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  1. Member
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    I say the source is interlace 29.970 because playback on my PC, I notice these lines across the screen as the individuals moved. Mediainfo also says the original VOB file is 29.970. I also want to deinterlace because I don't like seeing the lines on my ipad during playback.


    Do I need to change the encoding FPS from 29.970 to 59.94 by adding -r 60000/1001 to the beginning of the code when I deinterlace? If the source is 23.976 (fps=24/1001), should I add -r 50000/1001 to the beginning of the code when I deinterlace?


    After I encoded the vob file to an mp4 file, mediainfo shows the following:
    vob: 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
    mp4: 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS, constant framerate mode, progressive


    I thought I read somewhere where you're supposed to increase the FPS when deinterlacing to get "proper" progressive. Secondly, what about the -vf yadif part, should I have written it like -vf yadif(x2) or something?

    Just for the sake of completion, the code/.bat file worked. The video is deinterlaced, it plays back fine, but I'm not sure if I'm doing it correctly. Should I add in -r 60000/1001 and -vf yadif(x2)?



    Side Note: I followed the instructions in this video to create a .bat file. All I have to do is have copy this .bat file into the folder with videos that I want to convert, double click on the .bat file and it'll start the ffmpeg cmd conversion. Very simple.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=696ACV7gBG8&t=42s


    The following are .bat files where I double click on them and they batch encode all video files that I have in the folder. Makes things easier.

    if not exist convertedfiles md convertedfiles
    for %%a in ("*.vob") do ffmpeg -re -y -i "%%a" -c:v libx264 -preset veryslow -tune film -vf yadif -crf 22 -c:a ac3 -b:a 192k "convertedfiles\%%~na.mp4"
    pause


    ************************************************** *
    I didn't actually use this code with the 60000/1001, just wanted to know if this is the proper way to write..

    if not exist convertedfiles md convertedfiles
    for %%a in ("*.vob") do ffmpeg -r 60000/1001 -y -i "%%a" -c:v libx264 -preset veryslow -tune film -vf yadif -crf 22 -c:a ac3 -b:a 192k "convertedfiles\%%~na.mp4"
    pause

    ************************************************** *


    Will & Grace original DVD vob source

    Code:
    video
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
    Format                                   : MPEG Video
    Format version                           : Version 2
    Format profile                           : Main@Main
    Format settings                          : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
    Format settings, GOP                     : M=3, N=12
    Duration                                 : 83 ms
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Maximum bit rate                         : 9 000 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate                               : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
    Standard                                 : NTSC
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Time code of first frame                 : 00:59:59;00
    Time code source                         : Group of pictures header
    GOP, Open/Closed                         : Open
    GOP, Open/Closed of first frame          : Closed


    Same video file converted using the following code:

    if not exist convertedfiles md convertedfiles
    for %%a in ("*.vob") do ffmpeg -re -y -i "%%a" -c:v libx264 -preset veryslow -tune film -vf yadif -crf 22 -c:a ac3 -b:a 192k "convertedfiles\%%~na.mp4"
    pause


    Code:
    Video
    ID                                       : 1
    Format                                   : AVC
    Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
    Format profile                           : High@L4
    Format settings                          : CABAC / 16 Ref Frames
    Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
    Format settings, RefFrames               : 16 frames
    Codec ID                                 : avc1
    Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
    Duration                                 : 21 min 41 s
    Bit rate                                 : 891 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate mode                          : Constant
    Frame rate                               : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
    Standard                                 : NTSC
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Scan type                                : Progressive
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.086
    Stream size                              : 138 MiB (82%)
    Writing library                          : x264 core 148 r2638 7599210
    Encoding settings                        : cabac=1 / ref=16 / deblock=1:-1:-1 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=umh / subme=10 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.15 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=24 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=2 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-3 / threads=6 / lookahead_threads=1 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / bluray_compat=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=8 / b_pyramid=2 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=60 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=22.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=0 / qpmax=69 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
    Last edited by strawberryshortcake; 23rd Apr 2018 at 21:59.
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  2. If you have lines on playback, simply enable "deinterlacing" in your media player. No need to change the video itself.
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    Originally Posted by johnmeyer View Post
    If you have lines on playback, simply enable "deinterlacing" in your media player. No need to change the video itself.
    I understand I could do that with VLC, but I simply prefer to deinterlace so I don't have to worry about it. I'm keeping the original VOB, but encoding the video to a smaller size for playback on my 12.9 ipad which only has a maximum capacity of 512GB.
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  4. I think it's "-vf yadif=1" or "-vf yadif=mode=1" to get double frame rate.
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    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    I think it's "-vf yadif=1" or "-vf yadif=mode=1" to get double frame rate.

