New House Rules?

[mats.hogberg]

I've posted this in OT, but since OT subject is banned from the front page, and I find it rather important (I shouldn't have written it otherwise, should I?) and hopefully feedback isn't, I'm posting here too:

First of all: Since this is Badrics place, everyone who here enter, are bound to follow the rules set up by him. This is the way it should be, and everyone who don't agree may leave.
One nice aspect of Baldrics forum is the OT area, where, just like in the coffee room here at work, any subject can be ventilated. In our coffee room, if someone isn't interested in the subject, or finds it controversial, he turns to someone else and brings up his own subject, or just dont participate in the discussion of this subject. Either way, these coffee room conversations builds community.
AFAIK, Baldric has not stipulated rules regarding not suitable subjects in the OT forum, but recently, person(s?) here at Baldrics place has started loudly complaining about OT subjects that they don't like, to the point where some moderator finds it necessary to shut down the conversation.
I find this most disturbing. Freedom of speech is essential - not just when you agree with what's spoken. Either it exists or it doesn't. You can't have a limited freedom of speech.
So, Baldric and moderators - what gives? Are there new posting rules coming up, or can any thread that some fundametalist find offensive (but doesn't violate any expressed forum rules) be shut down?

/Mats

[Hardcoreruss]

Well said Matt, I could not agree with you more.

Keep up the good work.

[You_Are_Alive]

I disagree. Why is it that you are personally taking offense to this? I don't see hundreds of ppl complaining here, only you. The rules are fine, I guess someone said something that you don't agree with and sorry, but the point made more sense than yours. So you felt burned. Then you start talking about freedom of speech and all that other crap. Whatever man, take a chill pill. :P

[flaninacupboard]

i don't think freedom of speech is crap, and i agree with mats, some of the off topic diuscussions of late have been interesting and fun, and i think makes us regulars better tempered and helps maintain our interest when we answer yet again "can my cdrom read dvd's?"
However, someone always abuses the powet they have, no matter how great or small that power is. moderation is important and when a discussion degrades into goading and name calling (although i'm not sure how this one would work "well, at least i don't capture with a bt878 you backward retard!" ?) you can do little else than lock up the discussion.

[Hardcoreruss]

I disagree. Why is it that you are personally taking offense to this? I don't see hundreds of ppl complaining here, only you. The rules are fine, I guess someone said something that you don't agree with and sorry, but the point made more sense than yours. So you felt burned. Then you start talking about freedom of speech and all that other crap. Whatever man, take a chill pill. :P

If someone asks a question which you don't know the answer to, do you answer it ?

If you like oranges do you talk in a forum about lemons ?

If someone posts a question about CCE do I post a disagreement and tell them to use premiere?......NO

That is what Matt is saying if there is a topic you don't like, don't post to it. People read that post because of the subject and they do not want to here peoples incessant whinging disagreements. If this was common practice then forums would not work.

[housepig]

Mats -

while I agree that if people don't like what's being posted, they should find another thread (or even find another board) rather than trip out and have threads deleted and locked, your first point was the more relevant one.

This is Baldrick's place.

As such, "freedom of speech" only extends as far as he wants it to. He's not restricting your right to free speech - he's restricting your speech on his private, personal server. That's his prerogative, just as it's yours to set up your own server and open the forums wide and post anything you like.

as far as the moderators go, these are people that Baldrick has entrusted to keep an eye on the boards with him, so obviously Baldrick trusts their judgement.

But I would support an explicit addendum to the rules, if there are threads being locked or deleted that don't fall into the prohibited postings list, we should know why.

- housepig

[edsmith77]

C'mpon guys,
Baldrick has posted his rules. They are:

No warez.
No politics.
And please behave!!! or else will I close this forum.

See the second sticky in the OT forum.

[housepig]

edsmith -

the problem is, apparently some topics have been removed, edited or locked that don't fall into those categories.

so the question is, if some other type of post is going to be adversely modified, shouldn't that be an explicit rule?

