Wits end with DV to 'anything' conversion

[video_noob]

I've tried avi2dvd, handbrake, and now virtualdub with zero success. Virtualdub seemed to get me the furthest; I followed the guide at https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/187587-How-to-convert-DV-to-DivX-or-XviD-using-Virtualdub and it actually completed and produced an 8GB avi file that played on the computer but not on the WD TV (maybe this thing is just a PoS?).

I set it to convert to Xvid avi, which is a supported format according to the box, but it still didn't recognize the format.

[jagabo]

You're doing something wrong. The WDTV plays almost everything. It has no problems with Divx/Xvid AVI files.

[yoda313]

Have you tried the supplied software that comes with the wdtv? It can convert to its supported formats.

Also as jagabo suggested try divx or xvid with another converter like super or format factory - anything that can take dv as an input.

[video_noob]

You're doing something wrong. The WDTV plays almost everything. It has no problems with Divx/Xvid AVI files.

Highly possible, but the only CD that came with this WD TV does not have any conversion software. It has discovery, demo media, and user doc's. Nothing else.

I followed that guide fairly close only changing the version of smart de-interlacer and using target quantizer for max quality rather than bit rate.

Anyone who has a WD TV that they've converted DV video's to play please please please let me know what you used and how you did it.

Thanks.

[video_noob]

Have you tried the supplied software that comes with the wdtv? It can convert to its supported formats.

Also as jagabo suggested try divx or xvid with another converter like super or format factory - anything that can take dv as an input.

I'm downloading Super right now. I've now got about 7 different front ends installed along with another 5 codec's. I'm starting to get confused as to what I need but my intention is to get one, single working conversion with details written down and then leave it alone.

Thanks.

[yoda313]

Good luck.

But don't forget to try the arcsoft mediaconverter software that came with your wdtv. Give that a try too.

[video_noob]

Good luck.

But don't forget to try the arcsoft mediaconverter software that came with your wdtv. Give that a try too.

Where would that be? Let me rephrase: I don't think there's anything like that in my purchase. There is one CD only, no converter program(s) on it. That's it. Is it on the WD TV somewhere? I've been through all the setups and menus and not seen anything that looked like a converter.

Thanks.

[guns1inger]

Xvid4PSP - convert to AVC/H.264 in an mkv or mp4 container. If necessary, use the PS3 preset for MP4 and the wdtv will play it.

[aedipuss]

have you tried xmedia recode? it has presets for w.d.tv.

[jagabo]

One word of warning: DV is likely to be interlaced. Be sure to encode interlaced so you get proper playback on the WDTV.

[edDV]

If you aren't editing I'd recommend Handbreak for DV (plus most other formats*) to h.264 (MP4 or MKV container). I batch encode multiple files overnight .

It has filter options for deinterlace, decomb, denoise, deblock and inverse telecine.
https://trac.handbrake.fr/wiki/HandBrakeGuide


* including HDV, m2t SD/HD tuner captures, MCE dvr-ms but not wtv.

[video_noob]

Xvid4PSP - convert to AVC/H.264 in an mkv or mp4 container. If necessary, use the PS3 preset for MP4 and the wdtv will play it.

I have it installed but had not tried it yet. I'm going to try the xmedia wdtv preset thingy first.

Thanks.

[edDV]

Here is a quick Handbreak Guide for DV to h.264 in an MKV wrapper playable on the WDTV.

1. Under 'Source' button, select your DV file.
2. Under 'Container', select 'MKV'
3a. For 24p film telecine source, select 'Video Filter', 'Detelecine', 'Default'
3b. For all other formats including camcorder DV, select 'Video Filter', 'Decomb'*, 'Default'
4. Select 'start'

This will encode more quickly on your P4 2.8GHz than a full deinterlace and look very good for typical TV playback.

Alternative 1: For highest quality, encode interlace MPeg2 at >8000 KHz ave bit rate.
Alternative 2: For faster encoding, but larger file, encode xvid.


* decomb description from Handbreak Guide.

HandBrake now offers a new filter, called Decomb, that can be used instead of Deinterlace. It uses yadif in "Slower" mode, but only selectively.

Deinterlacing is a blunt weapon, and it should only be applied when it's absolutely necessary. It can also be tedious to discover whether or not a source is interlaced. And even when it is, interlacing is only visually apparent through combing artifacts. Those tell-tale horizontal lines only appear when things are in motion. But regular deinterlacing is applied to every frame without fail. This slows it down.

Decomb only deinterlaces frames that are visibly interlaced. This saves time, and makes it safe, usually, to leave it on all the time. It won't destroy the detail in progressive sources the way Deinterlace will, and should be faster than "Slow" or "Slower".

[video_noob]

I followed the failsafe 4 steps you listed and hot damn! Something finally worked!

Then to my absolute amazement the 8GB avi that was the result of a previous conversion, which I stated didn't work (because I hooked it up to the WD TV and it said it was an unrecognized format) worked today as well.

So a new question. In my layman's video mind it would seem to me that a 1.9GB mkv file has to be lower quality than an 8.6GB avi(xvid) file, does it not? Or is dv (circa 2000 using digital8 tape) so low quality that there's not much difference?

Thanks again for all the help, seeing that video play after all this grief made my day!

[edDV]

I followed the failsafe 4 steps you listed and hot damn! Something finally worked!

Then to my absolute amazement the 8GB avi that was the result of a previous conversion, which I stated didn't work (because I hooked it up to the WD TV and it said it was an unrecognized format) worked today as well.

