How much can one do with VirtualDub to clean up ugly VHS?

[Bix]

I trade & collect pro wrestling tapes as a hobby. There's a LOT out there, and with people disappearing over time, it's hard to find a lot of older stuff in nice, low-generation quality. There's one tape in particular that has some classic '70s footage, but the quality is...blech. So, for fun, I capped the footage using my DMR-E30 standalone (I know, I know, but it's what I have now and the results have been good), loaded it into VirtualDubMod, and filtered according to the suggestions on LordSmurf's site, plus set the smoother to 100 with noise prefilter enabled. I got this:
http://bix.shiningwizard.com/filtered.html

While the GIGO theory works against me, I thought those were pretty decent results all things considered. Is there any more I can do, or is that it?

Thanks,
-David

[housepig]

check out THIS PAGE for some good tips & Virtualdub filter tricks.

[Bix]

That was quite helpful, thanks!

EDIT: Further filtering screenshots here (it's also linked from the 1st page): http://bix.shiningwizard.com/filtered2.html

Frameserving and encoding now...

[fmctm1sw]

Wow, I recognize a young Jerry Lawler. And is that Toru Tanaka? That is some old stuff. What kind of playback hard ware do you have? Do you have a TBC?

[Bix]

Wow, I recognize a young Jerry Lawler. And is that Toru Tanaka? That is some old stuff.

It's Tojo Yamamoto, not Toru Tanaka. It's late '70s stuff. I have some tapes from around then in nice quality, but this isn't one of them...

What kind of playback hard ware do you have? Do you have a TBC?

No TBC , will get one when I get some more money. VCR is a 6-head Toshiba with gold cables going out.

[DVWannaB]

Looks like you are losing a lot of visual clarity and sharpness. True, the video is not the best, but I think you may want to revisit your Virtualdub filtering process/chain. That is if you can live with the current results. Try some of these links for some ideas:

Virtualdub filters: https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=225860

Grainy VHS: https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=211619&highlight=vhs+tape

Bad VHS tape: https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=211936&highlight=vhs+tape

Good luck.

[Bix]

I don't mind the loss of sharpness on the specific tape given the source quality, but I will check those threads and mess around more. Thanks.

[housepig]

Bix -

glad it helped.

if you find different chains or plugins that give a better end result, please post the info & shots here - if you annotate what you are doing, this could be a really useful thread...

one thing I'd like to know - how long did it take you to do the filtering?

[Suntan]

Have you looked into any of the AVISynth filters? I don't do any VHS caps so i can't give first hand knowledge, but check out both Pixiedust and Peach Smoother filters for AVISynth. I know they were made spicifically for analog caps.

-Suntan

[Bix]

http://bix.shiningwizard.com/filtered3.html

Includes cap of filter settings box (the ones that scroll off are set according to the recommendations of Smurf's site). Smoothing isn't quite as severe now, and the skin tones look better for it.

I tinkered for a couple hours w/ various filters before settling on what I wanted. I'm now going to frameserve to TMPGEnc to make the new DVD. I know the double encoding isn't the best mething, but until I can get $ for a capture card, that's what I have to do right now. Also, this isn't a gigantic project for me, more of my first taste of filtering to get used to it and see what it can do for me.

I haven't tried AVISynth, as I'm pretty sure I'd screw up the scripting and I couldn't get VirtualDubMod to work when choosing the "open w/ AVISynth" option.

EDIT: I might save an AVI first and then convert from there instead of frameserving...

[Suntan]

Don't bother using the "Open w/ AVISynth" option in Vdubmod. If you have AVISynth installed, just write up (or cut and past from the AVIsynth website) your script in notepad, save it (as a .AVS) and then open that in Vdubmod like you would a normal video. If there is an error in your script, Vdubmod will tell you when it trys to open (along with what script line and why it is wrong.)

If the .AVS opens in Vdubmod then your script is right.

-Suntan

[Bix]

So I did "Save as..." after applying the filters and chose HuffyUV as my compression. The resulting video wasn't filtered. What did I do wrong?

Thanks,
-David

EDIT: I think I realized my mistake, did fast recompress instead of full processing. Since the latter is so much more time consuming, I presume that's it

[Suntan]

Bix,

Yes, fast recompress will not implement any filters/framerate changes. For this you need to use full processing.

-Suntan

[SatStorm]

You used many filters, you don't need so many with virtualdub!
For real, your source needs temporal filtering, which gonna **** the motion and because of the nature of your source (wrestling) you don't wish that.
So, you need a different approach...

Try this combo

Deinterlace (unfold)
Sharpen 16
Frame merger ( 3 )
Static Noise Reduction ( 12 )
2D Cleaner ( 20 - 1 - 1 )
Deinterlace (fold)

Also you need luma / colour adjustments. So, before that filter chain use Flaxen VHS (colour shifting) and Exorcist ( luma shifting). That gonna help for real!

