Editing avi files troubles

[vbr666]

hi.

I recorded stuff from tv using pci tv capture card. It's recorded as .mpg file. Then I used Kingdia Video Converter to convert this mpg file to avi file with these settings:


everything is ok with video and I can watch it normally. but then I wanted to edit (cut some parts out of) this converted .avi video by using either windows movie maker or video edit magic or camtasia studio 4 or solveig mm video splitter and for some reason I can't. all of those programs stall and I can't do anything except end process in windows task manager. it' same for all of those programs.

I noticed that I can edit some of then, some I can't (I think I can edit those with higher resolution (640*480) and bitrate settings).

Why can't I edit this converted avi files?

[Baldrick]

Don't convert to xvid and mp3 if you want to edit it. Use something else like uncompressed, dv and pcm wav audio. Or get a mpg editor like videoredo, mpeg video wizard.

[vbr666]

but i have to convert videos, I cant leave them unconverted or they will eat all of my free disk space.
I have to convert them to avi or something of similar picture quality and small disk space demand.
And I have to have ability to edit some of my recorded videos for later purposes.

edit:
why musnt I convert them to xvid and mp3? why is it uneditable later?

[poisondeathray]

virtualdub and avidemux are very good for editing xvid/mp3 in .avi. Give either a try.

cheers

[vbr666]

ok i will try with those programs, but you still havent answered what might be the problem with the software (or anything else) ive been using to cause inability to edit videos after conversion.

[poisondeathray]

I'm not familiar with "kingda" software. If you post info from gspot or mediainfo on your problematic files, it might shed some more information on why your other software stalls

[vbr666]

with virtual dub i cant do anything with my avis. some error pops out and thats it.
with avidemux i converted my original avi to the one with settings like these:


and the same problem is still ocurring. when ever i try to edit this avi in windows movie maker or any other editing software, it stalls and i must end its process in task manager.

[guns1inger]

How are we supposed to help you when you don't provide basic details ?

You can use virtualdub because an error 'pops out'. What error ?

What are your computer specs ? Filling in your profile help us a lot.

The main reason for not encoding to Xvid first is because Xvid is not designed to be edited, so very few programs will edit it, and even fewer edit it well. You are far better off editing first, then encoding the final edited video to something more compressed. You will avoid most problems this way.

[poisondeathray]

If you were able to convert to xvid with avidemux, why not use avidemux to edit the file as well? You only mentioned cutting segments - this is very easy to do with avidemux.

However, you have to cut on keyframes using the "<<" and ">>" to advance and the "A" and "B" to mark in/mark out.

If you want to know why your other programs are crashing, post more information on your system and files as requested before.

[guns1inger]

You don't have to cut Xvid on key frames in AVI Demux. You can cut anywhere, and if you cut between keyframes, AVI Demux will offer to use smart encoding when you save.

[poisondeathray]

I forgot to mention: leave video as "copy", audio as "copy" and format as "avi"

Your settings above will re-encode whatever you are using as input.

My bet is that there is a problem with wmm on your system

[vbr666]

virtual dub error:


everything is fine with my computer its good enough to power all this software converters. im using winxp sp3.
I need to edit compressed videos later because i dont know in advance when and which part of video i will need and i cant keep it in mpg format because it uses too much of disk space. compression is mandatory.

which programs can edit xvid? which other good format should i use?

i cant use avidemux for editing because there is more to it than just cutting parts of video.

my other programs arent crashing they just freeze. in task manager it says software is not responding and there is no way to exit it except to press end process... no other errors.

there is no problem with my windows movie maker. i redownloaded and reinstalled it. same thing again.
and ive said earlier that i also tried to edit avis with:
solveig mm video splitter
camtasia studio
wmm
video edit magic.
same thing to all programs. they can load the movie to timeline but cant play it and they freeze up when u try to do anything with it.

edit:
ok i downloaded DJBCP Codec Pack 5.1.0.1 and it has virtualdub included. i tried to open my avi with it again and same error pops out again...

[poisondeathray]

Your initial post only mentioned cutting parts out. What kind of additonal types of editing did you want to do? Both virtualdub and avidemux have simple filters, but if you want complex effects and transitions, you will have to learn avisynth. (for a free solution anyway, there are other $ editors)

If you learn avisynth, you can do just about everything, but the learning curve is very steep.

That error in virtualdub might be because you dont have ffdshow installed and/or xvid installed (and xvid enabled the ffdshow vfw interface)

I think the freezing experienced on other programs is probably because you don't have the latest xvid installed. Can you play back the encoded xvid video properly (not on vlc, but on another player like mpc)?

[DarrellS]

I agree with poisondeathray. Obviously, the program you used to convert to XviD has a builtin XviD encoder. You will need to download and install the XviD codec to decompress and encode with other programs. Virtualdub will allow frame accurate editing in Smart Render mode without having to recode.

You can edit and convert mpegs to avi with Virtualdub, you don't need this convertor for the job or to keep from recoding, you could demux the file to separate streams and use Cuttermaran to cut out the parts you don't want.

