virtualdub creates substantially larger avi

[syeager]

I have an AVI file captured from ATI using HUFFYUV. It is a 10 minute clip at 704x480 resulting in a 5.3GB file. I process the file with virtualdub to remove some visual noise and attempt to save the file as an AVI again with HUFFYUV. The resulting file is about 8.7GB in size!

And Ulead VideoStudio 6 was able to read the original AVI file correctly, but the new file created by virtualdub only plays about 1-2 minutes and then thinks it is completed. It is also reporting almost double the frames in the files properties, withing VS6. However, ATI's file player plays both fine.

So, why is the file bigger? I removed noise, would that produce a file of the same size or smaller? Also, what could have happened to the file to make VS6 unable to play the entire clip?

[yoda313]

Hello,

Did you compress it??? You need to compress it to make it smaller. You can do divx, xvid, or another avi codec you have installed. Also, check your bitrate. You can use video bit rate calculator found in the tools section (<------ on the left).

Kevin

[syeager]

As I stated in the original post, I am using HUFFYUV, a lossless codec. Not very good at comression rates, but that is what I started with. The question is: why would the ATI capture process, using huffy, make a 5gb file, while virtualdub, also using huffy, applying a temporal noise removal filter and adding nothing to the video, create a 8gb file?

[SatStorm]

Few reasons I can imagine:
Different framesize
Different framerate
Different codec settings (not sure how this is possible with huffyuv, but...)
Different colourspace (YUV2 files are less size RGB ones...)

[syeager]

How do I specify these values, especially colorspace? Where are these settings?

[SatStorm]

On Virtualdub

I think that you must do some reading...

[syeager]

Thanks SatStorm, but most of us read. I have been reading for weeks. Now, am I finding the right thing to read, I am not sure.

I see frame size settings displayed on the information of the avi file: 704x480, just as it is specified when I use temporal smoother filter. However, I see nowhere where it might allow me to change that setting. However, when I evaluate the produced avi file, it sees it as a 704x480 file; no change.

I know where fps are - that is the same: 29.972, no change, process all frames, no telecine.

Codec is HUFFYUV; same settings here in virtualdub as used in ATI capture settings; no change.

I could find no setting for color space. Not certain what HUFFYUV is using. VS6 does not tell me the color space. I do not know where to read this.

So, your comment is helpful if you can direct me to something to read or a specific bit of information.

Try not to be insulting in your comments. Most of us, even newbies, are doing nothing but reading. We come to the site to augment our reading and rely on the expertise of experts like yourself. The only way people will be attracted to these boards are if they are helpful and genuine. I look forward to helping others, as I learn more.

So, any help you (or others) can provide is very appreciated.

[SatStorm]

I don't wish to insult anyone, but it seems that this is the way you understood my reply. As an insult. It wasn't my attention, but since it happened, here it is: I'm sorry.
I can't help you more on this. I don't have the time, the english language knowledge to express it well and the mood overall for doing it.
Maybe other experts around could help you more than me.

[syeager]

Now who is being a bit sensitive. Do not take it personally. We work with each other, we help each other. No harm done. I have seen several threads that went WAY wrong as people became unpleasant and unproductive. That was not the case here. Just wanted to make certain it did not go there.

Thanks for your help. If you know how to set the colorspace and are inclined to reply, please do. Later I am going to try to force Huffy to use YUY2 instead of RGB and see if that corrects things.

[Steen4]

syeager: the reason that your filesizes evince this discrepancy (lookit me over here wit da $10.00 words) is that your original capture was probably saved in the yuv colorspace, whereas the ensuing virtualdub processing was most likely saved as rgb data, unless you used the "convert to yuv" option in the huffyuv dialog box. You do not want to resave as yuv data anyway, as (again, reading the huffyuv dialog box, but there is more detailed info on http://neuron2.net/www.math.berkeley.edu/benrg/huffyuv.html . This page is highly recommended reading) subsequent resaves in the yuv colorspace will continue to degrade the original info.
By the way, as an owner of VS6, I can tell you with some confidence that this program does not "play nice" with stuff like huffyuv or the picvideo mjpeg codec. They, along with some others, become problematic within VS6. Maybe this has been fixed as of the most recent release, since I am aware that there is a large contingent of dissatisfied ulead customers due to the inability of VS to work with these codecs, but somehow I doubt it...

[syeager]

Great response, Steen4. That is pretty much exactly what I was looking for.

I agree, it looks like ATI was capturing using YUV colorspace and virtualdub was using rgb. I will attempt to convert to YUV using HUFFY configuration and see, understanding that it will begin to degrade quality.

I also have VS7, so I will try it there and see. Oddly enough, HUFFY in YUV works well in VS6, while HUFFY in rgb did not. Curious. That may be an over simplification of imperical(another $10 word) evidence, but I will attempt to investigate.

I wonder if the rgb as opposed to the yuv colorspace was the reason why ati and windows players cannot see the video correctly on frameserving? Again, I will test and see.

Thanks for the great response.

And again, Satstorm, I am sorry if I exacerbated( $20 dollar word) the situation where there was none. Thanks for the help in the past and in the future.

[Steen4]

Always glad to help when I can.

[duhmez]

All I can add to this: I have saved captures using rgb and yuy2 with huffy, and it did NOT create THIS much of a difference in filesize. Something is wrong.

[Steen4]

I have two identical video files sitting on my hd right now in huffyuv. One file is 721MB (yuv) and the other is 1.2GB (rgb), so I wouldn't think that something is necessarily wrong.
Duhmez: enter the huffyuv codec's dialog box. Select predict median and predict gradient as compression methods, then leave all other boxes unselected. Capture a few minutes of huffyuv video in your favorite app (make sure it's capturing in yuv colorspace), then go to virtualdub and simply re-save it as huffyuv in full processing mode. You don't have to use any sort of filtering, just re-save the entire file. What did you get?