- housepig

[edsmith77]

housepig -
I was trying to say rather obtusely that aside from warez and politics the OT forum is for just that, OFF TOPICS. Which was my subtle way of agreeing with MATS and subject matter. As far as closing down threads that have become abusive, that goes to the heart of the matter. And here Baldrick did add the gotcha, seems like his experience is that sooner or later OTs seem to degenerate into name calling general malaise.
So as Baldrick says, behave or else.

Ed

[tgpo]

I believe that the reason most of these types of topics have been closed is because of the people fighting in them. One person says it's a bad topic, another guy says its not, the first guy says you suck, the second guy cusses the first guy out. And it goes back and forth for ever. The forum doesn't need that kinda of crap. The topics are fine, but it's the people that start flames wars over them that get them closed. So don't blame the mods or the admin, blame the fighers.

[Karate Media]

I'm sorry, but I'm going to violate the cross-posting rule just this once, since this is where all the action is, and I feel as though this is a well-thought out rebuttal, if I do say so myself


Mats--

I won't go into another "freedom of speech" speech again (I'll just say that only the gov't guarantees FOS, private individuals/companies do not have to follow this rule necessarily), but Baldrick has set up a modicum of OT rules here: https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84274

No politics, no warez, and behave. That last one is interpretive -- "behave" as in "no flaming" or "behave" in a more general sense, e.g. "don't offend anyone"?

But lets widen the circle a little bit. One must assume that even OT posts must follow the General Rules set down here: https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=124514

"You agree not to post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-orientated or any other material that may violate any applicable laws."

And the "report problem posts" thread states here: https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=119319

"To make our lives easier, it would be great if you could link to a thread / post you think may be problematic. This includes: (...) Any posts that break the rules set in the forums"

So, it looks like "Freedom of Speech" here at dvdrhelp is much like "FOS" in America -- Say what you like until somebody gets offended. America has FOS, but it also has obscenity laws (jeez, imagine if you'd been a contemporary of Lenny Bruce -- no internet and no sex talk!), hate speech laws, etc., etc. Silky said: "There will always be members who complain at anything they find offensive" -- but the rules say "don't post anything offensive" and, well, "offensive" is a fairly subjective term that is defined differently by different people.

I find it ironic that you yearn for Freedom of Speech, yet find it difficult to extend that same freedom to people who want to complain. As you said:

"Freedom of speech is essential - not just when you agree with what's spoken. Either it exists or it doesn't. You can't have a limited freedom of speech."

Shouldn't the complainers have their FOS as well?

And we all know who one of the persons you are speaking of is. And my one and only post in the "report problem posts" thread was a complaint about this person's complaint (which I was rightfully chastised for doing so by Baldrick). But I agree with that person's right to complain, especially in a thread specifically designed by a mod for such a purpose. And according to the General Rules of this site, those complaints were valid, and as Baldrick spefically stated: "Remember also that everyone are allowed to complain about any post....but it doesn't mean that we(admins and moderators) will remove or lock it."

My analogy is that an online forum is like a community, and the off-topic section is like a playground -- keeping the kids busy and the adults sane. I don't want to come off as "one of those newbies that comes along and tells us how to act" -- I really only have problems with posts that would damage the integrity and/or existance of this site (such as warez posts or explicity violent/misogynistic posts).

I don't really give a crap if people want to discuss pullin' their puds, saluting the flag, or even buttering the ham. But, ultimately, I also think that the complainers should have their say (and they have a thread for it too, just like the off-topic people). I don't disagree with some of your points, but your argument has fallacies...

Just my 2 cents (which I seem to stretch for quite some time, even in this age of inflation )


(see https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=157519&highlight= for Silky's post)

Sorry Baldrick, it won't happen again

[Baldrick]

First, my username is Baldrick and nothing else.

The off topic rules are today
no warez
no politics
no religion(new)
behave
+ the general rules

As tgpo says are most topics that are beeing closed because of "flamewars". We are not deleting any posts.

But if you think that a topic is closed because of a wrong reason then it just to complain and we maybe can unlock it. The moderators(not me ) can make "mistakes".

