Guess what happens when...

[rallynavvie]

... all the 5v pins on your motherboard connector have a meltdown?
an amusing anecdote by the SMP whore

We'll start the story with my nice, stable Tyan 2460 running with a Powmax 550w PSU not really being stressed at all. Dual 1900 MPs are the max the board is rated for and that's all I wanted to run. An old picture of said workstation:
http://4wheelracing.com/media/dh800/tiger.jpg
This all was working well but being infected with the need for something greater I started building my current system back in March. I decide to wait for a certain technology to come out before finishing the computer which was due out in June. One week before that date the above computer gave up the ghost with these results.
http://4wheelracing.com/media/dh800/burned.jpg
So certainly the board is toast, and I'm really too lazy to find out if the PSU is still OK, I think it was junk anyway. So I quickly purchase processors for the new system to finish it so that I don't have any downtime with client video projects, only 4 hours before a major price break is announced which could have saved me $400. That sucks, but at least I still have a new PC to play with. Now what to do with the old one...

I strip the old 2460 down and salvage some bits for the new PC for the time being (namely the 39320) and test the rest of the hardware to make sure it still works. All the PCI and the AGP cards still work, but since nobody I know has a board that supports ECC RAM I have no idea if the 2GB of Mushkin PC2100 ECC registered RAM that was in there went down with the ship. Nobody wanted to risk trying the MPs in their XP system for fear that if the chips were bad it would do something nasty to their board (MPs work in XP boards just fine). Fortunately Tyan rules and I got a new board from them within a week. Now I just needed to find a power supply that I don't need to worry about. Enter the new Antec NewPower units:
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-103-924&depa=0
I decide to give one of these a try and got it in the mail yesterday. Today I fit all the pieces back together and hooked it up to the KVM and started her up for the first time in months. Boot, BIOS beeps for RAM
OK so the CPUs must me good still if I'm getting BIOS beeps for RAM. I swap sticks around until I find that 2 of the 4 512MB sticks are bad, but at least I still have 1GB left. Boot, 2 CPUs detected, 1GB of RAM tested, booting into Windows, and it reboots. OK, well Windows sucks anyway so I kinda expected that, but the hard drive must still be good. Try booting into safe mode and it gets hung on "d344bus.sys loading" and then reboots. Ugh, MBR is corrupt, so time to dig out the XP CD and try to fix that, but first I have to install an optical drive in the machine which means removing one from another.

And so I guess she'll sit there for a while longer
Sorry for the story, I just spent 10 hours messing with this thing and I needed a break. BTW I really like the NeoPower series, the modular cabling is really handy.

[Faustus]

Enermax, Antec. Another reason I will not accept less.

Sucks for that guy, bad/cheap PSUs fry so many systems, sometimes without the owner knowing it. "But this is my 4th mobo! Whats wrong!"

[ViRaL1]

It's like diving with a low-budget SCUBA tank.

[Capmaster]

Rally,
Sorry to hear about the hardware problems. Been there many, many times myself :P

You had indicated to me a few months ago that you were awaiting the new Iwill SMP Workstation MB board and a couple of Xeons, once the 64-bit ones drove the prices of the others down a bit. Did the plans change for you?

[IAIHMB]

Enermax, Antec. Another reason I will not accept less.

Sucks for that guy, bad/cheap PSUs fry so many systems, sometimes without the owner knowing it. "But this is my 4th mobo! Whats wrong!"

Why in hell do you have to go and scare the noobs? Is the PSU in this case: http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-129-120&depa=1
considered cheap? Should I hold off and buy a case and PSU seperately? Sorry to hear about the computer problems, they are terrible.

[Faustus]

Na, its an antec case so it has an Antec PSU. The brands are listed are GOOD brands not bad ones.

