How are Online Media Sites surviving?

[defense]

Surprises me that alot of these online media sites aren't going belly up. Their prices are ALL too high. They were ok when people were testing the waters and taking risks on princo/ACCU/RITEK..etc....but now that more and more media consumers are more savvy....and understand there are programs such as AVDINFO/DVDINFO..etc...it surprises me that these online sites get ANY business at all.

Think about it.....they were great because of their low prices on the "generic" types of media....but their prices for Name brand media such as Verbatim, TDK, etc...has always been almost DOUBLE any retail store! Now businesses such as Best Buy and even Target are having INSANELY low sale after sale on 4X DVD MEDIA! Take meritline for example. Their CHEAPEST 4X media right now is the LD/ACCU for as low as $1.15 a piece. Those 4x disks aren't nearly as high of quality as the majority of the Ricoh manufactured disks....nor do they burn CONSISTENTLY AT 4X! They burn MOST of the time @2x and when you match up consistent media vs consistent media..such as the Samsung BEALL DVD-R's for example.

Meritline sells those for close to $2.00 a piece...while you can get quality at or better then that with the TDK or Memorex Ricoh manufactured disks Best Buy has the sales on. The Memorex Ricoh's are still on sale and are $1.20 a piece! That's approximately a whopping .80 cents LESS PER DISK.....think about just a TEN PACK...that's eight dollars you'd save....and in a 100 pack between the two disks....your talking about an EIGHTY DOLLAR DIFFERENTIAL! LOL..... And now 8x burners are going to be released soon.....QUALITY/CONSISTENT 4X media is soon going to be LESS then a DOLLAR a piece....but these sites have not adjusted their prices accordingly at all. So as I said...i'm VERY surprised they are getting ANY type of business at all...at least on "MEDIA"..that is.

[lordsmurf]

The good media you can buy online is still better than the so-called "good" media you can buy in stores. Overall, the prices online are cheaper. The cheap discs ARE overpriced because of poor performance, but not the good media. At only $1.50 per 4x Ritek, that's the best deal in town (or any town). Stores don't really even carry good media, and what they have is overpriced. TDK is nice, but not as solid as Ritek or Optodisc.

I'll change my tune if Maxell comes down in price at the stores.

[andkiich]

Don't forget though a few things:

1) Most online stores are just that, online stores. Their overhead is probably incredibly low.

2) If they are buying in bulk, and I mean a lot like palettes of DVD writables, then they are most likely getting a deal that you wouldn't believe, especialy on the "cheap" stuff. They make the majority of their money on volume of sales, not a few high price sales. I used to work at a software/game retailer to get my way through college. And their advantage over everyone else in town was volume sales, so I've seen the concept at work in the real world.

3) They may be shiping direct from the factory/warehouse directly to your house, which cuts down on their overhead as well. It's similar to the way that Amway and the like work.

[ebenton]

Could be also that stores like Best Buy, etc. who have "sales" on DVD or other media might also be using the media as a "loss leader" the way supermarkets do with some things. Safeway or Albertson's might sell milk for $2.00 a gallon, but hope that you'll come in and buy a bunch of stuff at the regular price along with the milk.
Maybe BestBuy, etc. are hoping you might come in to buy the blank media, but also buy some other stuff, too.
The online stores could use that ploy, too, but it's more difficult when you've already paid a higher price for 1,000 pallets full of blank media sitting in a warehouse somewhere.

[LanEvo7]

I don't understand where you are getting this. I'm just went on Best Buy and CompUSA website and the lowest price for DVD-R discs are still about $2 per disc. I order a 50 pack of DupEZ's off Rima and it comes out to less than $1 each.

[vtecwil]

Most likely what he is reffering to is the sale that best buy has going this week .

They have a 25 pack of memorex 4X DVD+R for 29.99 .

That works out to around 1.20 per disc .

They are made by ricoh same as tdk and verbatim .

And I'll take those ricoh discs at 1.20 over those discs from rima any day even if they are less than a dollar .

