Capturing VHS - different methods

[Sharc]

This is a professional recording on an SVHS-C cassette from 1995. The files are named according to capture method. Files that does not name the A/D converter were captured with a ViXS PureTV-U 480B0 card. Have fun. Or not.

Out of curiosity: What exactly do you mean by "professional" recording?
Except the SONY capture they are incorrectly flagged (or reported by MediaInfo) as progressive instead of interlaced with correct field parity. Probably it is just MediaInfo reporting the unflagged .avi like this.
For the last one (Mitsubishi) the field order is even inconsistent (changing) ....
The SONY is 4:1:1, the others are 4:2:2 (for NTSC DV?)
I understand that the tapes seem to be in very poor condition as the captures are still wavy, which the "TBC" did not cure.

[Bwaak]

Out of curiosity: What exactly do you mean by "professional" recording?

Professional as in done as a job, not as an amateur home project. The tape was recorded in 1995 as a reverse shot of an interview. I do not have the tape of the direct shot. OTOH, it was not for a big network but for a local cable station, so SVHS-C, not Betacam.

Except the SONY capture they are incorrectly flagged (or reported by MediaInfo) as progressive instead of interlaced with correct field parity. Probably it is just MediaInfo reporting the unflagged .avi like this.

I guess between VirtualDub2, MediaInfo and AVI's less than robust metadata support this flag fell through the cracks. All samples are interlaced.

For the last one (Mitsubishi) the field order is even inconsistent (changing) ....

Interesting. Maybe the TBC repeats a field. I have a feeling that because it is a medical VCR, on which the picture does not change often, they felt they could repeat a field in case of even a minor issue. Yeah, it does not work for normal video.

The SONY is 4:1:1, the others are 4:2:2 (for NTSC DV?)

As I said, I used a Sony Digital8 camcorder in passthrough mode - SVideo in, DV out. NTSC DV is 4:1:1. This does not bother me in the slightest, but the elevated black level and chopped whites do. Others are captured with VirtualDub2 into Cineform using the built-in codec, this is one of the reasons I use VirtualDub2.

[Sharc]

Each has its specific deficiencies. Only the first 2 seem to have no field glitches.
After all, I would probably prefer the 2nd example with the SONY despite the 4:1:1 and apply some level corrections with the darks.

[Alwyn]

Pardon the French, but they're all cr@p apart from the Digital8 DV version. Ironic. Imagine if it was PAL!

Be an interesting test to put that tape through a proper SVHS+TBC VCR and of course, the ultimate test, the SX950 with an ES-10/15.

[VHSvideocapture]

Some sort of "stabiliser" is, in a lot of cases. Whether that stabiliser be a inbuilt VCR TBC or some external gadget, a significant number of tapes (or poor VCRs) will exhibit wavy edges/vertical lines/jumpy picture/wonky colours that are corrected when stabilised. Check this out (my site):

http://aaproductions.net/stabilisers.htm

A JVC svhs VCR on its own should be fine?
If that doesn't work add an es10 or es15?

TBC are hard to find for a good price and anyone who comes to this or any other forum is looking to digitizing a handful of home made movies or old tv records, would it be worth looking for a TBC? I don't think so it would be better to pay a good company in your local area and get the job done.

This is not aimed at you Alwiyn

These fourms should look at alternative methods of capture it should never be about 1 member joining in and banging on about how great TBCS are I'm sure they but most of us will never know because we don't them.

When a member does try to source a TBC the expert says that's the wrong model its the wrong time it's the wrong brand don't buy online just buy from one place that he has links attached to.

How is this fair?
What if that market place only has 1 TBC for $2000?
How many people who have a handful of tapes can afford that much money?

On the subject, it looks to me like the much maligned GotMemories uses, in the main, Panasonic combos. Critically, each of those combos has the Panasonic Diga VHS Refresh feature, which is the same feature that the ES-15 uses for stabilisation. So his videos are well-stabilised and probably come out quite nicely. I have two of those type of combos and they work very well in this regard. One does not need an ES-15.

He does and shows off and brags about it not only does he use low end junk he uses elgato software to capture and render to .h264 im a low bitrate 2mbps.

He charges$ 350 when questioned on YouTube he says its economics people are not willing to paymore but the point is he makes thousands of $$$ not a TBC in sight how can people with a few tapes be expected to find or buy a TBC? It's all well and good for people to say a TBC is always needed maybe they should put a link where one is being sold for at a reasonable price brand new?

The are not being made because demand has died 20 years ago people have moved on from VHS, many people have sold TBCS on ebay

[VHSvideocapture]

[QUOTE=dellsam34;2716385]

"Cleans up the picture and cleans up the signal" are layman words, Technically you could say they are wrong, Any voltage running in a wire is an electric signal, whether video, audio, data you name it. In a nutshell, line TBC fixes line timing or the HBI signal, frame TBC fixes frame timing or VBI signal. It is not always the case though, Some pro devices, DVD recorders and consumer VCRs can do both at the same time, those are the ones the guy in the video was referring to, Don't ask me what models or devices, but I know they do exist, even Sony VCRs have some sort of digital processing that actually produced rock solid picture in both the line domain and frame domain, but they never mentioned the term TBC in their marketing materials. [\QUOTE]

Yes anyone coming on here for help is a layman I'm am a layman looking for help to achieve the best quality from my vides tapes using alternative methods

From the above it means TBC is a vague term and can be interpreted whatever way? Maybe that's why people don't want to buy a TBC or don't feel the need to because the ones that become available are quickly sold or someone is warning people not to buy from ebay because the stuff is faulty. This is the case with the Cypress TBC some say they are good others say they are not the expert again talks about s production change in the latter 2009 models?

[QUOTE=dellsam34;2716385]
To make a database of what devices have this capability, it needs people to test such devices and report back with samples, From time to time I see members post feedback about capture cards and rack mount TBCs that are forbidden in these forums and the results are actually surprising. I remember when I was looking for a consumer alternative capture hardware I couldn't find any useful info so decided to take a dive and experiment for myself, and I'm glad I did otherwise I will be still dealing with audio drift and frame drop issues. [\QUOTE]

Put it this way anyone selling a TBC telling you that you need one means he is just looking for a sale, newbies are often gullible they will take anything at facevalue?
Why doesn't anything pass the experts test other than datavideo and Cypress? Both of which are EOL dead products.