[mats.hogberg]

As I said to start with, I cross posted because I found OT doesn't show up on the front page (any more), and if the rest of this jolly band is like me (who only go by the front page Lates topics), it'd get completely unnoticed. I again apologize.

/Mats

[Will Hay]

I guess it all revolves around the 'fine line', whereupon any topic is fine as long as it hasn't been created simply to offend.
The posts that do this are easily identifiable, and whilst I myself have participated in many off-topic threads (some of which are a little 'close to the bone'), I have complete faith that the current group of moderator's will close them for the right reasons.
If they close them for a shitty reason they'll hear about it from me, but I can honestly say in all the off-topic posts in which I've particiapted that have been locked, I feel they've all been locked for the right reasons.
There will always be members who complain at anything they find offensive, and dress it up as a concern for the rest of us ('how often do you watch porn' springs to mind, a great 'off-topic' tongue in cheek thread I've built friendly acquaintances from). This is rubbish, and these kind of people have some strange idea they'll be welcomed into the fold and offered a moderator position for their wonderful assistance in identifying these trouble-maker's...
....
I get the impression that the moderator's view these people as whiner's, insofar as they post four of five complaints in a space of two or three days. This to me simply suggests all they do is scan the forum looking for something to complain about.
Very sad.
The only stipulation I have is that these thread title's shouldn't appear on the front page (something Baldrick has already addressed), and that perhaps a popup appears when entering the off-topic forum that "the content may not always be connected with the theme of the site and at time may contain topic's of an adult nature".
Will

[defense]

I have to agree with mats.hogberg & rhegedus on this. The "OFF TOPIC" forum is just that, OFF Topic. Who should give the right to say what is "OFF" topic and what ISN'T. What may offend one person may not offend another. Hell, so many weak minded individuals out there, you can say DVD+R sucks ass and they start crying, probably "literally" because they feel offended. lol....


I think the strongest point though is "FREEDOM OF SPEECH" or Expression which mats elaborated on. Right next to that was another great point made for those people in the "coffee room." If they don't like the conversation then they simply don't respond. If they find it offensive, then SIMPLY LEAVE or ignore it. But you have people on here who are obviously pathetic enough to not only say they really feel disgusted by certain posts, but then they have the audacity to continue to read them! Then they want to cry like a grandmother eatin' a Jawbreaker with No Dentures that the post was distasteful.

Bottom line is that those individuals have some issues that need some addressing and they need to try to address them in other ways as opposed to harassing moderators with what they CONTINUOUSLY view as inappropriate. I'm sure most of the moderators would love to see "Hellraiser" throw 50 blank DVDRs at lightning speed at the one bish who continues to think they are Jr. Baldrick. I wouldn't mind seein' that either.

[Raen]

Take a history class or learn to read. I got news for you. You have no freedom of speech here.

Read the constitution. It says that Congress(the government) shall not limit your right to speak freely. That doesn't mean you can come into my backyard, this forum or a crowded movie theatre and start preaching. Private individuals and companies CAN restrict your right to speak on their property


So all this 'Freedom of Speech' crap is just that... crap. The people that operate this message board can restict anything they want. If you dont like it I suggest you start your own message board and you can say whatever you want to. Without moderates this place would be useless. I come here to read reviews, articles and get advice from people about capturing, encoding, authoring and burning of dvd's. Not to read that you had a bad day at work. Find a social message board to spew that crap. Frankly, I just don't care to read it and shouldn't have to wade through a dozen OT posts to find something I need to know, something that is site is all about.

[defense]

Take a history class or learn to read. I got news for you. You have no freedom of speech here.

@gooftroop, read the posts and don't worry about History classes. I didn't say jack shit about having a constitutional right on a "forum." I also didn't say "ANYTHING GOES" on this forum and that it should be accepted if it crosses the line. What I said is Freedom of Speech should be observed and at the very least takin' into consideration when topics which are merely for good, fun conversation, shouldn't be taking out of context and BANISHED because one or two people who feel so disgusted say they should.