[defense]

lanevo, exactly what vtecwil said is correct. I'm not even just "solely" talking about one particular sale on these Memorex "RICOH" disks..i'm talking about the continual sales each and every week. For the last two months there has been one sale after another where one retail store has a better deal then the other. To date, the best deal on QUALITY 4x media is that which Best Buy currently has on the Memorex 4x Ricoh manufactured DVD+R Disks. The Memorex DVD-R disks are CMC, so you'd probably want to avoid those.


Point though is that your order of DupeZ media is too highly priced...and not simply not the quality of some of the other brands i've mentioned. Not saying that they aren't worth buying...just not worth the price. Are those disks 2x? If so, that's robbery....if they are 4x disks...you are purchasing disks which are NON LEGIT 4X disks. Point being that those sites are extremely overpriced....the one example I gave showing comparable media is a difference of $80 in just a 100 pack. How about a 500 pack of the two? Now your talking $400! Just on one order...lol

[poopyhead]

1) a lot of deals still requires rebates...we love them don't we

2) online stores typically sell the cheapest media...they may not be name brand, but i can always get princos at $0.81 shipped and after tax without any rebate or having to buy in bulk.

3) retail stores may only sell big name brands...it's up to you if they're worth it. but, if the retail stores were carrying the exact same cheapo princo discs as online retailers..they will definitely be more expensive than online.

[ImaWeTodd]

Sold Out on their web site. The Best Buy near me has good deals but rarely has the item in stock.

You can always get deals if you look and wait for them. I get a coupon from amazon and they had a good price on Verbatim's at the time. Picked some up at $1.50 a disk I think.

My problem is I stock up when I find a reasonable price on disc that work for me. Unfortunately prices are always falling, but I don't really want to be caught with a project and no Discs.

Guess how many unopened CD-Rs spindels I have in the corner. Wanna buy some cheap? :P

[defense]

poopyhead...I understand what your saying, but your missing the point. Most of these deals i'm referring to require no rebate at all. They are INSTANT REBATES...the big TDK sale at Best Buy being one example...as well as the Current Memorex sale best buy is advertising.

As far as "cheap" media....these online sites are selling Princo disks that cheap...because that is what they are worth. Sure, you'll get a person every blue moon who CLAIMS they've never had a coaster....but for every 1 of those people you find.... you'll find 50 who say otherwise.

My point though is comparing QUALITY MEDIA vs. Quality media.... Princo obviously isn't included in this....and i'd be surprised if sites could live just one PRinco sales and the like alone.

When you take Quality media of any of these online sites...compare it to quality media being sold at places like Best Buy, Fry's, Sam's Club, Target...etc...there really isn't a comparison.

The Lead Data 4x disks, as well as the Prime disks, are NOT LEGIT 4X disks...i've said that a thousand times.....yea their price is cheap....you get one out of ten to burn @ 4x ...so did you really get what you paid for at $1.15-$1.50 a pop for these disks? Of course you didn't.....how bout spending $1.20 per disk like on these Memorex DVD+R 4X disks, and assure yourself a 4x burn EACH AND EVERY TIME...why? Because the disks are Legit 4x disks..just like the TDK's. And for alot less money. You take these factors....mainly price, and i'm sorry...you'd have to be a fool to purchase any of the other disks from meritline or any of the other online sites. But if you like SPENDING MORE MONEY for crappier quality as well as disks which are not True 4x disks....by all means...don't let me stop you.

Guess how many unopened CD-Rs spindels I have in the corner. Wanna buy some cheap?

lol..yep..same here....they are still collecting dust from the old SVCD days....use them for mp3's every now and then but still have a ton of cdr's all over.

[LanEvo7]

@defense
Week after week? I see that these new +R 4x discs are pretty good for the price, but what was last week's sale? I probably don't notice these sales as much because I have an a05 and these sales are usually for +R media. The last one I remember was the TDK 100 stack for $120 at best buy and this one was like 2-3 weeks ago. The rest of these sales are usually at staples for some crappy brand like Khypermedia which are CMC = CRAP. Yea, they are getting cheaper and cheaper but I still see myself using Rima or Meritline.

