Nube Questions, pls be nice ;)

[Smokintodd]

I'm currently researching a Video Capture solution for my dad, which I really know nothing about (but learning).

Pinnacle Studio Deluxe looks pretty good, but I'm a bit confused. Does it come with a video card (AGP/PCI) or just a breakout and capture box?

Secondly, the All-in-Wonder Radeon 8500 looks like a good solution as well. How does it compare to the above product? Will the 7500 work equally as well?

Gaming is not really a factor, so the Radeon(s) might be overkill. However, his new system will need a 2D/3D video card, and, if the Pinnacle doesn't come with one, it will be an expensive solution.

What do you pro's recommend in terms of the above?

Thanks in anticipation of your informed advice, I really appreciate it.

Smokintodd out.

PS System specs can be what I want them to be as I'm building a machine from scratch for him.

[vigilante]

As for the pinnacle studio deluxe, I do believe it comes with the pci card as well as the break out box. The Ati Radeon seems to be capable of doing the same thing as the Pinnacle card. Since You are going to be needing a video card as well I would suggest you go with the Radeon card. They both are priced just about the same and you might as well opt for the more options you'll get the the video card. You also say that you are beginning to be introduced into transfer so this might be a good way to start and get your video card as well. Good Luck.

[Bstansbury]

I laughed when I read your post. With todays technology it should be as easy as 1,2,3 to buy a new PC system, plus a Video Capture card, plug them together and "Bam",... your capturing video. If it was only that easy.

If you go through some of the posts and read them close, then look at several of the "HOW TO's", you will begin to see how many problems people are having. When I started it, I also thought at first it should not be that hard. After months of education, searching the web, requesting help, getting some,... rebuilding my system,... and finally, tuning my system for the best performance,... I was able to capture good video.

Of course, it would be very easy for us to tell you exactly what to do, how to do it, what kind of system to buy, what software to install, what drivers to get and how to load them, and then which programs to use for capture, which ones and what settings to use to convert to MPEG VCD or SVCD,... but you would not have any of the fun or pleasure that we had,... doing it all the hard way.

Besides,... if I told you exactly what kind of "New" system I would buy, you wouldn't trust me anyway,... and just purchase what you wanted to.

Do you see how bitter and vindictive one can become after months of agonizing frustration,... searching for information on how to get Video Capture to work,... isn't it sad.

Do some more reading,..especially down in the "User Guides",... and then post a plea for help that shows you have at least been bleeding internally for at least a week.

Bud

[Allan55]

Hi,

The first things to decide are where you want to play the video and the quality you want.

You playback choices are:

1. Stand-alone (A/V) DVD Player (a part of your TV - Stereo setup)

• a) DVD all will play DVDs (obviously )

• b) VCD and XVCD some will play

• c) SVCD and XSVCD fewer will play

See the player list (lefthand column on this screen, in the "Other"
section. Look through the "What Is" section for more details

2. Play only on a computer (including thru "video-out" to a TV)
Any format, compression, and quality can be used

Quality isn't just VCD or SVCD or DVD or play only on a computer. The bit-rate of the video (samples per second) and the quality of the compressor plays a big part here.

Better quality takes longer, sometimes much longer. For example. I'm currently recovering some faded video tape using just the TMPGE default noise-reduction and de-interlace to SVCD (2520 bitrate). 20 mintes of video takes 12 hours to process on an Athlon XP 1600+ with 512MB memory. It takes only about 50 minutes without noise reduction and de-interlace with a bitrate of 2000.

When reading comments here, including mine, you need to get a feel for what each person thinks is "good" quality - Read lots of threads; its faster and cheaper than buying something too soon and later having to upgrade.

Admittedly only people with problems post questions but the more posts about problems with a specfiic product or brand of products, the more likely you are to have similar problems. Separate "newbie" problems from more serious "technical" problems where you can.

In my humble opinion very few, if any, of the integrated-with-video capture cards produce good quality. I have an Asus v8200 (Geforce 3) video card with capture HW included and its captures can't match the Pinnacle DC10+ I've retired. Drivers are an ongoing problem too.

For what its worth, I bought a Dazzle Hollywood DV Bridge 6 months ago and am happy with it. The new Canopus ADVC100 seems good too, These are both at the high-end of the "consumer" tools but could be used by a low-end "pro" too. Cable-TV captures to SVCD typically look as good or slighly better than the original with the faster settings mentioned above; as do good quality VHS tapes. Stuff you get over the internet rarely has anywhere near this quality.

Hope this helps!

Allan

[Smokintodd]

Vigilante, thank you for an honest attempt at addressing the 3 simple questions I asked.

As for you Mr. Bstansbury, you may wish to read 'carefully' the questions I've asked. Only then you will find your reply completely irrelevant.

I didn't ask for the Bible of Capture/Transfer, I simply asked to get an opinion comparing 2 products' that I've already researched. The exact video hardware supplied is vague when it comes to the Pinnacle product. The description of the editing software supplied with the Radeon is vague. I checked both ATI's and Pinnacle's sites.

User boards are for a broad range of users, and I believe that my questions are legitimate. Since I have neither the time or the money to go buy both products and test them for myself, I thought I'd turn to the boards and try and benefit from others' experiences... this, in my opinion, is partly what boards are for.