    Cool -vf yadif=1 worked, but do you (or anyone) happen to know if that's how to "properly" deinterlace videos with interlaced lines?

    Code:
    Video
    ID                                       : 1
    Format                                   : AVC
    Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
    Format profile                           : High@L4
    Format settings                          : CABAC / 16 Ref Frames
    Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
    Format settings, RefFrames               : 16 frames
    Codec ID                                 : avc1
    Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
    Duration                                 : 27 s 261 ms
    Bit rate                                 : 549 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate mode                          : Constant
    Frame rate                               : 59.940 (60000/1001) FPS
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Scan type                                : Progressive
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.026
    Stream size                              : 1.78 MiB (73%)
    Writing library                          : x264 core 148 r2638 7599210
    Quote Quote  
  6. Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post

    Cool -vf yadif=1 worked, but do you (or anyone) happen to know if that's how to "properly" deinterlace videos with interlaced lines?
    It depends on the specific video, or what's causing the "interlaced lines" in the first place


    If it was "Will & Grace original DVD vob source" as in your 1st post, you might need to IVTC instead of deinterlacing. I think it was actually a sitcom shot at film rates, not a "video" like a soap opera
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post

    Cool -vf yadif=1 worked, but do you (or anyone) happen to know if that's how to "properly" deinterlace videos with interlaced lines?
    It depends on the specific video, or what's causing the "interlaced lines" in the first place


    If it was "Will & Grace original DVD vob source" as in your 1st post, you might need to IVTC instead of deinterlacing. I think it was actually a sitcom shot at film rates, not a "video" like a soap opera
    Is there a way to determine what's causing the interlaced lines using mediainfo?

    Basically is there a flow chart of sort to determine what causes the interlace and from there use ___ such and such technique?

    IVTC? I guess I'll need to do some internet/forum search to see what that's all about. I thought all deinterlacing method were universal (i.e. just pick one and go with it -- that's kind of what i thought initially).

    I've got Seinfeld, Will and Grace, Frasier, Friends, Everybody Loves Raymond that I can recall off the top of my head that I would like to encode to smaller file size.



    Will and Grace
    Code:
    General
    Complete name                            : T:\Sitcom - Will & Grace DVD\Will & Grace S1 D1 Ep1 - The Pilot (a.k.a Love and Marriage).VOB
    Format                                   : MPEG-PS
    File size                                : 845 MiB
    Duration                                 : 561 ms
    Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
    Overall bit rate                         : 12.6 Gb/s
    
    Video
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
    Format                                   : MPEG Video
    Format version                           : Version 2
    Format profile                           : Main@Main
    Format settings                          : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
    Format settings, GOP                     : Variable
    Duration                                 : 83 ms
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Maximum bit rate                         : 9 000 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate                               : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
    Standard                                 : NTSC
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Time code of first frame                 : 00:59:59;00
    Time code source                         : Group of pictures header
    GOP, Open/Closed                         : Open
    GOP, Open/Closed of first frame          : Closed
    
    Audio
    ID                                       : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
    Format                                   : AC-3
    Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
    Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
    Duration                                 : 561 ms
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Bit rate                                 : 192 kb/s
    Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
    Channel positions                        : Front: L R
    Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate                               : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
    Bit depth                                : 16 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Stream size                              : 13.1 KiB (0%)
    Service kind                             : Complete Main
    
    Text
    ID                                       : 189 (0xBD)-32 (0x20)
    Format                                   : RLE
    Format/Info                              : Run-length encoding
    Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
    Delay relative to video                  : 4 s 4 ms
    
