Are there any cheap external TBC's?

[tsu3000]

Hi

There doesn't seem to be many VHS decks with built in TBC on ebay at the moment. So I am considering getting a cheap external TBC unit instead. The one I have seen is this one:

http://www.lektropacks.co.uk/view_product_standard.php?product=12&department=&sub1=&show=

But I am not sure if this is any good. I would ideally like the ADVC-300, but that is way over my budget. Are there any other alternatives?

I mainly want to convert a collection of commercial VHS tapes that are not available on DVD. My VHS desk is a standard Panasonic NV-HV61EB (UK Spec).

Thanks in advance.

J

[Marvingj]

CTB100
Compact Time Base Corrector
Is a Darn good TBC for the money!!

[jagabo]

For a line TBC you can find a used Panasonic DVD recorder like the ES15 for around US$50. (The passthrough signal is is corrected, no need to record.)

[lordsmurf]

For a line TBC you can find a used Panasonic DVD recorder like the ES15 for around US$50. (The passthrough signal is is corrected, no need to record.)

Yeah, but you also add all of the problems of the Panasonic, too --
1. Posterization (harsh color palette compression)
2. Luma/IRE variance (image green/black is all muddy and off, must use proc amp afterwards to re-fix)

ES10 is great for salvaging damaged tapes, but you trades errors. A worse one for a lesser one. It would suck to use this as a TBC all the time, knowing how it rapes the quality along the way, if your source is clean.

Hi
There doesn't seem to be many VHS decks with built in TBC on ebay at the moment. So I am considering getting a cheap external TBC unit instead.

You don't understand the TBCs.
The internal VCR TBC "cleans the image quality", but does nothing for signal stability. The external TBC "clean the signal quality", but does nothing for the image visually. Pick the right tool for the right task, they are NOT interchangeable.

Given how a new consumer crap VCR was $100 not 10 years ago, and now a used pro-end VCR can be found in the $200 range (MSRP $500-2,000), I don't consider that to be even remotely expensive. HAVE SOME PERSPECTIVE!!!! 8)

[videobread]

There are 8 Hotronic AP-41's listed on ebay cheap. Go to ebay and search "hotronic". I paid $1,500 for one back in the S-VHS days. Read the specs to see if it will work for you.

[danno78]

External TBC like CTB100 have a plus: will remove Macrovision protection. TBC from DVD recorder will fix TBC errors but, can`t remove Macrovision.
I confirm (I have one just for TBC side) ES15 can cure most tapes in bad shape.

[orsetto]

You're located in the UK: are those tapes you want to transfer PAL or NTSC? You won't find a great many PAL-format VCRs on eBay with built-in TBC/noise reduction, they're just much less common than similar NTSC-format VCRs.

In any case as LordSmurf explained, such a VCR will do nothing regarding the copy protection so if thats your primary issue don't waste your time looking for the VCR, what you want is the external TBC. The Hotronic AP-41 and CTB-100 mentioned earlier would be good choices, as would the AVT-8710 or DataVideo TBC-1000. Last year these were rather pricey, even used, but the current global economy has resulted in more of these being put up for sale on eBay. When many are listed, the price drops. Last year a used TBC-1000 averaged $300 US, today I routinely see them sell for under $150 US. When shopping TBCs, limit your interest to smaller, more modern models: nothing larger than the Hotronic. Older professional rack-mount TBCs have proved repeatedly to be the worst thing you can buy on eBay- they're always worn out, beat up, and some don't really cure MacroVision as well as the more compact newer models. Also they're large, awkwardly-shaped and heavy, often resulting in shipping costs higher than the purchase price.

[videobruce]

There are 8 Hotronic AP-41's listed on ebay cheap.

Make that seven. I just picked up a AP41SF (the cheapest version with a S-video in and out). Over 95% of the under $300 TBC's don't have a S-video input and output and 90% won't have either. Also, many have that 7 pin industrial Y/C dub connection. I'm not sure you can use that (with a adapter cable) with a consumer Y/C connection. If I remember correctly, the individual signals are separated differently.