What you won't be able to "clean" is those colour lines. Those lines need temporal filters and you better not use those...

For sharpness, try MSU_Sharpen filter. Excellent but SLOOOOOWWWWWWW. If you have the time (about a week for a 2 - 3 hours of filtering...), it is the best you can do!

[Bix]

Thanks SatStorm, I'll try that chain since you seem like a major authority on this.

Maybe I should filter the match segments separately from the non-wrestliing ones to try to get better quality on those using temporal filtering?

[lordsmurf]

I've got a filter project right now that'll take 15 minutes per minute for a 2-hour video. But the old vs new does not even look the same. Looking at 30 hours just for one video! I've done worse.

[Wilbert]

You have awful chroma artefacts.

I suggest you go the AviSynth route and try DeScratch (latest version). It will remove many of those artefacts.

[pedmog]

I have to digitalize 12 vhs videos. someof them are 8mm on vhs and old! 1939-1994I am new to this and use a logilink graber with virtual dub.
I use the folling filters chain.. see pic.



and need help on getting those... spikes/lines? see pic


if I would know what is the name of those lines. I could search for.. but I don't know it.
after using smart bob AND deinterlace area based they became less. but still are a lot! imagine how full the picture was before using both
so if you know the name of those lines/spikes, noise... let me know and if you have a solution please tel me. of course I am happy to know what are better filter chains if you have some working better.

[manono]

The best thing you could do would be to capture using a VCR with a TBC. Either that or use a DVD recorder with one in pass-through mode put between the VCR and the computer capture card. If you don't know what a line TBC is, or what it can do for you, then read this:

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/video-restore/2251-tbc-time-base.html

[pedmog]

thank you for such a fast answer.what is the NAME of such lines?!

as I could read, tbc is buffering somehow and putting things after buffering together. so is there any filter that do it with virtualdub?! my computer is powerfull enogh to buffer some video
my vcr is a sony slv e500 and I saw some TBC VCRs... few hunderts just for 13 video plays?! because after that no cassette will be put in that expensive box! and I have to put few hundert dollars in the garbage.
by the way. the original was this, would you change anything on the filterlist?

[manono]

No, nothing in VDub can fix that mess. Maybe it's also caused by dirty heads, but that's beyond my knowledge. Someone will come along soon that knows more about what causes that and how to fix it. Hold on...

[themaster1]

I recall Jmac's advice on how to deal with exactly those same black lines. You have to capture the video 2 or 3 times and use his script

original topic:
https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/340963-Best-quality-and-speed-video-denoisers-2011?...=1#post2122313


similar topic:
https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/340068-sort-of-black-comets-trails-in-hi8-video

Have a look here aswell:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=121197&page=3

[2Bdecided]

my vcr is a sony slv e500 and I saw some TBC VCRs... few hunderts just for 13 video plays?! because after that no cassette will be put in that expensive box! and I have to put few hundert dollars in the garbage.

I don't think a TBC would help this at all, but a different VCR probably would. The heads of the record or playback device are damaged.

However, if you bought an expensive VCR (e.g. from eBay) for just 13 tapes, you would sell it after you finished (e.g. on eBay) for about as much as you paid for it. They only way you'd lose money is if it broke in the meantime.


Cheers,
David.

[sanlyn]

True...that is, if a VCR with bad heads didn't permanently damage the original tape -- in which case it's all over.

[pedmog]

thank you. now I can try another vcr and see if there are any differences. and let you know.

[davexnet]

That distortion in the photo's above look very similar to something I got when I tried to playback an S-VHS recorded tape
(may have been S-VHS ET) on a player that didn't support it.

[pedmog]

and can you tell me where to look for manual how to implement scripts... if I search for "scripts" there are almost in any thread

[manono]

and can you tell me where to look for manual how to implement scripts...

http://avisynth.nl/index.php/Main_Page

Start reading and experimenting. Test your scripts in VDub (File->Open video file) which gives helpful error messages if something's wrong. Come back with specific questions. Good luck.

[sanlyn]

and can you tell me where to look for manual how to implement scripts... if I search for "scripts" there are almost in any thread

True, there are literally thousands of "scripts" in this forum. But theMaster1 furnished some good links in post#22 showing ideas that addressed similar problems in another video (in fact, I copied the pages of the first link a long time ago and study it now and then). The scripts give you an idea of how the code flows and some of the plugins people use to fix problems. There's also Avisynth's own documentation on how to get started and what a script looks like -- which happens to be in your Windows Program listings that you can access by hitting the START button, in case you've never looked at your program listings before now.

Then as manono says, look over some scripts, get some ideas, and come back with specific questions. That's the way everyone learns to work with advanced tools. What I would advise at the outset is that there's no way to use VirtualDub for the problem you describe and get the same results you would get with Avisynth. VDub is pretty cool and I use it a lot myself, but you can't use it for everything.