear, crisp fashion than the Daewoo.

The Napa DAV-311 not only played the discs flawlessly, but it was the only player that did not have issues with encodes beyond the 75 minute mark. I was shocked. This player usually only plays pressed VCDs without problems, and has significant issues with TMPGEnc encoded discs using the standard VCD template in it. Finally, this thing has usage!


\rate\
Overall, I'd rate the Terapin a BUY, especially if you can get it cheap. Even though it only makes VCD1.1 discs, for a real time encoder that gives you perfectly acceptible results given its idiosyncracies, you couldnt do better for the money. Save yourself a lot of headaches and bite the bullet. Spend your time copying movies, not making coasters on your computer. [/b]

[AntnyMD]

Update:

Just made a recording onto a consumer CD-RW from the Component connection, the source being one of the digital cable channels. Picture quality was slightly better than I previously noted. There were NO audio/video sync issues throughout the disc. The Terapin DID NOT choke on its own disc! The JVC and the Napa played it perfectly. I guess this consumer CD-R/W thing that the manual recommends merits taking seriously.

[braker]

Another option to look at: I'm very pleased with the Amoisonic VDR2000. Records VCD (2.0) and SVCD, great results from pro (low-noise) sources.

I did have an issue with overall sync, which is fully resolved by delaying audio by 5 frames (NTSC here) on the way into the unit.

Otherwise all around fabulous.

I was intrigued by the DataVideo, which has componenent connections (limited advantage) and apparently puts an autorun player on each disc. Not sure if that works for SVCD, but the thing was too expensive for my limited use anyway. I'll try to add the autorun with a CD writer (which I was trying to avoid).

That's currently my biggest hangup: getting hassle-free playback on a variety of user machines. I can't imagine why they don't build VCD/SVCD/DVD playback into all the operating systems.

[AntnyMD]

My main concern with an MPEG-2 VDR was that it would make SVCD compliant discs, i.e., video at 480x480 (NTSC), which would not easily enable transfer to DVD in the near future. DVD doesnt support 480x480/576, but does support 352x240/288, which would only require re-encoding the audio to AC-3 at 48kHz.




Also to note, I just received the RCA 5400P portable DVD player in the UPS today, and it does not play Terapin made CDs on "data" media in sync. My one "consumer" CD-RW recording went out of sync towards the end of the disc on the portable RCA, but this recording was made from composite connections -- I'm making a recording from a DVD via the S-Video connection to test sync on that.



I would LOVE to get an Amiosonic MPEG-2 VDR, but my main issues are: 1) does it force you to make SVCD compliant discs, and 2) do sync issues arise when using "data" versus "consumer" compact disc media

[braker]

My main concern with an MPEG-2 VDR was that it would make SVCD compliant discs, i.e., video at 480x480 (NTSC), which would not easily enable transfer to DVD in the near future.

a) why would you want to transfer an SVCD to DVD? Your quality isn't going to improve, in fact it will degrade if there is any resizing or resampling.

b) It's hard to tell without digging (not time to do so) what screen ratios you're getting. Apparently SVCDs aren't all created equal. Datavideo, for example (http://www.datavideo-tek.com/datavideo2/information_population/product_info/videorecor...0_features.htm) states that theirs does NTSC SVCD at 352x480, which to me makes quite a bit more sense than 480x480 for translation from digital source (CCD or tape). Amoisonic makes no claims that I have found about pixel resolution.

Also to note, I just received the RCA 5400P portable DVD player in the UPS today, and it does not play Terapin made CDs on "data" media in sync. My one "consumer" CD-RW recording went out of sync towards the end of the disc on the portable RCA, but this recording was made from composite connections -- I'm making a recording from a DVD via the S-Video connection to test sync on that.

It would be very strange for the type of input used to have an effect... besides, there's really no way for sync to drift during a realtime recording.

