Are SVCD's compatiable with Anamorphic?

[Beautiful Alone]

When you rip a Anamorphic DVD to SVCD, is it possible to make the SVCD with Anamorphic format aswell?

[Conquest10]

i don't think svcd supports anamorphic.

[Beautiful Alone]

There must be a way to encode it so it would fit on a Widescreen TV.

Do you own a Widescreen TV by any chance?

[Conquest10]

no.

[Beautiful Alone]

no.

NO to what?

[DivXExpert]

It does support animorphic. In TMPGEnc, you the SVCD template (film or NTSC). Then load the unlock template. Then change the aspect ratio to 16:9. Crop out the black bars on the original video, if there are any. If your source is film. encode it that way and use the pulldown flag. rather than wasting bits on frames that don't need to be there. If your source is NTSC then encode it so.

MPEG-1 (VCD) also supports animorphic. But not the pulldown flags.

[DivXExpert]

Also make sure that you set your source aspect ratio to 1:1. Otherwise things will get really messed up.
Like if is 16:9, and you set the source to 16:9, Then it will add black bars to make it look right. but then if you encode it with the black bars, and tell the DVD player to add more black bars with the 16:9 flag, it will look really squished. If you set the source to 4:3, it will do the same thing. So don't change the way the source aspect ratio is read.
Your source is a DVD so do an IVTC if you can. Unless your PAL.

[DivXExpert]

If your source is non-animorphic widescreen and you want it to be animorphic widesreen, crop out the hardcoded black bars, the resize to 480x480(NTSC and NTSCFilm SVCD Standard). Then add the 16:9 flag.

With the 16:9 flag, it will look proper on a Widescreen TV and a normal TV.

To note, unfortunatly not all DVD players do that, some ignore the 16:9 flag and play it as 4:3. But as long as you can switch manually, there's no problem...

[DivXExpert]

Players that are supposed to play VCD and SVCD are supposed to do that. Otherwise they are ignoring the standard.
Players that have VCD and SVCD playback as an accident, or not made with SVCD and VCD playback in mind. Maybe. But aspect ratios are apart of the standard.

[Beautiful Alone]

Well..what is 16:9 flag ? and also, if i encode a svcd to anamorphic, will it look normal as it is on a 4:3 TV? I don't want to make an anamorphic just so it will look right on a 16:9 tv and not 4:3.
Just like an anamorphic DVD, it looks right on both 4:3 and 16:9 TV.

[Cornucopia]

I could be wrong here, but AFAIK the flags that denote the Display Aspect Ratio (DAR) are added to the Mpeg video stream either in the header of each GOP or at the very beginning of the file, and that this is added during the Muxing.

For SVCD, that usually is done prior to authoring--during the encoding--and left that way.
For DVD, that is done during encoding and then it is stripped and put back in in a different way when Muxing to VOBs.

So I think it depends on how players read the streams (think Firmware).

Player A will look only at IFO/VOB GOP headers for DVD and not at all for SVCD-going with default expectations instead.

Player B will look only at IFO/VOB GOP headers for DVD and for MPEG video stream GOP header info on SVCD. This will work as hoped with anamorphic material.

Notice I made no mention of (X)VCD, cuz MPEG1 doesn't support the DAR flag.

Hoping that might clear some things up...
Scott

[Miles]

Quote from Doom9:

"Formats for standalone players like VCD and SVCD work differently [to PC based formats], since they too have a DAR flag (4:3 or 16:9, where the latter won't work properly on all known players)."

1st point: VCD is MPEG-1 and doesn't have a DAR flag, as Cornucopia said. Certainly there is no such option available in TMPEnc. However, it is possible to encode to a custom size that forces a VCD to have a 16:9 anamorphic picture. (I wrote a guide on how to do this with AVI files, but it's over at www.fasttrackcentral.com which is having major problems at te moment.)

2nd point: According to Doom9, an SVCD can have a DAR flag but no player will recognise it. Does anyone know of a standalone player that does support the 16:9 DAR flag on SVCD?
(My player doesn't even support it on DVDs! )

[Cornucopia]

I'm pretty sure that player support for Anamorphic 16:9 is a required part of the DVD spec.