    Menu

    Frasier
    Code:
    eneral
    Complete name                            : J:\=== Frasier\Frasier VOB all combined\Frasier S04E01 - The Two Mrs. Cranes VTS_01_1.VOB
    Format                                   : MPEG-PS
    File size                                : 1.16 GiB
    Duration                                 : 22 min 45 s
    Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
    Overall bit rate                         : 7 326 kb/s
    
    Video
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
    Format                                   : MPEG Video
    Format version                           : Version 2
    Format profile                           : Main@Main
    Format settings                          : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
    Format settings, GOP                     : Variable
    Duration                                 : 22 min 45 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Bit rate                                 : 6 988 kb/s
    Maximum bit rate                         : 9 800 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Scan type                                : Progressive
    Scan order                               : 2:3 Pulldown
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.843
    Time code of first frame                 : 00:59:58;00
    Time code source                         : Group of pictures header
    Stream size                              : 1.11 GiB (95%)
    
    Audio
    ID                                       : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
    Format                                   : AC-3
    Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
    Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
    Duration                                 : 22 min 45 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Bit rate                                 : 192 kb/s
    Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
    Channel positions                        : Front: L R
    Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate                               : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
    Bit depth                                : 16 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Stream size                              : 31.3 MiB (3%)
    Service kind                             : Complete Main
    
    Text
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)-CC3
    Format                                   : EIA-608
    Muxing mode, more info                   : Muxed in Video #1
    Duration                                 : 22 min 45 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Stream size                              : 0.00 Byte (0%)
    CaptionServiceName                       : CC3
    
    Menu





    Seinfeld
    Code:
    General
    Complete name                            : T:\Sitcom - Seinfeld DVD\Seinfeld S1 D1 VTS_04_1.VOB
    Format                                   : MPEG-PS
    File size                                : 746 MiB
    Duration                                 : 23 min 1 s
    Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
    Overall bit rate                         : 4 528 kb/s
    
    Video
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
    Format                                   : MPEG Video
    Format version                           : Version 2
    Format profile                           : Main@Main
    Format settings                          : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
    Format settings, GOP                     : Variable
    Duration                                 : 23 min 1 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Bit rate                                 : 4 246 kb/s
    Maximum bit rate                         : 9 800 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate                               : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
    Standard                                 : NTSC
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.410
    Stream size                              : 699 MiB (94%)
    
    Audio
    ID                                       : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
    Format                                   : AC-3
    Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
    Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
    Duration                                 : 23 min 1 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Bit rate                                 : 192 kb/s
    Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
    Channel positions                        : Front: L R
    Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate                               : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
    Bit depth                                : 16 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Stream size                              : 31.6 MiB (4%)
    Service kind                             : Complete Main
    
    Text
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)-CC3
    Format                                   : EIA-608
    Muxing mode, more info                   : Muxed in Video #1
    Duration                                 : 23 min 1 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Stream size                              : 0.00 Byte (0%)
    CaptionServiceName                       : CC3
    
    Menu


    Friends
    Code:
    eneral
    Complete name                            : T:\Sitcom - Friends DVD\Friends S01 D1 Ep1VTS_01_1 - The Pilot.VOB
    Format                                   : MPEG-PS
    File size                                : 1.01 GiB
    Duration                                 : 29 min 39 s
    Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
    Overall bit rate                         : 4 867 kb/s
    
    Video
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
    Format                                   : MPEG Video
    Format version                           : Version 2
    Format profile                           : Main@Main
    Format settings                          : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
    Format settings, GOP                     : Variable
    Format settings, picture structure       : Frame
    Duration                                 : 29 min 39 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Bit rate                                 : 4 386 kb/s
    Maximum bit rate                         : 9 000 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
    Frame rate                               : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
    Standard                                 : NTSC
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Scan type                                : Interlaced
    Scan order                               : Top Field First
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.423
    Time code of first frame                 : 00:59:59;00
    Time code source                         : Group of pictures header
    GOP, Open/Closed                         : Open
    GOP, Open/Closed of first frame          : Closed
    Stream size                              : 930 MiB (90%)
    