Point though is that your order of DupeZ media is too highly priced...and not simply not the quality of some of the other brands i've mentioned. Not saying that they aren't worth buying...just not worth the price. Are those disks 2x? If so, that's robbery....if they are 4x disks...you are purchasing disks which are NON LEGIT 4X disks. Point being that those sites are extremely overpriced....the one example I gave showing comparable media is a difference of $80 in just a 100 pack. How about a 500 pack of the two? Now your talking $400! Just on one order...lol

I don't understand what you are saying here. They are 1x/2x discs and most media prices for 2x discs at retail are >$2 each + tax. Here and there you'll find a sale like this, which is great. And compared to the sale, these discs are probably of lower quality, but the prices aren't really at a constant low price.

[Rippermac]

I don't know where you guys are buying at online but I don't see BestBuy or anybody else giving a better deal than say Rima or Shop4Tech...eg..I recently purchased 50 4X Ritex at a cost of $82(includes postage) that works out $1.64! Now I could possible go to Bestbuy or some other major chain and get close to the same price after rebates!!! I don't know about you but I hate waiting 8 to 10 weeks for a freaking cheque! Besides I know I'm getting Ritek 4X not some rebadged princo or some other inferior grade media. There is cheap quality media available on line but if you DVD burner doesn't recognize it and your burning software defaults to 2X or 1X then it's really a waste of your money. Until the local stores sell the name brands that I like at the online prices without that damn rebate crap...I'll stick with online. My .02¢

[defense]

@LanEvo, I see you have had much success with those LD disks. Good to see that in all seriousness. I don't know how many plants LD has...but it would appear yours, which come from Rima...are of higher quality then other people. Although I remember Disturbed said he wasn't too impressed with the LD DUPEZ either...but maybe Rima gets them at a higher quality now. Anyway, not saying those disks aren't good....hopefully they work out...i'm just taking sheer numbers.

But what I am saying is that you are right in terms of .99 being a good price in comparison to the other "online" sites...but NOT in comparison to the High Quality media being sold at many of the other retailers. If you only have a -R drive...then your choices are less limited for these sales..which BY THE WAY...is probably partially the answer to my question. These online sites are getting a lot of business because sales are limited....and if a person misses one...who knows when the next one will come around. I guess I just got caught up in the luxury of my multiformat burner and assuming everyone had a multi-format burner. But sales have been more apparent over the last month or so...and if i'm not mistaking..Target has these TDK disks for $29.99 for 20....

that is not even a sale price to my knowledge...so that's just incredible...because those disks were twice as much for a long time...so by them stocking those TDK disks at that uncommonly low price...their forcing the issue on other retailers to lower their prices or have sales to stay competitive. So far CompUSa, Best Buy, Fry's, Sam's Club..have all followed suit...but these online sites continue to sell there media at too high a price. Like I said...those .99 DupeZ disks are just too expensive...I can go right now and purchase higher quality 4x disks for pennies more....and not only have them be higher quality..have them be twice as fast with respect to burning time.

As I said, the retailers have followed suit and adjusted their prices accordingly...the online sites have NOT as of yet...and that's why i'm surprised that they get much business at all.

[defense]

don't know where you guys are buying at online but I don't see BestBuy or anybody else giving a better deal than say Rima or Shop4Tech...eg..I recently purchased 50 4X Ritex at a cost of $82(includes postage) that works out $1.64

@rippermac..what are you talking about? The biggest media sales over the last month have required NO M.I.R...they have ALL BEEN INSTANT REBATES in store.

Just curious....what disks did you purchase for $1.64 per disk? You got ripped off on whatever disks they were...but i'm anxious to hear what disks you purchased......Ritek?

[Faustus]

I'm pretty picky on the brands that I use. If some good TDK is on sale I might get them at a local store. I even picked up some of the 1x Imation (ritek g03s) just to have a few extra disc as I was running low at the time. But I can get 100 pack of disc that I trust for around $100, sometimes higher sometimes lower, online, everytime. I can't say that about any local stores.