So that's what needs to happen, People need to experiment for themselves and report for analysis and data collections of bad and good devices, Otherwise nothing will change, newbies open threads to ask questions and regular members start to argue about their feelings and nothing gets done.

I understand that sir but people don't have money to waste buy 1 lot of capture cards then TBCS then another then another we will waste our time testing junk when will we capture VHS?
Time is running out VHS lifespan is 20 years even less for poorly stored tapes.

[lollo]

VHSvideocapture, the analog signal coming from a VHS needs correction.

At minimum is the TBC inside the high-end VCRs or a specific DVD-Recorder in passthorugh mode if the first is not enough for certain tapes.

If this is still not enough because different specific problems, you need to add an external TBC or use a high-end capture card featuring the "deeper" time base correction, such as BE75 or Snell & Wilcox or Canopus NX for example.

There are no other ways.

[dellsam34]

@VHSvideocapture, You need to fix your quotes, It's confusing, If you don't know how, don't quote just put @ before the member name you are addressing as I put it in this post.

Back to topic, I wasn't asking anyone to buy equipment and test until finding the right one, I was addressing regular members and hobbyists to build a database of good and bad equipment rather than rely on hearsay.

No one is asking you to buy a $2000 TBC up front, Start with a good VCR and a stable capture device and go from there, If there is any problematic tapes left then see if it's worth investing in more equipment, if not, send them out to a reputable transfer service, Once done you can sell your stuff and recoup some of the money spent.

[VHSvideocapture]

Back to topic, I wasn't asking anyone to buy equipment and test until finding the right one, I was addressing regular members and hobbyists to build a database of good and bad equipment rather than rely on hearsay.

No one is asking you to buy a $2000 TBC up front, Start with a good VCR and a stable capture device and go from there, If there is any problematic tapes left then see if it's worth investing in more equipment, if not, send them out to a reputable transfer service, Once done you can sell your stuff and recoup some of the money spent.

I'm not saying you were please don't take it personally 1 member here only talks about timebase correctors he doesn't have any other input, to him everything is bad quality.

The JVC 7500 is not good because it does not have a TBC? The next model up is 7600 that does have a TBC.

Capture card io data gv-usb2 is mentioned favourably on here these days looking at other topics ATI 600 is another one Diamond vc500 is another 1 hauppage live USB-2 is the last option.

Why don't people agree on 1capture device some say USB is good enough others say sdi to hdmi digital conversion no reconverting back to analogue.

The brighteye75 that you have is not an option for me it's toooo expensive not seen any on the used market ever.

I've read a thread on here where another user bought one has issues with it and returned it for a refund, it was doing strange things on the VHS capture

[VHSvideocapture]

In this new video uploaded today the got memories YouTuber
rants and raves, I can't understand what he's going on about please watch this video and explain to me what's going on
He is capturing VHS using a cheap 2 head black Panasonic VCR no TBC no Panasonic DVD recorder pass through.
El*rapo USB capture card that only supports 640x480 input.
Standard VHS is 720x480 30 fps and 720x576 25 fps


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I0dRRQzoTq8&t=927s

[Bwaak]

Once done you can sell your stuff and recoup some of the money spent.

Or not.

Standard VHS is 720x480 30 fps and 720x576 25 fps

VHS is analog.

Why don't people agree on 1capture device some say USB is good enough others say sdi to hdmi digital conversion no reconverting back to analogue.

"The expert" from another forum can give you specific reccommendations. He can even sell the equipment to you.

[dellsam34]

Capture card io data gv-usb2 is mentioned favourably on here these days looking at other topics ATI 600 is another one Diamond vc500 is another 1 hauppage live USB-2 is the last option.

Why don't people agree on 1capture device some say USB is good enough others say sdi to hdmi digital conversion no reconverting back to analogue.

The brighteye75 that you have is not an option for me it's toooo expensive not seen any on the used market ever.

I've read a thread on here where another user bought one has issues with it and returned it for a refund, it was doing strange things on the VHS capture

People do agree on certain working USB capture devices, The issues related to them could be computer hardware or software related, This is the reason I use my setup so I don't have to rely on computer CPU.

I never asked you to buy BE75 or any other niche hardware, I also do not recommend HDMI capture except specific DVD recorders from back in the day that have true rec.601 output.

The guy who you referring too who bough a BE75 and returned it are the kind of people to ignore in these forums, He wanted one so bad, then started asking questions about it, we directed him into the right direction, then started complaining about lack of support, like we are 800 customer support employees on the payroll here, Then he bought it anyway, then complained about some weird problem that could be due to wrong setup and when we asked him to provide samples of the problem so we can help him, we got 2 screenshots, we asked for samples, he changed his attitude and he instantly became an expert and knows it all, when we ignored him he returned the device.

[VHSvideocapture]

Once done you can sell your stuff and recoup some of the money spent.

Or not.

Standard VHS is 720x480 30 fps and 720x576 25 fps

VHS is analog.

Why don't people agree on 1capture device some say USB is good enough others say sdi to hdmi digital conversion no reconverting back to analogue.

"The expert" from another forum can give you specific reccommendations. He can even sell the equipment to you.

@Bwaak I'm not buying anything, I have what I need already.
Can his recommendations be trusted? Because he has a personal interest in selling stuff like TBC because he links on his signature to his market place . He will recommend a capture card that is not in production or available online easily something very old that only he has available. This is not good such a persons advice can't be taken st face value I'm sorry 😔

[VHSvideocapture]

People do agree on certain working USB capture devices, The issues related to them could be computer hardware or software related, This is the reason I use my setup so I don't have to rely on computer CPU.

I never asked you to buy BE75 or any other niche hardware, I also do not recommend HDMI capture except specific DVD recorders from back in the day that have true rec.601 output.

The guy who you referring too who bough a BE75 and returned it are the kind of people to ignore in these forums, He wanted one so bad, then started asking questions about it, we directed him into the right direction, then started complaining about lack of support, like we are 800 customer support employees on the payroll here, Then he bought it anyway, then complained about some weird problem that could be due to wrong setup and when we asked him to provide samples of the problem so we can help him, we got 2 screenshots, we asked for samples, he changed his attitude and he instantly became an expert and knows it all, when we ignored him he returned the device.

