Canopus ADVC-100 vs. ATI ALL-IN-WONDER RADEON 8500DV 64MBDDR

[LABachlr]

Which produces better quality? Judging by the price of each, it is most likely the Canopus ADVC-100, but is the quality that much better that it can justify spending $125 - $150 more? The ATI AIW is AGP, btw.

Please vote and post a message noting which one you voted for and why.

Thanks.

EDIT

I added the Canopus ADVC-50, as it is more around the ATI AIW's price range, and only lacks analog video out when comparing to the Canopus ADVC-100.

[TBoneit]

I have both, The ATI is very easy to lose audio/video sync compared to ADVC-100

Capture quality is better with the Canopus too.

It does a much, much better job on VHS tapes.

However YMMV.
For the money the ATI is Ok, But since I'm doing DVDs I want the besty results. SO I use the Canopus.

Cheers

[LABachlr]

Cool. Thanks.

[LABachlr]

Also, which of the above products allow you to turn off Macrovision? I know that the ADVC-100 does, but how about the other two?

[vhelp]

labachlr,

I've ben testing out my new Osprey-210 that I purchased two weeks ago
for $165 (retail $199) and as far as quality goes it's as good as the ADVC-100
or better (in picture quality) but that's just my opinion, and i'm still testing
this card out, so expect different comments from me. I seem to be the only
person w/ this card, cause there's no posting in the Capture Cards section
Maybe I should post my comments/experience there, and be the first ??

Anyways.. my point to add is like this..

I do LOTS of capturing, and usually short ones for testings purposes, and
one thing that drive's me crazy is the slowness I have in setting up the
Osprey-210 (any analog capture card) under AVI_IO (or other app) vs.
the ADVC-100 capture activation quickness. It's a tad bit too slow in setting
up the capture w/ analog cards, caues usually, I have the Overlay turned
on, and I:
* sometimes forget I have it on, and waist a good (and quick) capture of
something I that caught my eye or attention, or
* after the Overlay crash, I have to restart the capture (loosing my moment)
and reset to Preview mode, and then re-start my captures.

Other times, I have select a few other settings to get it working up to speed.
When you're doing lots of quick and small captures, you don't want to have
sluggishness your main concirn.

With my ADVC-100, I have quick turn-around. I have it down to a system..
* under DVIO, all I do is press my the "capture video from camera" button
and (after I increment my counter) and away I go.

If I catch something else after I've stopped the capture, I quickly increment
the counter, and press capture button. It's that simple, and quick - - and I'm
done !!

IF ONLY SOMEONE COULD REVISE DVIO W/ THE OPTION FOR AN
INCREMENT !!

my DV files are like this.. 10.01.AVI then I increment the BLUE digit by one number,
and the rest is selef explanitory.

So, there are some good points for this External DV box.

Well, that's my experience, thus far. ..and good luck in yours.
-vhelp

[LABachlr]

Thanks, vhelp.

[dimentia]

hey I just posted a thread about Dell's bundled capture solution. does anybody have any input on how the dell solution compares to these cards?

[rhegedus]

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=156582&highlight=

[LABachlr]

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=156582&highlight=

Thanks, Rob. I actually read that thread. I just figured I would take a poll.

I just quickly re-read it, and it did mention that Macrovision could be turned off with the ATI AIW card (which I missed the first time around), but it was never confirmed or denied for the Canopus 50. It was just mentioned that one of the posters "read it somewhere". I wanted to have confirmation from an experienced poster.

[rhegedus]

I'm not aware of a way to disable macrovision on the ADVC-50. Sorry.

I swear by the ADVC-100, but then I've not used an AIW card so I can't really compare the Canopus to it.

I think in the search for the 'best' capture hardware the quality of the source material often get's overlooked. I'm presuming that most people will be capturing in an attempt to put their VHS collection onto either (S)VCD or DVD. Most of these VHS tapes will be a couple of years old and thus the quality of the content may not be as good as what it initially was. In conditions such as this I don't think that there will be much to separate the Canopus and AIW cards (though those that use both claim that the Canopus is better at capturing lower quality VHS).

