Import AVCHD with 5.1 Sound in FCP

[Mr.Ash]

I have a new Sony HDR-SR12E Handycam witch is capable to record with Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound. The problem is, when i imoprt the media file in FCP the audio will be downmixed to stereo automaticly. When i connect the cam to my multimedia reciever it tells me that there is nativ 5.1 sound and also Toast 9 gives me the same information.

My question now is:
Is ther a possibility to import the 5.1 sound channels directly into FCP? Or is there a possibility to demux the MTS format and import the AC3 sound seperatly into FCP?

P.S. I've tried ffmpegX but it fails with this MTS format competly.

[terryj]

My question is this: What are you trying to do specifically
with the footage on the HandyCam?

Are you trying to burn directly to DVD? if so Toast 9,
or a standalone recorder with the proper inputs should
be able to handle the job.

Are you trying to edit out some parts, and then take it
to DVD by using FCP as your NLE? then if so, then yes,
FCP is acting correctly in taking the MTS directly
and converting it to an FCP acceptable format.
the new iMovie 08 as well as iMovie HD, will also try and do this.

You could try opening the footage in MpegStreamclip,
from the Handycam, and see if it will allow you to demux the
MTS file into something FCP likes. You will need to purchase,
if you do not have already, the QT Mpeg-2 Component from
Apple to enable MpegStreamclip to do this.

[Mr.Ash]

Yes i want to edit & cut a lot of sequences using FCP.

As for Toast 9 i'm aware of the fact that Toast 9 can handle this format directly but that's not my goal.

I also have the Apple MPEG2 Component for AVCHD (H.264) it's useless and MPEGStreamclip is not capable of handling MTS containers or demux them.

Why does Apple implement an automatic downmix to stereo in the AVCHD pligin for FCP in the first place? I'n my oppinion this is very stupid.

EDIT:
The only solution i've found for now is:

- open the MTS File with VLC
- export the audio with A/52 setting (512kbit/s) as a MPEG-TS file
- open the MPEG-TS with ffmpegX
- encode only the audio stream to AC3 (5.1 at 448kbit/s)
- import the resulting 5.1 AC3 stream into FCP

To say it formal this is a pain in the ass, especialy if you have to do this for every MTS stream

[minidv2dvd]

well you could buy a pc and edit with vegas......

[Herve]

Why does Apple implement an automatic downmix to stereo in the AVCHD pligin for FCP in the first place? I'n my oppinion this is very stupid.

my 2 cents...
Certainly because 5.1 with camcorder is useless. A camcorder cannot record a real spatial sound with only one microphone (5.1 is done with multiple differents micros: front, sides, back). I think 5.1 camcorders is only for Marketing purposes

bye

[deejay.2001]

good program which accept 5.1 audio and does not convert video for authoring is tmpgenc dvd author.
it perfectly works with dvd but not avchd and blueray yet

so you might wait little longer before some easy programs to author blueray and avchd supporting 5.1 and without need to reconvert video will be here...

hopefully tmpgenc will come with new version to author blueray and avchd files.....

i was also thinking to get hdr sr12e but it is too pricey plus support only 16 bitrate..new incoming canon hg21 will have up to maximum 24 bitrate which could be better for fast motion sport videos...but canon will not have 5.1 audio...but only stereo audio...but it is cheaper...ebay now offers 550 UK pounds deals for this new camcorder hg21 which is better price than sonys hdr sr12e which is still around 700 UK pounds..

so i do wait for sure for next gen sonys...till february 2009 i believe sony will introduce 24 bitrate and also you will have 5.1 audio plus there will be selection of some programs be able to author these files...

[rumplestiltskin]

Apple's MPEG2 component has nothing to do with H264 as that's MPEG4.

[Mr.Ash]

Certainly because 5.1 with camcorder is useless. A camcorder cannot record a real spatial sound with only one microphone (5.1 is done with multiple differents micros: front, sides, back). I think 5.1 camcorders is only for Marketing purposes

bye

This is totaly wrong! i have a Sony HDR-SR12E camcorder witch contains multiple microphones to record 5.1 sound. I've testet this by my selft and connected the cam directly via HDMI to my 5.1 surround sound system. The system and my iScan VP30 recognize native 5.1 surround sound from the cam anud you can clearly here the voices in the background witch ar coming from the rear surround speakers. This is no marketing gag, this is for real!

For me it's not useful to use some DVD authoring programs cause i have to cut the footage first. If i only want to burn the footage to DVD or Bluray i've used Toast 9 a long time ago. I wan't to edit everything without loosing the 5.1 sound is that so difficult to understand?

[terryj]

Mr. Ash, you have a camera that is ahead of the curve as far as what
NLE's can currently do, as pointed out by deejay.

Apple's implementation of this to get it directly off the camera
is not 100% Apple's fault; Sony has to provide specs to Apple
for them to implement them into FCP. Sony drops the ball,
Apple can only do what it can to get it to work.

This will most likely be fixed in the next release of FCP,
as each version of FCP has been able to handle newer
camera standards.

sucks for now, but it's the price you pay for being "cutting edge".
If you take a look at this page, this always gives
you an idea of what cameras play nice with the latest version of
FCP, before you go buy a camera.

[Mr.Ash]

Apple's implementation of this to get it directly off the camera
is not 100% Apple's fault; Sony has to provide specs to Apple
for them to implement them into FCP. Sony drops the ball,
Apple can only do what it can to get it to work.

That's complete nonsense. The file format of the Sony HDR-SR12E cam is the exact same one as you will find on any Bluray movie disc, this means it's a defined standard and open for everyone. Apple was also one of the first companies in the Bluray consotium along with Sony, so don't tell me the don't know anything about AVCHD, MTS and AC3.

FCP is capable of handling multichannel surround sound, the only thing Apple has to do is to convert the AC3 stream to a 6 chanel AIFF format, but instead Apple implements a stupid function witch only downmixes it to stereo. AC3 is a well known format so it should be easy for Apple to handle this.

This will most likely be fixed in the next release of FCP,

To be honest i don't have much faith in that.

If you take a look at this page, this always gives you an idea of what cameras play nice with the latest version of
FCP, before you go buy a camera.

That's exactly what i did before i bought this camera. According to Apple it's fully compatible with FCP, witch is for the AC3 5.1 Sound defenitly not the case.

[tomlee59]

Certainly because 5.1 with camcorder is useless. A camcorder cannot record a real spatial sound with only one microphone (5.1 is done with multiple differents micros: front, sides, back). I think 5.1 camcorders is only for Marketing purposes

bye

This is totaly wrong! i have a Sony HDR-SR12E camcorder witch contains multiple microphones to record 5.1 sound. I've testet this by my selft and connected the cam directly via HDMI to my 5.1 surround sound system. The system and my iScan VP30 recognize native 5.1 surround sound from the cam anud you can clearly here the voices in the background witch ar coming from the rear surround speakers. This is no marketing gag, this is for real!

I can attest to what you are saying. Although you cannot quite achieve the full richness capable with a complement of properly distributed microphones, you can do surprisingly well with multiple microphones with individual delay lines (implemented electronically, of course). I have done this many times, both acoustically, and with microwave antennas for communication. It's not just marketing. It's Huygen's principle + DSP.

[raulveiga]

I hope this helps

http://www.shedworx.com/node/294

BTW if you can't help, why post stupid replies?