Baldrick Help.... Useless guides being posted lately..

[Treebeard]

I have noticed a trend that a lot of noobs are posting guides (in the wrong forums) on various things, and they are usually very bad and take way to many steps. Is there a way to not have guides actually posted on the forums until they have been reviewed and approved by you or a mod? It just causes confustion among other new people who are being either mis-informed or taught non-efficient ways to do things. Im sure others agree with me on this.

[Gazorgan]

Hehehehehehe. At least 1/2 are worthless or re-hashes of someone elses work. It doesn't affect the veterans, but a lot of newbies should be mighty frustrated with some of the Authors.

Not to belittle Whompus, but this guide http://www.polarhome.com:793/~afonic/shrinksplit.htm needs work. Step 1 and 2 serve no purpose whatsoever. Step 7 needs more explanation for the newbies. Step 8 needs a disclaimer about deleting unwanted subs/audio. Step 11 is ambigious, and people may get confused, no mention of closing the old window. The whole guide ignores DVD5's, and doesn't mention Main Movie on 1 disk and extra/subs on another. I do know it's supposed to split a movie to 2 disks, but it never tells you when you should and when you shouldn't. This is an example of a sub-standard guide, yet it's 'endorsed' by dvdrhelp since it's linked.

How about an Approved guides section? Approved and Un-Endorsed maybe? Non-Approved has bad connotations.

[lordsmurf]

FYI: I've got a better DVD Shrink guide forthcoming.

Anyway, this is why not everybody is Democrat, Republican, or what-have-you. Not everybody agrees on the same means to meet an end. My thoughts. The most common disagreement on this board is TMPGEnc encode methods. Too many guides there.

I think the bigger issue is that guides should expire in time, maybe have a voting system (was this useful? with a 1-10 rating, like Amazon has for it's reviews) so people will know whether or not the guide sucks. I see several old ATI install guides on this site that no longer apply, same for some other Divx and VCD information that is just plain wrong now.

[Faustus]

Speaking of I need to delink mine out of my sig. It so far out of date its crazy, and the rest of it tho' decent info for a newbie I would hope they could figure on their own. If they can't then perhaps they are mistaking their TV for a comptuer anyway.

[daamon]

Baldrick / Moderators,

I joined this forum as a complete newbie just over 6 months ago and found the huge amount of guides / "How To's" overwhelming. That, in itself, isn't a bad thing.

However, I did find some common problems along the way:

1. References to tools that were (now) old versions.
2. Confusing / vague / ambiguous information in the guide / how to.
3. Information that contradicts other guides.
4. Language / jargon that assumed varying degrees of knowledge.

So, I'm with lordsmurf when he says:

I think the bigger issue is that guides should expire in time, maybe have a voting system (was this useful? with a 1-10 rating, like Amazon has for it's reviews) so people will know whether or not the guide sucks.

I addition I'd like to suggest that the guides are rated (by the author) as to whether they're aimed at A) Total Newbies, B) Slightly Knowledgeable Newbies, C) Fairly Experienced or D) Experts. This rating can then be reviewed (not sure by whom / who has the time) to ascertain it's correctness.

I'd say that both of these together will help anyone searching for a guide / "How To" identify what's considered good and what level of knowledge / experience it's pitched at.

Further still, you could even have a comments section on the guide (like in the DVD players & Tools sections) where people can pass (hopefully constructive) comment.

Food for thought in case you get bored of Christmas / In Laws / TV / Turkey...

Have a good'un one and all. I've certainly learnt loads and it's thanks to you guys and all the posters in the forums and the guides (good and not so good).

[vhelp]

So, I'm with lordsmurf when he says:

Quote:
I think the bigger issue is that guides should expire in time, maybe have a voting system (was this useful? with a 1-10 rating, like Amazon has for it's reviews) so people will know whether or not the guide sucks.

I disagree here

I don't want this to become a "biased" poll on guides. Gudes are great, no
matter how many there are. And, even if from a newbie. However, I do
agree, those that are from newbies (you can tell by viewing their posts or
their birth date in their Avator) and someone (un-biased) can view the guide
"but to see that they work" not "judge" them !!
.
.
I would not want my guide to be judged (specially if it were to be, just as I
U/L'ed it 5 seconds later) ..only to be voted (or taken) off.

