Write Strategy / Discs: Pioneer 520H

[Seeker47]

From other threads, I'm told that the burner in this recorder is a Pioneer 107 -- which I think can do its maximum speed write at 8x. I have been using 8X media (various brands, but with the better, recommended media codes) almost exclusively, and have obtained very good results. A high-speed copy from the HDD that fills or nearly fills a DVD-5 is usually estimated by the recorder to take about 7 - 9 minutes, and I have no reason to believe that estimate is not pretty accurate. Strictly based on my experience with this recorder for the last 8 months, it is looking like it prefers 8x media. The difference in using an 8x MIJ Sony blank vs. a 16x Sony MIJ blank is striking: more like a 12 or 13 minute "high-speed" burn time to the 16x disc for the same length movie or programming. Until one of you can give me some better info on this, I'm inclined to chalk this up to write strategy, and what the recorder knows how to do with whatever blank media its firmware is able to write to. If this is correct, I should be stocking up more on 8x blanks, which have gotten much harder to find, at least on store shelves.

One other thing I've noticed but can't account for is the discrepancy between what a disc is supposed to hold with a given "MN" recording quality setting (according to the chart in the manual), and what it winds up holding in real-world practice. For example, a recording at MN-28 is only supposed to give you 80 minutes for a DVD-5 (and this recorder only records single-layer discs) , but I have managed to get perhaps as much as 90 or 91 minutes. That is, it should not have worked; the attempt should have shown up in red, with a warning. This is using the high speed copy. The manual says this is strictly a digital process, and does not change the quality setting of the recording (re-encode ?). Are they telling it straight here, or is there some fudge factor ? I think there is some "extra" room on a CD or DVD that the mfr. does not acknowledge -- hence Nero's "overburning" setting for CDs -- but I wouldn't expect that much headroom !

[Frobozz]

As for your first issue, Sony media isn't good quality and newer certainly isn't better. You probably will be better off with 8X than 16X but another brand of 16X may be fine.

The second situation occurs if you recorded a program that is letterboxed. The black bars on top and bottom just don't take as much space to write so you can boost your setting a little whenever recording letterboxed shows. The full-frame shows are pretty accurate.

[gshelley61]

8x burners often will have problems with newer 16x discs unless they have a firmware upgrade. This goes for the burners in DVD recorders, as well. Check with Pioneer to see if they offer a consumer firmware upgrade disc for your 520H... if they do, that could help with disc compatibility in the future.

The MN settings are estimates. Several factors are in play for single pass hybrid VBR recording. High action sources with lots of motion will require increased bitrate more often than slower action movies and programs. Letterbox bars (as mentioned in the previous post) will indeed reduce the average bitrate, too. Sources with grain, streaks and chroma noise will eat up more bitrate than clean video sources will.

[Seeker47]

As for your first issue, Sony media isn't good quality and newer certainly isn't better. You probably will be better off with 8X than 16X but another brand of 16X may be fine.

I would have to run DVDIdentifier or DVDInfoPro again to look up the media codes, since I don't remember what they are and don't seem to have written this down, but I do recall Lord Smurf giving his seal of approval to the Sony MIJ blanks. It probably wasn't a top rating, like some of the TYs, but I think it was reasonably good. These are the MIJs that are easiest to find on store shelves (and you don't see too many MIJs there, period), and often sold at a good price on sale. The other brand I have used the most in -Rs are the Taiwanese Verbatims. For -RWs, the TDK 4x discs -- but they are generally temp or transitional discs anyway. I avoid junk like Ritek / Ridata / Princo, no matter how cheap they happen to be. So far, I haven't seen any problems with the Sony MIJs, and I've burned a great many of them. (Then again, I think ROF has claimed much the same thing in regard to some brands with a very dicey rep around these parts.) The only real proof for any of these is going to be when we try and play discs we've burned in another 2 - 5+ years. I don't even think it will matter that much whatever the graphs from these so-called diagnostic programs are showing, now or at that time. Does it play without a problem, and How does it look on your screen ? That is what will tell the tale.

[Frobozz]

Thanks Seeker47 for that info. My reason for criticizing the Sony brand is that many Mac owners have had trouble with some of those discs (probably other than MIJ ones). It seems nearly all the media is getting worse. Your issue, though, is probably related to the 520's firmware with that media and not due to the media's quality.

[CrayonEater]

I don't buy Sony because I am permanently boycotting them for the XCP thing and other malicious stuff they have done. I guess this is just one more reason to avoid Sony.

[Zen of Encoding]

Check with Pioneer to see if they offer a consumer firmware
upgrade disc for your 520H.

No burner firmware upgrades available from Pioneer for DVD recorders w/hard drives,
or at least that's what everyone in this thread says (and there are *loads* of posters):

https://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=253998