    Audio
    ID                                       : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
    Format                                   : AC-3
    Format/Info                              : Audio Coding 3
    Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
    Duration                                 : 29 min 39 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Bit rate                                 : 384 kb/s
    Channel(s)                               : 5 channels
    Channel positions                        : Front: L C R, Side: L R
    Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate                               : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
    Bit depth                                : 16 bits
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Stream size                              : 81.4 MiB (8%)
    Service kind                             : Complete Main
    
    Text #1
    ID                                       : 189 (0xBD)-32 (0x20)
    Format                                   : RLE
    Format/Info                              : Run-length encoding
    Muxing mode                              : DVD-Video
    Duration                                 : 29 min 25 s
    Delay relative to video                  : 1 s 668 ms
    
    Text #2
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)-CC3
    Format                                   : EIA-608
    Muxing mode, more info                   : Muxed in Video #1
    Duration                                 : 29 min 39 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Constant
    Stream size                              : 0.00 Byte (0%)
    CaptionServiceName                       : CC3
    
    Menu
    Quote Quote  
  8. Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post

    Is there a way to determine what's causing the interlaced lines using mediainfo?
    Not reliably ; it just tells you metadata or how it was encoded or stored. It does not necessarily tell you anything accurate about the actual content

    Basically is there a flow chart of sort to determine what causes the interlace and from there use ___ such and such technique?

    IVTC? I guess, I'll need to do some internet/forum search to see what that's all about.

    I've got Seinfeld, Will and Grace, Frasier, Friends, Everybody Loves Raymond that I can recall off the top of my head that I would like to encode to smaller file size.

    Knowing what the source genre is will usually provide clues on what it will be most likely

    Basically dramas, films, theatrical series will be shot on film or film equivalents . They are actually progressive content. Only because of DVD standards or some types of broadcast, do they need to be stored and transmitted in an interlaced format . IVTC means inverse telecine . Basically you're reversing that process to recover the original progressive frames

    You don't want to deinterlace progressive material, because you degrade the picture unnecessarily. It becomes more blurry and you get deinterlacing artifacts


    Things like sports, soap operas, news, are often shot on video (or at least a higher sampling rate) , they have a higher chance of being interlaced if distributed on DVD
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  9. Member
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post

    Is there a way to determine what's causing the interlaced lines using mediainfo?
    Not reliably ; it just tells you metadata or how it was encoded or stored. It does not necessarily tell you anything accurate about the actual content

    Basically is there a flow chart of sort to determine what causes the interlace and from there use ___ such and such technique?

    IVTC? I guess, I'll need to do some internet/forum search to see what that's all about.

    I've got Seinfeld, Will and Grace, Frasier, Friends, Everybody Loves Raymond that I can recall off the top of my head that I would like to encode to smaller file size.

    Knowing what the source genre is will usually provide clues on what it will be most likely

    Basically dramas, films, theatrical series will be shot on film or film equivalents . They are actually progressive content. Only because of DVD standards or some types of broadcast, do they need to be stored and transmitted in an interlaced format . IVTC means inverse telecine . Basically you're reversing that process to recover the original progressive frames

    You don't want to deinterlace progressive material, because you degrade the picture unnecessarily. It becomes more blurry and you get deinterlacing artifacts


    Things like sports, soap operas, news, are often shot on video (or at least a higher sampling rate) , they have a higher chance of being interlaced if distributed on DVD
    Good to know. So do I not use yadif=1 for any of the above sitcom DVDs (frasier, friends, seinfeld, will & grace) because everyone of those episodes playback on VLC media player (using the VOB file) have "lines." I'm using the term "interlace" to describe them because that's all I know. Maybe that's not the correct term?

    So all of these I need to use the IVTC (inverse telecine) technique to remove these interlaced lines during playback. Looking back at those codes that I posted, the only one that said progressive was Frasier.