I don't see much agreement on any USB device? Diamond vc500 and hauppage live USB 2 the expert says newer ones are different from the old ones. The Io data gv-usb2 was being liked by many online and offline then the experts posts a picture of a gv-usb2 box and says look look I found a fake ebay listing, ebay and Amazon sellers are selling fakes, what do we do then not buy anything?

Then Alwyn started a thread on it ⚠️ people to be careful when buying. Where is the agreement on any capture device?
Some stores do not accept returns BH photo video clearly state no returns on the be75 or did when I last time checked?

[Bwaak]

Diamond vc500 and hauppage live USB 2 the expert says newer ones are different from the old ones.

Maybe ask him for teardown photos and sample videos? I am sure, with 30-year experience around video, he will be happy to back up his statements with a paper trail so to speak.

[dellsam34]

No one agrees on fakes, that's for sure, I was mainly talking about the genuine products.

Not sure why you watch that YT channel, He clearly prey on gullible and ignorant people as if he is not doing what big bucks companies do, He is actually doing worse with his low end consumer equipment, For him it's all about how quick he can get the job done, he can care less about quality.

[Sharc]

@Bwaak I'm not buying anything, I have what I need already....

So what's your problem then? Just do it, post an example of your source and results instead of trolling with confusing questions. You will probably get specific help instead of endless discussions about anything you have picked up or heard of from somewhere, leading to nowhere.
Re-read post#67

[lordsmurf]

Not sure why you watch that YT channel, He clearly prey on gullible and ignorant people as if he is not doing what big bucks companies do, He is actually doing worse with his low end consumer equipment, For him it's all about how quick he can get the job done, he can care less about quality.

^ This.

Capture card io data gv-usb2 is mentioned favourably on here these days looking at other topics ATI 600 is another one Diamond vc500 is another 1 hauppage live USB-2 is the last option.

Ever since I joined this site, which is 20 years ago now, "memes" have existed. Not just capture cards, but blank DVD media, software, etc. It's the "it" of the moment. Sometimes the suggestions are horrible, stupid beyond belief, at least to anybody that truly knows about this stuff. The lemmings and site newbies are vocal, but then go away within a few years. Or realize their info was bad, and then just hush up moving forward, as if they'd never given the awful advice.

VC500 was a perfect example of it, with all sorts of issues. I came out against the VC500 multiple times, but was argued, newbie pitchfork mobs formed. But fast forward a few years, and most people are aware of the horrid AGC issues, amongst others. Those mouthy VC500 lovers are either gone or STFU.

@Bwaak I'm not buying anything, I have what I need already.
Can his recommendations be trusted? Because he has a personal interest in selling stuff like TBC because he links on his signature to his market place . He will recommend a capture card that is not in production or available online easily something very old that only he has available. This is not good such a persons advice can't be taken st face value I'm sorry

Having a conspiracy mindset must really make life miserable. "They" are always out to get you.

That said, in general, I would agree. Advice + selling is suspect. However, I didn't start to sell anything until 2016, and I've been giving capture advice since the 90s. So what you say doesn't jive. I'm not selling anything that I didn't recommend in the decades prior to selling refurbs. Still the quality VCRs, TBCs, capture cards.

The reason I started to refurb gear, and sell those refurbs, is specifically because the gear we need for this hobby/DIY/pro capture community was falling into disrepair after 10/15+ years (now 20/25+ years). I have the skill and knowledge, and had been doing it for decades for myself and others offline. But it ain't free, and takes lots of time.

All the "new" stuff on Amazon/etc is Chinese junk, or niche gear for HD or videogames (and not analog SD videotapes). There are no new VCRs, period.

I generally find that
- The few people who gripe about "evil selling" lack the skills to set a VCR clock. Or think the world owes them something, ie everything should be free/cheap (but they want pay raises for doing nothing, of course!). Or both.
- The few who actually understand the gear at a deep level have no desire to get into the time and costs of it.
- Most folks are grateful that I'm keeping our community supplied with what we all need. And I will continue as long as I'm able, but it is getting vastly more challenging in recent years, as gear scarcity and costs are getting ugly.

Why don't people agree on 1capture device s

Or the best car.
Or the one true religion.
Or the one political party that we should all vote for.
Or the ideal length for a piece of string.

But that also doesn't mean "everything is good". For example, nobody of consequence votes for the Green Party (U.S.), or worships squirrels. There is some consensus around "the top few".

[VHSvideocapture]

No one agrees on fakes, that's for sure, I was mainly talking about the genuine products.

Not sure why you watch that YT channel, He clearly prey on gullible and ignorant people as if he is not doing what big bucks companies do, He is actually doing worse with his low end consumer equipment, For him it's all about how quick he can get the job done, he can care less about quality.

I love watching these YouTube channels for a laugh 😂
The issue is if big companies like him are not using a TBC what are the chances a person with 20 home movies is going to bother?
This will put people of converting themselves and people like that guy will keep getting more business

[VHSvideocapture]

Ever since I joined this site, which is 20 years ago now, "memes" have existed. Not just capture cards, but blank DVD media, software, etc. It's the "it" of the moment. Sometimes the suggestions are horrible, stupid beyond belief, at least to anybody that truly knows about this stuff. The lemmings and site newbies are vocal, but then go away within a few years. Or realize their info was bad, and then just hush up moving forward, as if they'd never given the awful advice.

VC500 was a perfect example of it, with all sorts of issues. I came out against the VC500 multiple times, but was argued, newbie pitchfork mobs formed. But fast forward a few years, and most people are aware of the horrid AGC issues, amongst others. Those mouthy VC500 lovers are either gone or STFU

The VC500 and Hauppage live USB 2 use the Conexant Polaris chipset CX23103 this shows up when the VC500 and the Hauppage live USB 2 are connected in virtualdub, nothing has changed in chiipset or production country.
The diamond VC500 have always been made in China and the live USB -2 is made in Indonesia, it doesn't really matter if country of production changes what matters is the chipset and model number that is the same for both and has been before Conexant shutdown in 2017.

