Encode to Transport Stream (.TP)

[HansBeekman]

Hello to you all,

I see a lot of q&A on how to convert from a Transport Stream to an avi or mpeg. But I want to do the reverse thing.

I posted this question to the Matrox forum as I own a Matrox RT.X2 for HD editing but this must be something folks there don't do that often. Here is my question:

The matrox RT.X2 can do export to MPEG II in 1920x1080. So we have a nice looking Mpeg file. Half the electronic world is using the HD demonstrator boxes (Like Tarkan) but we editors can't make the file to use on these machines.

How on earth can you (encode) convert such a file with (or otherwise without) use of the Matrox card and without any loss of quality???

Does anybody know?

Regards for reply

greetings,
Hans Beekman
Educo MultiMedia

[Soopafresh]

https://forum.videohelp.com/topic324969.html

You can also use VideoRedoPlus ($60) and save the .mpg file as a .TS . This works VERY well and I've tested it on Mpeg2 Playback hardware. Here's the really nice part - the ability to choose audio and video PIDs, which allows your file to be more compatible with different kinds of Mpeg2 playback hardware.



The procedure would be:

1) Encode to MPEG2 with your favorite Mpeg2 encoder or your Matrox card

2) Open the MPEG2 file you created above. Use VideoRedo, and save as a .TS Transport Stream file

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh,

Thanx for your help. Nice to have such quick response.

I just made the mpgeg-II file for testing and will install the tools.

I ket you know how things went.

By the way, it's a good looking Forum. A bit very technical to me but perhaps i can help someone from my editing experience. I will watch the forum.

Greetings,
Hans

[Soopafresh]

Let me know if you have problems or questions about the procedure. After you do it a few times, it will be very easy

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh

Yes one question: can you just rename the .ts file to .tp file?

I'm very new to this, I know.

Like to here.

greetings,
Hans

[Soopafresh]

Yes, .TS and .TP are the same.

[HansBeekman]

Hi There,

First made a testfile from the matrox card and put it out as mpeg2

File looks great in full HD

Then I run the MpegII file trough videoredoplus to a .ts file. Then ran it trough mpe2repair. No problems so far. But the file has a lot of jitter and will not load in the HD demonstrator box.

So I made a new file at a higher bitrate (20 Mb/sec). As I saw i could also export to TS, wow let's do that. But it exported it as m2t file. Searched this forum and wikepedia and stil can't make up the difference between these to. Yes, when i rename the m2t it wil show in PowerDVD but still not sure if this is the way to do things.

Any thoughts?

Like to here them.

with greetings,
Hans

[Soopafresh]

The HD demonstrator box - can you tell me what kind of hardware is doing the decoding ? Give me a link to a website or documentation.



Try a few of these test .TS files. Just give them a .TP extension.

http://www.w6rz.net/parkrun1920_23mbps.ts

More on this page: http://www.w6rz.net/


Also these (right-click to save):

http://media.dvinfo.net/canonxh/24fhndyband.m2t
http://media.dvinfo.net/canonxh/60itrpdkismldrppans.m2t

I tested both of these with hardware mpeg2 TS decoding.


.M2T, .TP, .TS = All the same


Also, make these settings the same/slightly more bit rate as your encoded MPEG2.

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh,

Thanx for your research.

The High Definition Demonstrator =

HD Stream Generator
Tarakan / HVP-2040
Digital Inc.
http://www.dzonei.com/html/old_product.htm

Further

I downloaded the demo parkrun1920_23mbps.tp
I uploaded it to the demonstrator box
It does work.

The company I'm producing for is a consumer electronics firm (Philips Netherlands) and the send me a demo file like the one's already on the machine. That one will load to and looks fine.
What i found out by comparing the to file's is that the one's loading are Progressive: Prog or Int and my own creation is Progressive: Progressive Only
Can that be the difference?

Here are the file information’s

My file

File Name: I:\shared\test02.tp
File Size: 384154876 ( 0.36 GB )
Program Duration: 00:03:14.05
File Type: TS Stream
Encoding: MPEG 2
Video stream Id: 4096 (x1000)
Encoding Dimensions: 1920 x 1080
Display Size: 1920 x 1080
Aspect Ratio: 16/9
Frame Rate: 25.00 FPS
Bit Rate: 18.500 Mbps
VBV_Buffer: 976 KB
Profile: Main/High
Progressive: Progressive Only
Chroma: 4:2:0
Audio Format: Layer 2
Audio Stream Id: 4097 (x1001)
Audio Bit Rate: 384 Kbps
Audio Sampling Rate: 48000 Hz

The file from Philips (does load)

