Digital Flags stop internet sharing of TV shows

[Roundabout]

FCC mulls digital 'flag' to sink TV pirates


U.S. regulators in coming weeks will adopt strict limits on sending digital television programs over the Internet to avoid the problems now plaguing the music industry, U.S. officials said on Tuesday.

The Federal Communications Commission will likely adopt rules that will allow programmers to attach a code to digital broadcasts that will in most cases bar consumers from sending copies of popular shows around the world, said the officials, who declined to be identified.

The approval, expected as early as next week, are intended as another step along the long road to higher-quality, crisper digital signals, which have been slow in coming because of worries about piracy, high-priced equipment and limited programming.

An agency spokeswoman declined to comment on when the five commissioners would vote on the issue.

Consumer advocates have warned that consumers will have to buy new DVD players if they want to play programs that have been recorded on machines that recognize the digital "flag." But agency officials stressed that that always happens when new technology hits the market.

"It will simply prevent consumers from illegal piracy, from mass distribution over the Internet, which is the problem with the music file sharing," Kenneth Ferree, head of the FCC's media bureau, said.

The music industry has been plagued over the last few years with consumers illegally sharing and copying songs over the Internet, which has led the recording industry to sue music downloaders for damages up to $150,000 per song.

Consumers will still be able to make unlimited copies of their favorite shows and watch them in various rooms of their homes, but they will not be able to send them over unsecured networks until protections are established, the officials said.

"Why should anyone in the world buy if it's on the Internet," said Andrew Setos, president of engineering at News Corp.'s Fox Entertainment Group.

Initially, the FCC is aiming for a relatively open process for approving equipment that will read encrypted shows, officials said, and the agency will likely retain some oversight along the way to help ensure a fair review of new technologies.

Programmers had wanted a role in approving television equipment to ensure that security features were robust enough. But some technology companies, such as Microsoft, had worried they would be shut out from developing new ways to deliver protected digital content.

IBM has been developing technology so that some day consumers will be able to transmit shows over secured networks, such as between their homes and offices.

Television-set makers hope to begin installing the necessary equipment for the broadcast flag in TVs going on sale next year.

"As a solution for addressing the single narrow problem of Internet redistribution, this is a pretty good solution," said Dave Arland, a spokesman for Thomson, which manufactures RCA television sets.

But consumer advocates warn that it would make obsolete 50 million DVD players already in Americans' homes.

"If a consumer records a program on a new Broadcast Flag equipped machine and then tries to take that program and play it on Grandma's older DVD player, it's just not going to work," said Chris Murray, legislative counsel for Consumers Union.


Exactly as I expected, they are going to try to prevent us from backing up/sharing TV shows and anything else transmitted digitally. Why would I want my DVD player to be obsolete overnight, along with millions of other consumers? Hollywood always seems to want everything their way, without a thought for the consumer. More backlash expected...

[The village idiot]

This is actually an old topic. That's why I bought my HD tuner card early before they had a chance to "hard code" this protection into the chips. With current bandwidth for consumer use, they shouldn't be too worried about TV broadcasts ending up on the net in HD form. At around 18GB an hour, the bandwidth just doesn't exist. Everything will have to be down sampled for 'net distribution. And as far as home HD recorders go, we will need a method of storage that is much more dense than current dual layer DVD. If you are really concerned, better buy an HD tuner card now! And start contacting your elected representatives!

[MOVIEGEEK]

I can see the headlines from 2005:
"12 year old sued for illegally downloading reruns of Sesame Street."

What next a phoneline connected to the DVD player so the bloodsuckers can tell us what we can and cannot watch?!
George Orwell must be turning in his grave.

[The village idiot]

I can see the headlines from 2005:
"12 year old sued for illegally downloading reruns of Sesame Street."

What next a phoneline connected to the DVD player so the bloodsuckers can tell us what we can and cannot watch?!
George Orwell must be turning in his grave.

No just no more DVD players! And no more TV's! You might take a camcorder and record what is displayed and then pirate that onto the 'net

[Styro]

This sounds a awful lot like the broadcast flag for HD signals that will disable the recording of shows that carry the flag. Actually this is probably a brother to the broadcast (bah! called it no-record) flag. The major corporations are just trying (and succeeding) in removing consumer rights. They have a sympathetic government now, so they might as well strike while the iron is hot.

While major corporations should be able to protect produced content, we consumers should be able to view the content whenever we want, on whatever player is convenient for us, and without any additional cost and/or inconvenience. Time-shifting and personal recording is a part of the fair-use laws that make sense and need to be preserved.