[The village idiot]

I think it is starting again............
I'd quote what I'm refering to, but it has already been done.

It's easy....

#1 NO WAREZ!
#2 No unpaid advertising.
#3 NO FLAMING!
#4 Try not to break any laws. :P
#5 Be cool. 8)

If you are going to break any of the above, be aware of the consequences to your actions.

I must say that the off topic forum here is a little tame compared to another place I regularly post

[vhelp]

Evening peoples.

It's either Baldrick's way, or the highway.. hehe..

Anyways..

I gotta admit.. smart move on Baldrick's part about not including the
OT posts in the frontpage for which I surf 99% of the time when I'm checking
for latest posts, news and even add's and stuff like that.
.
.


..and be nice to one another, k guys
-vhelp

[gmatov]

Take a history class or learn to read. I got news for you. You have no freedom of speech here.


So all this 'Freedom of Speech' crap is just that... crap. The people that operate this message board can restict anything they want. If you dont like it I suggest you start your own message board and you can say whatever you want to. Without moderates this place would be useless. I come here to read reviews, articles and get advice from people about capturing, encoding, authoring and burning of dvd's. Not to read that you had a bad day at work. Find a social message board to spew that crap. Frankly, I just don't care to read it and shouldn't have to wade through a dozen OT posts to find something I need to know, something that is si
te is all about.

Raen,
I don't think Baldrick is limiting your speech other than his posted rules, new and old. You do have "freedom of speech" here to a degree, although limited freedom of speech is asinine. You either have or you haven't.
If someone posts that he had a bad day at work and a bunch of people reply with their really bad day at work, this is a bunch of kindred spirits enjoying each others remarks. For you, or anyone else, to complain to the Mods that you "shouldn't have to wade through a dozen OT posts" is also asinine. The Forum is devoted to Video. Page 1, page 2, and almost every other page on the site is Video. You don't want to wade through a bunch of "crap" on the OT site, don't click on the OT site. Don't run to the Mods crying "They're talking about stuff I don't want them talking about, shut them down!!!"
Personally, I visit OT first. I may not agree with every little thing, and sometimes I think someone may have had a beer too many, or just not know what in the hell he is talking about, but if he wants to say it, hell's bells, why should you give a damn? Walk on by and visit the Video sites that you tried to but the stupid OT grabbed you by the scruff of the neck and made you read.
This is not directed strictly at you, just addressed because your post struck a nerve.
The whole US of A is in this boat because of PC speech. Not 'Puter, but Politically Correct. A guy says his 9 (?) year old kid should not have to hear the Lord's Prayer, or the Pledge of Allegiance in school, so 280 million people are forbidden to recite it. That is not Freedom of Speech, nor Freedom FROM Speech, but the Tyranny of the Minority. And it is always the minority that causes loss of Rights, in this country, or any other..
Freedom of Speech is guaranteed by the First Amendment , not by the Government. The government would love to abolish the guarantees of the Amendments.
BTW, where's Adam when you need him? I think he could shed much light here.
George

[txpharoah]

I find this most disturbing. Freedom of speech is essential - not just when you agree with what's spoken. Either it exists or it doesn't. You can't have a limited freedom of speech.
So, Baldric and moderators - what gives? Are there new posting rules coming up, or can any thread that some fundametalist find offensive (but doesn't violate any expressed forum rules) be shut down?/Mats

Don't misunderstand freedom of speech laws. That only applies to the government censoring you. Businesses, websites, the media, etc., can all censor themselves.

Baldrick owns this site, and within legal limitations, do whatever he sees fit in its operation, including censoring its member topics and language. I'm very happy to see Baldrick making the decision to keep potentially offensive material off the front page of this site. It damages it credibilty and can chase away viewers that would potentially be valuable to its growth and success.