    Any example of an IVTC technique command line?
    Quote Quote  
  10. All those series will likely be progressive. Mediainfo is useless for this, because you can have progressive content encoded interlaced, or interlaced content encoded progressively. You can have pulldown cadences within interlaced or progressive encoding. All that matters is the actual content. So you have to examine the fields and use your eyes to determine what you actually have

    Unfortunately , ffmpeg is *still* very unreliable for IVTCing. Much of the code is ported from avisynth - so it should work in theory - but you can get messed up frames, sometimes dropped wrong frames, and sometimes duplicated frames in the wrong position. I revisit and recheck this every few months to see if it's fixed, but ffmpeg is way too unreliable for this. There is more than one way to IVTC in ffmpeg, but none of them work well. The errors are reproducible on many sources all the time. Consistently unreliable. Just Brutal. It is that bad, no joke. I'm a huge ffmpeg fan and use it almost everyday, but this is one area that is unusable

    I think the reliability with avisynth comes largely from the indexed source filter. People typically use DGIndex for mpeg2/dvd sources and it the most reliable method by far. It cannot be the field matching and decimation, because the exact code is ported from avisynth.
    Last edited by poisondeathray; 23rd Apr 2018 at 22:52.
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    All those series will likely be progressive. Mediainfo is useless for this, because you can have progressive content encoded interlaced, or interlaced content encoded progressively. You can have pulldown cadences within interlaced or progressive encoding. All that matters is the actual content. So you have to examine the fields and use your eyes to determine what you actually have

    Unfortunately , ffmpeg is *still* very unreliable for IVTCing. Much of the code is ported from avisynth - so it should work in theory - but you can get messed up frames, sometimes dropped wrong frames, and sometimes duplicated frames in the wrong position. I revisit and recheck this every few months to see if it's fixed, but ffmpeg is way too unreliable for this. There is more than one way to IVTC in ffmpeg, but none of them work well. The errors are reproducible on many sources all the time. Consistently unreliable. Just Brutal. It is that bad, no joke. I'm a huge ffmpeg fan and use it almost everyday, but this is one area that is unusable

    I think the reliability with avisynth comes largely from the indexed source filter. People typically use DGIndex for mpeg2/dvd sources and it the most reliable method by far. It cannot be the field matching and decimation, because the exact code is ported from avisynth.
    So am I suppose to use DGIndex to reencode the VOB files or which reliable program do I use to 'deinterlace' those lines? What about MeGUI?

    Using DGIndex, under frame type,

    Will and Grace flickers continuously between progressive and interlace
    Frasier keeps saying interlace


    Click image for larger version

Name:	WillandGraceAnalysis.jpg
Views:	179
Size:	517.6 KB
ID:	45333

    Click image for larger version

Name:	Frasieranalysis.jpg
Views:	142
Size:	274.3 KB
ID:	45334



    I also get this error message when I load the MeGUI converted Will and Grace file. Maybe the program only works on original source? How do I determine the source if it's a file that has already been encoded?
    Click image for larger version

Name:	MeGUI will and grace converted file.png
Views:	2617
Size:	31.2 KB
ID:	45335
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  12. You can check quickly to see if your exported 29.97 file was actually 23.976 "filmrate". You can open it up in vdub2 or avidemux and go frame by frame. If the rate was supposed to be 23.976, you will see every 5th frame is a duplicate . The playback will be jerky . You're also encoding 25% more frames for nothing (it's not 25% worse, temporal compression doesn't work like that , duplicate frames don't "cost" very much) .

    Frametype there just tells you how it's encoded. Again, it's not confirmation of what it actually is in terms of content. But in that 2nd Will and Grace screenshot, if it's >99% film and progressive, you can probably "force film" . All this stuff is covered in other posts, there should be some guides as well

    Sometimes you can have bizzare things, mixed content. IIRC Some seasons of Frazier were very tricky with aliasing


    Yes you can use Megui ; it also has an "auto analysis" but it's not always correct either.
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  13. Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post

    I also get this error message when I load the MeGUI converted Will and Grace file. Maybe the program only works on original source? How do I determine the source if it's a file that has already been encoded?
    Image
    [Attachment 45335 - Click to enlarge]
    I haven't used megui in a few years but not sure, never seen that before. Maybe it wasn't decrypted properly ?

    You can use megui on anything, but it uses avisynth in between, so you need a script. It should create a script for you if you use it correctly

    megui is not the easiest to use, but there should be step by step guides out there
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    You can check quickly to see if your exported 29.97 file was actually 23.976 "filmrate". You can open it up in vdub2 or avidemux and go frame by frame. If the rate was supposed to be 23.976, you will see every 5th frame is a duplicate . The playback will be jerky . You're also encoding 25% more frames for nothing (it's not 25% worse, temporal compression doesn't work like that , duplicate frames don't "cost" very much) .