File Name: I:\shared\Extreme Sports.tp
File Size: 648609212 ( 0.60 GB )
Program Duration: 00:03:47.03
File Type: TS Stream
Encoding: MPEG 2
Video stream Id: 17 (x11)
Encoding Dimensions: 1920 x 1080
Display Size: 1920 x 1080
Aspect Ratio: 16/9
Frame Rate: 25.00 FPS
Bit Rate: 22.000 Mbps
VBV_Buffer: 768 KB
Profile: Main/High
Progressive: Prog or Int
Chroma: 4:2:0
Audio Format: 2.0
Audio Stream Id: AC3: 20 (x14)
Audio Bit Rate: 224 Kbps
Audio Sampling Rate: 48000 Hz

The Internet Demofile (does load)

File Name: I:\shared\parkrun1920_23mbps.tp
File Size: 189929256 ( 0.18 GB )
Program Duration: 00:01:00.08
File Type: TS Stream
Encoding: MPEG 2
Video stream Id: 49 (x31)
Encoding Dimensions: 1920 x 1080
Display Size: 1920 x 1080
Aspect Ratio: 16/9
Frame Rate: 29.97 FPS
Bit Rate: 22.496 Mbps
VBV_Buffer: 1194 KB
Profile: Main/High
Progressive: Prog or Int
Chroma: 4:2:0
Audio Format: 2.0
Audio Stream Id: AC3: 50 (x32)
Audio Bit Rate: 384 Kbps
Audio Sampling Rate: 48000 Hz


I must be honest to you; the footage is originally shot on HDV and exported to HD

Perhaps that's the issue for the flickering (jitter) but that can't be the issue for not loading the .tp; or does it?

Stay's: how to export from the Matrox RT.X2, to .m2t? , do I need to run the .m2t through VideoReDo Plus ? and why is the file not eaten by the demonstrator box?

I feel like I have to do some more research for myself but if you have any idea's I would like to here them.

With regards,
Hans Beekman

[Soopafresh]

Hi Hans -

There are a few things about your file - the PIDs are a little bit different.

Doesn't work:

Video stream Id: 4096 (x1000)
Audio Stream Id: 4097 (x1001)

Bit Rate: 18.500 Mbps

Works:

Video stream Id: 17 (x11)
Audio Stream Id: AC3: 20 (x14)

Bit Rate: 22.000 Mbps
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Set VideoRedo like this:





It looks like the player will accept up to 40Mbps encoded Mpeg2 Transport Streams, so you can make them very high quality.

Unfortunately, the user manual that you can download doesn't specify the exact file settings that the player wants from the source TP file, so it might require a little bit more experimentation.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If that doesn't work, I'm going to ask you to upload 10-15 seconds of your Mpeg2 file so I can try to convert it to TP. But first, let's see if the settings in VideoRedo fix it

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh,

Very good, I will try this right away. But...

as I said I have knowledge of editing video, but obvious no knowledge of MPEG especialy transport streams. So I would like to know what on earth are PIDS? I found out that it is a sort of identifier for streams. But why do they have to be different for video ans audio, what do they do and why is the impact so great when they are not on the bit correct?
Why 17 and 20 ???
Do you want to explain something about that

What i can do is send a email to the company of the demonstrator box and ask for the specs.

Like to hear again from you.

greetings, Hans

[HansBeekman]

Hi Zoopafresh,

These are the specs after conversion.

I will burn the disc and try things out.

be back later

----------------------------------------------------------------
File Name: I:\shared\pids.ts
File Size: 224741028 ( 0.21 GB )
Program Duration: 00:01:53.18
File Type: TS Stream
Encoding: MPEG 2
Video stream Id: 17 (x11)
Encoding Dimensions: 1920 x 1080
Display Size: 1920 x 1080
Aspect Ratio: 16/9
Frame Rate: 25.00 FPS
Bit Rate: 18.500 Mbps
VBV_Buffer: 976 KB
Profile: Main/High
Progressive: Progressive Only
Chroma: 4:2:0
Audio Format: Layer 2
Audio Stream Id: 20 (x14)
Audio Bit Rate: 384 Kbps
Audio Sampling Rate: 48000 Hz
----------------------------------------------------------------

greetings,
Hans

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh,

Yes, yes that's working. So the PIDS did the trick. Well seen. Now I know I can deliver the project, great. What a relieve and many thanks.

But there's always something to complain about, isn't it?