If a guide is good, it will service. Look'it Sefy's guides. They are one
of the oldest, and long-standing since time began. Well, you know what I
mean

If anything, the guides could be quickly tested for "validity" and that's it.
This is suppose to be a free forum. Not, "you guide sucks". It just wouldn't
be fair

I say, leave the guides alone. If there is a "bad" guide, someone will catch
it (if it really needs to be corrected, as has ben in the past) and get
over it

Course, I wouldn't mind a Guide menu. That would be C8)8)L
Just a simple and condensed menu (ie, a listing of all guides)

-vhelp

[daamon]

Hi vhelp
CC: Baldrick / Moderators,

Having read your comments, I can see where you're coming from and would like to review and update my suggestions. I'll summarise, as the details are already stated above.

1. Introduce a user rating, by way of votes, (as lordsmurf suggested) for each guide - This will return a fair indication on the usefulness of the guide, from a large number of people across a broad selection, over time.
2. Introduce a comments section, as already exists in the Tools. More detailed feedback, allowing the person looking for info to make a better decision on whether the guide is suitable for their needs or not.
3. Don't set an expiry date (in line with vhelp's comments, sorry lordsmurf). That way, all guides are always available - whatever they end up being rated.
4. Introduce an "experience rating" to help people identify the level of knowledge required to use the guide.

I believe that these will address Treebeard's concerns and alleviate vhelp's fears. My personal (humble) opinion...

I think vhelp's idea for a guide menu would be good, in addition to the current search facility, as people don't always know what keywords to use but a useful looking title could catch their eye.

My reason for commenting here is that I believe that anyone looking for info would find it easier if they had some guidance from other users as to the usefulness of the guide, and an idea of the level of knowledge / experience at which the guides are aimed.

After all, if you're buying a new car you seek advice from others that have driven the same model before. And when you buy a manual to help fix/maintain the car, there are ratings for the different activities (e.g. from chaging the brake pads to removing the engine and gear box assembly) to allow you to judge whether to undertake the job or not. Same thing here...

I fully take on and accept vhelp's comment implying that the site should not be judgemental, but should encourage contribution. Hence the review of part of my suggestion.

If a guide doesn't do so well in its ratings, then the author (being adult, and mature) could learn from reading the more popular guides and understanding how their guide could be improved.

Apologies for the seemingly long comment, I tried to be brief. However, it comes from my appreciation of the site as I have learned so much and achieved my own little successes. I want to be able to contribute to improve it, and am baseing my comments and ideas on my own experiences of the site.

Regards...

[Baldrick]

I will add some kind of rating and also views and clicks(too see how popular a guide is). I'm not sure about comments....I think most will just ask questions instead of feedback.

[daamon]

Good point about the "Comments" thing, I hadn't thought of that.

It'll be interesting to see how it pans out...

[mazinz]

my old guide (capturing with the dazzle) is a bit out of date too. With some wrong info as well (ex capturing at the highest bitrate for mpeg2, of course that is when the dvc2 first came out).

hey Baldrick is their anyway i could update it or is it better to re-do the whole thing and submit it again, deleting the older one?

I know in that i had some methods mixed in with the Tmpg encoder, that still hold true, and would like to keep those, etc thanks

[Gazorgan]

How about guides get a 10 day probation period? Let people comment the heck out of them, then let the Author edit it (if they feel the comment warrant it), then 'release' it with no editorial comments.

I do think a user rating would help (1 through 10), as well as an experience level (Newb(clueless), Rookie(knows what TMPEnc does and how to burn with Nero), Veteran(knows how to fix bad frames and deal with AC3/VBR audio and understands DAR), Expert(Doesn't flinch at PAL conversions, Authors with AC3 audio, has adobe Premier/Ulead for serious editing), Godlike and don't laugh certain processes require godlike skill/patience to pull off correctly!)

[lordsmurf]

Be sure that whatever gets implemented applies to all guides, whether hosted on dvdrhelp or held offsite (like mine are).

I think a rating system will work decently at weeding out bad guides or old guides.

