Hey, I’m looking to build a decent system strictly for video editing. I’m looking at my options and want some input.
I have a G4 Mac (500 MHz I believe) with OSX, and a ton of software. The system was designed for audio/music sequencing, etc. so it’s not much of a power horse for video.
With a budget of just over $1000, I’m stuck on the choice of either spending a part of that on more RAM and external hard drives (I want external storage for different projects)for the Mac, or spending it all on a brand new PC (I doubt I could get a speedy new Mac for that price). I’ve seen a tutorial on building a NLE PC for $1000.. so I know it’s possible.
I wonder if adding more RAM to the Mac would actually make it decent for video work. Wouldn’t the core processor (400-500MHz or so) have to be faster as well? What speeds are acceptable for video work? I’ll be doing some major rendering work – hour, to 2 hour long projects… with effect and such. I want as much power as I can get. Any ideas/help?
Thanks
Robbie
Robbibee@comcast.net
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 30 of 31
-
-
I've done editing on both a PM 710/80, a G4 466, a G4 Dual 800 QS, and now a Dual 1 G4 MDD. I can DEFINITELY say
Processor makes a difference, the difference between
a project taking say 5-7 hours round trip
(editing, compressing to format, author and burn)
to 2-4 hours round trip.
That being said, I did try some light editing and saving to MPEG-1
of some low end footage on an eMac 1.25ghz.
it didn't take long, the machine had 1GB of Ram,
and produced the file ( an 11 min clip) in roughly
the same time as my Dual 1 would have taken.
I for one am NOT of the opinion of sinking money
into a machine, just becasue new OS's usually cause havoc
with third party cards, and this can be a pain.
For $1000 dollars you could easily get into one of these macs here:
G4 1ghz eMac
http://www.powermax.com/cgi-global/generate_css_temp.cgi?p=c-u57567
G4 1.42 Emac
http://www.smalldog.com/product/34822
As long as you stay 1ghz or better, with a min of 512MB
( 768 to 1GB of ram is better), you'll be fine
for getting 2 hour projects done."Everyone has to learn, so that they can one day teach."
------------------------------------------------------
When I'm not here, Where can I be found?
Urban Mac User -
The only thing I like about Mac is DVD Studio Pro. Everything else I can do on PC, often better, and with a much broader choice of software.
Just my thoughts on this.Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
The other option is to buy a CPU upgrade -- a Mac accelerator card, which will offer a speed boost up to 1.7 GHz. These third-party CPU upgrades are about one half the price of a new Mac, much less if you want to risk eBay. You won't get all the speed increase as with a new Mac such as a faster bus and so on, but it may solve your problem. But some software won't work with an accelerator card.
Many Mac users (myself included) prefer the older tower Macs because they are more expandable than the new budget all-in-one units, particulary if you want to add more video cards/monitors -- essential to video editing IMHO. Many other add-on options are available via USB, but not all.
As for software, my experience is that the expensive pro studio software is equal to the PC, but the PC is better at affordable hobby applications, although iLife is pretty fine. And I have both platforms. Although the Macs are much more affordable than they used to be compared to a PC, you still pay a premium for the towers that enable extra, faster video cards... -
Originally Posted by lordsmurfKeeper of the "Unofficial" iMovie FAQ also for the lastest iMovie news click here
Your source for iMovie answers and what not! ;-) -
I'd go for the upgrade if at all possible. I have quit the windows world for good for all the usual reasons (viruses, windows blue screen of death, etc) and have never regretted it for a moment. I picked up a an AGP Sawtooth G4 minitower very inexpensively, upgraded it with a second 120 gb internal hard drive plus a firewire external 200 mb hard drive I already had, a pioneer dv-109 super drive (froogle it and get it for under $50 -- burn support in tiger for all dvd formats), got a powerlogix g4 1 gig cpu upgrade ($169 through xlr8yourmac.com's owc specials), 1 gig of ram (saving up for another 512mb) and a radeon 8500 agp sound card (the best for the agp 2x mac) off of ebay. Careful shopping and use of some components from my old blue and white kept my budget under $500 for the entire system. Tomorrow my Convertx for Mac video capture/tv tuner is set to arrive ($170 from Tech for Less) and I can't wait to try it.