Hope you haven't already skrewed your system up by installing codec packs (since XviD is the most common codec you'd think it would've been installed but codec packs are bad news).

[vbr666]

thank you, it shows picture from my video and doesnt freeze up now. I need to use windows movie maker or some other similar software.

I downloaded and installed newest ffdshow and enabled all options along with installation. So it is working now, but still not satisfactory.

Picture is on, but its very poor, low quality and grainy. Like you're watching TV with poor antenna and reception. Why is that? Which options to change, there are so many:


heres the picture from sample movie:
1) decoded pic from wmm: http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/9070/screenshot002il7.jpg
2) original pic from avi vid: http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/6375/screenshot003ts2.jpg

notice that wmm pic is grainy compared to original one. when you edit it and produce movie it's much, much lower quality (and still grainy) than it should normally be (if you edited mpg for example).

i guess i need to configure some decoding options but i don't know which, there are so many.

[poisondeathray]

1) If you are importing the xvid into wmm, it depends on the encoded characteristics like bitrate etc... that would dramatically affect quality. What settings did you use to encode the .mpg to xvid? You could use a higher bitrate (lower quantizer). When you say "picture is poor" do you mean in wmm or playback with a media player for the xvid file? You still haven't provided gspot or mediainfo information on your xvid as requested.

2) It's difficult to tell from 1 frame, but was your original .mpg interlaced? Did you deinterlace before converting to xvid?

3) You still haven't explained what kind of "edits" you wished to do besides cutting & pasting. wmm is not the best, there may be better free options if you explained

4) What are you outputing from wmm? If you are re-encoding (again) that's 2 lossy conversions - of course the quality is going to be crap. There is probably a better, more efficient workflow strategy if you provided more information. Is your end goal an xvid .avi file?

Generally the more information you provide, the better answer you'll get here

[DarrellS]

Install the XviD codec and Do Not use WMM. You are recoding the file which is giving crappy quality.

1. Install XviD codec

2. Open your XviD AVI in Virtualdub

3. Select Video > Compression > XviD (use default settings) > choose Smart Render mode under Video

4. Select Audio > Direct Stream Copy

5. Delete sections you want to remove

6. Save finished AVI

[vbr666]

1) encoding settings are on first picture in my first post.
mediainfo:
General
Complete name : "NAME"
Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
File size : 953 MiB
Duration : 1h 43mn
Overal bit rate : 1291 Kbps
Writing application : MEncoder dev-SVN-r23107-4.3.0
Writing library : MPlayer

Video
Format : xvid
Codec ID : xvid
Duration : 1h 43mn
Bit rate : 1151 Kbps
Width : 512 pixels
Height : 384 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 4/3
Frame rate : 23.970 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.244
Stream size : 849 MiB

Audio
Format : MPEG Audio
Format version : Version 1
Format profile : Layer 3
Codec ID : 55
Codec ID/Hint : MP3
Duration : 1h 43mn
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 44.1 KHz
Resolution : 16 bits
Stream size : 94.5 MiB
Writing library : LAME3.97


gspot:

2) I do not know whether it was interlaced or not. I'm using Cyberlink PowerCinema for recording videos. It does not show any options (except to change video quality: best, medium or low), so it's quite basic recording software. Im changing deinterlace options in VLC player under "video" drop-down menu. Nothing is changing so I guess, mpg is not interlaced.
I did nothing before converting to xvid.
Produced avi video is at very good quality/size ratio and can be viewed in any player.

3) wmm is enough for me but if you know any better tell me i might try them. Im using visual effect and subtitles, transitions, changing volume of specific cuts, inserting audio and music files, combining...and then producing video.

4) im outputing it to wmv of course. I think movie maker's resolution settings are at 320*240 and its final quality can be more than satisfying for me. I also use camtasia studio, but I didn't like its output and encoding options, it's very slow but pic quality isn't better that much, so i prefer wmm.
it doesnt have to be that crappy. I was producing wmvs from other wmvs and it was good enough. I dont see why it would be different with avi.

[vbr666]

darrell its not that simple i need more editing options and if possible in simple package (as in wmm).

[poisondeathray]

You can do this stuff with better editors like Vegas or Premiere (unfortunately not free )

You can check your .mpg with mediainfo to see if it was interlaced (open your .mpg and use view=>text)

You might need to use a higher bitrate for your xvid .avi file to preserve quality (at the expense of size). Try a small clip to see if this makes a difference (you are only using ~1100kbps, try >2000kbps).

Am I correct in saying that you are using the xvid for an intermediate storage format for space considerations? Because it would be much better quality if you imported the .mpg directly, skipping the intermediate conversion and resultant quality loss

Can you play with the wmm settings? Maybe that's causing the problem?

[vbr666]

premiere as adobe premiere? I think i got this soft.

of course, i know it would be better quality using mpg, but yes, im converting it to xvid to spare some disk space (significantly).

there is no significant quality loss in wmm. i already posted this pic taken from wmm:
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/9070/screenshot002il7.jpg
where you (should) see that the picture is of much lower quality (and grainy for some reason) than in original avi/xvid.