The only time VC500 exhibits AGC issues is if the VHS has macrovision on it, this has nothing to do with the chipset used.
The I-O DATA GV-USB2 is another solid card that works on 10 and 11 without any issues it has no AGC issues it uses the Techwell NEC chipset , no user has ever reported any issues only you, why is it that only you have a problem with ever card STILL AVAILABLE?
you love the ATI 600 USB, that is also not available to buy. I don't know what it uses but I know its a generic unbranded card that 2 companies have sold in the past Diamond multimedia and Vision Tek, both of the cards are made in Taiwan by the same company it sells to anyone that puts its brand to it. your other favourite Cypress Technologies also sold it's TBC to other manufacturers TVone and Globalmediapro Australia and New Zealand they rebadged those same TBC as Global media pro TBC.
The solution you keep promoting is the AIW 9800 PCI they only work with win xp, how many people have a working win xp pc?
This is not good advice that the vast majority of newbies can follow.

How many will have a working PC with XP on it?

The timebase correctors that are recommended online datavideo, Cypress, Kramer none of which are available to buy from any shop
you are against ebay because that effects your business of selling old TBCS, people have pointed this out to you on Reddit
A few of the Cypress ones that are available you advise against because it effects your business.
Bigvoodo people aee using successfully too not available new you also don't like that either this says to me you just want desperate gullible newbies to flock to your sources and buy any TBC that you recommend.
Even the datavideo tbc does not escape your criticism I've researched that you often mention some with a dip switch v jumper switch issue.

Why do you think datavideo don't make tbcs anymore? Because the demand is low now and the parts are not available which brings me on ro my next point if I did buy a datavideo tbc somehow what would happen if decided to break down repairing it would be almost impossible the parts are not available.
Will you promise to do free repairs for people who buy expensive tbcs from you?

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2716612]
Having a conspiracy mindset must really make life miserable. "They" are always out to get you.

That said, in general, I would agree. Advice + selling is suspect. However, I didn't start to sell anything until 2016, and I've been giving capture advice since the 90s. So what you say doesn't jive. I'm not selling anything that I didn't recommend in the decades prior to selling refurbs. Still the quality VCRs, TBCs, capture cards.

The reason I started to refurb gear, and sell those refurbs, is specifically because the gear we need for this hobby/DIY/pro capture community was falling into disrepair after 10/15+ years (now 20/25+ years). I have the skill and knowledge, and had been doing it for decades for myself and others offline. But it ain't free, and takes lots of time

All the "new" stuff on Amazon/etc is Chinese junk, or niche gear for HD or videogames (and not analog SD videotapes). There are no new VCRs, period.[\QUOTE]

You may have only started selling in 2016 by then most people were done with converting VHS tapes 2002 is when it started by 2012 it was finished that is the reason the companies selling tbc don't bulk order the parts because they did not order the parts the company making the tbc parts has shut down and it is not possible to make another tbc.
You may have been giving advice in the 90S but it was analogue era back then and having the internet was not a thing for most people, the internet generally kicked off in 1998 roundabout the time commercial dvds came out after dvds dvd recorders came out in 2004 2005 all the none technical people used DVD recorders to capture VHS.

I generally find that
- The few people who gripe about "evil selling" lack the skills to set a VCR clock. Or think the world owes them something, ie everything should be free/cheap (but they want pay raises for doing nothing, of course!). Or both.
- The few who actually understand the gear at a deep level have no desire to get into the time and costs of it.
- Most folks are grateful that I'm keeping our community supplied with what we all need. And I will continue as long as I'm able, but it is getting vastly more challenging in recent years, as gear scarcity and costs are getting ugly.

nobody has a gripe about others selling its the price and playing with peoples emotions that I have a problem with somebody may need to capture a VHS of a dying family member who may only have months to live or to show other family members video of a person who is no longer alive and you not providing any useful solutions can be a problem because you are never happy with any solutions other than jumping in trying to promote the importance of a TBC, however if a tape is damaged and worn out and has lines across it no TBC in the world can fix such problems.

Or the best car.
Or the one true religion.
Or the one political party that we should all vote for.
Or the ideal length for a piece of string.

But that also doesn't mean "everything is good". For example, nobody of consequence votes for the Green Party (U.S.), or worships squirrels. There is some consensus around "the top few".

Different context nobody will say a car has AGC issues if it takes you from one place to the other it's fine
Religion whatsoever religion a person is born into he-she thinks its the best because they have been brainwashed into believing what they believe is the truth.
Please change politics on a regular basis

[VHSvideocapture]

@Bwaak I'm not buying anything, I have what I need already....

So what's your problem then? Just do it, post an example of your source and results instead of trolling with confusing questions. You will probably get specific help instead of endless discussions about anything you have picked up or heard of from somewhere, leading to nowhere.
Re-read post#67

I will give me a days.

I have another capture card too

[lordsmurf]

TBC are hard to find for a good price

This is always a silly unqualified statement. By what metrics have you determined that this item, that you only just learned about, is not a "good price". Do you attribute random arbitrary pricing to everything? Is anything over $x suddenly a "bad" price just because?

These fourms should look at alternative methods of capture

So in the 21st century, we're supposed to "find" (???) better methods to use 20th century technology, simply because some are too cheap to buy the 20th century tech needed for the task? Alrighty then.

When a member does try to source a TBC the expert says that's the wrong model its the wrong time it's the wrong brand

Because it's true.

How is this fair?

WTF?

How many people who have a handful of tapes can afford that much money?

Ain't broke?
Buy it, use it, resell it?
How does anybody afford a new TV, a gaming computer, a refrigerator, a lawnmower, etc?
Or pay a service, not DIY?

they should put a link where one is being sold for at a reasonable price brand new?

This is such a clueless statement. "Find me a brand new phone booth! Preferably cheap, and on Amazon!"

The JVC 7500 is not good because it does not have a TBC? The next model up is 7600 that does have a TBC.

PAL 7500? Correct.
NTSC 7500? Not correct.

use the Conexant Polaris chipset

So? On-chip software matters just as much as chips.

The only time VC500 exhibits AGC issues is if the VHS has macrovision on it,

False.

I don't know what it uses but I know its a generic unbranded card that 2 companies have sold in the past Diamond multimedia and Vision Tek, both of the cards are made in Taiwan by the same company it sells to anyone that puts its brand to it.

False. And correct, you don't know.

your other favourite Cypress Technologies also sold it's TBC to other manufacturers TVone and Globalmediapro Australia and New Zealand they rebadged those same TBC as Global media pro TBC.