When I joined, such stuff was not seen on the front page. When it was last month, I complained. My co-workers wouldn't come here when they saw the "masturbation" and "porn" topics. Their exact comment on the site was "childish crap" and because of what they saw, unfortunately, I couldn't convince them otherwise. You just lost some darn good opinions too, I tell you that, as these video engineers can make me feel stupid at times. Also think of the parent or educator that sends students to this site for video info, only to be introduced to questionable topics.

And remember that not all speech is proteced. Discussing anything obscene is often illegal, as is defamation of private individuals, plus some others I'd rather not go into.

As far as the "looking to complain part", no way, but I call things when I see them (remember I read posts too in order to respond, and even then, I only read a few a day at most, less now that I'm only online a day or so a week again - gladly too). I know this is directed at me. And it's funny how I am considered "the complainer" when posts like this seem to merely complain, and I'm not the one starting it. 8)

[Will Hay]

..I come here to read reviews, articles and get advice from people about capturing, encoding, authoring and burning of dvd's. Not to read that you had a bad day at work. Find a social message board to spew that crap. Frankly, I just don't care to read it and shouldn't have to wade through a dozen OT posts to find something I need to know, something that is site is all about.

If you're wading through a dozen OT posts to find something you need to know then you need a leeson on where to look for your capturing, encoding, and burning questions.
The premise is simple, don't look for site topical posts in the off-topic forum.
Jeeshh!!!!!!!!
Is that so hard?
WH.

[gmatov]

All of yunz can interpret this a s you see fit. I just, somehow, lost 3 paragraphs, biguns, most of which said if you don't like it, go away. Every post has a name, even if it's, Wha'd I do Wrong, helpppppp. This guy will repost 4 days in a row saying Can't anyone help me?, but you dare post something maybe a little bit racy, or even downright smutty,and damn if some "bluenose" doesn't jump right on it. "I Don't want to have to wade through a dozen posts" on OT, mind you, to read what I want to on "
Can I IVTC a DIVX, intoCCE, and burn with EasyVCD, with EZCD Creator"
Seems like"Snoop, Snoop, someone wrote something I probably find offense with, gotta check

Tex,
Come on, now. All them PHDs are saying I won't go there? What're they, morons, or just really, really peoplephobes. Christ, the entire internet was invented so that people could exchange their "dirty" pictures. (I know, youngster that you are, you think it is for the free exchange of ideas, scientific, and otherwise. But when they interview the "old farts", they invariably tell you that it was to exchange their version of "smut" You know, their bathing suits showed their KNEES, for God's sake.
I did not know that you were the lead bitcher on the OT site. Is that a Texican thing, or was there really something they said that a true Texican could never let go by without a major protest?
Regardless, Baldrick is a Swede, what you say, unless it is universal, should not matter. If it is a flame war comiing up, by all means quelch it.
Someone says you're an *******, well, look in the mirror, or consider the source. One will be right.
And if he has to be worried about being PC, I would advise him, rat now, that he might as well shut it down. There are something like 191 "countries" now (Countries, sheesh, Monaco is more of a country and it's about 4 1/2 acres, but the "Powers That Be" (Political Taboo, Baldrick?) want the Prince to have his Principality so that they can go to Monaco to gamble)
Ah, well, I've lost my train of thought, comes with age, so, just don't open the door, if the stuff on the other side offends you. Don't tell me what I may or may not read.

[bbb]

The off topic rules are today
no warez
no politics
no religion(new)
behave
+ the general rules

As tgpo says are most topics that are beeing closed because of "flamewars". We are not deleting any posts.

I'm glad Baldrick's forum rules remain simple, reasonable, and not overly oppressive. Freedom and sharing of information was and should remain the spirit of the internet, even though law firms, corporations, media moguls, and the military industrial complex are always flexing their monetary might and political clout to lock down freeflow of information (e.g., DMCA) to keep the public naive, ignorant, and dependent on the accepted corporate controlled media to get their information. And last I heard Vcdhelp.com has not been bought out by a corporation ... yet.