    Frametype there just tells you how it's encoded. Again, it's not confirmation of what it actually is in terms of content. But in that 2nd Will and Grace screenshot, if it's >99% film and progressive, you can probably "force film" . All this stuff is covered in other posts, there should be some guides as well

    Sometimes you can have bizzare things, mixed content. IIRC Some seasons of Frazier were very tricky with aliasing


    Yes you can use Megui ; it also has an "auto analysis" but it's not always correct either.

    I did a quick frame by frame test in Avidemux (already had this) as you suggest for Seinfeld, Fraiser, Friends, and Will and Grace. There are no duplicate frames at all.

    I'll be running around the internet to read about IVTC, but in the meantime, what program do you use to IVTC?
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  15. Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post


    I did a quick frame by frame test in Avidemux (already had this) as you suggest for Seinfeld, Fraiser, Friends, and Will and Grace. There are no duplicate frames at all.
    On the exported deinterlaced file at 29.97 ? Yes , with all the info here, there should be a duplicate every 5th frame at 29.97.

    That 99.34% film and "progressive" encoding screenshot of W&G is the 1 case where you can be reasonably sure automatically, because it's soft pulldown. This means it's encoded progressive, and "flags" signal repeat fields to output 29.97 interlaced. But it's actually progressive content, and progressive encoding.

    The other ones that say "interlaced" are likely progressive content, but interlaced encoding - that's known as "hard telecine" because the actual field repeats are hard coded or actually encoded

    I'll be running around the internet to read about IVTC, but in the meantime, what program do you use to IVTC?
    I use avisynth. For mpeg2 sources , like DVD, dgindex.
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  16. Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post
    I did a quick frame by frame test in Avidemux (already had this) as you suggest for Seinfeld, Fraiser, Friends, and Will and Grace. There are no duplicate frames at all.
    Just post samples of them, 10 seconds with steady motion taken from the body of the episodes (not intros), perhaps M2Vs demuxed using DGIndex. You don't know how to interpret what you're seeing. Rather than pdr trying to explain it to you, and you getting it wrong, untouched samples will be much more valuable.

    To IVTC DVD video, you use AviSynth and one of its IVTC filters.
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post


    I did a quick frame by frame test in Avidemux (already had this) as you suggest for Seinfeld, Fraiser, Friends, and Will and Grace. There are no duplicate frames at all.
    On the exported deinterlaced file at 29.97 ? Yes , with all the info here, there should be a duplicate every 5th frame at 29.97.

    That 99.34% film and "progressive" encoding screenshot of W&G is the 1 case where you can be reasonably sure automatically, because it's soft pulldown. This means it's encoded progressive, and "flags" signal repeat fields to output 29.97 interlaced. But it's actually progressive content, and progressive encoding.

    The other ones that say "interlaced" are likely progressive content, but interlaced encoding - that's known as "hard telecine" because the actual field repeats are hard coded or actually encoded

    I'll be running around the internet to read about IVTC, but in the meantime, what program do you use to IVTC?
    I use avisynth. For mpeg2 sources , like DVD, dgindex.

    Maybe I'm not doing the test correct, but I simply loaded each video VOB file into Avidemux, use the right arrow on the keyboard (or the blue arrow, next frame). I tried it at zero, then went to 29 seconds, etc.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nHXIPw6VU4&feature=youtu.be


    Am I suppose to be looking/using those .... just using the right next frame arrow for many frames in a row and nothing is duplicated.

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    Originally Posted by manono View Post
    Originally Posted by strawberryshortcake View Post
    I did a quick frame by frame test in Avidemux (already had this) as you suggest for Seinfeld, Fraiser, Friends, and Will and Grace. There are no duplicate frames at all.
    Just post samples of them, 10 seconds with steady motion taken from the body of the episodes (not intros), perhaps M2Vs demuxed using DGIndex. You don't know how to interpret what you're seeing. Rather than pdr trying to explain it to you, and you getting it wrong, untouched samples will be much more valuable.