You write without knowledge. What is sold there is not the same as the recommended TBCs. Any Cypress isn't any Cypress, anymore than any Ford is any Ford -- or GM, or Dodge, or Tesla, or whatever.

The solution you keep promoting is the AIW 9800 PCI they only work with win xp, how many people have a working win xp pc?
This is not good advice that the vast majority of newbies can follow.
How many will have a working PC with XP on it?

It's not hard. Many people still have XP systems available (closet, attic, etc), or are willing to create one, or willing to pay for a quality system build. So your statement "most" really just applies to you. Not everybody is unwilling, and/or lazy, and/or cheap. That said, there are many decent cards for post-XP, but "the best" (ATI AIW) is using XP, because VHS transfer is from that era.

The timebase correctors that are recommended online datavideo, Cypress, Kramer none of which are available to buy from any shop
you arecagainst ebay because that effects your business of selling old TBCS, people have pointed this out to you on Reddit

Again, correct, I sell refurb'd gear. However, again, I only started to refurb gear for others in 2016, and I was recommending this same gear for many years prior (feel free to browse all my 00s/10s posts at VH, digitalFAQ.com and elsewhere). So there goes your conspiracy theory, again. The gear we needed for quality transfer was falling into disrepair, and disappearing (trashed as broken). So I've done my best to revitalize the community, providing the quality gear we need. Most people are very appreciative of this.

eBay sellers are 99% just recyclers now in the 2020s, not owners/users of the gear. They have zero clue what a TBC is, or does, nor care whatsoever. They just want your $$$$, not to make sure you have a good capture experience. The descriptions of "tested" and "working" are complete nonsense. LED lights is not a test, which is what most of them do. The rest feed it digital sources (DVD players, etc), and/or ignore obvious flaws. When it comes to some items, eBay is gambling, not buying. If you want to piss away time and money, have at it. Lots of people have learned this lesson the hard way, especially stubborn ones.

A few of the Cypress ones that are available you advise against because it effects your business.

False. Those are flawed chipset models, aka "black AVT-8710" type Cypress. Those actually induces errors, which is crazy.

Bigvoodo people aee using successfully

No. BV models are all over the place, with some spewing noise, others corrupting the signals (ie, same issues as black AVT-8710, probably because of "shared" or more like reverse-engineered boards/chips), some other screwy issues/quirks.

Even the datavideo tbc does not escape your criticism I've researched that you often mention some with a dip switch v jumper switch issue.

Correct. Most DataVideo TBC-1000 are entering a nasty phase like the AG-1980 did in the 2010s, where caps are now failing en masse. It really sucks to have to avoid this model now. I have literally not seen a good DataVideo TBC-1000 "in the wild" (which includes eBay; even the "tested" and "working" BS) for almost a year now. I've gotten to where I'm no longer interested in reburb'ing those myself (few exceptions), and have been referring to a trusted party instead. Even he's getting annoyed by the level of failure witnessed in the past year. The dip/jumper is a TBC-3000 issue, and there are at lest 5 generations of that model, each with their own quirks and issues that often need attention before using.

Why do you think datavideo don't make tbcs anymore? Because the demand is low now and the parts are not available

Correct.

which brings me on ro my next point if I did buy a datavideo tbc somehow what would happen if decided to break down repairing it would be almost impossible the parts are not available.

False.

Will you promise to do free repairs for people who buy expensive tbcs from you?

When your used 2000s era car breaks, do you expect the seller to repair it for free? (Even if you purchase from a dealership, and purchase an extended warranty, it doesn't 100% cover everything for free.)

that is the reason the companies selling tbc don't bulk order the parts because they did not order the parts the company making the tbc parts has shut down and it is not possible to make another tbc.

False. I suggest you learn more about the semiconductor industry. Parts needs were no longer fabbed.

You may have been giving advice in the 90S but it was analogue era back then and having the internet was not a thing for most people, the internet generally kicked off in 1998 roundabout the time commercial dvds came out after dvds dvd recorders came out in 2004 2005 all the none technical people used DVD recorders to capture VHS.

You must be very young. Everything you wrote here is wrong, all dates way off.

nobody has a gripe about others selling its the price and playing with peoples emotions that I have a problem with

This is precisely why I pushed back against the marketing BS of "your tapes are fading! convert them now!" in the 2000s and 2010s. The "fading" in itself is 100% BS, color data is magnetic, and "fade" is optical.

somebody may need to capture a VHS of a dying family member who may only have months to live or to show other family members video of a person who is no longer alive and you not providing any useful solutions can be a problem because you are never happy with any solutions other than jumping in trying to promote the importance of a TBC, however if a tape is damaged and worn out and has lines across it no TBC in the world can fix such problems.

I would suggest that "need it done quick" (and quality) is a reason to buy quality gear, not be a cheap ass and screw around with junk that wastes your time.

Different context nobody will say a car has AGC issues

And nobody will say a TBC has alignment and steering issues. Learn what an analogy is.

Religion whatsoever religion a person is born into he-she thinks its the best because they have been brainwashed into believing what they believe is the truth.

Nope. Lots of converts out there.

Please change politics on a regular basis

Nope. Too many people vote "the same" their whole life, even when their party changed decades ago. Not paying attention. Voting against their own self interests, too stupid/lazy to observe/learn stuff.

Once done you can sell your stuff and recoup some of the money spent.

Or not.

Your statement is FUD BS.

@Bwaak I'm not buying anything, I have what I need already....

So what's your problem then? Just do it, post an example of your source and results instead of trolling with confusing questions. You will probably get specific help instead of endless discussions about anything you have picked up or heard of from somewhere, leading to nowhere

^ This.

[VHSvideocapture]

This is always a silly unqualified statement. By what metrics have you determined that this item, that you only just learned about, is not a "good price". Do you attribute random arbitrary pricing to everything? Is anything over $x suddenly a "bad" price just because?