Overly politically correct forum rules (which is unfortunately the trend pervading our society these days) always inhibits information (including the truth--e.g., Pinnacle Forums) and diversity thought. Political Correctness is not a good thing at all. Thank goodness Balderick has the intellectual fortitude and moral conviction not to be influenced by those who are "easily offended" and desire retribution.

This is why I like the newsgroups. It's free there--one of the freest places on around. And for the most part, most newsgroups remain orderly and contain useful info/posts, despite the occasional flame wars. In fact, I would go so far as to say flame wars are healthy in that in allows us readers to see who's more credible and who's BSing--the truth tends to come out at the end. And if it gets too heated for your tastes, just don't read it. Simple as that (killfiles make this very simple).

As someone stated above, if you don't care for the post (e.g., info on the newest CDR or DVDR burner) or don't agree with the opinion, just ignore it. Only if a post blatantly breaks the rule should action be considered (i.e., giving a warning and/or a lock).

But if you think that a topic is closed because of a wrong reason then it just to complain and we maybe can unlock it. The moderators(not me ) can make "mistakes".

This explains why certain posts are mistakenly locked despite not breaking any stated forum rules. I'm glad Baldrick was not behind the locks. But, what can be done to educate the other Mods on sticking to the rules, not to automatically lock all reported threads, and not to practice favoritism for certain individuals who report a lot of posts. Mods should take accountability on what they lock. Perhaps the name of the Mod who locked/deleted the thread should be recorded. This way we can see whether the Mod even bothered to read the post or thread and judge whether a stated forum rule was broken (which is their job) before locking it. This would be fair since Mods will be accountable for their actions and that way we can report problematic Mods too (except the all mighty, all wise Baldrick).

In fact, after reading the "Report Problem Members/Posts" thread on many occassions, I find that a few vcdhelp.com members seems to get a kick out of locking threads or banning members. Some reported posts seem totally unoffensive, like quoting the stats/description about the latest CDR or DVDR burner. Or perhaps these frequent thread reporters are under the false impression that they can become a Moderator by reporting a certain number of posts/members. I'm pretty certain that is not a prerequisite to becoming a Moderator.

[txpharoah]

Tex, Come on, now. All them PHDs are saying I won't go there? What're they, morons, or just really, really peoplephobes.

This makes no sense.

Christ, the entire internet was invented so that people could exchange their "dirty" pictures.

You really believe this don't you? Not at all. Its a new form of media, like a newspaper or magazine, only more interactive. That statement is like saying print media was made so we could publish porn pictures and video was invented for porno videos.

(I know, youngster that you are, you think it is for the free exchange of ideas, scientific, and otherwise. But when they interview the "old farts", they invariably tell you that it was to exchange their version of "smut" You know, their bathing suits showed their KNEES, for God's sake.

It was made by the military to exchange intelligence. And by schools and universities. Porn folks were still wackin' and filming/photographing their stuff. I suggest you do some more research.

I did not know that you were the lead bitcher on the OT site. Is that a Texican thing, or was there really something they said that a true Texican could never let go by without a major protest?

The word is TEXAN. Call a Texan a "texican" and you're libel to get your butt kicked down here.

Regardless, Baldrick is a Swede, what you say, unless it is universal, should not matter.

Berne Convention comes to mind, as do extradition laws, as well as other laws common around the world.

If it is a flame war comiing up, by all means quelch it. Someone says you're an *******, well, look in the mirror, or consider the source. One will be right. And if he has to be worried about being PC, I would advise him, rat now, that he might as well shut it down. There are something like 191 "countries" now (Countries, sheesh, Monaco is more of a country and it's about 4 1/2 acres, but the "Powers That Be" (Political Taboo, Baldrick?) want the Prince to have his Principality so that they can go to Monaco to gamble) Ah, well, I've lost my train of thought, comes with age, so, just don't open the door, if the stuff on the other side offends you. Don't tell me what I may or may not read.

More nonsense. Use sentences if you want people to understand you.