So a new question. In my layman's video mind it would seem to me that a 1.9GB mkv file has to be lower quality than an 8.6GB avi(xvid) file, does it not? Or is dv (circa 2000 using digital8 tape) so low quality that there's not much difference?

Thanks again for all the help, seeing that video play after all this grief made my day!

It's all about compression (video and audio) which is lossy but designed for one way shrinkage for display.

DV format is designed for editing and has low compression for low loss through several generations of editing. Each frame is individually recorded. Each video frame is only 5x DCT compressed. Audio is uncompressed PCM. Tradeoff is file size ~13GB/hr. Still DV makes the best archive format because it has the highest quality.

DVD MPeg2 compresses both in frame like DV but also across 15 frame GOPs where one full I frame is recorded + change info only for the other 14. This allows DVD MPeg2 to compress about 12x to 25x. Interlace can be retained so it is possible to have no deinterlace losses. Audio is usually compressed to mp2 or AC3. The penalty is a lossy recode if MPeg 2 is further edited because the 14 missing frames need to be reconstructed.

Xvid and h.264 are the next generation of MPeg compression codecs They add additional I frame compression and more efficient GOP compression. Currently these formats don't have a great deal of compression advantage for interlace video. They are most efficient for progressive frames. Deinterlace to progressive adds loss to the process. H.264 can achieve about double the compression of MPeg2 from progressive source (i.e. 24x-50x) with an acceptable picture. Playback decode needs a beefy CPU or a hardware decoder (e.g. display card, player or TV).

[guns1inger]

Source can also have a big influence. A noisy, hand held DV/Digital 8 clip is not going to compress as nicely or as well as a clean, high quality source, such as a well lit, tripod mounted HD video.

[video_noob]

Here is a quick Handbreak Guide for DV to h.264 in an MKV wrapper playable on the WDTV.

1. Under 'Source' button, select your DV file.
2. Under 'Container', select 'MKV'
3a. For 24p film telecine source, select 'Video Filter', 'Detelecine', 'Default'
3b. For all other formats including camcorder DV, select 'Video Filter', 'Decomb'*, 'Default'
4. Select 'start'

This will encode more quickly on your P4 2.8GHz than a full deinterlace and look very good for typical TV playback.

Alternative 1: For highest quality, encode interlace MPeg2 at >8000 KHz ave bit rate.
Alternative 2: For faster encoding, but larger file, encode xvid.


* decomb description from Handbreak Guide.

I'm interested in alternative 1 but don't see an Mpe2 option on my install of Handbrake. I have MP4 as an option under 'container' but that's the only other one besides mkv.
In the video tab on the codec dropdown it's MPTEG-4, h.264 (x264), and VP3 (Theora). Either I'm missing a codec load or you're suggesting a different program.

MPeg-2 is DVD format correct?

Thanks.

[video_noob]

And if I could type it would be a miracle.....

MPeg-2
MPEG-4

[guns1inger]

Mpeg-2 is the compression used by the DVD format, but it has wider application than that.

I believe that recent versions of Handbrake now only output to mp4/mkv containers.

[aedipuss]

if you want mpeg-2 output along with mpeg-4 you will need to use a different program. mediacoder is one that might work, but's not very newbie friendly.

[video_noob]

OK, sticking with mkv and Handbrake since 1) I now know how to make it work (thanks ed) and 2) I'm a total noob and not inclined to become a videophile any time soon.

Thank you all for your help and insight. My goal was simply to capture my dv's and get them to play on my wd tv. Mission accomplished!

[edDV]

Here is a quick Handbreak Guide for DV to h.264 in an MKV wrapper playable on the WDTV.

1. Under 'Source' button, select your DV file.
2. Under 'Container', select 'MKV'
3a. For 24p film telecine source, select 'Video Filter', 'Detelecine', 'Default'
3b. For all other formats including camcorder DV, select 'Video Filter', 'Decomb'*, 'Default'
4. Select 'start'

This will encode more quickly on your P4 2.8GHz than a full deinterlace and look very good for typical TV playback.

Alternative 1: For highest quality, encode interlace MPeg2 at >8000 KHz ave bit rate.
Alternative 2: For faster encoding, but larger file, encode xvid.


* decomb description from Handbreak Guide.

I'm interested in alternative 1 but don't see an Mpe2 option on my install of Handbrake. I have MP4 as an option under 'container' but that's the only other one besides mkv.
In the video tab on the codec dropdown it's MPTEG-4, h.264 (x264), and VP3 (Theora). Either I'm missing a codec load or you're suggesting a different program.

MPeg-2 is DVD format correct?

Thanks.

I would recommend interlace MPeg2 720x480i or 720x576i for better quality from DV. Again at sufficient bit rate >8000 Kb/s. These will play fine on the WDTV.

There are many MPeg2 encoders or editor/encoders. The free ones require a learning curve.

Typical consumer video suites are.

Sony Vegas Movie Studio (Platinum version for HD)
Corel Video Studio
Adobe Premiere Elements

I also recommend keeping important tapes archived as DV-AVI. Hard drives are cheap.

[video_noob]

I'm actually planning to keep *all* dv imports in native format; as you said hard drives are cheap. Not only that but I figure somewhere down the line there will be software that's more tuned to my skills that will convert dv to playable format with little to no loss. No time for learning curve but thank you for the information. You've been immensely helpful already.

Thanks, and happy video'ing.

[edDV]

Good plan. Deinterlacers and encoders get better with each new generation.

Someday there will be a Holodeck encoder with DV import.

http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&safe=off&q=star+trek+holodeck&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=...iw=947&bih=756