    To IVTC DVD video, you use AviSynth and one of its IVTC filters.

    Okay, I'll see if I can cut a few segments... give me a few ...
    Last edited by strawberryshortcake; 24th Apr 2018 at 00:03.
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    Use DGindex. [ and ] to select
    File/save project and demux video
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  20. And upload the m2v file, not the d2v file.
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    Originally Posted by davexnet View Post
    Use DGindex. [ and ] to select
    File/save project and demux video

    Went with ffmpeg to cut instead, but also tested out your method and that's pretty cool tool.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4iZEz3GURA&feature=youtu.be
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    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    And upload the m2v file, not the d2v file.
    Let me redo it again.
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    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    And upload the m2v file, not the d2v file.

    Don't know if I'm doing it right. When I let it run it's course it was recording about 16 minutes worth of frasier.

    Here, I simply tried stopping it process early (not even sure how to do it properly). 2minutes .m2v
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmMEuRoH61Y&feature=youtu.be
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  24. Geez, it says you're in the US so I can only assume English is your first language. Did anyone say anything at all about YouTube? Please upload the M2V you got from DGIndex here. To this site. There's an upload button. And 10-15 well chosen seconds will be plenty. Two minutes is neither wanted nor needed.

    Move the DGIndex slider to an appropriate start place and hit '['. Move the slider further along and hit ']'. Go File->Save Project File and Demux Video. Upload the resulting M2V file here.

    Edit: The Fraser YouTube video has duplicate frames every 5th frame. From that we know it was shot on film. What we can't learn is if it's soft or hard telecine. Which it is determines how it's to be treated. Hard telecine has the 3:2 pulldown encoded into the video and is encoded as interlaced 29.97fps. Soft telecine has the 3:2 pulldown added as flags telling the DVD player how to display the fields and is encoded as progressive 23.976fps. There's a big difference there and a YouTube version is worse than useless in telling which it is.
    Last edited by manono; 24th Apr 2018 at 02:20.
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    Originally Posted by manono View Post
    Geez, it says you're in the US so I can only assume English is your first language. Did anyone say anything at all about YouTube? Please upload the M2V you got from DGIndex here. To this site. There's an upload button. And 10-15 well chosen seconds will be plenty. Two minutes is neither wanted nor needed.

    Move the DGIndex slider to an appropriate start place and hit '['. Move the slider further along and hit ']'. Go File->Save Project File and Demux Video. Upload the resulting M2V file here.
    Apologies. Yes, United States. I was looking for some type of attachment and notice the "insert video" icon asking for website link, thus youtube initially.

    Fixed uploading with a 17 second clip, at about 3:30 mark into the first episode of Frasier.
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    A couple more, probably not necessary, but Frasier supposedly is "different" from what I may have read.
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  27. Okay, now we're getting somewhere. Thank you. The first one - Frasier S01E01 NEXTTEST.demuxed.m2v - is hard telecine and just needs an easy IVTC:

    TFM().TDecimate()

    That's from TIVTC. I couldn't tell you if you can IVTC in ffmpeg as I don't (and won't) use it. If you're serious about your video encoding hobby, in my opinion it's in your best interests to learn your way around AviSynth.

    I noticed from the YouTube one that the intro is real 29.97fps. I don't know if it's pure interlace or progressive (probably the former). In any event, the part where the buildings are drawn will be slightly jerky. It's very short and, in my opinion, doesn't matter. I would make my D2V file in DGIndex using 'Honor Pulldown Flags' and then IVTC it in an AviSynth script. Maybe others have other suggestions. If the goal is to make another DVD, then there's other solutions that can keep the 29.97fps parts as 29.97 and the 23.976fps parts as 23.976.