If you think you might want a dual processor upgrade some day, make sure the older Mac you have or get can support it (I found out belatedly that only some Sawtooth models have a high enough "uni-m" number to handle the dual processors).
You could get a mac mini for what I spent, but minus the ram, the extra storage and the superior dvd burner, so in the end I think I got a bargain. -
Originally Posted by DanSlagle
If all you want is DV in, edit in NLE, encode to MPEG, author out to DVD, it's fine.
If you want to start running massive amount of filters, restore video, encode multiple formats, do "maintenance" style work, repair work, audio work, etc ... too limiting. Sometimes Mac has no software at all.
There are no counterparts to things like VOB Edit, Restream, DVD2AVI, Womble, Nero CD-DVD Speed, CloneCD, ISOBuster, DVD Rebulder ... and that's just looking at software on my desktop.
Apple has not deemed those things "necessary" so you don't have software for it. While new stuff pops up from time to time, most of it is recent and way behind in stability (MPEG Streamclip, BitVice, MainConcept, for example).
Any time somebody asks me "is a Mac good" I be sure to cover all these bases, often to the chagrin of Mac fanboys. So far, none seem to be flocking to this thread, so that's good. I have no bias towards anything other than "what works for what I need".
If they would put out OS X for PC, with a copy of DVDSP, I'd setup a dual-boot system 24 hours later. I far prefer the ease and pro abilities of DVDSP compared to anything found on the PC.Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
Are MAC processor speeds comparable to PC processor speeds? Or do they work more efficiently so the figures (MHz) aren't relative?
I guess what I'm basically asking is, what could get me more for $1000: A PC or a MAC?
The G4 processor I have is 500 MHz.. and I don't want to replace that. So what's a decent G4 processor speed for video? Is 500 Mhz acceptable? It seems it isn't from what I've heard, and I'm only willing to up the RAM and hard drive stuff. If not, I'm dropping the upgrading idea and starting from scratch (PC or MAC).
Which leads to the same question. With $1000 budget, what could I get more of, a PC or MAC.
I'm fine with upgrading more RAM later, but I want something functional with that price. -
Easily get more PC for $1000.
Mac costs a lot more for a lot less.Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
Originally Posted by lordsmurf
Sure you can build a nice and speedy pc for $1000, but what about the software you'd need? Plenty of free-ware, and low cost consumer grade apps, but anything pro will cost a bundle on the PC. There's also 50 million apps that do the exact same thing. Product selection is over whelming, and sometimes confusing.
Don't bother with the mini mac, it won't be any faster than what than what you already have. It's also legacy hardware that is (for the most part) non upgradable. You can opt for a faster than base MINI mac, but those are overpriced, and still use old hardware. You'd be better off just buying an upgrade card for your current MAC.
The only thing a faster CPU will do, is cut your production time down. There are quite a few of us here that started with much slower machines. I used to create SVCDs on a Pentium Pro 200, that's 36 hours to make one SVCD. Not that I want to go back to that time, but you deal with what you have.
If time rather than creativity and quality are of the essence. Buy a $300 PC, $300 Real Time MPEG capture card, $60 DVD Burner, $90 for TMPGEnc DVD Author + AC3, and have money left over for pizza beer and blank DVDs. -
I would not agree about PC software costing more. It's about even. DVDWS2 comes close to DVDSP in features, but not quite (DVDSP has more), though prices are about the same.
I'd like to hear more about WHAT the person wants to do. Still not heard that one. Mac is really more geared towards a DV solution, though there are limited copying abilities from Mac freeware.Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
I think you should reconsider your adamant opposition to upgrading your Mac's processor. It's very easy to do: Upgrading the CPU in a Mac tower is a 5-10 minute, 1 screwdriver operation, not much harder than adding RAM. The Sonnet and PowerLogix cards are self-configuring, no jumpers to mess with (opening and working on a Mac tower, IMHO, is easier than the average PC), and there is a broad price range: well under $200 for a 1.0 ghz G4 (roughly equivalent to a 1.5 ghz pentium class) to $359 for a 1.8 ghz G4 (equivalent to a 2.5 ghz pentium) to $459 for a dual processor 1.2 ghz G4, which should pack plenty of punch for most any video work. There is no doubt that the wealth of choices for software and video cards is much greater on the PC, and that is a valid determining factor in making your choice; but there is also no doubt that Tiger is a vastly superior and more efficient OS, and that, too, should figure in your final decision. If you haven't tried Tiger yet, you really should before you decide to switch back to PCs.