I did not ask for your, or anyone else's opinion on computer hardware,
(Quote; "PS System specs can be what I want them to be as I'm building a machine from scratch for him")
or any thing else in this particular paragraph of your reply,
("Of course, it would be very easy for us to tell you exactly what to do, how to do it, what kind of system to buy, what software to install, what drivers to get and how to load them, and then which programs to use for capture, which ones and what settings to use to convert to MPEG VCD or SVCD,... but you would not have any of the fun or pleasure that we had,... doing it all the hard way")

I can field-strip a PC in the dark and rebuild it in 10 min., so you're right, I'm not interested in what PC component hardware you have to recommend, thanks.

I suggest you put the cap back on the glue bottle and get off your high-horse regarding the arrogant attitude that you've displayed reagrding this matter. If you were a true advocate of the hobby/profession, you would encourage other 'newbs' with a more diplomatic approach.

As for some bleeding to learn the 'deal', or any other 'computer deal', I couldn't agree more. That is why I can field-strip a computer in 2 min. and rebuild it.... eer, never mind, lol.

As for this comment,
(" Do you see how bitter and vindictive one can become after months of agonizing frustration,... searching for information on how to get Video Capture to work,... isn't it sad.")
I couldn't agree more.

My questions still stand and I'd be interested and grateful if anybody else had some constructive information.

Thanks.

Smokintodd out.

[kingrdr]

Amen, brother.

[Smokintodd]

Allan, very informative. Thank-you.

Smokintodd out.

[Bstansbury]

Sorry "SmokinTodd",

I was just trying to add a little humor,... along with some suggestions. I took your first line to be factual,

I'm currently researching a Video Capture solution for my dad, which I really know nothing about (but learning).

I meant to help,... and I'm sorry if something I said has offended you.
The spec's on the capture cards won't tell you the problems you're going to have. The point I was trying make was that it just isn't the Capture card. It's the Capture card, the audio card, the system, the software, the motherboard, and how the entire setup is tuned.

Anyway,... once you get you card and you build the new system,... Your troubles will begin. I was suggesting that you investigate a lot more than just the capture card.

P.S. Ease up on the smoking and the caffine.

[vigilante]

Where I come from, trying to add a little humor, does not begin with "I laughed when I read your post. " Bstansbury, smokintodd had a completely legitimate question, what you did was completely rude. You assumed that he has no idea what he is doing, and continued to give advice he did not ask for. I understand that you have had some frustration with hardware, I think we all have been there too. That however is no reason to bash somebody else's post. This is the perfect time to politely offer your suggestion. Tell the person what problems you have run into , and maybe how you solved them, or even what hardware you recommend he use.

Smokintodd, perhaps a good thing for us to know is exactly what kind of video you plan to work with ( DV or AVI ). By the hardware you are looking into, I am assuming you are going to work with both? Please let us know, that way somebody, if not I, may be more of an assitance to you.

[Smokintodd]

I will accept your apology sir and thank you for an explanation of your intentions.

In terms of your P.S., once again you're being irrelevant ;)

Smokintodd out.

[Smokintodd]

Thanks vigilante and thanks for the email.

Again, it's not for me at this moment. It's my dad's deal and it will be up to him and the family to go through the trials and tribulations.

I've done enough reading to know that it's best described by what Bud says, (" The spec's on the capture cards won't tell you the problems you're going to have...it just isn't the Capture card. It's the Capture card, the audio card, the system, the software, the motherboard, and how the entire setup is tuned").

I simply want a product that will keep his options open as you described, both DV and analogue, and give them the best all around quality (without having to jump through too many hoops) in the price bracket we're looking at. The system they run it on will play a large role and that will be taken care of with a high regard.

Most of the work will be from 8 to VHS with some fun-type editing (titles, transitions, and some sound dub), and 8 to perhaps VCD. The plan for sound is to use the capabilities of an SB Live or Audigy. If this all sounds naive, it is. We realize there will be some trial and error, but again as Bud mentions, that's part of the fun.. well at least it is for me ;)

It will benefit me as well as I too have a mountain of 8's that need some magic and am moving towards this as a hobby once I finish off the 75 other projects I'm working on, ;)

Thanks again.

Smokintodd out.
Operating out of CYXU.

[EricB]

If your intention is to capture and then edit, I highly recommend you use a product that converts to DV video. This takes you out of the realm of regular capture cards, and into the Hollywood DV Bridge, Canopus product, or a DV camcorder with analog-in.

For me, the best solution was to buy a camcorder and get all the benefits of recording live video in a digital format, plus have a bullet proof conversion method that never drops frames. I can also take the edited DV files and store them back onto tape at the original captured resolution.

[TOMMO]

I have seen many posts with people having problems with the ATI all in wonder solutions. Whenever I have tried the card in past I was was not impressed, that was quite a while ago.

A dedicated hardware capture card is a good solution, Pinnacle do produce many options. Some relatively inexpensive, some much more expensive, I think you get what you pay for. Look at the software bundles, some come with expensive programs like Adobe Premiere and Media Studio, when you look at the cost of those programs alone, its almost like getting the card for nothing.

Matrox produce the Rt range which are supposed to create good results.

The ultimate though, is Firewire and DV. A firewire card costs about £40 and the results are very very very good, so you might consider that route if you have a DV camcorder.