-- Styro

[arealgijoe]

What next a phoneline connected to the DVD player so the bloodsuckers can tell us what we can and cannot watch?!
George Orwell must be turning in his grave.



Ever hear of Divix?

I am refering to the divix DVD format pushed by Circuit City etc.


Nearly ran CC out of business.

=JD=

[MOVIEGEEK]

"Ever hear of Divix? "

Yes I remember DIVX but that was to limit the amount of times you watched the DVD,Hollywood wants to limit that to one viewing and wants us to pay for any additional viewing...wait a minute....that is DIVX!

[Faustus]

So how long when they come out with this eqipment until there is a firmware hack? All any of this stuff ever really does is stop casual people and the non electronicly inclined. Hardcode in.... softcode an ignore for the hard code. It all just seems so stupid really. If you see the discussion about Reality programming and current TV in the off topic section I ask... do you really want to trade TV programs that badly?

[RabidDog]

nice word "mulls" ... it means we 'll try this and see if we can get away with it. Fight back with the video recorder, buy a really good one now as they wont be available soon.

[lordsmurf]

Encrypt, copyright, prevent, pay-only... blah blah blah.
It may stop the masses, but not the determined person.

[Gazorgan]

The flag already exists for analog broadcasts, it's jsut never used because of the 1000's of phone calls a station gets when they turn it on (broadcast Macrovision) and people's soaps are messed up.

Less than 3 years to go before it's Digital only in the US, and that's their target date!!! (note: Digital TV and HDTV aren't the same thing).

[Styro]

I can just image the problems they would encounter enabling broadcast macrovision - vcrs (and possibly) tivos recording blank channels and alot of pissed off consumers. Why, I would have to put that video stabilizer (that happens to defeat macrovision) back into my video setup, or put up with the 8.5 hours of additional personal productivity (per week) I could reclaim. Choices, choice, choices...

The heck with corporations and their "you'll watch what we give you to watch, when we want you to watch it, how we want you to watch it, and you'll be a good zombie and buy the crud advertised during." Maybe I'll just join the masses that drops TV altogether. Won't be a big loss here.

-- Styro

[joepic]

This is actually an old topic. That's why I bought my HD tuner card early before they had a chance to "hard code" this protection into the chips. With current bandwidth for consumer use, they shouldn't be too worried about TV broadcasts ending up on the net in HD form. At around 18GB an hour, the bandwidth just doesn't exist. Everything will have to be down sampled for 'net distribution. And as far as home HD recorders go, we will need a method of storage that is much more dense than current dual layer DVD. If you are really concerned, better buy an HD tuner card now! And start contacting your elected representatives!

Curious as to which HD tuner card you purchased and why?

Any recommendiations would be appreciated.

Thanks...

[XanaXManX]

It doesnt matter what protection or encryption they come out with, it will be broken.

Hell the only TV show that I really dont like to miss is the Simpsons and I have almost every single one. Duck Tales have been kinda hard to get though.

[kirpen]

I dont think your old equipment is going to work with the new tech. From what I've read everything in the chain has to read the flag are you lose hd

[cplevel42]

That is correct!!! The old equipment will NOT work with the new. They are going **** us all into buying new stuff.

Of course, you know that this will bring on an even larger underground REVOLUTION. Get ready boys, were going to need the big guns now.

[FOO]

"13 channels of shit to choose from" -Pink Floyd
"I'm the slime oozin' outta yur TV set" -Frank Zappa

[Roundabout]

Updated: 11/5/03

FCC Approves Internet Anti-Piracy Tool

WASHINGTON - The government on Tuesday approved an anti-piracy mechanism to make it harder for computer users to illegally distribute digital TV programs on the Internet.

In its order, the Federal Communications Commission (news - web sites) told makers of digital television receivers that by July 1, 2005, their models must recognize an electronic marker that broadcasters can embed in their programs to limit piracy.

As Internet connections get faster and broadcasters switch to much clearer digital TV, the movie and television industries are concerned that consumers will put high-quality copies of shows and films on the Web that others can download for free. This would reduce the broadcasters' ability to sell the shows for syndication or overseas.

The proliferation of music on the Internet has held down the sales of CDs, and the music industry has started to sue listeners who illegally distribute the songs online.

FCC (news - web sites) Chairman Michael Powell said his agency was taking "an important step toward preserving the viability of free over-the-air television."

