"Shimmer" in picture during EP playback for DVD

[zfishman]

Hello, people First, I'd like to thank everyone for offering their help with a few questions I have posted concerning a jitter problem I was having with VCR playback. Happy to say, I have found a VCR that plays those older tapes perfectly It involved a special feature that has you hold down "play" for two seconds to reduce jitter on EP/SLP recordings.

However, I have another concern. now that I have the major jitter issue fixed, have another minor issue that cropped up. What I'm seeing on those tapes during playback is something I can best describe as a minor "shimmer" or tiny "shaking". I have the VCR attached to my DVD recorder (Panasonic DMR-ES10) through a standard set of AV cables. When I playback the tape, I can see an occasional shimmer, or slight vibration in the picture. It's not really a jitter, but a small shimmer (if that makes any sense). I thought it may have been the cables but I've tried higher end ones and they work the same. In other words, if I try to make a DVD copy of my older tapes, there are some issues with the picture which only occur then.

Now, here's the kicker: When the VCR is attached directly to the TV, the playback looks perfect. Also, when the VCR is connected with the AV cables through another VCR, the picture is also perfect. So, I only get the shimmer when the VCR is connected to the DVD burner for dubbing.

Any ideas? Thanks

[Krispy Kritter]

Have you tried recording to see if the shimmer occurs on the recorded media? It could just be a low quality video pass through in the DVD recorder.

[davideck]

It might also be that the jitter has been reduced by your latest VCR, but some signal instability still remains. Your TV may be less susceptible to this instability than your DVD recorder.

Holding down PLAY might initiate an auto tracking system.
Have you tried adjusting the tracking manually?

[The_Doman]

When the VCR is attached directly to the TV, the playback looks perfect. Also, when the VCR is connected with the AV cables through another VCR, the picture is also perfect. So, I only get the shimmer when the VCR is connected to the DVD burner for dubbing.

Any ideas? Thanks

This "shimmer" effect is caused by variations in the video signal.
It's caused by the mechanical fluctuations of the VCR (video heads,tape transport).
All VCR's without some form of TBC built inside have this effect more or less.
Specially with LP/EP modes this effect will be more noticable..
Your TV has special ciruits built in to correct those signal variations.
Apparently your DVD recorder has no video stabilizing circuits (TBC), or they are turned off.

[davideck]

What I'm seeing on those tapes during playback is something I can best describe as a minor "shimmer" or tiny "shaking"...In other words, if I try to make a DVD copy of my older tapes, there are some issues with the picture which only occur then.

Is the tiny shake you mention in the horizontal direction?
I've experienced this type of disturbance on a couple of tapes with my TBC-3000. They look fine straight to a monitor, but they can cause the TBC to introduce a very slight field_1 to field_2 horizontal displacement, resulting in a noticeable flicker.

You might benefit from a JVC VCR with TBC/DNR, as the built-in TBC handles these types of instabilities quite effectively.

[thecoalman]

I have a an example clip in this post, perhaps it's the same thing you are describing. It's a great example of how well the JVC 9911 can eliminate noise (in my example clip shimmering can be one word to describe it) The clip is actually named shimmer..... :P . Apparently though this tape was perfect for showing this, may not work as well on other tapes.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=269801

BTW, standalone TBC-1000 had no affect whatsoever in eleminating or causing this problem.

[vhelp]

What is your capture card.. ie, ATI x (being anything) or other brand ??

I ask, because.. if it is an ATI "x" card, it is a servant of Macrovision,
and as such, will result in various issues, including yours.
Note, the "x" is just a place-holder for whatever ATI brand/make card
you have.

When you said, it plays fine on your tv, this was a red-light indicator to
me that your card is serving Macrovision.

Capture cards today (by ATI specially) are advocates for the devil,
macrovision. When you run a specific video source through to your
capture card, it will immedicately turn on MV by default. Becuase of
this, any number of phoenaminas can arrise. Picture jitter is one
form of such MV nonsense. It is sending (shall I say) a feed-back
signal, to your card, (well, to your video being captured) and is
resulting in a drunkard manor. Curling is another. TBC's used in
this, in most cases will worsen the issues w/ curling. Happend in
one case with a Commercial VHS tape of mine.

Well, that's enough for now.

-vhelp 3571

[zfishman]

Hello again! Thanks for everyone's responses already I'm not sure if anyone has hit it on the head yet, but every bit helps.

The thing that leads me to believe the issue lies with the DVD recorder is that the shimmer only occurs when the video signal is fed through the DVD recorder (a standalone, no capture card). I'm guessing the DVD recorder has a built-in filter or something which is making changes to try and correct a problem but is making it worse.

Again, when I play the tape in the old VCR, I can get it to play perfectly. I've tried those tapes in other VCRs and the picture twitches and jitters like crazy. I think the "holding down play for 2 seconds" thing is some older form of TBC or something similar, as the picture clearly and instantly gets better when I engage that. I've tried playing those tapes in the same VCR without engaging the "hold down play for 2 seconds" and adjusting the tracking, and I can get the picture a bit better but clearly not as sharp as when I do that function.

I also tried a composite-tosvideo adapter to see if maybe the digital signal would be treated better by the DVD recorder. But, to no avail.

Thanks for everyone trying!

[thecoalman]

The thing that leads me to believe the issue lies with the DVD recorder is that the shimmer only occurs when the video signal is fed through the DVD recorder (a standalone, no capture card). )

Hmmm, I missed that part in your original post. My example vid that I posted about above is caused by the source. It's present even on a direct connection from VCR to TV, so that's not going to help you.

[davideck]

I think the "holding down play for 2 seconds" thing is some older form of TBC or something similar, as the picture clearly and instantly gets better when I engage that.

What is the make and model of the VCR you are using?

[zfishman]

Hi, all

The VCR is a Sharp VC-A410; I'd say it's about 8 years old.

[zfishman]

Howdy, again

I have a thought (scary, I know). Since I can get a perfect picture on my source VCR, I wonder if a simple digital stabilizer would work for me, something like a Sima CT-200. My problem seems very minor, I wonder if anyone else has had success in curing very minor jitter/shimmer issues. The problems I have do not result in screen "bouncing" and the picture doesn't shift up and down, only "jitters" in place. Maybe a small fix would work.