Check your player settings / manual. It should have a section that deals with video. Within that there should be a setting that lets you choose how the player deals with 16:9 video. Every player I've seen so far has at least 3 choices:

Force to Letterbox (for std. 4:3 TV's)
Force to Pan-n-Scan (also for std. 4:3 TV's)
Automatic (mainly for 16:9 TV's)

...Just check other sites -- your player (Wharfedale 750 ?) should do Anamorphic just fine.

Good luck,
Scott

[Miles]

Sorry, I was getting confused.

The Wharfedale does have those settings, and plays anamorphic DVDs fine (it's set to 16:9 for my widescreen TV).

What I meant was that the feature that tells your TV to autoswitch to 16:9 mode through pin 8 of the SCART connector is broken/disabled on this player.

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&threadm=39FD3E9A.3AB88370%...%2B16%253A9%2B

[Donny661]

you can make anamorphic vcds and svcds for display on 16:9 TVs, but most players will not handle a anamorphic vcd or svcd like it does with a dvd. With dvds only the film portion (of a 16:9 film, for wider some black bars are added) is encoded; the dvd player adds the black border to make it fit on a 4:3 tv. Most players won't do that with vcds or svcds. So, anamorphic is useful for 16:9 televisions but not 4:3 ones (in the case of svcd and vcd).

[DivXExpert]

I don't want to make an anamorphic just so it will look right on a 16:9 tv and not 4:3.

I already said this.

With the 16:9 flag, it will look proper on a Widescreen TV and a normal TV.

[DivXExpert]

16:9flag is animorphic.

[DivXExpert]

Beutiful Alone PMed me. asking how to make animorphic SVCDs. I thought I already did.

If your source is non-animorphic widescreen and you want it to be animorphic widesreen, crop out the hardcoded black bars, the resize to 480x480(NTSC and NTSCFilm SVCD Standard). Then add the 16:9 flag.

Yep I did.

Okay so I pm him back

Load the SVCDfilm Template, Load the video file. Then load template > extra > unlock. Then goto settings, and under video stream settings set the aspect ratio as 16:9 525line NTSC. Under advanced set the source aspect ratio as 1:1 VGA.

Okay then, he PMs me and says be more specific.
Is this specific enough?


Download DVDDecryptor. http://www.dvddecrypter.com/download.asp
Open the DVD in DVDDecryptor. It automaticly loads in ifo mode. and should automaticly choose the correct stream. press decrypt.

Download DVD2AVIhttp://arbor.ee.ntu.edu.tw/~jackei/dvd2avi/
Open the first .vob in DVD2AVI. The rest will automaticly be loaded. Select the audio stream, english is usually track 1.
Under the Audio tab, select Dolby Digital > Demux. And Dolby Surrond Downmix. 48 > 44.1Khz off.

Now press F5. let it play for a while, and if the video is over 95%Film (It says on that little status bar on the left) Goto Video > Field Operation > Forced Film. If its NTSC or a lesser % of Film than 95 set it to none.

Now goto file > save project.

Now Download TMPGEnc http://www.tmpgenc.net/e_main2.html Get the Plus version because its the version that supports MPEG-2 (SVCD) Encoding.

Open TMPGEnc.
Close the Wizard.
Under Video Source. Select Browse. Then select the .d2v that DVD2AVI made (project file).
Now Goto Load > SuperVideoCD [NTSCFilm] if you set forced film in DVD2AVI. Or Set it at SuperVideoCD [NTSC] if you did not. Double click whatever template you are going to use. NTSC or NTSCFilm. okay. Now press the load button again. and choose the extra folder > unlock.
Okay. Now press settings.
Don't change anything except for the bitrate, and the aspect ratio. Set the Aspect Ratio to 16:9 Display.
Set the encode mode to noninterlace.
Motion search to Estimate fast.
Don't close this window. Goto the Advanced Tab.
Set the video source type as non-interlaced.
And set the source aspect ratio to 1:1 VGA.
Now press okay.
Under stream type select video only ES.
Now press start.

Wait a long time....