If a review section was implemented, it would need to be like the software reviews. No questions, just comments on how well it worked, etc, maybe even be the best place for the ratings criteria, much like the software has criteria for price and usability. It does well at being fairly question-free, I'd hope the same would exist on guide reviews.

Newbie, Rookie, Veteran, Expert, Professional (God-like ) is a good system. Though "rookie" and "newbie" are a bit interchangeable, as far as the words sound, maybe need a better word for "rookie". Maybe "Somewhat experienced" or "Not total newbie"? For that matter, "expert" and "pro/god" are interchangeable. How about just 3: Newbie, Veteran, Expert ... simple.

@ Baldrick
In terms of expiry, I'm mainly wanting to go after old guides that use software that is long gone. Or after guides that no longer apply at all. I think the one I take issue with most is the ATI install guide, which is just clearly wrong because of how ATI now does their hardware and software. I've seen a few other ones here too, where the out of date info is more harmful than helpful ... since you no longer read the "report this link" aspect for guides, what do you suggest for helping us keep the guides area clean?

[daamon]

How about just 3: Newbie, Veteran, Expert ... simple.

I think that the 5 suggested by Gazorgan (Newbie, Rookie, Veteran, Expert, Professional) are better, as the gap between "Newbie" and "Veteran" is too much. "Veteran" to "Expert" isn't so bad. It needs more differentiation between them, hence my vote for 4 or 5.

To avoid misunderstandings, all you need is a definition posted in with the guides area detailing what the 5 are. Gazorgan's suggestions are a good place to start, though harsh... (Newb = Clueless )

[g_shocker182]

quit your bitchin and ignore the guides if you dont want them. its baldricks job to keep up the site, not yours so dont worry about it

[lordsmurf]

Baldrick can always use new ideas, he's open to them as far as I know and as history has shown, and trying to keep the "help" in dvdrhelp is not "bitchin".

Somebody needs to be gatekeeper of the info. Otherwise, it's just chaos.

[tenders]

I will add some kind of rating and also views and clicks(too see how popular a guide is). I'm not sure about comments....I think most will just ask questions instead of feedback.

i would be interested to see how i compare

[tenders]

quit your bitchin and ignore the guides if you dont want them. its baldricks job to keep up the site, not yours so dont worry about it

so i take it it your(self appointed) job is to complain

who the hell are you anyway

this is a feedback forum

there are too many noobe's that want to take shortcuts. for the most part i think the guides are good,....dont"t forget tho....everyone has a different computer system

[baker]

Just a quick comment.

I found this site a loooooong time ago now and there where only a few guides under the guides section. i went there, learned loads and eventually with a few hiccups made vcds, and later some very snazzy svcds.

now i came here today and was hit with a complete barage of useless "click the go button and the thingy will start to copy your film" guides.

Its a great site, find a new way of submitting guies please!
Baker

[vhelp]

Hi guys,

yeah.. perhaps a long awaited VHELP guide is in order hehe..
.
.
Maybe something on the boarder of VHS :P

I don't know. Maybe someday.., as I'm always too busy knee-deep in interesting
projects, and things.

From the Video Workstation of,
-vhelp 2207

[tenders]

Just a quick comment.

I found this site a loooooong time ago now and there where only a few guides under the guides section. i went there, learned loads and eventually with a few hiccups made vcds, and later some very snazzy svcds.

now i came here today and was hit with a complete barage of useless "click the go button and the thingy will start to copy your film" guides.

Its a great site, find a new way of submitting guies please!
Baker

i can see where some system needs to be in place

[g_shocker182]

so i take it it your(self appointed) job is to complain

i think of it to be more of an informative job

who the hell are you anyway

i would be g_shocker182. if i went any furthur it would defeat the purpose of the internet

this is a feedback forum

my comment wasnt directed at you, so, as i say again, dont worry about it

[johns0]

Keep the old guides that use older programs in case people with the older programs need help that way,i find the guides here very helpful like a library,you dont go in a library and ask to chuck out the stuff you think isnt needed or outdated or not good enough,maybe just the completely useless no brainer by a newbie trying to contribute should be nuked.

