Well, I want to upgrade my computer too :p

[Caple]

I have seen lots of new threads about upgrading hardware. I'll be straight.

Motherboard: Epox 9NDA3+ Ultra
Processor: AMD Athlon64 939 3200+
RAM: 1x Samsung 512Mb DDR 400MHz
Video Card: GeForce FX5500 256Mb AGP 8x

I need/want to upgrade (yes, I'm a nerd).

Options:
1 - change only the processor.
2 - buy more RAM.
3 - change processor and buy RAM.
4 - blow my credit card to buy a brand new mobo and processor, wich leads to new RAM, video card and probably PSU too. And pray to FIND some money around to pay the bills

The computer will be used for almost everything, from internet surfing to PVR and video encoding. Maybe some games, but nothing heavy.

Any comment is very welcome

[ahhaa]

Wait. Save Money. Look at sexy cases. Start leaving very specific hints about Xmas gifts... wait out Vista's arrival.

[budz]

I have seen lots of new threads about upgrading hardware. I'll be straight.

Motherboard: Epox 9NDA3+ Ultra
Processor: AMD Athlon64 939 3200+
RAM: 1x Samsung 512Mb DDR 400MHz
Video Card: GeForce FX5500 256Mb AGP 8x

I need/want to upgrade (yes, I'm a nerd).

Options:
1 - change only the processor.
2 - buy more RAM.
3 - change processor and buy RAM.
4 - blow my credit card to buy a brand new mobo and processor, wich leads to new RAM, video card and probably PSU too. And pray to FIND some money around to pay the bills

The computer will be used for almost everything, from internet surfing to PVR and video encoding. Maybe some games, but nothing heavy.

Any comment is very welcome

You could upgrade your cpu to a DUAL CORE 939 processor 4200 Manchester, $198.00. Add another stick of 512 mb of DDR400 RAM. IMHO why buy a complete new system when you can still upgrade to your existing pc.

Here's that DUAL CORE 939 4200 Manchester processor:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103547

[Caple]

Yes, I've seen this processor. Didn't think about "why buy if I can still upgrade".

So here's the deal.
If I choose 2x1Mb L2 cache I can choose between 4400+ (2200Mhz) and 4800+ (2400MHz).
If I hoose 2x512Kb L2 cache I can choose between 3800+ (2000MHz), 4200+ (2200MHz) and 4600+ (2400MHz).
What I should consider first? Clock speed or L2 cache size?
I can get the 4600+ cheaper then the 4400+. The 4600+ has less L2 cache but has higher clock speed.

[jagabo]

What I should consider first? Clock speed or L2 cache size?

There's no simple answer to this one. Some programs will benefit more from the additional cache, some from the greater clock speed.

About the only thing I do where I end up waiting for the computer is video encoding. That usually benefits more from a faster clock than a larger cache.

One other thing to consider: single threaded applications often run about the same speed on dual core and single core CPUs of the same clock speed (although the A64 X2 does have some other improvements over the A64 that can make it faster). Since you're going from a 2.0 GHz A64 3200+ to a 2.2 or 2.4 GHz A64 X2, single threaded programs will only show a small increase in speed. Multithreaded applications will see a much greater increase as they'll be able to use both cores.

[Caple]

Hmmm I spend more time encoding than playing, surfing or anything else.
The higher clock is 2400MHz (4600+ and 4800+). 4800+ is much more expensive than 4600+, seems to be the way to go. Have to check if my mobo supports all that.
Thanx jagabo.
Does anyone else share the same thoughts?

[jagabo]

Hmmm I spend more time encoding than playing, surfing or anything else.

Fortunately most video encoders are multithreaded, especially MPEG2 encoders, so you'll get a significant reduction in encoding time. TMPGEnc encodes twice as fast on a dual core processor. CCE about 80 percent faster.

[Jeremiah58]

First upgrade your RAM with one more stick of 512 MB - must be the same as the one you already have or compatible. This is something you should do, regardless of other upgrades.

Any other upgrade depends on compatibility of your system and a price you are willing to pay and, of course, what do you use your machine for.

[Caple]

I'm sure I'll buy more RAM, another 512Mb stick to make dual channel.
Now the processor is the one to make my choice.

[Morse2]

Hi Caple: you've been given good advice.

For reference, I have built and used systems with the AMD64 3000+, 3200+, 3500+, 3800+ (X2), 4200+ (X2), 4400+ (X2) and 4800+ (X2). The 4800+ is clearly fastest, but it's getting hard to find, is the most pricey, and generates significant heat compared to the others. Comparing the 3800+ (X2) to the 3200+ for single threaded apps does indeed show them to be identical in the real world. Where the dual core shines over it's single core sister is when you're running more than one single threaded app at a time (common here).

Definitely go with the 4600+ if you can afford it and you're primarily after a video encoding machine (unless $$ is no object at all, in which case go 4800+ - if you can find one). The 4400+ runs almost as hot as the 4800+ in my experience and will not give you the performance boost of the 4600+ should for encoding (my comparisons of 1MB L2 vs 512KB L2 and 200MHz boost were on the 3800+ vs 4200+ vs 4400+ though they should hold true for the 4600+ as well). If $$ is tight, go with the 4200+ - it's got the 200MHz speed boost of the 4400+ over the stock 3800+, but the 4200+ generates less heat than the 4400+ and you WILL NOT notice a time difference in encoding.