One thing though, the quality is a bit disapointing because of the jitter.
Perhaps any ideas on this field?

greetings,
Hans

[Soopafresh]

Dear Hans:

PIDs are usually Video and Audio pairs found inside of a TP file. They are like mini TV channels inside of a file. Look at the examples on this page:

http://www.dododge.net/roku/ts-samples.html

For example - a single TP at 32Mb bitrate file, but contains 3 different programs

PIDs 21 and 24 = HD at 20Mb
PIDs 31 and 34 = SD at 6Mb
PIDs 41 and 44 = Another channel at 6Mb

Certain Mpeg2 hardware playback devices require their HD Streams to use specific PID channels.
For example, Mediasonic provides very specific information of how the TP file for their player should be configured :

http://www.mediasonic.com/el_support/el_support_encoding_req.html

-MPEG2 files must be encoded as a Transport Stream.
-Elementary Video stream must be Main Profile High Level MP@HL 4:2:0.
-Elementary Audio Stream is optional and must be AC3 encoded at 384kbps.
-Source audio before AC encoding is 16 bit at 48 kHz sample rate.
-Constant Bitrate CBR
-Transport stream packet size is 188bytes.
-Stream must start with an I frame and finish on a 188 bytes packet boundary.
-The two main resolutions supported are 1920 x 1080 x 29.97 interlace and 1280 x 720 x 59.94 progressive.
-Recommended Video PID numbers are 0x11, 0x21 & 0x31. Audio PID numbers are video PID +3. Try to ensure that all files are encoded with the same PID. We typically use 0x31 which is 49 in decimal.

[HansBeekman]

Hi there,

Ok, that is different from MPEG because, like a tcp/ip network, the packet's odd to be send, in pieces? Or am I completly wrong.

Do I understand from the url you send, that you can create transport streams in HDV1080i format, so 1440x1080 ?

Oke, that's not the highest quality but you need very good eye's to tell the difference and it can perhaps solve the jitter effect.

[Soopafresh]

Your jittering might be due to several different things -


Make sure you are encoding at CBR (constant bit rate)

Lower your audio bitrate to 256kbs



Upload a 10-20 second example of the jittery file.

[HansBeekman]

I took a part of the testing file and cut the jitter piece out with VideoRedo. Saved it as mpeg with no changes.

It's just a piece from the timeline, testing camera position's, not spectacular at all but shows the jitter.

I just uploaded the file to this forum but don't see the post coming through.

Please take the file from my website, the link is here:

http://www.educomedia.eu/jitter.mpg

[HansBeekman]

http://www.educomedia.eu/jitter.mpg

[Soopafresh]

I'll take a look....


Edit:
I see it. I think you imported your files into your editing program as BFF (bottom field first). It should be TFF (top field first). - or the OPPOSITE of what your settings are. Hard to tell, as I don't know the procedure you're using to edit your video. Did you shoot at 25FPS? Are you doing an NTSC-PAL conversion somewhere? Did you drop your PAL video into a 24fps timeline?
Are you converting 29.97fps into 25fps? Conversion from NTSC to PAL is tricky.


You have to specify TFF (top field first) on your Mpeg2 encoder settings as well, probably.
Increase your bitrate too.

Somewhere along the way, your fields are getting messed up. Deinterlacing will mask the error somewhat, but not completely.

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh,

Thank you for the work.
To be honest with you; the file i downloaded seems to be worse for jitter over here.

The footage is originally shot on HDV (1440x1080) and exported to HD mpeg2

Further there is no conversion. I played a bit with the export possibilities of the matrox card but then suddenly VideoRedo wouldn’t load it.

But it were 2 weeks of hardly any sleep and perhaps I’m to tired to think well.

I take the night off and get some rest, hope to here from you again later.

I’m very interested how it comes that you have such a knowledge over these technical things. Is it profession or very well interested in these things? Just curious.

Have a nice day (what’s the time over there in your part of the US)

Greetings,
Hans

[Soopafresh]

Yeah, I noticed my re-encode was worse when I played it on my hardware card Sorry.

How do you learn this stuff? Practice, make mistakes, and read a lot of posts.

[HansBeekman]

Hi Soopafresh,

At the moment very busy with the editing of the movie. It's a relieve that i can upload the composition on the HD demonstrator. Thanks again for your support and effort!

Before starting the big edit on the matrox RT.X2 I did some investigations. Firts I captured the files at the standard Matrox Native HDV settings wich is Interlaced, upper field first. So I took a sample clip and exported it out as MPEG2 with 22Mb/sec Interlaced and Upper Field First. I took your settings for VideoRedo Plus and transformed it to Transport Stream. Uploaded the file to the HD demonstrator and everything looks fine. Nice to know. The jitter is totaly gone.
Still not sure why it is not as sharp as it should be but the footage is 1080x1440 and the export is 1080x1920 so somewhere there is an upscaling.

Anyway, things are going well here.

Greetings,
Hans