A timebase corrector corrects timing issues if a tape is damaged it or chewed uo it won't magically make the tape perfect.
I think you oversell TBC'S . It's not a good price because they are cheaply made the cypress ones are nothing more than a plastic box with a few chips inside them that cypress have defaced to stop people - rival companies finding out what parts they use and build another version to sells aa a different brand, that to make should cost no more than $25 in Taiwan -China I don't know how much it sold for in the past but I have seen a few go on ebay for more than $1000

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
So in the 21st century, we're supposed to "find" (???) better methods to use 20th century technology, simply because some are too cheap to buy the 20th century tech needed for the task? Alrighty then.
[\QUOTE]

Yes, surely because not everyone has the budget or can't justify buying such an expensive item on a few tapes 10-20 if someone has more than 200 tapes then it might be worth looking into, this is where these YouTube fools grab hold of the market 2 people are doing this currently 1 got memories on YouTube and another new guy Emerald coast digitizing both are misguiding the public they are using normal 2 head VCRS and the elgato usb capture card no TBC at all I don't think they know what one is uf they do they can't be bothered enough to go out and look for one.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
Because it's true.
[\QUOTE]

NO it's because you just want people buying stuff from your marketplace you had this planned all along you bought gear cheaply sorted it away for 10 years then falsely created a demand for the stuff you had by saying this is the best like the CYP TBC boxes and ATI because you keep mentioning these a lot, why do you not like the GV-USB2? Please tell us what is wrong with it?!show us some captures where the GV-USB2 is misbehaving, if thus stuff was in production and availabie you would not have a business today.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
Ain't broke?
Buy it, use it, resell it?
How does anybody afford a new TV, a gaming computer, a refrigerator, a lawnmower, etc?
Or pay a service, not DIY?
[\QUOTE]

How could I do that? When you keep telling people not to buy from ebay I've read your posts saying ebay sellers sell junk they sell junk TBCS they are just resellers they wouldn't know the difference between q TBC and toaster?
If I had a TBC and put it up for sale and someone shared the link with you asking for your opinion as to buy it or not you would most probably say no and tell them I have something better or tested on the market place


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
This is such a clueless statement. "Find me a brand new phone booth! Preferably cheap, and on Amazon!"
[\QUOTE]

Different item different rules I don't think Amazon sell phone booths but they did sell the CYP CTB100 TBC which is the original model the TVONE AVT8710 is based on but you talk about a production change in 2009 you do the same thing with Hauppage and Diamond, at least with the diamond we know it uses the cxt23 model chipset, not many people will have a cyp TBC to teardown and look at.

So? On-chip software matters just as much as chips.

First thing that matters is condition of the tapes
Then VCR, then capture card, then wires connected, if a TBC is used it'll prosesss the image in it's buffer memory this cam also add sude effects like darkening the image adding a blue mist to it in some cases


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
False.
[\QUOTE]
Not false, if you capture a macrovision protected tape the brightness plumps VC 500 is one of those cards that ignores macrovision so does the Hauppage live tv2usb.

False. And correct, you don't know.

I do now after doing some search, it uses Texes instrument for video and Empia for audio.
That's what it says online.

What is so good about it? It outputs noise in the picture from what I've seen from it

This is always a silly unqualified statement. By what metrics have you determined that this item, that you only just learned about, is not a "good price". Do you attribute random arbitrary pricing to everything? Is anything over $x suddenly a "bad" price just because?

A timebase corrector corrects timing issues if a tape is damaged it or chewed uo it won't magically make the tape perfect.
I think you oversell TBC'S . It's not a good price because they are cheaply made the cypress ones are nothing more than a plastic box with a few chips inside them that cypress have defaced to stop people - rival companies finding out what parts they use and build another version to sells aa a different brand, that to make should cost no more than $25 in Taiwan -China I don't know how much it sold for in the past but I have seen a few go on ebay for more than $1000

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
So in the 21st century, we're supposed to "find" (???) better methods to use 20th century technology, simply because some are too cheap to buy the 20th century tech needed for the task? Alrighty then.
[\QUOTE]

Yes, surely because not everyone has the budget or can't justify buying such an expensive item on a few tapes 10-20 if someone has more than 200 tapes then it might be worth looking into, this is where these YouTube fools grab hold of the market 2 people are doing this currently 1 got memories on YouTube and another new guy Emerald coast digitizing both are misguiding the public they are using normal 2 head VCRS and the elgato usb capture card no TBC at all I don't think they know what one is uf they do they can't be bothered enough to go out and look for one.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
Because it's true.
[\QUOTE]

NO it's because you just want people buying stuff from your marketplace you had this planned all along you bought gear cheaply sorted it away for 10 years then falsely created a demand for the stuff you had by saying this is the best like the CYP TBC boxes and ATI because you keep mentioning these a lot, why do you not like the GV-USB2? Please tell us what is wrong with it?!show us some captures where the GV-USB2 is misbehaving, if thus stuff was in production and availabie you would not have a business today.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
Ain't broke?
Buy it, use it, resell it?
How does anybody afford a new TV, a gaming computer, a refrigerator, a lawnmower, etc?
Or pay a service, not DIY?
[\QUOTE]

How could I do that? When you keep telling people not to buy from ebay I've read your posts saying ebay sellers sell junk they sell junk TBCS they are just resellers they wouldn't know the difference between q TBC and toaster?
If I had a TBC and put it up for sale and someone shared the link with you asking for your opinion as to buy it or not you would most probably say no and tell them I have something better or tested on the market place


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
This is such a clueless statement. "Find me a brand new phone booth! Preferably cheap, and on Amazon!"
[\QUOTE]

Different item different rules I don't think Amazon sell phone booths but they did sell the CYP CTB100 TBC which is the original model the TVONE AVT8710 is based on but you talk about a production change in 2009 you do the same thing with Hauppage and Diamond, at least with the diamond we know it uses the cxt23 model chipset, not many people will have a cyp TBC to teardown and look at.

So? On-chip software matters just as much as chips.

First thing that matters is condition of the tapes
Then VCR, then capture card, then wires connected, if a TBC is used it'll prosesss the image in it's buffer memory this cam also add sude effects like darkening the image adding a blue mist to it in some cases


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
False.
[\QUOTE]
Not false, if you capture a macrovision protected tape the brightness plumps VC 500 is one of those cards that ignores macrovision so does the Hauppage live tv2usb.

False. And correct, you don't know.