[rallynavvie]

The guy in the story was/is me, I was just making fun of myself

No, I do have the Iwill DH800 up and running, has been since the Tyan went down. There are pics and screenshots in that same directory that the others are posted in. I was holding out for the Nocona Xeons when the 2460 burned out and was forced to get the 3.06 533 Xeons instead so I could keep working on client orders. I went to eBay to get processors quick and dirty but ended up paying more than what the chips cost the next day when Intel announced cost-cuts on the Xeons. I wasn't happy about that but in the end it was good that I didn't wait a little longer for the Noconas when they came out, there are some problems with them and Intel is making a revision to them this fall.

Good power supplies are the foundation of the computer. That's why when I built the new system (I bought the core of the Tyan system from someone, thus the inferior PSU) I put an Antec True550EPS supply in it, and also why I put an Antec NeoPower in the 2460 now. Antec and PC Power and Cooling are the only PSU manufacturers I know I can trust from experiences with them. I'm sure there are others as well. Sparkle has been mentioned with good reviews.

[Capmaster]

Glad to hear it rally. You'll have to let me know how you like the Iwill (benchmarks, etc.) because although I had to prematurely replace mine when it did a boat anchor imitation, and couldn't wait for the Xeons, I eventually want a SMP Xeon workstation for my video work.

It worked out fine - 2.8 HT P4 1MB L2 - plenty of horsepower ...for now. I might upgrade it in a year.

Boy are you right about the PS. The most durable, reliable PC I ever had was one I built myself ...with an Antec case/PS

[ViRaL1]

Speaking of Dual Xeon boards, what do you think about the TYAN Thunder i7520? (S5360)?

[Capmaster]

Speaking of Dual Xeon boards, what do you think about the TYAN Thunder i7520? (S5360)?

Never tried that board, but I've been a Tyan fan from the days when they were first to offer a dual Pentium Pro AT form factor MB.

The beauty of the Iwill board that rallynavvie mentioned is that it's optimized to be a workstation and not as a server MB like all the other dual Xeon boards

[ViRaL1]

I like TYAN as well. I used to have a Tomcat III with Dual P200s. Solid boards and lots of options. Although I was just checking out SuperMicro, and they've got quite a selection of new Xeon boards. Some even have PCI Express x16 slots. I had forgotten how expensive Xeon systems can be.

[rallynavvie]

And you can overclock the ever-loving Christ out of it. Folks are getting 3.6 GHz clock and 1066 MHz FSB on it from 2.4 M-0 Gallatins. Apparently my D1 Prestonias are pretty good candidates as well but I don't want to mess with taking the procs out to mod them just yet. It seems to be doing pretty well in its stock format for now. Only regret is that it doesn't have PCI-E, but that will come with the next SMP machine I'm due to build next year this time

Tyan make fantastic server boards. If not for the flaky supply on my 2460 it would have gone on forever. But Tyan boards aren't geared toward multimedia as much as other manufacturers are. The 5360 is very much a server board (though without SCSI) with its support for up to 16GB of RAM and 2 onboard GbE controllers. If you're looking for a great server board and want to throw tons of money at it I'd recommend one of their Opteron boards though.

[ViRaL1]

I was actually thinking more along the lines of a high-end workstation. Have you seen / heard anything about the new SuperMicro boards?

[rallynavvie]

I guess the X6DAL would make a decent workstation. Seems more toward server use still with ECC ram up to PC2700 instead of the PC3200 my system can run. I'd watch for 925 and 945 chipset Xeon platforms, those would be the PCI-E equivalent of what I've got and would make far better workstation platforms than the 7525.

[indolikaa]

I feel so inadequate with my lowly single-CPU solutions...

[Capmaster]

I feel so inadequate with my lowly single-CPU solutions...

Yeah I know <looks down, kicks the dirt> CPU envy

[DVD_Ripper]

I feel so inadequate with my lowly single-CPU solutions...

Yea... but don't you have 5 or 6 diasy chained together

[rallynavvie]

I got the 2460 up and running finally. I put an old CD drive in it for the time being to install most of its core apps. I need to get my home network fixed so I can start doing updates and stuff off the web as well as get it running its file and game servers. I ended up doing a complete install on it since fixing the boot sector didn't do anything. Oh well, just lost a bunch of data from it, at least I backed up the important stuff. I can make a ghost image of its original install at least. It is a wee bit loud when all those SCSI drives start accessing, I'm going to have to find a place to hide it and get some extra long KVM cables. Anyone know what the effective distance is for KVM cabling?