What is the general opinion of the CBT-530TR from TVOne?? I haven't seen anyone mention this model.

[victoriabears]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Panasonic-TV-and-Video-cassette-player-AG-1000B_W0QQitemZ110410303095QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_C onsumerElec_VCRs?hash=item19b4f78677&_trksid=p3286 .c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1690| 293%3A1|294%3A50

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/panasonic-video-recorder-NV-HS900B-SVHS_W0QQitemZ250460126456QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Co nsumerElec_VCRs?hash=item3a50963cf8&_trksid=p3286. c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1690|2 93%3A1|294%3A50

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Panasonic-NV-HS900-SVHS-Video-Recorder-Player-VCR_W0QQitemZ220447923867QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Con sumerElec_VCRs?hash=item3353b85e9b&_trksid=p3286.c 0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1690|29 3%3A1|294%3A50

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Panasonic-NV-FS200-FS200-SVHS-Prosumer-high-end_W0QQitemZ220448019818QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Con sumerElec_VCRs?hash=item3353b9d56a&_trksid=p3286.c 0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1690|29 3%3A2|294%3A50

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PANASONIC-NV-HS870-SUPER-VHS-VCR_W0QQitemZ170354411354QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Con sumerElec_VCRs?hash=item27a9ea075a&_trksid=p3286.c 0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1690|29 3%3A2|294%3A50

check on panny uk site for the manual but I think iy has tbc/dnr

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Panasonic-NV-HS900-SVHS-Video-Cassette-Recorder_W0QQitemZ200358218761QQcmdZViewItemQQptZU K_ConsumerElec_VCRs?hash=item2ea647cc09&_trksid=p3 286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A16 90|293%3A2|294%3A50

The CTB TBC is same as AVT8710 and is good but fragile, all I did for the above was search panasonic vcr on ebay UK

[victoriabears]

If your tapes are in good confition, well recorded, then an external TBC is unnceessary in my experience. Why do you think you need one, certainly the panny 870 would be my choice or the FS200 , it does a good job of creating a nice playback image, the 900/1000 are old by now but the last one looks good.

[orsetto]

He needs an external TBC because he primarily wants to transfer protected commercial VHS titles which have not been re-released on commercial DVD. The OP was a little confused about the two different types of TBC, so his original question asking recommendations for a PAL VCR with line TBC that would be cheaper than a "real" TBC like the CBT100 steered the thread in that direction. Since tsu3000 hasn't posted any followup questions regarding our advice, he probably doesn't like the answers, but fact is fact: clearing tape protection requires an expensive external TBC (or a dedicated protection removal filter, which often costs as much).

Before this thread dies, for the benefit of newcomers let me repeat LordSmurfs excellent simplified advice: no VCR, by itself, can cure copy protection on commercial VHS tapes. The term "TBC" has different meanings: the version built into high-end VCRs is nothing more than an image filter that makes the video "prettier". It cannot remove copy protection. To do that, you need an external TBC: this has no visible effect on the picture but rebuilds the faulty sync signals caused by copy protection schemes. Ignore any claims you have ever heard that certain old VCRs "bypass" copy protection: while this is true, it applies only between VCRs. DVD recorders do not react the same way, their digital "sniffers" easily detect the existence of any protection, no matter if the VCR 'bypasses' it, and immediately lock out their recording functions anyway.

Lousy-looking tape needs improvement for DVD transfer? Get a deluxe VCR with built-in TBC.

DVD recorder won't record from commercial tapes? Get an external TBC or protection filter.

[sanlyn]

For a line TBC you can find a used Panasonic DVD recorder like the ES15 for around US$50. (The passthrough signal is is corrected, no need to record.)

True. jagabo. Older Toshiba DVD recorders can also be used as pass-thru TBC's as well as a Y/C noise filter. I'm using refurbished RD-XS34's and a RD-2. Also use my old Panasonic ES20 -- the TBC works on pass-thru, but only on Line 1 (why, is anyone's guess). The Toshiba's seem to do a better job. I also discovered by accident that the Toshiba output playback image controls also work, even if they're not all that great.