[jnk76]

defence,

The pricing must have gone way cheaper in last few months at bestbuy.

One thing I must comment on is that I have enjoyed a very very high success rate using Riteks. I have never seen them at any retailer in Canada or online at bestbuy. The companys (media) may have been losing so much market share that just decided to outsell to try and get some back.

IMO......if I ever see high quality discs in store for same or slighty more than online......I would not hesistate to buy immedietly for obvious reasons.

But so far buying bulk of Riteks online has been only option for me.

Also I like the white printable and I haven't seen those either at brick and mortor stores

J

[defense]

But I can get 100 pack of disc that I trust for around $100, sometimes higher sometimes lower, online, everytime. I can't say that about any local stores

Are you talking about 1x disks flaystus? Again, you have to keep apples with apples...because if you can get 100 1x or hell, even 2x disks for about $100, then how can you be getting a better deal when I can go to a retailer and get High Quality TRUE 4X disks which are twice as fast and of higher quality then your online purchased disks...in addition, we're talking only a difference of pennies.

Yes, the online sites were good over the last few months...I've used several of them...but times have changed....retailers have dropped their DVD media prices considerably. I remember the 2x Verbatims were always $44.95 for a 15 pack...that's more then $3 a piece with tax and now they are around $2 a piece WITHOUT A SALE...that's a big price drop...your talking $1 per disk. Although those Verbatim disks could be 2 cents because that's what their worth.

But the point is that prices are dropping...times are changing....you might be able to get those generic 1-2x disks for $100 for 100 ....but when I can spend pennies more and get Higher quality disks which burn twice as fast...there really is no comparison.

[LanEvo7]

Its great that the prices are lowering. I HATE buying stuff online. I'd much rather go to the local store and pick it up right there and then, instead of waiting at home all day for the delivery guy. I probably don't notice these sales as much, but at regular retail price, its rare to find anything below $2(not counting Khypermedia and other crappy brands). As for Target, its 44.99 for a 20 pack of tdk +R or -R. People like me prefer not to wait hoping for a sale next week. I don't like to stock up media because it gets cheaper every day and I don't use that many in a week. Its great that you found this deal, lets hope these deals stay constant enough so that we don't ever have to deal with online anymore.

[Rippermac]

See if this linky works http://www.shop4tech.com/user.htm?go=view_cata&cata=1&s_cata=88&s_scata=248....if not go to shop4tech.com and search for -4X media...$82.50 for 50 and $155 for 100. Quality 4X Ritek that I know will work and burn at rated speed! Give an example from this past Sunday...OfficeDepot had a sale 50 TDK for about $82 after taxes...went and got some and tried a burn...guess what? They were CMC and wouldn't burn at 4X...these sales you see are the exception rather than the rule....99% of the time you send a rebate in...now if I see the brands I like for the prices of the TDK's or Imation or Khypermedia...then I'll have no problems buying them locally...too many times I have had to roll the dice to see what rebadged brand I'm buying under that name brand label...I'll go with the sure thing...my .02 [/code]

[defense]

rippermac.... 99% of the time you have to send rebates in? All the target sales...the Office Depot sales, buy one get one free on Verbatim and PHilips...the CompUSA branded disks....the Best Buy TDK SALES..the Best Buy Memorex sales..i've just named about ten.....ALL OF THEM WERE INSTANT...so where are you getting your figures from?

Those Ritek disks ARE NOT TRUE 4X disks either. Ritek are good disks..and maybe they burn for you @4x, but they don't for many...and the reason is because they are NOT TRUE 4X disks either. Are they better then the Speedy's or Matrix disks? Yes...no doubt....but they aren't worth the price you paid for them...ESPECIALLY when you could of gotten some Ricoh manufactured disks for .44 cents A PIECE cheaper! You just threw $22 down the toilet which is exactly my point. You also would of gotten higher quality media which is true 4x.

Oh well.....whatever makes you happy. As I said...these online sites were good a few months ago...but they have remained constant in a market where DVD Media prices are contiuously falling. Anyone who purchases media online armed with these facts really needs to take a deep breath and get some sleep...gather their thoughts and realize whether they like throwing money away.