The deadline would be in advance of the congressionally mandated goal of 2007 for all TV broadcasts to switch to a digital format, which uses computer language, from the current analog format, which uses radio signals sent as waves. After the switchover, consumers who don't subscribe to a cable or satellite service would need digital tuners, either inside a TV or in a set-top box.

FCC officials said the embedded electronic signal, known as a "broadcast flag," would not prevent consumers from using existing or new DVD or VCR machines to make copies of TV programs. But the signal is designed to make it more difficult for consumers to then transfer those copies to the Internet and make them available to potentially millions of others.

While all five commissioners supported the order, Jonathan Adelstein, one of two Democrats on the five-member panel, said the decision did not safeguard viewers' privacy.

"Improper use of the technologies could arguably allow such things as tracking personal information," Adelstein said. "The broadcast flag should be about protecting digital content, not about tracking Americans' viewing habits."

Broadcasters had strongly urged the FCC to approve the flag.

"Without it, high quality programming will migrate off of free television," said Edward O. Fritts, president of the National Association of Broadcasters.

But consumer groups said the electronic marker is not the solution to prevent illegal copying of TV programs.

"We would like to be talking about how to best protect over-the-air content rather than rush 1,000 miles an hour to approve a solution that isn't going to work with technology we haven't seen for a problem we don't yet have," said Chris Murray, legislative counsel for Consumers Union, the publisher of Consumer Reports magazine.

[MikieV]

Just read an article about a maker of PCI HDTV tuner-cards for PCs, and how they are going to stop selling them in 2005, when the new regulations take effect.

Get yours now!

And remember to pay cash! So they don't use credit-card receipts to track you down - like "they" did with people who had bought memory cards and writers, which -could- be used to pirate satallite TV reception => if you ever had a satellite TV hookup AFTER you purchased the card/writer, you had to prove you were innocent of piracy??? - or fight being billed for use of all scrambled broadcasts/channels you -could- have pirated???

Every day, and in everyway, its' getting better and better (for the Media Conglomerates).

Mike

[Gazorgan]

I would like to point out it's a 'Flag'. So, when the digital tuners come out, I'm sure there will be quite a number that can have it disabled (just like todays settop DVDPlayers).

Don't get worked up over something that's never going to matter a hill of beans. The conversion to digital alone is going to be the 'biggest disaster' in the US since the great depression. I don't think 2% of the US population realizes their TV's will stop working in less that 3 years. The others already have Digital TV's.

Buy stock in companies that will make the digital-2-analog conversion boxes. Actually most people will get a Digital ready VCR and tue with that. Little hacking and your flag free!

[jeg_jason]

I am curious to think whether this flag can stop anything from getting on the net. Will it be able to be seen if a user encrypts the file before trying to upload it? Will it work if a user makes an ISO image of the file on CD and then uploads it? Will it survive compression utilities? Will the P2P programs make their interface look like another hard drive on your system so the flag thinks it is only being transferred locally and not over the net? My point is that someone will find a way to do it eventually. This flag will probably just piss most consumers off who will then adopt a workaround for it or stop watching as much TV. Just when I was getting excited about digital television stuff like this appears. If I miss a TV episode, am I a criminal for getting a copy of the net to watch it? If I am then what is the difference between that and me borrowing my neighbor's recording of the same show. It makes me think that I should stockpile programs and hardware now before all digital video gets FUBAR by excessive regulations. But if everything in the future has to recognize the flag then it would be a moot point.

[jbenj01]

Man, all this stuff is just a blurr to me.. someone, please explain so a moron like me can understand..

OK.. so i understand that any digitally broadcast TV program (that's HD, yes??) will have some sort of 'encryption' technology built-in so that it can't be recorded by.. any type of recorder??

And what is an HD Tuner Card? You need this to watch HDTV on your pc? Or connect your HD STB to your pc, then to your TV.. And b/c of this new 'encryption', these HD Tuner Cards will no longer be sold, i.e., banned for sale??

My HT system is separate from my computer.. so i'm to connect these systems together, using the HD Tuner card to watch TV??

Thanks for your patience.. BTW, i just posted a separate post, inquiring as to whether my Panasonic DVD recorder (DMR E20) is useful for anything now.. my guess is, not really.. ??

[courtrrb]

I belive I've already gotten nailed by this flag this week. I recorded StarTrek Enterprise from Channel 9 out of NY. When I played it back all I got was a blue screen(When I would pause the video I could see the picture.). When I changed to another channel for a second test It recorded fine.