Recording TV with ATI MMC. What settings work for you?

[presto]

I finaly have things pretty much working but I can only record when I use avi (in ATI Multimedia Center). This only lets me record a few shows before my hard drive is full. I've tried all the other preset formats and none of them work. Many of them give jerky pictures and/or the audio is out of sync.

I have an AMD Athlon 1.3 GHz processor and plenty of memory and harddrive.

Are other people able to record with mpg or ati's format in real time with good results? If so any suggestions on what I am doing wrong?

Thanks

[Sulik]

No problems here. Make sure you always use the latest MMC, though (I'm using 7.7).

For maximum quality:
480x480 IBBP @ 4+Mbps (6+Mbps is virtually lossless)
720x480 IBBP @ 6+Mbps (8+Mbps is virtually lossless)

[Mirror_Image]

I capture NTSC cable TV programming on an WinXP/P3-1000 using an ATI Radeon AIW 32MB AGP (a.k.a. Radeon 7200 AIW), ATI MMC 7.7 and the ATI preset (labeled "Half-Horizontal Resolution [HHR]") - 352x480 MPEG-2 4.80Mbit/sec VBR. I think that these captures look quite nice.

[presto]

Mirror Image - The ati half horizontal setting almost works but the sound is somehow slightly out of sync. Somehow it doesn't have that "real" feeling that video can have even at low quality. It seems to me like the mouths just don't move right even though the sound seems to be coming out at the right time.

Sulik - Thanks but could you elaborate. How do I get the settings you suggest?

Thanks

[Mirror_Image]

The ati half horizontal setting almost works but the sound is somehow slightly out of sync.

I really couldn't speak to that; the captures go into Ulead Video Studio post haste and are edited and transcoded to VCD forthwith. They are definitely in synch when they are finished transcoding.

[Sulik]

I had no problems with A/V sync either in the recent MMC versions either.

For setting a custom capture profile, you need to select custom and edit an existing MPEG capture preset.
You can then select the number of P and B frames (the best IBBP settings are P=4, B=2 for NTSC and P=3, B=2 for PAL)

You can also select the bitrate and/or up motion estimation to 100%.
If you drop frames, lower the motion estimation until you don't drop frames anymore (I-frame only should a last resort option on slow CPUs)

[presto]

Thanks guys, I tried recording an mpg using I frames only. As you said that should be a last resort for slow cpu's. I don't have a slow cpu, so why does the picture go slow, fast, slow, fast? I can tell because there was a ticker at the bottom of the screen that should be moving smoothly but is not. That may account for the effect I mentioned where the sync doesn't seem right even though it is not ahead of or behind the video.

I want to do some benchmarks to try to prove my computer is a lemon so that I can get Compaq to do something about it. If I post cpu, hard drive, memory, multimedia, benchmark results will you guys be able to tell me where the problem lies? Something has to be way out of wack.

[Sulik]

I think I've heard of that problem before (slow-fast-slow-fast transitions).
It seems to be related with the system clock and ACPI. (It would work with ACPI disabled, but if you've already installed XP with ACPI on, then XP will no longer boot)

If I remember correctly, there was a workaround for this:
Using regedit, create a DWORD entry in the registry at the following location:

"HKLM\Software\ATI Technologies\Digital VCR"
(You may need to create a new key if "Digital VCR" is not there)

Create a DWORD value "DriftLimit" and set it to some small value between 5 and 10.

[presto]

Old Hero: Abraham Lincoln

New Hero: Sulik

Sulik, you have just solved the whole problem that has been tormenting me for months. No one seemed to believe that there was bottleneck in my system that was making it way underperform. ATI and Compaq (when I got any help at all) just kept giving me stale old advice to tweak my computer and kept telling me that I was probably expecting too much.

After your registry fix I can (for the first time) record in ANY of the preset formats in MMC. Audio sync is perfect. Wow!

Thanks Thanks Thanks...

By the way

1)What is ACPI?
2)Is this a soundcard problem? Would I benefit from a new soundcard?
3)Unrelated problem: When I start the TV in Multimedia Center I get two TV windows. One is black and the other has the picture. If I close the extra window both windows close. I never had this before the latest version of MMC. I tried uninstalling and reinstalling but no change.

[Sulik]

1) ACPI is related to power-management on the computer, and is a new interface between the BIOS and the OS.

2) This is not a problem with the soundcard or AIW. It's a problem in the BIOS. It probably causes other issues as well, since it's related to interrupts resources.