[Faustus]

I keep seeing the term "True 4x disc" since 4x DVD-R is an open standard unlike 2x then a disc is either 4x and not good at it, or 4x and good at it. To call it true 4x inplys that they are somehow cheating.

Regardless yes those are 1x disc that I find burn perfectly at 2x. I've not seen a worth while deal on 4x disc that was a brand I would trust at my local _insert store here_.

Of course its a little soon to say that these sales are constant. For a while the DVR-A04 was anywhere between 179 and 150 after rebates because of sales, but it did eventually dry up. of course it came back, but it did dry up. Until the prices are NORMAL you cannot assume they will be there when you need them.

Besides when I buy online I don't have to go anywhere, and if something is out of stock I know pretty quickly and move on to the next place online to buy from. I can do it all from my desk and not be stressed trying to get the disc before they all sell out.

[defense]

I keep seeing the term "True 4x disc" since 4x DVD-R is an open standard unlike 2x then a disc is either 4x and not good at it, or 4x and good at it. To call it true 4x inplys that they are somehow cheating

you hit the nail right on the head! Not only are they cheating...they are basically lying! The reason meritline and shop4tech as well as the other online sites get away with this is because the disks MAY occasionally burn at 4x OR the disks will burn @4x IN ONE DVD BURNER..LMAO.....so they are called 4x disks! That's why you look at meritline...they are selling those ACCU and PRIME disks for $1.15-1.25 a piece....much lower priced are they then their other 4x media such as OPTODISK AND BEALL...but there is a REASON FOR THEIR LOWER PRICE....because they are NOT TRUE 4X disks.

Now, with that being said...I still can't see how you can say that these sales at retailers are not better then the price you've been currently paying for media. So i'll ask you this just for my own solice....are you saying that you'd rather pay $100 for 1x certified ritek's which do burn @2x....instead of getting Quality "TRUE" 4x disks such as those "RICOH's" for pennies more

[Faustus]

..."TRUE" 4x disks such as those "RICOH's" for pennies more

I think you continue to miss my point about the True 4x thing, BUT that aside in answer to your question. Yes. Because I do not know the price of the disc you are talking about, and I have never used them. I cannot personally say that they are good disc and therefore I will not waste money on a large buy of them. As far as saying Pennies more... per disc? How many pennies? that adds up very fast. Plus when you consider Tax for buying locally... the price rises very quickly when you take these things into account.

[bebrewer1]

I think at this particular time, it's harder for -R owners to get good local deals on 4X media than +R owners. Now that Ricoh is making 4X DVD+R for Memorex, there's always good media on your local retailers shelf and you can get it on sale from time to time. I was hoping that Ricoh would be making the Memorex DVD-R media as well but it looks like it is CMC.

Until Sams or Best Buy starts carrying Verbatim or TDK 4X, rebadged/retail media for less than $1.50 per, I'll have to continue to purchase Ritek 4X media from web based retailers to get the better price.

Target is carrying the 4X TDK media but I'm not paying $2.52 per blank after tax because, with my inherent male cheapness I'd probably have a heart attack knowing I was willingly throwing away $$. I have a wife and two daughters for that

[defense]

I think you continue to miss my point about the True 4x thing

what's your point? As far as pennies adding up quickly...sure..they do..but when your getting higher quality media that burns TWICE as fast....for pennies more then your paying for 1x certified media....again, there is no comparison.

[Faustus]

What I mean is that by saying True 4x you are suggesting that the others are fake, its an open standard. some burners and software combos are better at burning some disc at 4x, thats all. If you have trouble with a brand stay away.

I've only burned a couple of 4x disc and those have been Ritek, they all burned at 4x nicely. Same with my Ritek G03s at 2x. If the prices is cheaper, and the disc work then they work. The only real difference between buying TDK2x and Ritek 1x (then burning at 2x) to me is the price. Because both disc have worked flawlessly for me.