[gmatov]

txpharoah,
Firstly, I do not dislike you. I read most of the posts you have made, and do not think you are as much a know-it-all as some of your detractors make you out to be.
Also, I guess the girl in "Quigley Down Under" shouldn't have said " I AM a native born Texican.", should she? I have to assume that's a Tex-Mex thing. Texicans are of Mexican descent? I hereby apologize

Now to business:

My co-workers wouldn't come here when they saw the "masturbation" and "porn" topics. Their exact comment on the site was "childish crap" and because of what they saw, unfortunately, I couldn't convince them otherwise. You just lost some darn good opinions too, I tell you that, as these video engineers can make me feel stupid at times. Also think of the parent or educator that sends students to this site for video info, only to be introduced to questionable topics.

This is in reply to "This makes no sense." You said the engineers wouldn't come here because of the Off Topic (!) subjects that they could be offended by. The same goes for them as for the rest of us. You do not HAVE to read anything on these pages.

As far as exchanging their "dirty" pics, it has often been written that they were some of the earliest "messages" sent. When I find some of the references, I'll post them for your perusal.
BTW, that was also some of the earliest printing press output, also. Ditto, when I can point you to a location, I'll do so.

Regarding Baldrick being a citizen of Sweden, they are more sexually liberal than our "bluenoses", Berne Convention or no. You say you don't like a message with a vaguely sexual tilt, I would expect him to ask where in the heck are you coming from. Do you think babies are actually found under a cabbage leaf?

I thought my last paragraph was well punctuated. All the sentences have periods after them. Parentheses are perfectly legitimate. Quotes, and end quotes are in order, commas, where they belong. I can read it and understand it.

How in the hell do you quote specific paragraphs? I try to quote and get the whole post, and have to delete all but what I want to quote?

And, you are not about to even nibble, let alone bite, on why all them poor cowpunchers have to wear ballcaps, are you? You ARE a difficult person!

George

[/i][/u]

[txpharoah]

txpharoah,Firstly, I do not dislike you. I read most of the posts you have made, and do not think you are as much a know-it-all as some of your detractors make you out to be.

Alright, I'll calm down. Sorry to jump. But too many people here have pissed me off in past days, which since I'm not online much, may be my last days.

Also, I guess the girl in "Quigley Down Under" shouldn't have said " I AM a native born Texican.", should she? I have to assume that's a Tex-Mex thing. Texicans are of Mexican descent? I hereby apologize

Yeah. It's about a derogatory as some other choice words when referring to Mexicans and or Texans, especially when they are not Mexican/Spanish descent. I understand. Movie-learned. I'm now afraid of your perception of Texas. Movies like X-Files should have the creators shot for such horrible misrepresentation. I'd be living in the desert by their description of my part of the state! Which is green! And wet!

This is in reply to "This makes no sense." You said the engineers wouldn't come here because of the Off Topic (!) subjects that they could be offended by. The same goes for them as for the rest of us. You do not HAVE to read anything on these pages.

Well, when I came to the front page, I did read it. That was the problem. It was inappropriate for that section of the site. When you see something and natively speak the language, you do HAVE TO read what you see (referring to the words on the post title, not as in clicking into it and reading). It's second nature.

As far as exchanging their "dirty" pics, it has often been written that they were some of the earliest "messages" sent. When I find some of the references, I'll post them for your perusal. BTW, that was also some of the earliest printing press output, also. Ditto, when I can point you to a location, I'll do so.

I've professionally worked in media my entire life. I couldn't disagree more. While porn does have strong impact, the first Internet content in 1993 had no porn in site. The first newsgroups and BBS's in the 80s had no porn. The first printing press made either bibles or news leaflets, I'll have to recheck. The first photos were of scenery. The first video and audio was of other stuff as well. The people that invented this stuff most likely had no thought of porn or prurient content (whether it be showing ankles or whatever the inappropriate ideals of the time).

Regarding Baldrick being a citizen of Sweden, they are more sexually liberal than our "bluenoses", Berne Convention or no. You say you don't like a message with a vaguely sexual tilt, I would expect him to ask where in the heck are you coming from. Do you think babies are actually found under a cabbage leaf?