I would LOVE to get an Amiosonic MPEG-2 VDR, but my main issues are: 1) does it force you to make SVCD compliant discs, and 2) do sync issues arise when using "data" versus "consumer" compact disc media

1) I don't know and would love to myself
2) I guess I need to know about this too, I've never heard about it. Amoisinoc does provide a list of specific brands of CD-R and CD-rws to use.

Good luck!

[AntnyMD]

I think you misunderstood me a bit -- Its very important to be able to transfer SVCD (err, XSVCD) content to DVD in the near future, as a) you can put more data on a DVD than an SVCD, and b) if the XSVCD data is encoded properly, i.e., video at 352x480 and audio at 48kHz, there is NO NEED to re-encode or re-sample the data -- it is already at DVD spec. If you make a COMPLIANT SVCD disk, i.e., 480x480 and 44.1kHz, you will need to re-encode and re-sample the data to get it to DVD spec. So, my interest in an MPEG-2 VDR would increase solely based on if it enabled off-spec XSVCDs .. i.e., those off-spec enough to comply with the DVD spec.



Back to the Terapin:
The type of input makes a huge difference when it comes to this machine. Simply put, composite video connections somehow unexplainably cause the video/audio to go out of sync, while S-Video connections somehow unexplainably maintain audio/video sync. I wouldn't be able to believe it either unless I owned one and made tests -- I do own one, I made tests, and its true!

[thebigguy62]

Owned 2 of them and had sync problems and encode problems with both of them; have bought disks made with the terapin and it has sync problems. I'm moving on to the ADS Instant DVD Usb machine, will let folks know how it works out; I guess my feeling is that a stand alone machine should do it's job without you having to stand on your head. The Terapin encoded well for 15 minutes at a time, then heated up and the image got all blocky, and i don't like how it handles text on the screen when the ADS machine costs the same or less and it can create mpeg 2 files. I suppose i'm old school thinking that i'm better off that individual components are better cause a separate machine that does one job should be able to do it better than a multifunction machine; for me the Terapin just didn't do it all well enough, i'd rather break up the jobs of capture, encode and burn to have more control over the process. maybe if an all in one machine comes out under $500 (and correct me if it has) that can make hi q mpeg files i'll try it, but until then it's catch as catch can.

[AntnyMD]

Owned 2 of them and had sync problems and encode problems with both of them; have bought disks made with the terapin and it has sync problems.

Did you use regular, "data" CDs, or did you use "consumer" or "digital audio" CDs for recording on the Terapin? Also, what standalone machines did you test your Terapin-made CDs on? Before I read the manual carefully (where it stresses use of 74-minute "consumer"/"digital audio" CD-R/W), I just assumed I could use up all the blank CD-R data discs .. so when I did, I experienced sync issues. The very first time I used a "digital audio"/"consumer" disc, there weren't any sync issues, even on a composite connection.

I guess my point is if you get a Terapin and it doesn't work the way you expect, just return it for a refund. Make sure you purchase from a place that knows you may exercise that option, too! And above all, don't purchase it on the Terapin website where it costs US$499! It's among the most expensive sites on the net for this machine!

[bryanjohnfields]

Thanks for all the info about the Terapin.

I do have one question I can't seem to find the answer for. Does the Terapin have Scheduling Capability. If so Can I schedule more than one recording on a disk, i.e. schedule it to record 2 half hour programs while I'm at work.

[AntnyMD]

Theres no scheduling capability within the Terapin itself, whatsoever. I wonder if they plan that sort of capability in DVD VDR decks?

[bryanjohnfields]

Thanks AntnyMD

That is what I thought. If I get a Terapin, I will have to First Capture what I am looking for on my Tivo, then use the Save-to-VCR function from Tivo. I may still get one so I can easily Back up my Tivo Programs and so I take out one of the sets of cords I have running from My entertainment center to the Computer.

It is my Belief that scheduling will be a function of the new DVD recorders. They are selling them as a replacement to the VCR. I have also heard that they don't record to DVD directly but to Hard Disk, then to the DVD. This would allow show shifting, and some editing. That is what the sales guy at our local High End Electronics store told a co-worker of mine.