For a while -R had the price advantage, right now on 4x disc +R has the advantage thanks to some recent sales, this sort of thing happens, no big deal to me, because I'm very happy with 2x burn speeds, heck I was happy when I found a disc that burned at 1x well for a decent price, I'm willing to lose some time to save some cash. Why? I'm cheap I guess, but I also will not settle for a disc that doesn't perform to my expectations, so far the media I purchase online has done so at a cheaper price the local. ALWAYS remember to factor in Tax also.

[defense]

What I mean is that by saying True 4x you are suggesting that the others are fake, its an open standard. some burners and software combos are better at burning some disc at 4x, thats all. If you have trouble with a brand stay away.

I'm sorry flaystus, you are absolutely incorrect there. I say that with confidence and have tried a total of 24 different types of media. According to you media listed as 4x, simply is 4x. If the burner doesn't support it...too bad, right? Wrong! ...the media is NOT 4x if the majority of the burners don't support it.

I'm not just referring to Ritek here. I'll give you THREE solid examples from media i've tried. 4X LEAD DATA, 4X PRIME AND 4X SPEEDY/MATRIX. Each one of those disks is LISTED AS 4X....the Speedy's were even listed as "TRUE" 4X on the site...when that was complete B.S. The Speedy's were only tested to burn successful @4x in one out of 7 different burners...you call that 4x? LOL...I think not....some burners identify the safest maximum speed the media in the drive can be burned at. That's why their is the initialization process PRIOR to burning. That's just another reason why Sony is heads above the rest....it basically tries to protect your disk and assure you burn at the "safest" maximum speed. Unfortunately, the safest maximum speed for the LD disks as well as the Primes and Speedy's..is 2X.

Some burners MAY burn those disks @4x...but I damn sure wouldn't want to burn disks which are not true 4x disks to be burned @4x. Why do you think Meritline is selling those disks I mentioned at a mucher lower price then the Primes and Optodisk 4x disks? lol....I just answered why.....shop4tech is doing the same....because the disks are NOT TRUE 4X disks...as a result they can "legally" advertise them as 4x because ONE BURNER may successfully burn them @4x with hacked firmware. No thanks...I'll stick with TRUE 4X disks which are CERTIFIED 4X disks and which will burn Consistently @4x.

[Faustus]

Defence I think your still totally missing my point. They are 4x disc, they may not be very good ones but they are. I'm trying to make sure you understand that the phrase "True 4x" means squat, it just means you used it and it worked for you. You could just as easily say "here is a list of 4x disc that I like" and be done with it.

And whats this about a sony initialization process, never heard of it. If you mean the few seconds before it burns then EVERY burn does it. If you mean the few seconds before it can tell there is a blank in the drive then they all do that also. If you mean its actually testing the disc that that should eat up space on the disc I would think. If its something else then its something I've never heard of and would like to have some facts on how it works.

I'm not disputing that you have had problems with some of the cheaper 4x disc, I'm not even disputing that perhaps its because they may not be very good. What I'm saying is that SOME of them might be because they don't like your burner and for someone else work great! Therefore to Call the higher quality disc "True 4x" is misleading because there is really not difference other then the manufactuers. There is no standards body setting the difference between 4x and True 4x. They are in fact one and the same, however some manufactuers are better at it and more compatible, they are usually also more expensive.

I hope that clears it up, it was really just a simple comment to start with about the "True 4x" thing. Its just when people start using terms like that then its easier to take advantage of them when they see the turn over at some online store trying to make a quick buck by selling them some "True" disc.

[Faustus]

I think it see where the breakdown in communication is here. If it burns 4x in mine but not yours then its not "True 4x" correct? Not true.

Its just a low compatibility and perhaps an unreliable 4x disc, but it IS a 4x disc.

What I'm saying is that the term "True 4x" makes me uneasy, because there is no "True 4x" standard, its just a nickname given to disc that you like.

[Bob W]

I believe the low prices we are seeing at the retail level are recent so perhaps the effect of that hasn't been seen yet by the online stores. Lately I have bought most of my media from CompUSA however I did buy a 100 4x printable DVD-R on-line so that I could put my Epson 900 printer to work.