[Faustus]

I'm thinking of posting a guide on how to clean your homes duct work. It may seem off topic but I found a way to do it using dvdxcopy... thing that is a good one to post?

[daamon]

quit your bitchin and ignore the guides if you dont want them. its baldricks job to keep up the site, not yours so dont worry about it

Wow, what a constructive, intellectual and accurate comment. I'm sure Baldrick also appreciates the support and appreciation you demonstrate for all his efforts.

I can't see how the preceeding posts are bitching, or where anyone says they don't want the guides. And, whilst it may be Baldrick's job to keep up the site, I think it's a good thing that (most) people want to make a positive contribution to the site by giving feedback and suggestions for improvements based on their knowledge and experiences of using the site - from whatever degree of expertise.

so i take it it your(self appointed) job is to complain

who the hell are you anyway

this is a feedback forum

Baldrick can always use new ideas, he's open to them as far as I know and as history has shown, and trying to keep the "help" in dvdrhelp is not "bitchin".

Well said...

[daamon]

Keep the old guides that use older programs in case people with the older programs need help that way,i find the guides here very helpful like a library,you dont go in a library and ask to chuck out the stuff you think isnt needed or outdated or not good enough.

Good point, good idea.

[offline]

VHELP...from newbies (you can tell by viewing their posts or
their birth date in their Avator)

Humph! I lurked for over a year before I registered and so
do others I think. Avatar age does not equal newbie status.
When I first lurked, only Sefy's guide + one other was online.
It is a pity Sefy got ripped off, and now it seems he has sold
his latest guides to www.dvdhelp.us ( a pale facsimile of DVDRHelp )

[lordsmurf]

Keep the old guides that use older programs in case people with the older programs need help that way,i find the guides here very helpful like a library,you dont go in a library and ask to chuck out the stuff you think isnt needed or outdated or not good enough,maybe just the completely useless no brainer by a newbie trying to contribute should be nuked.

Not entirely true. Most libraries toss away a LOT of stuff each year. It's only places with low budgets that keep old junk. While things like fiction have infinite lifespan, encyclopedias and how-to guides do not. Some things were made to be chucked as they age.

We don't need help guide for TMPGEnc v2.0, DVD Shrink 1.0, etc etc.

[Sefy]

@Offlline, my guides weren't ripped
I've contacted DVDhelp.us so they could also host the guide, cause i've wanted to reduce stress from hosts, as the guide is very large and heavy now, and when people use it' it can get lots of bandwidth and slow down, so the more hosts, the less viewers on the same page.

I've got about 8 hosts for the guide
I Was hoping on releasing the newest version of the guide for 2004, but it looks like it might not happen, my PC died 2.5 weeks ago now, and with a bit of luck I may get a new board by the end of this week, so I couldn't do any updates and finish the new guide and I had so many plans for it

If anyone knows where I can upload about a 4mb ZIP file so hosts can do a download of the new guide, please let me know!

@LordSmurff, my guide is old, true, very true, about 4 years now if i'm not mistaken, Baldrick knows for sure. But I do try to keep it as updates as possible, always using latest programs. But I keep the old ones as well cause it might surprise you, but people still do use them. like for example TMPGEnd 12a cause it can open ASF/WMV files, even I still have it 8)

Having a Guide for older software isn't bad, it's always usefull and never hurts to have one

[Baldrick]

Keep the old guides that use older programs in case people with the older programs need help that way,i find the guides here very helpful like a library,you dont go in a library and ask to chuck out the stuff you think isnt needed or outdated or not good enough,maybe just the completely useless no brainer by a newbie trying to contribute should be nuked.

Not entirely true. Most libraries toss away a LOT of stuff each year. It's only places with low budgets that keep old junk. While things like fiction have infinite lifespan, encyclopedias and how-to guides do not. Some things were made to be chucked as they age.

We don't need help guide for TMPGEnc v2.0, DVD Shrink 1.0, etc etc.

My budget is very low. . But I will see what I can do, maybe a section for old guides using old tools.

[daamon]

maybe a section for old guides using old tools.

Good idea, but no doubt you're then gonna get some pedantic who's gonna start arguing over what the definition of "old" is. I guess "you're the law" on that one / common sense will rule.