    Now to check the others...
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  28. Will And Grace was shot on film and isn't hard telecined. However, it was edited as video and that presents problems. I'd make the D2V using 'Honor Pulldown Flags' and make the script like this:

    TFM(D2V="Will & Grace S1 D1 Ep2 - A New Lease on Life NEXTEST.demuxed.d2v").TDecimate

    That allows TIVTC to treat the soft telecined parts as film (no IVTC needed) and just IVTC's the video portions. It's not a bad way to handle everything as, unless the bottom of the D2V file shows as 100% FILM, and you can Forced Film it in DGIndex and get an immediate progressive 23.976fps video file with no need of an IVTC, you might be better off doing it this way. The D2V setting is thoroughly explained in the docs included with TIVTC.

    Seinfeld was shot on film and hard telecined, like Frazier. It needs a full IVTC to return the original progressive 23.976fps frames.

    Friends, same thing, hard telecine.

    Note that none of these get deinterlaced (except for some orphaned fields and any intros that might be pure interlaced 29.97fps). The fields are reassembled into their frames and the duplicate frames are removed. As pdr mentioned earlier, you do not want to blindly deinterlace when it's not necessary. However good the deinterlacer is, it's still not as good as getting back the original progressive frames.
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    Originally Posted by manono View Post
    Will And Grace was shot on film and isn't hard telecined. However, it was edited as video and that presents problems. I'd make the D2V using 'Honor Pulldown Flags' and make the script like this:

    TFM(D2V="Will & Grace S1 D1 Ep2 - A New Lease on Life NEXTEST.demuxed.d2v").TDecimate

    That allows TIVTC to treat the soft telecined parts as film (no IVTC needed) and just IVTC's the video portions. It's not a bad way to handle everything as, unless the bottom of the D2V file shows as 100% FILM, and you can Forced Film it in DGIndex and get an immediate progressive 23.976fps video file with no need of an IVTC, you might be better off doing it this way. The D2V setting is thoroughly explained in the docs included with TIVTC.

    Seinfeld was shot on film and hard telecined, like Frazier. It needs a full IVTC to return the original progressive 23.976fps frames.

    Friends, same thing, hard telecine.

    Note that none of these get deinterlaced (except for some orphaned fields and any intros that might be pure interlaced 29.97fps). The fields are reassembled into their frames and the duplicate frames are removed. As pdr mentioned earlier, you do not want to blindly deinterlace when it's not necessary. However good the deinterlacer is, it's still not as good as getting back the original progressive frames.


    Good thing I posted otherwise I would have gone down the wrong path, which I've already done by encoding episodes of Seinfeld, Will and Grace and Frasier using yadif. Time to start over and use Avisynth.

    I tried to install it but coming up with an error message. I simply aborted the installation process.

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    The following Windows System folder has AviSynth.dll present. How I came upon this was googling the error message
    windows\system32\avisynth.dll forum issues

    xtrill user of videohelp mentioned deleting the AviSynth.dll file. Instead of deleting I simply moved it to the desktop. I didn't want to mess anything up. But the installation process still prompted the error message.
    https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/328805-Unable-to-install-avisynth-Error-opening-file-for-writing

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    I can open avsPmod, does that mean I already have avisynth installed? Youtube tutorial is few and far between for beginners when it comes to Avisynth.
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    I've got to go to bed soon/ like now. But I'll be back.



    EDIT: I also downloaded the TIVTC file all the way at the bottom. Unzipped but not really sure what to do. Basically trying to figure out how to even start using avisynth. Is it a program like handbrake, megui, or ffmpeg typing command lines.

    This: http://avisynth.nl/index.php/TIVTC
    Last edited by strawberryshortcake; 24th Apr 2018 at 04:20.
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  30. If your avisynth is installed correctly, just extract tivtc.dll to "C:\Program Files (x86)\AviSynth\plugins".

    To answer your question, Avisynth is a frameserver program that is controlled by scripting. Think of it like program that's doing something in the background and you feed output of that to some other program for encoding. It doesn't have its own GUI but you can use avsPmod that you mentioned as an editor and to preview the avs output. On the first page of the official site, there's section that explains the basics, it's not that hard.

    And don't mind if someone is a little impatient with you, guys like manono, poisondeathray, jagabo are very knowledgeable users that helped many people for many years and they probably answered this particular topic ("how to deinterlace DVD") probably hundreds if not thousands of times so it's a little tiresome for them to repeat common knowledge for the nth time. Everything is already answered here about DVD and IVTC many many times.
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