I do now after doing some search, it uses Texes instrument for video and Empia for audio
[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
You write without knowledge. What is sold there is not the same as the recommended TBCs. Any Cypress isn't any Cypress, anymore than any Ford is any Ford -- or GM, or Dodge, or Tesla, or whatever.
[\QUOTE]

This is why it's best not to buy one with all this confusing information

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;2718812]
It's not hard. Many people still have XP systems available (closet, attic, etc), or are willing to create one, or willing to pay for a quality system build. So your statement "most" really just applies to you. Not everybody is unwilling, and/or lazy, and/or cheap. That said, there are many decent cards for post-XP, but "the best" (ATI AIW) is using XP, because VHS transfer is from that era.
[\QUOTE]

I got rid if my xp PC 10 years ago, I don't even know where the xp disc is now some people don't have the space for 2 PCS other solution is partition the hard drive and add XP?;how many people have done that or how many people are willing to do all that who just want to get a wedding video onto dvd? This will just push people towards bad actors who have YouTube channels like got memories and Emarald coast digitizing who use cheap VCRS and elgato to capture they don't have a TBC I haven't seen one in aby of the YouTube videos they post.

[QUOTE==lordsmurf;278812]
Again, correct, I sell refurb'd gear. However, again, I only started to refurb gear for others in 2016, and I was recommending this same gear for many years prior (feel free to browse all my 00s/10s posts at VH, digitalFAQ.com and elsewhere). So there goes your conspiracy theory, again. The gear we needed for quality transfer was falling into disrepair, and disappearing (trashed as broken). So I've done my best to revitalize the community, providing the quality gear we need. Most people are very appreciative of this.
[\QUOTE]

Why do you actively promote your marketplace on forums and Reddit? You have links underneath your post to marketplace TBC and capture cards.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
eBay sellers are 99% just recyclers now in the 2020s, not owners/users of the gear. They have zero clue what a TBC is, or does, nor care whatsoever. They just want your $$$$, not to make sure you have a good capture experience. The descriptions of "tested" and "working" are complete nonsense. LED lights is not a test, which is what most of them do. The rest feed it digital sources (DVD players, etc), and/or ignore obvious flaws. When it comes to some items, eBay is gambling, not buying. If you want to piss away time and money, have at it. Lots of people have learned this lesson the hard way, especially stubborn ones.

A few of the Cypress ones that are available you advise against because it effects your business.

False. Those are flawed chipset models, aka "black AVT-8710" type Cypress. Those actually induces errors, which is crazy.

Bigvoodo people aee using successfully

No. BV models are all over the place, with some spewing noise, others corrupting the signals (ie, same issues as black AVT-8710, probably because of "shared" or more like reverse-engineered boards/chips), some other screwy issues/quirks.

It doesn't really matter because ebay have a return policy on any item that is sold faulty seller has to pay for returns I think people would knowingly sell faulty items on ebay *because* they know the seller will get a refund from ebay they will be left out of pocket and it would be a huge waste of time and effort on the sellers part.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
Correct. Most DataVideo TBC-1000 are entering a nasty phase like the AG-1980 did in the 2010s, where caps are now failing en masse. It really sucks to have to avoid this model now. I have literally not seen a good DataVideo TBC-1000 "in the wild" (which includes eBay; even the "tested" and "working" BS) for almost a year now. I've gotten to where I'm no longer interested in reburb'ing those myself (few exceptions), and have been referring to a trusted party instead. Even he's getting annoyed by the level of failure witnessed in the past year. The dip/jumper is a TBC-3000 issue, and there are at lest 5 generations of that model, each with their own quirks and issues that often need attention before using.
[\QUOTE]

Now the TBC 3000 is off the list 😂 I'm guessing you have some that you want to sell off to despate people you are waiting for the right time to add then to the market place? You want the ebay stock to die out before you can list your ones at a muvh higher price because they won't have any faults because they are sold by you lol I bet your price wil be $2000. If ebay had more stock I'm sure people would take the risk on ebay rather than pay you higher asking price.

False.

When your used 2000s era car breaks, do you expect the seller to repair it for free? (Even if you purchase from a dealership, and purchase an extended warranty, it doesn't 100% cover everything for free.)

Not false datavideo website says this is a legacy product which we don't repair.


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
You must be very young. Everything you wrote here is wrong, all dates way off.

nobody has a gripe about others selling its the price and playing with peoples emotions that I have a problem with

This is precisely why I pushed back against the marketing BS of "your tapes are fading! convert them now!" in the 2000s and 2010s. The "fading" in itself is 100% BS, color data is magnetic, and "fade" is optical.
DVD came out in 1998 DVD, the ATI 600 document on diamond website shows 2009.
The CYP TBC 2001 then 2009 TVONE black 2016 EOL on CYP TBC.

I would suggest that "need it done quick" (and quality) is a reason to buy quality gear, not be a cheap ass and screw around with junk that wastes your time.

The stuff that is considered quality is not available so people will just settle with whatever is easily available like the black tvone AVT8710 TBC even if this forum has many pages highlighting faults because it's all that is available sometimes, if that's not available then ES10 or ES15 they are available but prices have gone up because they keep being mentioned on these forums as a TBC substitute, you mzy argue its not ans and should only be used for stopping tearing issues but people do use them, mostly YouTubers that upload old TV commercials.


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
Nope. Lots of converts out there.

People change politics on a regular basis
Nope so many people vote "the same" their whole life, even when their party changed decades ago. Not paying attention. Voting against their own self interests, too stupid/lazy to observe/learn stuff.[\QUOTE]

Do they understand what they are getting into or are they brainwashed into believing something is right?
People with no religious beliefs is increasing too.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
You write without knowledge. What is sold there is not the same as the recommended TBCs. Any Cypress isn't any Cypress, anymore than any Ford is any Ford -- or GM, or Dodge, or Tesla, or whatever.[\QUOTE]

With all this confusion it's best not to buy any.

[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
It's not hard. Many people still have XP systems available (closet, attic, etc), or are willing to create one, or willing to pay for a quality system build. So your statement "most" really just applies to you. Not everybody is unwilling, and/or lazy, and/or cheap. That said, there are many decent cards for post-XP, but "the best" (ATI AIW) is using XP, because VHS transfer is from that era.
[\QUOTE]

Some people may not have the space to keep 2 PCS, other solution is to partition the drive and add xp but how many people have done that who capture? Lots of people that review capture cards on Amazon can't even install the drivers that came on CD they just send the items back and leave a negative review.

QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
Again, correct, I sell refurb'd gear. However, again, I only started to refurb gear for others in 2016, and I was recommending this same gear for many years prior (feel free to browse all my 00s/10s posts at VH, digitalFAQ.com and elsewhere). So there goes your conspiracy theory, again. The gear we needed for quality transfer was falling into disrepair, and disappearing (trashed as broken). So I've done my best to revitalize the community, providing the quality gear we need. Most people are very appreciative of this.

eBay sellers are 99% just recyclers now in the 2020s, not owners/users of the gear. They have zero clue what a TBC is, or does, nor care whatsoever. They just want your $$$$, not to make sure you have a good capture experience. The descriptions of "tested" and "working" are complete nonsense. LED lights is not a test, which is what most of them do. The rest feed it digital sources (DVD players, etc), and/or ignore obvious flaws. When it comes to some items, eBay is gambling, not buying. If you want to piss away time and money, have at it. Lots of people have learned this lesson the hard way, especially stubborn ones.
[\QUOTE]

But ebay have a returns policy if the item does not work the buyer can test the TBC if it does not function correctly they can always return it. The seller has ti pay postage too, it would be wast8of time to cheat when the seller knows ebay will help the buyer.


[QUOTE=lordsmurf;278812]
No. BV models are all over the place, with some spewing noise, others corrupting the signals (ie, same issues as black AVT-8710, probably because of "shared" or more like reverse-engineered boards/chips), some other screwy issues/quirks.
[\QUOTE]

I've read the ones that are BV10 models work fine.
The CYP TBC spew noise too the green ones are known to have different chroma levels on different models, that's what you wrote in one of your posts, because you want people to buy the green ones from you at a very high price.

Correct. Most DataVideo TBC-1000 are entering a nasty phase like the AG-1980 did in the 2010s, where caps are now failing en masse. It really sucks to have to avoid this model now. I have literally not seen a good DataVideo TBC-1000 "in the wild" (which includes eBay; even the "tested" and "working" BS) for almost a year now. I've gotten to where I'm no longer interested in reburb'ing those myself (few exceptions), and have been referring to a trusted party instead. Even he's getting annoyed by the level of failure witnessed in the past year. The dip/jumper is a TBC-3000 issue, and there are at lest 5 generations of that model, each with their own quirks and issues that often need attention before using.[/QUOTE[

Its best not to buy one at all then and go with w cheaper solution at least you will waste lesd money

You may have been giving advice in the 90S but it was analogue era back then and having the internet was not a thing for most people, the internet generally kicked off in 1998 roundabout the time commercial dvds came out after dvds dvd recorders came out in 2004 2005 all the none technical people used DVD recorders to capture VHS.

You must be very young. Everything you wrote here is wrong, all dates way off.

nobody has a gripe about others selling its the price and playing with peoples emotions that I have a problem with

This is precisely why I pushed back against the marketing BS of "your tapes are fading! convert them now!" in the 2000s and 2010s. The "fading" in itself is 100% BS, color data is magnetic, and "fade" is optical.

somebody may need to capture a VHS of a dying family member who may only have months to live or to show other family members video of a person who is no longer alive and you not providing any useful solutions can be a problem because you are never happy with any solutions other than jumping in trying to promote the importance of a TBC, however if a tape is damaged and worn out and has lines across it no TBC in the world can fix such problems.

I would suggest that "need it done quick" (and quality) is a reason to buy quality gear, not be a cheap ass and screw around with junk that wastes your time.

Once done you can sell your stuff and recoup some of the money spent.

Or not.

Your statement is FUD BS.

@Bwaak I'm not buying anything, I have what I need already....

So what's your problem then? Just do it, post an example of your source and results instead of trolling with confusing questions. You will probably get specific help instead of endless discussions about anything you have picked up or heard of from somewhere, leading to nowhere

^ This.

[Cornucopia]

Dude! Learn how to use quotes properly! That stuff is incomprehensible.


Scott

[Alwyn]

Learn how to use quotes properly!

@VHSvideocapture, use a forward slash in the closing quote code, not a backslash.

[lordsmurf]

Dude! Learn how to use quotes properly! That stuff is incomprehensible.
Scott

He's incomprehensible.

Across all of his posts on the site, he wavers between being a deer-in-headlights newbie, to suddenly putting on his "big boy pants" and pretending to know all about capture cards and TBCs. Yet his lack of knowledge is evident to anybody that understands capturing.

This is the reality of the situation: he wants to be a cheapskate, not buy the tools needed for a quality capture job, the end. That's fine. He can be cheap, make crap that nobody wants to watch. Totally his choice, totally on him. Trying to mask it under the guise of "seeking alternative methods" doesn't fool anybody.

The problem is he's attempting to defend bad methods, as well as spreading misinformation.

Throwing shade about selling some refurb'd gear is just ignorance about the state of gear in the 2020s. If he wants to buy "used"/non-refurb'd gear from sketchy eBay sellers/recyclers, good luck with that. Odds are he won't know if the unit is properly working anyway, until it's way past the 30 day window he seems to adore -- that catches so many newbies, it's such a trap. People like this don't know what they don't know. There's a reason individuals and organizations come to me for my limited stash of gear, not buy from random nobodies on eBay.

[thecoalman]

I haven't posted here in over a decade....

Some suggest DV capture which is lossy it uses 4:2:0 chroma sub-sampling and reduces colour and overall quality and if one was going to work on the file reencoding the file would make it lose quality even more, have I understood this correctly?

When I was capturing I used DVC 110 and the simple reason for that is because it just worked. 1 minute capture or two hour capture, it just worked.

Setting aside the VHS to DV conversion issues DV is lossy but it's marginal. There is a post here somewhere buried but years ago as an experiment I exported some frames to .png directly from an originally recorded DV source. Repeated this with the same frames from the DV source played through my camera over RCA into the DVC 110 and the result for all intents and purposes was identical frames.

[lordsmurf]

I haven't posted here in over a decade....

Nice to see you again.

Still delivering coal?

[Alwyn]

Nice to see you again.

Not going to launch into another tirade about using ADVC-110s and use of RCA?

[lordsmurf]

Nice to see you again.

Not going to launch into another tirade about using ADVC-110s and use of RCA?

Are you okay?