-
Originally Posted by disturbed1Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
Originally Posted by lordsmurf
-
Originally Posted by thoughton
I believe this has been posted here before:
http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0506intelmac.html -
Originally Posted by adcvideo
The current developer release works (barring some driver issues) on any PC, the hardware "dongle" is a planned add-on layer of "protection". (FWIW I it seems impossible that it will be an actual dongle, most speculation seems to center on a DRM-style chip). There are screenshots around of the dev release running on everything from basic Dells to high end Tablet PCs. I think it's pretty much accepted wisdom that the retail Intel OS X will be hacked to work on any PC too.
In any case, I was actually wondering if Lord Smurf would be getting the Apple-Intel hardware, and running his PC apps on that, rather than installing OS X onto the current PC. I know I certainly look forward to being able to running PC software on my Mac at near-native speeds! -
What I get next depends on what exists when I go shopping in the future. I don't bother with "looking forward" as proposed specs and final products are never the same. If Apple makes it difficult or has unreal pricing/expectations, I'll pass on their hardware/software next time too. If they want my business, they have to provide a product I can use as desired. Same goes for PC or anything else (toasters, coffee pots, cars, whatever).
At this very minute, today, for the poster shopping right now, unless you merely want a DV solution, I'd totally bypass Mac and invest in a PC. That may change someday, but not now.Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
I'd stay with the Mac and upgrade the processor (or get a new G5). One thing to consider is that Final Cut Pro has become the de factor standard for non linear editing among independent filmmakers. In fact, a system not much different from yours has been used to edit major Hollywood films.
-
Originally Posted by pduck
What the PC also has are loads of utility software for DVD work, rendering and conversion, including some great freeware, and a better choice of capture hardware at the consumer level. If I were building up a studio, I would buy a bank of G5 Macs, and have a PC as well for the occasional utility tasks that needed completing. And that may be what you will find at the professional level, or so Apple would have us believe
And, about the question if the Mhz comparison is accurate -- it used to be accepted wisdom that the G4 CPU was faster than the same speed Intel or AMD, but I don't know if this holds true today, when you can purchase a PC with all the horsepower needed for a great price. And the Macs cost a bundle if you want an expandable tower. I still believe that the capacity for second monitor or two is essential for video editing, so I would recommend to the original poster that a CPU upgrade card and a second video card such as a Radeon (a real Mac version, not a crappy ROM-hacked PC card) would be a good start if you already own some good Mac software that works for you.
Cheers -
Honestly, how can someone with a ~$1K hardware budget also afford Final Cut Pro?
-
In my opinion, upgrade the mac. Anything my clients need, I can produce on my mac. It has been my cornerstone for video production (but then again, thats just my opinion. There are many good things about PCs.)
-
Originally Posted by sjk
You can do that with most software. Forget MSRP.Want my help? Ask here! (not via PM!)
FAQs: Best Blank Discs • Best TBCs • Best VCRs for capture • Restore VHS -
What I plan to do is DV editing... transfer footage to the HD, edit, a authoring it to DVD. That simple. I've got a bundle of software for my MAC already, including FCP3, and I have access to a bunch of other software. That's not the case though. I'm just concerned with hardware, a fast system that doesn't have me sitting and waiting for day-long render times. I mean, that's understandable for a +2 hour long project, but I think anything is faster than my PC.
As for a mac, the G5 dual processors need a mobo that has two sockets or is that like a single unit hyperthreading processor?
To answer your questions, yeah editing, I'm starting an independent film company and want a station for doing just that.