On memory, your system will definitely benefit from an improvement. If $$ is super tight, get one more stick of whatever you have (make SURE that it's the same latency, manufacturer, etc) and make sure you've got it installed in the right mobo slot to run dual channel. If $$ is not THAT tight, I'd consider a pair of 1 gig sticks of the performance ram of your choice and put the lone stick of 512 into a second 'web/email only' machine to free up your video workhorse. A cheapie mobo for that can be had for as little as $55 or so with onboard video (I've built a couple of 'em using Foxconn mobos with the Nvidia 6100 chipset that are terrific little email/websurfing machines that will even play video as is with no troubles). You already have the chip and memory, so all you'd need to do is eventually buy a case/power supply, KVM switch (as little as $25 at Newegg), scrounge a 40+ gig HDD and download a freebie copy of Suse 10.1 AMD64 for a hyper-cheap email machine. And that way you don't have to worry about viruses on your video machine (or your email/surfing machine either, thought that's an off-topic subject).....

Back to your dream rebuild. For video editing (I'm assuming you do that as well as encoding), the more memory the merrier, with some provisos:

What OS are you running? For 32 bit Windows XP there's no point in going over 3 gigs. 64 bit windows will handle 4 gigs no sweat, but your mobo might not (you'll need to check and see if it supports memory mapping so it can address your AGP/PCI cards AND all 4 gigs of memory). Linux is a whole new ballgame though, since a. Linux distros like Suse 10.1 are available FREE in 64 bit versions that handle all the memory you can toss at them with aplomb, and b. the Linux kernel will do all it can to use your system memory in place of the 'swap file' that's created with a Linux install. The system I'm typing this on has 2 gigs of ram and the memory monitor shows that 61% of it is being used to completely replace what would be 'swap space'. Of course I'm just email/websurfing so the system's not being taxed the way it is when encoding....

For light gaming and video watching, your AGP card is fine. Leave it be.

Anyway, good luck on it - you're asking the right questions and look to be on the right track.

All the best,
Morse

[Caple]

Damn, didn't think someone would write all that Thanx, Morse.
I'm running Windows XP Pro SP2. Tried Windows 64bit once and had some problems, don't remember what, and went back to 32bit. In this case memory won't really matter, as I'm not going to have more than 1gb.
I'm looking for the best prices here in Brazil. It's really hard to find online shops that send to Brazil so I have to pay more for everything. For example: jagabo suggested the 4200+ processor for 198 dolars on Newegg. I don't find it here for less than 600 reais, and that would be around 260 dolars Now imagine the more expensive processors...
Well, seems like I'm going for 4400+ or 4600+ and a new stick of 512mb.
Thanx for all the inputs!

[Nelson37]

Suggestion for you.

Consider buying an entire new PC, then swap out the motherboard, CPU, with what you currently have. This will allow you to sell a good-looking PC with your used mobo and CPU, thus recovering some of the value.

Otherwise your old CPU just sits, worthless.

SFAIK there is quite a demand for used PC in your area, and few available.

[Caple]

I considered buying a new entire PC, cause I don't want to buy/keep something that will be "old" in a short period of time.
The problem is that changing mobo, cpu, ram and video will be very expensive for me. Even if I sell the older stuff, which I'll do for sure.
I didn't check how much I can get on my used stuff. But if I go for a new computer I want a Core 2 Duo E6600 and none of the mobos I see have more than 2 IDE conectors, than I would need to sell on of my IDE HD and get a SATA (more money to spend )

[jagabo]

You can get adaptors that allow the use of IDE drives on SATA ports:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822998001

[Caple]

Oh yeah, forgot about the adapters

[Morse2]

Hi Cople;

If a $198USD chip is going for $260 in Brazil, I don't think you'll find the Core 2 Duo to be very cost effective since you will need a new mobo, video card to replace your AGP, and DDR2 memory, all at presumably inflated costs. Then there's the issue of your XP license - if you have an OEM copy, MickeySoft insists you buy a new one, unless you can talk 'em into a reactivation. FWIW, I've thought about the Core 2 Duo route myself, but the costs are a killer (right now everything is built on a common socket 939/DDR400/PCIe technology so I can freely swap out parts).

From your more recent posts, I'd suggest the 4200+ (2.2GHz dual core with a 512K cache for each core). The 4600+ should be considered, but I'd definitely drop the large cache models (4400+ and 4800+), since the 4600+ is actually cheaper than either of 'em (at least here). If you KNOW your encoder is single threaded, you could also look at the FX55, which is a 2.6GHz SINGLE CORE with a large cache, that is now about the same cost as a 4200+, stateside.

All the best and good luck,
Morse

[Caple]

Weel, I use Premiere, TMPG, CEE, DLP, VirtualDub... nothing more than that when it comes to video editing/encoding.
At least some of these are multi threaded, right?
Seems like 4200+ or 4600+ and another stick of 512 are the way to go. Just need to find the best prices here

Caple