[ViRaL1]

Do you really spend that much time in front of it once it's up and running? Or is it something you can get set up and just access through Remote Desktop? I rarely access my servers directly.

[rallynavvie]

I suppose I could do remote desktop, I've never really played with it much. I do know KVM uses less system resources though and allows me access to both regardless of what I'm running on one or the other. I don't know yet what I'm going to use it for. It would make a dandy file and game server, especially with how fast my DSL is here (3Mb dedicated up and down) but then it would also be handy when I'm doing a large amount of encoding. I could network resources to it and assemble the project with Premiere or Encore on my primary and then set up the rendering on it instead so I can go on doing other work on the primary. I do know I need to get a GbE controller for it and a GbE switch so I can take advantage of the far greater transfer speeds for video files. Gigabit switches are getting pretty affordable now, especially for the smaller ones. I may just get a 4-port so I have room for new PCs

Ugh, I'm already looking at the next one. How do I make the voices stop telling me to upgrade

[ViRaL1]

I know the feeling; I've been having that same itch myself, although my current system is about a year and a half old. I have a Linksys GbE switch, but it's only one 1 port (which is hooked to my ISO server), the other 8 are 10/100. Linksys also makes 5 and 8 port full GbE switches for less than $150. D-Link and Hawking also have inexpensive options. 3Mb up is damn fast, I only get about 500Kb, but then again I'm not sharing anything and I still get 5Mb down, so I guess I can't complain. Remote Desktop does take up SOME resources, but for a server you won't see much of a performance hit, unless you have plans to leave the window running 24/7. I just connect when I need to do something on the server. Remote Desktop also allows you to close the window and leave the session running so you can reconnect without starting a completely new session (logon, startup etc). I do have a Linksys 4-port KVM (PS2KVM4) connected to my 2 servers and 2 other desktops that I use for burning and testing. It's pretty solid, but every once in a blue moon I end up having to restart one of the systems because it locked up. It uses hotkeys so switching is easy and I don't even have to touch the KVM itself.

[indolikaa]

I feel so inadequate with my lowly single-CPU solutions...

Yea... but don't you have 5 or 6 diasy chained together

Well, yeah...

[rallynavvie]

NewEgg (of course) has the Linksys 5-port workgroup GbE switch for something like $90 and that's the one I was looking at. I can use my DSL modem's built-in G wireless for the rest of the wireless computers in the household instead of my wonderfully reliable D-Link 624 so that I don't have to chain another switch onto the modem. I'll probably get an Intel or Linksys GbE NIC for the Tyan for $30-40. I'd like to see some of those fantastic transfer speeds.

I suppose the reason for the single port Gb switches is so that feasably the other PCs on the 10/100 ports wouldn't see much, if any, of a transfer hit when they're all accessing that one machine?

[ViRaL1]

Yes, I don't see mine listed anymore, so I'm not sure of the model number but it was a kit. It came with the 1 GbE+8 10/100 switch and a GbE NIC. Its good for sending a lot of data on a machine or two and still being able to stream movies to my laptop (through a WRT54G router). I already have 3 machines with GbE now and I'm looking to add NICs to the rest as soon as I buy a full GbE switch, probably the Linksys EG008W. If you decide to go with Linksys, I spoke to one of the support reps a while back when the new GbE models came out (SD2005 and SD2008) and asked if there were any improvements over the EG005W and EG008W. He told me that internally there was no real difference, just the new 'Cisco' look. The SD models are more expensive, but with no difference other than aesthetics. Now that I look at pricegrabber, the price gap has closed, so it seems the only major difference is whether or not you plan to stack it with your Linksys router, as the SDs have a different case type.

--------------------------

EDIT: for anyone interested in the Linksys switches, I found out from Linksys support that the older models only come with a 1yr warranty vs lifetime for the new models.

I was hoping to get the older one, but 1yr vs lifetime has changed my mind.