new Pioneer 110? with price falling on 109?

[rotuts]

Hello
Ive noticed even at Fry's in the SF bay area that the price is falling on the Pioneer 109 DVDR. does this mean there is a 110 in the future and if so, any idea what that will have?

thanks rotut

[sjk]

It means the price is dropping.

[lenti_75]

it's always something else.....but the price is falling because it's getting old.

[galactica]

its crazy these days
I remember my 1st dvd burner cost me about 200$ for a blazing fast 2x burn!!!

now you can get top of the line for under 80$

Teh 109 has not been out "forever" but I suspect the price probably dropped because FINALLY 16x Media so now there is media for these puppies!

[terryj]

Man, a 25 pack of 16x media for $21???
50 packs for $40.00???

Are they pushing you 2 upgrade or what?

I'm gonna have to get me some of the
BEALL/Samsungs when my new -109 burner gets here
from newegg on Friday....SWEET!

[sjk]

I remember my 1st dvd burner cost me about 200$ for a blazing fast 2x burn!!!

What a bargain! Hell, $200 is closer to what an external floppy drive cost for my first Amiga!

I paid ~$500 for my first 4x/2x Yamaha SCSI CD-RW burner. Probably around the time a 9GB HDD cost ~$1K... same as TB LaCie Bigger Disk costs nowadays!

Let's change the subject?

[ninja86]

Hey just to let your know that the reason it is so cheap at newegg.com is because it is the oem version, not the retail.

The retail (model a09xl) is only different from the oem (model 109) with regards to the front faceplate, quiet speed software, and the rip lock.

So pretty much the rip lock is the only difference. The retail will read DVDs at 12x where the oem supposedly reads at 6x.

I was checking out the incredibly low price at newegg.com as well, but I think that I would prefer the better rip times. Your call though.

Oh, also, the a09xl is approx. $130 in stores. Depending on where you buy it from, there is a $30 mail in rebate. Hope that helps.

[willrob]

Its $105 at Amazon with free shipping. Amazon is one of the store that you can apply the $30 rebate to. So $75 final price. Still $68 is even less.

I can't find any verification as to the difference between the retail and OEM versions. The drive comes in three colors:beigh, black and silver (bezils). And the retail versions ship with a CD of PC software (Nero). Pioneer's own stats for the drive are the same for each of the three models. The version at Egghead is the black bezil; but I've also seen bother the beigh and the silver refered to as OEM.

And just to muddy the waters more: the Amazon black model is DVR-A09XLB, while the Egghead is DVR-109 BK.

The reviews of this drive on this site are luke warm.

>>Oh, also, the a09xl is approx. $130 in stores. Depending on where you buy it from, there is a $30 mail in rebate. Hope that helps.<<

[terryj]

It has been stated over and over again, to get the higher rip speeds, you have to flash the firmware upon recieving the drive.

When I get mine, I'll check the FW, if it is 1.14, I plan on putting it in a USB 2.0 case, attaching it to a Sony Viao laptop at work and patch it to 1.17 FW.

Xlr8yourmac, as well as
cdfreaks,
have reported so about the FW.

[Booger]

1) terryj mentioned putting the drive in a "USB 2.0 case", couldn't you also put it in an external FireWire case and get better results (faster data transfer speeds, etc.) vs USB 2.0?

Sorry if this sounds like a doofus question but thusfar the only thing I have tried this with is an external HD (into a combo FireWire/USB 2.0 case - works great!) so I'm genuinely curious - no experience w/ external DVD burners yet (just the internal 106 in my iMac).

2) He also mentioned flashing it from 1.14 to 1.17. Is that an official Pioneer FW updater - I keep reading posts saying the "hacked" FW flasher for the 109 is still in the works (by "hacked" I mean like the one I used on the 106 to allow DVD+R/W burning, overclocked burning speeds (4x on 2x media), and increased ripping speeds, etc.)?

3) Do most of you lean towards getting the retail (model a09xl) vs the oem (model 109) or does it really not matter?

Sure would appreciate you guys squaring me away on this. TIA!

[willrob]

So there's no Mac FW upgrade method yet for the 109?

I notice that the differences between the 108 and 109 are only slight (some faster burning speeds on media that supports it). The 108 has already been "hacked," but of course suddenly it's not as easy to find one, nor are the prices as low as the 109.

Guess I'll have to do more homework. For me (I have a 106) the issue is media. I already have a ton of 4X media, which won't benifit from the faster speeds. By the time I use them all up, the 120 will be the current model. The other big factor is the price of dual layer media. If it drops dramatically...

[ninja86]

Actually, there is a big difference between the 108 and the 109. That is DVD-R DL support.

True everything else is pretty similar, but to have the future capacity to burn DVD-R DL discs is awesome. Here is a link to an official comparison between the 108 and 109.

http://www.dvd-recordable.org/Reviews%2Bindex-req-showcontent-id-133.phtml

Evidently, the 109 has support up to 6x burning of DVD-R DL discs, but the firmware right now only allows 4x. So, hopefully later Pioneer will allow 6x burning.

Also, the only way to get the rip lock off is by installing a hacked firmware which also tends to void your warrantee.

That Amazon deal is pretty sweet. However, I need a black bezel, darn!

[willrob]

>>That Amazon deal is pretty sweet. However, I need a black bezel, darn!>>

The bezel is black. They sell all three "colors."

See:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0007M60ZK/ref=pd_sbs_e_2/102-6398484-60...onics&n=281407

[HatchetMan]

>>That Amazon deal is pretty sweet. However, I need a black bezel, darn!>>

The bezel is black. They sell all three "colors."

See:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0007M60ZK/ref=pd_sbs_e_2/102-6398484-60...onics&n=281407

from the site-

This item is currently not available

[willrob]

It was available last night when I looked. it wouldn't make much difference to me. I would have to remove the bezil anyway (Dual Mirror G4). Only the tray would show when opened.

The question I have:
Is the black bezil version Amazon is selling (or the other two colors, for that mater) any different than the Egghead $68 shipped drive. They all appear to be OEM. Other suppliers with high prices aren't specifying OEm or Retail, nor whether the high price reflects some CD of PC software Is there really a hardware difference as an earlier post suggests?

[terryj]

1) terryj mentioned putting the drive in a "USB 2.0 case", couldn't you also put it in an external FireWire case and get better results (faster data transfer speeds, etc.) vs USB 2.0?

Sorry if this sounds like a doofus question

ok...
Since PC's in general DO NOT HAVE FW Ports,
you would have to use USB 2.0.
Thus why you would put it into a USB 2.0 case to flash the firmware.....
as I'm going to do with my Sony VIAO Laptop, whcih is running Win XP...

2) He also mentioned flashing it from 1.14 to 1.17. Is that an official Pioneer FW updater - I keep reading posts saying the "hacked" FW flasher for the 109 is still in the works (by "hacked" I mean like the one I used on the 106 to allow DVD+R/W burning, overclocked burning speeds (4x on 2x media), and increased ripping speeds, etc.)?

no this the official FirmWare as posted on pioneer's site. No hacked FW
has made it out yet AFAIK.

3) Do most of you lean towards getting the retail (model a09xl) vs the oem (model 109) or does it really not matter?

Sure would appreciate you guys squaring me away on this. TIA!

matters to your wallet...!

but no they are both the same device, just a way for Pioneer to goose newbies who can't use the Internet to find out the truth.....

[terryj]

willrob:
they are both the same drive,
Newegg is just ( notoriously) cheaper
than Amazon....

[willrob]

A quote from Las Vegas posted at the rpc site:

http://forum.rpc1.org/viewtopic.php?t=33341&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&st art=25"

"I have a version of the dvrflash command-line utility in the late alpha stages of development with DVR-109 support added. If, as a Mac user, you wish to test it, keep in mind that if it fails, it will leave your drive in "failsafe mode." The only way to fix it from there is to move the drive to a PC and reflash it with initial_D's 109 utility. If you're still interested, post a PM to me and I'll let you beta test it when it reaches that stage."

[terryj]

Pass!


At least if you flash it on a PC with Pioneer's fw updater,
if the drive is messed up, the warranty is still intact.

There is also speculation that some drives are shipping
with the 1.17 FW already on. I'll know more Sat. when mine
gets here....

[motherwell]

How can I check the firmware version? I just ordered my 109 from NewEgg on Tues. and got it today. I am going to install it tonight.

[willrob]

Once it's installed go to About This Mac>More Info>ATA>and highlight the Pioneer 109. The firware version will then be displayed as the Revision#.

[miksu]

Hello
does this mean there is a 110 in the future and if so, any idea what that will have?

They are going to make 110, for sure. And 111. They have used every number from 101 to 109, why not 110 then

[willrob]

From Pioneer's website DVR-109 FAQ:

Question
What is the difference between DVR-109 & DVR-A09XL

Answer
Apart from the cosmetic differences the retail version DVR-A09XL also contains an advanced Ulead software bundle as listed below..
The DVR-A09XL also includes Performance adjusting firmware, which allows for quiet playback of commercial DVD video.
As for the DVR-109 this is sold as a bare drive and may or may not contain the Nero 6.6 OEM Suite 3 software installation CD.

[willrob]

This is a link to the Pioneer PDF that shows which media will write at what speeds with the 109, using firmware 1.09. There doesn't seem to be an updated list for the 1.17 firmware. The firmware came out in Feb of this year, 20 days after this list was published.

http://pioneeraus.com.au.us.server-fast.com/media/downloads/Supported_media_DVR-109-FW109.pdf

[terryj]

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!! !



Got my DVR-109 from Newegg today and guess what:



ITS ALREADY GOT THE 1.17 FIRMWARE INSTALLED!!!!!

No having to wait until monday to flash, its ready to go!!!!!

( for those who ordered this drive, the top sticker says it was
manufactured jan. 2005)

[willrob]

What does "Vendor Supported" mean? When I replaced my internal with a 106, About This Mac called it Apple Supported/Shipped. Possibly because some system update had a driver it loaded even before I installed it?

So does iDVD recognize it? ITunes? etc? Do you still need Patchburn?

[terryj]

"Vendor Supported" means that Patchburn 3
did it's job, and that "Vendor Supported"
means that APPLE supports it.

Don't use iDVD, but DVDSP3 , iTunes all support it fine.
iTunes maxed the speed to about 24x
( Although I set it to about 40x using 52x rated media) ,
and xlr8your mac had a report on that,
so that's cool.

DVDSP3 burned at 8x to Taiyo Yuden 8x media
( 6mins! DAYUM!) and Toast 6.09 burned a full 4.2GB
DVD of Freelance Projects to the same media in
6:13 sec.

Getting ready to test MTR with it now, curious to see
how fast it rips....


and yes, your OS had a driver
( OSX 10.35-.38 all have drivers that support up to DVR-107/A-07)
pre-installed that is why U saw
"Apple Supported" after your install of your -106.