Sexual tilt is fine. Blatant sexual content is another. Discussing masturbation and porn-watching habits are really pushing it for the content of this site. Off-topic? Fine. But not on the front page.

I thought my last paragraph was well punctuated. All the sentences have periods after them. Parentheses are perfectly legitimate. Quotes, and end quotes are in order, commas, where they belong. I can read it and understand it.

Sorry, I didn't see what it meant. Sentences? Sure, I can see that. But I don't understand what you're trying to get at with it.

How in the hell do you quote specific paragraphs? I try to quote and get the whole post, and have to delete all but what I want to quote?

Cut and paste +quote="gmatov"+ and +/quote+
But of course don't replace the [ ] with + like I did.
Otherwise it wouldn't have shown the code.

And, you are not about to even nibble, let alone bite, on why all them poor cowpunchers have to wear ballcaps, are you? You ARE a difficult person!

Talk to the wife about that last one. Sometimes, I know.

Cowpunchers wearing ball caps... sigh... some cowboys have no pride for the cowboy hat and boots. Of course, I wear ballcaps too. And shoes, not boots. Only wear the other stuff when working outdoors. More rugged, can take the wear.

Alright. We good again? Didn't mean to jump on you.
Been too used to fighting off morons.

[gmatov]

txpharoah,
Good grief, no! You mean you have never heard that the reason cowpunchers wear ballcaps is because "We don't want no one to think we're truck drivers."? Man, where you been? We have a lot of 40 grand SUV drivers up here that just HAVE to have a 10 gallon hat and pointy toed snakeskin boots. "Course, none of them have ever had grass under their tires, let alone tree limbs wiping their side mirrors off.

Hey, it's entertainment, that's all. X Files, I'll fight you on. I like 'em. They're silly, true, but they are entertaining.

I hate to bust your bubble, but the Internet didn't start in the '80s. More like 1968. I did a quick search a few hours ago to try to rebut you, but couldn't find what I wanted, but those years did come up. ( As a matter of curiousity, the first message had 2 people connected by computer and by telephone, and the protocol was to type in L O G, and the computer would complete with "In", for "login". It crashed on the "N".

The last, I wasn't really "getting at" anything, just that you do not HAVE to read anything. Again, if it offends you, walk on by. I think it was BBB who reiterated that, above. We think alike on that.
The main point is, again, 191 countries, something like that, all with their own laws, and you try to comply with them all? Afghanistan, who GW went into and kicked ass, and cleaned house, and they're back to burkas and cutting hands off? And we send a military force there and someone says he/she saw a US military person make wee-wee with their right hand, when Mohammed said you should always hold it with your left hand, you are a sinner, we demand that you deliver the profaner to us for OUR version of justice.

BTW, I haven't been to Texas for 45 years. All I can tell you about that state is that for a desert, with 100 F in the day, in October, it gets awfully cold at night. The farthest I got was Big Springs. I ain't goin' back there.

Cheers,
George

[txpharoah]

I hate to bust your bubble, but the Internet didn't start in the '80s. More like 1968.

I know. But I didn't say that. The 60s was government and the 70s was AT&T Bell Labs and universities playing with the technology. I was talking about BBS systems and newsgroups that developed in the 80s. It was late into those days that porn showed up (as text stories only), not even the first users did it. You have to remember that transferring images/files/video was near impossible. I know. I was there. Using it. We had 400 baud and slower modems! Video was unheard of. As were computer images. The most you could do for "porn" was Leisure Suit Larry on an EGA or CGA monitor. You're thinking ot the early 90s that BBS systems and newsgroups/chat lines got porn. The late 90s had video. In fact I was part of a group that beta-tested some of the first streaming video, on the receiving end. And yes, it sucked.

[gmatov]

Pharoah,
I missed something in your last. Green and wet? Would that be Corpus Christi area, wet, or way North, most likely green? Or, maybe, you have to go East to get green.
And I know Texas up, down abd sideways. I've read every Louis L'amour book ever written. Louis wouldn't have fabricated anything, would he?