Now download pulldown.exe http://www.doom9.org/Soft21/svcdtools/pulldown.zip
and the GUI.http://www.wminds.com/downloads/pulldownbatchfe/down.html
Open the pulldown GUI. Set the source as the .m2v that TMPGEnc made. Now just press whatever it is that makes if finish.

Download BeSweet and the GUI http://dspguru.doom9.net/
Set the source as the .ac3 that DVD2AVI made. Set the output as mp2, 224kbps, 44.1khz. Save MP2.

Now open up TMPGEnc again.
Goto File > MPEG Tools.
Simple multiplex.
Type : SuperVideoCD [VBR]
Video Input : the .m2v that pulldown.exe made.
Audio Input : the .mp2 that besweet made.
Press Run.
Open the resluting Mpeg file in Nerohttp://www.nero.com/en/index.html#root
And burn as a SVCD.
Don't forget to put a blank CD-R in the tray.

[dbecker]

I have a regular tv, so when I have an amaphoric movie I convert it to full screen without stretching the picture by selecting in other settings the video arrange method 'no margins, keep aspect ratio' ... this selection will also convert widescreen to amaphoric. However you will lose the sides of the movie. I am willing to do that for the fact I cant stand widescreen on a regular tv..way too small

[BuMpErS]

Thanks for the Avi file convert info worked great on my test file.

Is there anyway to convert a SVCD NTSC 480&480 mpg so that it will play in full screen on my PAL 4:3 TV ?
As unfortunately Sony DvD player NS705V does not Zoom in.

[vhelp]

moring all.

I STILL don't see the reason or need, for the PULLDOWN.EXE app to add
in flags if you are using TMPG !!

Am I missing something here ??

TMPG, assuming you are encoding Film as such:
Video Tab:
* 23.976, then add in
* 3:2 pulldown

The only flags that PULLDOWN.EXE adds or works with is the framerate, but
NO 16:9 flags. So, I'm confused why everyone MUST D/L that app, adding
more confusion to this threads topic ??

So, what does PULLDOWN.EXE has to do with:
A - framerate (3:2 pulldown) in TMPG, even though it support it already ??
B - and TMPG's 16:9 setting ?? (where PULLDOWN.EXE has no reference to it) ??

Unless of course.., are you saying that TMPG's flags don't work ??

I understand that if you are using an older version of CCE, that you have
to use the PULLDOWN.EXE app for this framerate thing, but that's about it.

-vhelp

[vhelp]

@ DivXExpert..
.
.
My appoligies.. dude !!

I wasn't up to date and did a little reading at the website you posted !!

I understand now.. below is snapshot taken from DOS cmdline..

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
PULLDOWN - v0.99d, by Hard Code.
[Based on sources by Brent Beyeler (beyeler@home.com)]

PULLDOWN is a tool for modifying the encoding flags in an MPEG-2 video
stream. It is most useful for turning a 23.976fps progressive stream into
an SVCD or DVD-compliant 29.97fps NTSC interlaced stream via 2:3 pulldown.

Using pulldown with only the source file name and no additional arguments
creates a new file called PULLDOWN.M2V in your current directory.

usage: pulldown.exe <source> <target> [options]

options:

-nopulldown : pulldown will not insert the necessary flags for 2:3 pulldown
-framerate [23.976, 25, 29.97] (defaults to 29.97) : changes framerate
-norff : strips out all RFF flags
-tff [odd, even] : changes the field order
-notimecodes : does not recalculate timecodes for the new framerate
-prog_seq [p, i] : marks the entire MPEG stream as progressive or interlaced
-prog_frames [p, i] : marks each frame as progressive or interalced
-drop_frame [true, false] : Set drop_frame_flag for NTSC streams
-aspect_ratio [1:1, 4:3, 16:9, 2.21:1] : Change aspect ratio
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for informing others AND myself 8)