Given all the variables that can effect the quality of a signal even before you get to the capture stage (VHS tape, VHS player, cables) and then the output format and bitrate, I'd think that the differences between two very good cards aren't worth worrying about. Go with what you feel comfortable with, both in terms of experience and in terms of finance.

[LABachlr]

Thanks for your wise advice, Rob. I'll take it into consideration when making my decision.

[rhegedus]

Having just seen your PC specs, I'm sure you don't need to be told that your 16Mb Voodoo is a bit long in the tooth. I think that the move for an AIW will be better for your PC and captures than the addition of a Canopus. Use the money you've 'saved' by not buying a Canopus ona 120Gb hard drive - you're going to need it!

[LABachlr]

Having just seen your PC specs, I'm sure you don't need to be told that your 16Mb Voodoo is a bit long in the tooth. I think that the move for an AIW will be better for your PC and captures than the addition of a Canopus. Use the money you've 'saved' by not buying a Canopus ona 120Gb hard drive - you're going to need it!

LOL. Yeah, I know. Vid card is ancient. I plan on building a new killer system soon anyway. But in the meantime, yes, I should replace the vid card. I just don't want to have issues with anything when I am capturing, especially the audio synch, as I will be producing products for clients.

But I also need to get a DVD burner for myself, and the one I want is the Sony DW-U10A. I want to be able to deal with both DVD-R/RW and DVD+R/RW in case some of my clients deal with DVD+R/RW, as one did already. So, I could use the extra cash for that.

And yes, I know I will need the 120GB drive eventually. I already do have a 60GB 7200RPM IBM, a 40GB 7200RPM WD, as you know, and I have another 40GB 7200RPM WD that I just got, but I might use that for a system that I am going to build for my sister.

BTW, I know that you don't deal with ATI AIW cards, but do you happen to know if there is much difference between the ATI All-In-Wonder Radeon 8500DV 64MB DDR, and the ATI ALL-IN-WONDER RADEON 7500 64MB AGP DDR? I assume you still capture with firewire with the 7500 (what's with the "DV" after "8500", but not after "7500")?

Also, in the thread that you mentioned, that I read, it mentioned that all ATI AIW cards use the same hardware, that it is the software that is different. Is this true, and does that mean the quality of the captures are going to be the same?

[LABachlr]

Nice system, by the way, Rob.

[TBoneit]

a. The 8500 is supposed to be a better chip for games than the 7500, In general the higher the number on ATI the better for games, Right now the AIW 9700 will give good capture & very good gaming.

b. the AIW cards marked DV have analog S-Video & Composite inputs and a Firewire connector so that you can do both.

c. The main drawback of the AIW series (having had several & a ADVC-100) is that you use your sound card to capture sound... this could lead to poor quality sound, noise in the sound, or Sound/Video sync issues.

As I say I've used many video capture devices over the years, and now use the ADVC-100 99% of the time.


In fact I just ran across my second video capture device from the 80s, it only captured still images as I remember. It is on a 8 bit ISA card, A Computer Eyes Pro.

Cheers

[LABachlr]

Thanks for the heads up on the sound issue. I didn't know that I would have to capture the sound with my sound card, but that obviously makes sense. Good point.

Don't do much gaming right now, so that is not an issue. But I would like to make sure that my vid card, 16MB voodoo1, is good enough if I were to get the canopus ADVC-100.

And I guess you're saying that the cards that don't have "DV" don't have a firewire input, but do have a firewire output. But correct me if I am wrong.

Thanks.

[TBoneit]

Almost forgot, All the AIW cards also have a Tuner with Coaxial input, No RF Output, S-Video & Composite outputs as well as inputs.

Non DV AIWs have no firewire on them... It's the same firewire port for input/output. That is why you can hook a hard disk or DVD-RW or CD-RW to them.

The soundcard isssue is one reason I switched to teh Canopus. Sound is important to me when I do a music video type program or Clip.

