Subtitles question ...

[Liru]

I added subtitles to VCDs using this method with no problems.

However, i'd like to do some optimization on this process.

If you have a 16:9 resolution movie as the source and you want to convert it to VCD, you get 2 black borders above and below the picture if you have a 4:3 TV system.

The question is: how can i position the subtitle below the picture, on the bottom black border?

I couldn't find any option in the subtitle plugin for Virtualdub and the SRTtoSSA converter only lets you to choose a min of zero pixels, but from the bottom of the picture, not of the screen .....

I wonder, is this possible?

Thanx,
Liru

[sterno]

If you manually resize and letterbox the source to VCD resolution before adding the subtitles they'll be positioned in the bottom part of the image, which should mostly be in the letterboxing.

[jimA]

Could U elaborate please ?

How do I manually resize and letterbox the source to SVCD resolution ?

Can it be done using virtualdub and tmpgenc ?

thx
/jim

[sterno]

VirtualDub and avisynth are both capable of resizing and letterboxing your video. tmpgenc normally does this for you, but in this case you're trying to add something in to the letterboxing before sending it to tmpgenc.

If you have a 16:9 anamorphic source, you would resize it to 352x180 (VCD NTSC) and add 30 pixels top and bottom to letterbox it to full VCD resolution. For NTSC SVCD you would resize it to 480x360 with 60 pixels top and bottom. I don't remember the sizes for PAL, but you could use FitCD to calculate them (or to get the exact numbers for NTSC, the ones I use are close enough to look right but some people want more precise resizing).

With the standard VirtualDub resize filter you'd set the video resolution and then use "add frame and letterbox" with the frame size set to the VCD/SVCD standard resolution. With avisynth you'd use bilinearresize/bicubicresize to resize the video and addborders to add the letterboxing.

[Liru]

sterno, m8, thanx for your suggestions. I fully understood and tested this filter.

Actually, the video size doesn't change, i just add the black letterbox to it and the result is a multiple of the VCD resolution needed.

The questions are: do i lose quality by doing this? What filter mode should i use to get the best quality? Can i do this without actually having to re-encode the file?

Thanx for your patience.

Cheers,
Liru

[sterno]

do i lose quality by doing this?

Depends on the source, if the source material is already at VCD (or lower) quality it'll get worse just because it has to be reencoded. If the source is better than VCD quality it should be fine, though.

What filter mode should i use to get the best quality?

Do you mean bilinear vs. bicubic? Bicubic tends to give better quality at the expense of taking longer, but when the image is made smaller bilinear tends to be about as good and runs faster. But that's just a rule of thumb, and not all thumbs are the same size. I would suggest encoding a short sample clip each way and comparing to see which one you like better.

Can i do this without actually having to re-encode the file?

No. You're actually changing the picture, so it has to be encoded again.

[Liru]

I thought about something: what if i put 2 filters at the same time in VirtualDub. 1st the resize filter and then the subtitle one and frameserve all to TMPGEnc? I'll get this way a VCD with subs added in the letterbox area? And no intermediate AVI ....

Is it possible?

Thanx for your advice.

[sterno]

You can use as many filters as you want and frameserve to tmpgenc with no intermediate AVI.

[jimA]

First off, thx for the help.

In my situation, I have a .avi in 2.35:1, ntsc-film. Is this "an anamorphic source" ?

I want to watch it on my 16:9 tv. I want it to be letterboxed so I can use the tv's zoom mode, to zoom in, and move the picture up. This means I want a lot of black border. The top border will disappear, when I move the picture up, and there will be plenty of bottom black border for the subs.

If I use the resize filter, I can check the "add frames and letterbox", but then the resulting movie is squeezed, so everyone is tall and thin.

Should I then use some special settings in tmpgenc ? Normally (when I don't have subs) I use 16:9 in the "Aspect ratio" and 1:1 in the "Source" when I use Tmpgenc, and then I use the tv's 16:9 setting, which stretches the mpeg. The tv's zoom-setting doesn't stretch the picture.

Now that I think of it, another way to put it is "I only want a border below the movie, but a big fat one"

thx for the already valuable help
/jim

[sterno]

First: AVI files are almost always encoded for playback on a computer screen, so the original source aspect ratio is 1:1/VGA, non-anamorphic.

Second: When you resize in VirtualDub, you'll need to do the aspect ratio correction to change that to 4:3. Download FitCD and use it to calculate the right resolution. Once you've resized it and converted it to 4:3, your source aspect ratio in tmpgenc is 4:3. If you normally make your VCDs in 16:9, I don't think that there is any particular reason you can't do it when you have subtitles - just replace 4:3 with 16:9 in the previous statements.

Third: I don't think the standard VirtualDub resize filter or tmpgenc arrange method know how to put different borders on top and bottom. However, it's trivial to do it in avisynth with AddBorders. It might be worth your time to learn the basics of avisynth, it's really not that hard and will often be faster than VirtualDub. Also remember that even if you do it at 16:9 you'll want to keep a small border at the top to allow for overscan.

[aguillon]

Friend, your solution was perfectly correct: first apply the resize filter (I use the smart resize filter by Donald Graft, no need to do any calculations, very simple in any case - use Bicubic and not nearest neighbour if you want better quality), in my case I already resize to VCD size before frameserving (352x288 for Pal, 320x240 for Ntsc).

Once this filter has been applied and your letterboxing is in place, apply the second filter, in our case the TextSub filter for instance (comes with Vobsub) - your subtitles should show up at the bottom, inside the black borders. Adjust style and position if needed, then frameserve. Works every time.

Little trick: you can actually preview the result from within the resize filter 'Preview' function - once both filters have been applied, it will show you the subtitles as well

[Tonio Roffo]

Don't put subtitles in the black border - widescreen users won't be happy as they will lose the subtitles off screen...

[jimA]

Only if it's 16:9 format, not if it's 2.35:1

/jim

[ladieskiller101]

I just wanna chime in here a little bit. I have problem making permanet subtitles for VCD, and I don't know what I did wrong. Before, I did make permanent subs for VCD and it works really well (and i am using the guides that using virtualdub with subtitles filter having in this web site). But i don't know why after i reinstall all my vobsub, virtualdubs and everything, I can't make it work any more. Do you guys have any idea on this? I did axactly the same like the guy that show me. Does it have anything with me install the warez incorrectly? Or, you guys have any comments? Thanks alot.