So if I were to go out and buy a G4 or G5 processor upgrade, would there be an issue with the mobo accepting it? Or are all Mac mobo's compatible with upping processor speeds?
I'm fairly happy with Adobe Premiere for my editing, so with that for PC, I basically need DVD authoring software. -
Originally Posted by lordsmurf
Instead of just wasting the summer away on the couch, enroll in your local community college in an "intro to DV" or "Digital Scrapboking" class,
and reap the benefits of an educatioanl discount.
much cheaper than MSRP. -
Your G4 PowerMac can handle with virtually no effort any of the commercially available G4 single CPU processor upgrade cards out there -- Sonnet, PowerLogix, OWC, Giga Designs (which has the most powerful available at 2 ghz). But only SOME older PowerMacs can handle dual processors; you have to get a bit of free software and verify your uni-m number is 7 or higher for dual processor compatibility. The Giga Designs web site has the links and support info you'll need to do this: http://www.buygiganow.com/dualcomp.html .
There are no G5 upgrades for the older PowerMacs.
Obviously, your rendering/encoding times will be reduced by getting the fastest upgrade you can afford. The PowerLogix 1 ghz G4s start at $177, and they go up to $380-$400 for the 1.7 and 1.8 ghz models.
One consideration -- and perhaps someone else on the list can answer this -- is whether a 1 or 1.2 ghz dual processor upgrade would be faster
for your purposes than a 1.8 ghz single G4 (because they are likely to be similarly priced). -
Originally Posted by lordsmurf
-
Were did you see Academic Pricing for FCP at $499?
The Twilight Zone? Beverly Hills? Or just Apple direct?
I know for a fact that FCP 5
(upgrade from previous) can
be had for about $380.
You just need to check with either your
local campus bookstore, or
have an educator releative look into it for you.
( it's what I did)"Everyone has to learn, so that they can one day teach."
------------------------------------------------------
When I'm not here, Where can I be found?
Urban Mac User -
$499 is Apple's non-upgrade price; I didn't see one for the upgrade.
Anyway, my point wasn't about finding the lowest price (which is certainly worth looking for, of course), just that someone on a fairly limited budget will want to remember that video software like FCP, even when discounted, is a significantly more expensive investment than some $15 shareware tool. For instance, it's not uncommon to see DVDSP and ffmpegX mentioned in the same posting, almost as though both are just as affordably available for everyone. That's all. -
but both are essential to a "videographer's" toolbox,
if you will.
While I understand your statement of
"almost as though both are just as affordable",
the REALITY of the case is that, in the course of
helping someone, would you rather we just post
(a) all shareware at the same price point, even
if that piece of shareware is NOT right for the
course of action,
or (b) point the user in the direction to get his
questioned answered, with the BEST tools
for the job?
I kinda go more for (b) and I dunno, maybe
EXPECT people to have a little COMMON SENSE
and look up the tools mentioned in a post to
help them get back on track
[ they do come up highlighted in RED for a reason, after
all], and use the information to look at the price
in the "TYPE" listing to see how much it is, to
determine if they are willing to pay that much to accomplish
[insert task here]?
No one said what we do here was going to be
easy or not cost/free.
Whether time or money, it always costs SOMETHING.
just depends on which is worth more to you,
the individual, i guess....
*shrugs*"Everyone has to learn, so that they can one day teach."
------------------------------------------------------
When I'm not here, Where can I be found?
Urban Mac User
Similar Threads
-
Windows 7 is out, have you upgraded?
By Baldrick in forum PollsReplies: 84Last Post: 6th Jan 2012, 16:56 -
I upgraded an old PC and use it to rip BDs
By barkinglama in forum Newbie / General discussionsReplies: 37Last Post: 30th Sep 2010, 18:36 -
Upgraded Ram memory?
By neworldman in forum ComputerReplies: 13Last Post: 25th Jul 2010, 22:24 -
Have you upgraded to a HD camcorder?
By Baldrick in forum PollsReplies: 18Last Post: 8th Nov 2009, 19:36 -
Have you upgraded to WIFI N yet?
By yoda313 in forum PollsReplies: 14Last Post: 25th Jun 2007, 19:16