@ DivXExpert..
Now, I do have a question for you.. hope you have an answer..
I've ben toying around w/ lots of 16:9 encodes from my captured sources..
form Satellite (which are 4:3, if I'm not mistaken) If I understand correctly,
are ALL captures, by default, 4:3 EVEN if they are letter boxed ??
.
Then, based on the above, when I do my 4:3 -> 16:9 encodes in TMPG
(if I don't use the PULLDOWN.EXE app flags) and I crop off the top/bottom
black bars, and proceed to encode, I SHOULD have a properly encoded
16:9 MPEG-2 clip. Now, this I have ben doing w/ all my Letterboxed captured
sources quite regularly.
But the problem I've ben having is my encodes are 352x480 w/ 16:9 flags.
When I burn to CDR, they either don't play right (very distored like Interace
garbade) or they play fullscreen, but w/out the boarders added.
Now, I found a way to make it display properly, but it's pure broot force.
I'm wondering if I'm missing something, or if I should just start using TMPG's
.M2V encoding, and use PULLDOWN.EXE on it (can't test it right now though) Am I missng something during this process for 352x480 encodes ??

If I encode 720x480 at 16:9 I get the black bars added, but not if the res.
is 352x480, unless I use a brute force method.

Any light/help shed on this issue would be greatly appreciated - by anyone !!

Have a great day.
-vhelp

[geek rock]

what the hell are you all talking about?

the ability to add borders to widescreen video footage, "on the fly" by your DVD player, so it appears in the correct ratio on a 4:3 TV, is a feature exclusive to DVD. this is what's meant by "anamorphic".

you CANNOT do it with VCDs or SVCDs. you're stuck with having the picture permanently stretched, or encoding it with borders.

[Beautiful Alone]

I have a regular tv, so when I have an amaphoric movie I convert it to full screen without stretching the picture by selecting in other settings the video arrange method 'no margins, keep aspect ratio' ... this selection will also convert widescreen to amaphoric. However you will lose the sides of the movie. I am willing to do that for the fact I cant stand widescreen on a regular tv..way too small

[DivXExpert]

what the hell are you all talking about?

the ability to add borders to widescreen video footage, "on the fly" by your DVD player, so it appears in the correct ratio on a 4:3 TV, is a feature exclusive to DVD. this is what's meant by "anamorphic".

you CANNOT do it with VCDs or SVCDs. you're stuck with having the picture permanently stretched, or encoding it with borders.

I didn't say all DVD Players could do it, just that they are supposed to if they comply with the vcd svcd standard.

Sorry vhelp. Some DVDplayers don't do it right. I don't think your doing anything wronge.

[vhelp]

@ DivXEpert..

Thank you for your confirmation.

Yes, it's a bit tricky to get 16:9 encodes using 352x480 resolutions, but it
does work out ok. I've ben able to enjoy them as such ie, Pitch Black
came out great (test sample, that is) though I lost the whole capture I made
a week ago. I've ben deleting stuff by accident lately - - too quick on the
DEL key w/out a quick and simple vdub verification of what that file(s) is/are
..you know.

Anyways, I'll continue to play around w/ this 16:9 process cause I think that
a lower resolution (if source is good quality) is worth the extra bitrate savings
if properly prepared for encoding. So..

Should I have any further problems or can't work out my 16:9 w/out issues,
I have this idea I'm throwing around in my mind that might work to our benefit !!
So, maybe a "stay tuned" is in order.. I don't know.. we'll see what I can come
up w/ thus far.. if anyone else is having issues and would like to reap the
benefits of 16:9 encodes w/ 352x480 resolutions.

Thanks to all that contributed to this thread.
-vhelp

[DivXExpert]

Eh 352x480 is not standard. So I guess you can't expect it to enable SVCD and VCD standards if the file isn't standardized anyway.

[DivXExpert]

When you crop of the black bars, resize to 480x480. that way it is truly animorphic. It will be vertically streatched, but the DVD player is supposed to squish it back with black bars.

[DivXExpert]

352x480 with the 16:9 flag would be like cropping out black bars and telling it to add more black bars. Open up an animorphic DVD in DVD2AVI and look at how streached it is. You want it to be streached so that the DVD player will squish it back. 16:9 Tells it to squish it. If its already squished, and you tell the DVD player to squish it more, then I can see how it would result in garbage. Sorry, I guess I wasn't thinking.