3) There is an option in MMC to show the closed captions in a separate window - do you have this enabled by any chance ?
What's displayed in the window title bar ?

[Amish Electrician]

What is the diff between I frams only & b frams
Do you guys cap with the audio inputs that come from the ati breakout box (the purple boob)or do you use a spliter & got right to sound card.
I hookd my sound up with an interal conector to my sound card.

[presto]

Sulik - I guess I figured out the dual TV windows. I opened up the configuration on "Hydravision" and I pushed the "Unload Desktop Manager" button. The extra TV window went away.

I don't understand Hydravision. It is supposed to help with multiple monitors but my TV and Computer monitor are fine without it.

When I did your registry fix I put in the number 7 where you said to put in a small number between 5 and 10. Will I ever have reason to want to tweak this number? What differences will I get?

AMISH ELECTRICIAN - I have a coaxial cable from my cable TV going into my AIW Radeon 7500 card. The card came with a cable that plugs into the card and has an RCA jack that goes to the line-in of my sound card.

[Amish Electrician]

Well when i use the coax cable the picture is not as good as the rca jacks or s-video but i do get a lip sink problem when i use rca.

[Sulik]

I personally always use the S-Video connector, and have an internal cable connecting the AIW to my SBLive.

I believe that the registry setting works as a percentage for limiting the timing errors of incoming frames (1=0.1%, 5=0.5%, 7=0.7%, 10=1% etc).

B and P frames compress better (ie better quality at the same file size), but they require more horsepower. The amount of horsepower the B and P-frames use is directly controlled by the motion estimation quality slider.
(0%=fastest, 100%=slowest but maximum quality)

[presto]

Sulik - I found out how to reinstall XP without ACPI. This computer is dedicated to video only and isn't loaded with other stuff so it is not out of the question to to do a reinstall. My question is what would I lose by not having ACPI?

Since my system is working great right now I doubt I will do anything but there may be a time in the future when I want a fresh start.

Also do you have any pet performance tweaks? I have read some how to's that recommend setting some services to manual and other people say that may improve boot time but not computer performance.

[Amish Electrician]

presto hope you dont mind me giving input here but on a fresh install of XP 2 things
1 get norton ghost make a ghost of you system after you get it all setup & burn it on cd that way if you hose it you can get right back too good in about 10min.
2 go to blackviper.com read his stuff on xp about how to shut down all the exter crap MS runs on you system that you will never need.
Few good progams to check out would be tweakui for xp or power toys
& xp antispy
your my doc folders & stuff you like to keep like favs email set those on you second hard drive with tweak that way if you restore your ghost you dont over write your files.
Hope that helps

[presto]

Thanks, I bought ghost a while ago but have not used it yet because I never had things really working. Now that you reminded me I will run Ghost tonight. Thanks for the tips about fresh install. I will check out that site.

I have a really nice set up where I have two computers hooked together with only one keyboard and mouse. A switch controls which computer I am using. That way I can run video on my video computer while doing work on the other. I can use my video computer like a vcr and have it playing on my TV but still do other things at the same time.

[acravero]

I'm trying to record CVD quality (352X480 @ 2520), but I can't get MMC to bump the sound quality to 48kHz, which would make my burnt CVDs DVD compatible in any machine (supposedly). Anyone know if the most recent MMC has 48kHz capability? I have MMC7.5 right now--the last time I installed 7.7 I had to reinstall & reformat EVERYTHING, and unless it has some dramatically new & useful features (like 48kHz encoding), I'm a little leary of trying again.

Also, since you are all ATI users--I have a problem that's occurring after I use MMC. It works fine when I use the TV or the Guide plus features and leave them up/running, but if I close either of them, and then try to open anything else, I get a blue screen. I have an Athlon 1gig Tbird, 512mb DDR, and plenty of HD room. I have also completely removed all ATI apps according to their guide, and reinstalled everything, and the same thing happens. Anyone else have this happen, or have a solution?

Thanks!!!
-Anthony

[Sulik]

MMC 7.7 is stable, except if you have the Radeon VIVO - no problems on the AIW.

It does allow 48kHz captures and SVCD-compliant captures. However, you can't mix the SVCD compliance and 48kHz (mutually exclusive).
For 48khz captures, you have to base your custom preset on a DVD preset (not SVCD).

If you want to be DVD-ready, I would select 352x480 @ 48khz, since this is DVD-compliant. There is already such a preset in MMC 7.7 (DVD Half Horizontal Resolution)