I can hear the background noise on a Fleetwood Mac PBS special I did on the ATI AIW.

Good Luck

[jar5000]

I'm currently using the AIW8500DV to cap vhs. I've been pretty happy with the results but only after hours and hours of reading guides and forums to get the right settings in VirtualDub and TMPGenc. I've always wondered if I could have saved myself a bunch of time by just picking up one of these Canopus ADVC100's.
I am assuming however that if you use this Canopus device to cap in raw AVI format using DVIO, your file sizes for a 90 or 120 minute VHS would be huge. (I use MJPEG to compress the avi and average about 12-15 Gigs for 90 minutes)Wouldnt this also cause your encoding times in TMPGenc to skyrocket....am I correct?
My goal was to find an efficient way to cap and encode my tapes to burn to DVD (I've got a lot to do). Like I said, I've been pleased with my results so far when I compare the original tape to my DVDs. I just wanted to know if I could save time and significantly improve quality by switching to the Canopus or a hardware based encoder.

[rhegedus]

Don't do much gaming right now, so that is not an issue. But I would like to make sure that my vid card, 16MB voodoo1, is good enough if I were to get the canopus ADVC-100.

If all you're doing is projecting a desktop image to your monitor and NO gaming, then you're Voodoo will be OK with the Canopus. The beauty of the Canpus is that you can get excellent captures with a PC that's past it since all the hard work is done on-board. Having captured using a WinTV card on a PIII 700, I know that a system can be put under strain when capturing using a PCI device. The flip side of this is that you get 13Gb/hr DV avi files that you then need to do some processor intensive stuff on to get it into a useable form.

txpharoah is the 'man with the plan' to speak to if you're going to go down the AIW road and want to get it 100%

[LABachlr]

Thanks a lot for all of your info. Based on the response and very informative posts, I am going to save up for the Canopus ADVC-100. I need something that will give me high quality, high reliability, and ease of use, and the Canopus is going to be my capturing device of choice.

Rob, you referred me to txpharoah who has the guide when using ATI AIW cards. Could you possibly point me to the guide when capturing with the Canopus ADVC-100, settings and all? I would like to capture VHS tapes, and then make a DVD out of them with menus and all, like iDVD. Appreciate the help. I am willing to get any software that you suggest.

And just in case you are not familiar with iDVD, the menus that it can make are pretty impressive. When you pop in the DVD, the menu that pops up consists of the entire background being a video that is consitently playing, along with mini menus that are each playing their respective videos in their windows (much like the scene selections section on a commercial DVD like The Matrix). And you can also make it so that when you click on one menu, it goes to another page vs. going straight to the video.

[rhegedus]

OK

1) Scenalyzer for capturing http://www.scenalyzer.com/main.html
2) TMPGEnc for encoding avi to MPEG2 http://www.tmpgenc.net/e_main2.html
3) TMPGEnc DVD Author for authoring http://www.pegasys-inc.com/e_main.html
4) Any burning progran should be OK - I use Nero 5.5.10.15 http://www.nero.com/en/index.html#c1002822566925

I'm pretty sure that all these programs have a 30 day trial period, so be sure to use it to the full and feel comfortable with the programs and processes involved before you shell out any hard earned ca$h.

There are a few guides and suggestion on this site about the best settings for VHS to DVD:

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=127563
The third poster hits the nail right on the head - these are the setting I use.

[rhegedus]

Sorry - Just read your posts about iDVD. I'm not that familiar with the more advanced DVD authoring programs - I started simple and sort of stayed there since there was no need to explore further!

[LABachlr]

OK. Cool. Thanks a lot for the info, Rob.

BTW, I did some quick research, and I think DVD Workshop will do the trick with regards to a software pkg equivalent to iDVD. If anyone has a better suggestion, however, do tell.

[txpharoah]

I like DVDit! but keep your eye on DVDlab.

[LABachlr]

OK. Cool. I'll check them both out. Thanks.

Why do you prefer DVDit! over DVD Workshop?