the best cd media

[gops782]

i want to build a collection on vcds and svcds, but i want to use media that i know will work the best w/ dvd players.
so i decided to take a poll... what's the best cd media available for vcds? and where can i get it?

also i've seend all of these sony and memorex media designed especially f/ music cds... they're a lot more expensive as well... does anyone know if they're better f/ vcds?

all replies appreciated

[sterno]

i want to build a collection on vcds and svcds, but i want to use media that i know will work the best w/ dvd players.
so i decided to take a poll... what's the best cd media available for vcds? and where can i get it?

The best media is the kind that works best with your player. In terms of media quality, Taiyo-Yuden, Verbatim, Kodak, and Mitsui tend to be some of the best. Compatibility is another matter, though.

Many players (and almost all computer CD drives) will use dirt-cheap generic media just fine. Some set-top DVD players actually work better with the cheap garbage like the 50/100-disc Imation spools that are always on sale. You just have to test to see what your player likes. You can also check the comments on your DVD player in the list on this site to see if other people have said that certain kinds don't work, and search the forum for the (many) other posts about this.

also i've seend all of these sony and memorex media designed especially f/ music cds... they're a lot more expensive as well... does anyone know if they're better f/ vcds?

No. They're also not better for music, unless you have a component audio CD recorder that requires them. In general, the same applies to the "black" CD-Rs that some people insist are better quality.

[hwoodwar]

Gops782:

I have done some extensive searching about this subject on the internet. One day I spent over four hours, trying to find a general consensus as to which CD-Rs are the best quality blanks. During my search I found more people recommended Fuji, Kodak (no longer being produced they dropped their CD-R line) and Taiyo Yuden. Fuji's latest 48x CD-Rs are made by Taiyo Yuden.

My research also showed that CD-Rs are kind of like VCRs in that there are lots of different companies that put their name on a product, but in actuality there are much fewer manufacturers and many are relabelled to a particular companies' name.

There are utilities out there that will do a test and tell you the "true" manufacturer of a CD-R disk. I use one called CDR Identifier.

I am a firm believer in "You get what you paid for." I expect you will get some answers like "I just buy the cheapest I can find" or "I have never made a coaster with XXX brand." Consider this: there is a lot more to quality that just, can I do a successfull write the first time. Some other charcteristics to think about are: scratch resistance, will the dye fade with time or heat, will the surface peel with time, will random errors appear with time, etc.

Now that I have found out the above mentioned information, I only buy Fuji CD-Rs as they are the only ones of the three that I mentioned that I can readily find in my area. The cheapest I have ever found these is $15 USD/50 CD spindle.

Here are a few links for you:

http://www.cdrlabs.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=4248

http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?s=ce7d76fe3a1f62a20424e6dc3cc06afa&threadid=57462

http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?s=ce7d76fe3a1f62a20424e6dc3cc06afa&threadid=42...5&pagenumber=1

[gops782]

thanks for the replies, i also agree in you get what you pay for. but then i've also found on some players only real cheap ones work. i don't just want these f/ my player but also to use on other players. i guess i'll have to try fuji then...

i also believe it might be an issue with my player, its an msi DragonWriter 48x16x48 CD-RW. even though it's 48, if i burn any image, vcd, or audio cd, more than 8x i start getting problems... does anyone else know of this issue? could it just be a defective burner?

[defense]

@Hwoodwar, I think you might want to do a little more research. You are gonna probably be in for a big surprise in a couple of years with those FUJI CDR's. I few years back BEFORE I knew much about burning MP3's, etc, a friend of mine got a burner when they were very expensive. He burned a few cdr's for me on Memorex and Fuji. To get straight to the point, I did my own testing and found that IMATION as "INEXPENSIVE" NOT "CHEAP" as they are, work incredible. I have HONESTLY NEVER HAD A SINGLE PROBLEM WITH ONE. And I've only made about 600 MP3's CDR's with them. I think that's safe enough to say they are the BOMB to say the least. As far as the Memorex from a few years ago, the three or four that I have still play perfectly, but what about the Fuji from a few years ago. Those FUJI pieces of CRAP are PEELING!! THE DAMN DIE ON ALL THREE OF THEM ARE LITERALLY COMING OFF AND CHIPPING! It has nothing to do with how I handle them, because I keep my place VERY cool, at about 70 degrees at the hottest. I'm here in Miami, and I know Heat can cause damage, so I'm careful with that. I'm also careful with how I handle CD's, DVD'S, etc....it would be virtually impossible for anyone to take greater care with CDR'S, DVD's, etc..then I do. My point is that out of well over 600 CDR's made, the ONLY THREE that have any physical problems, are the FUJI's. That's probably why their DVD blanks are some of the cheapest at BEST BUY, because buying them would be a WORST BUY! I'm still shocked that people think Imation are "cheap"..they may be "inexpensive", but they are FAR from Cheap. They burn and play so pefectly, I thought initially they were the best on the market, until recently where I keep reading people talking about how little they cost. And one last thing about those FUJI jokers....If ONE had this peeling of the dye happening to them I would say, ok....that must just be bad luck...BUT ALL THREE...and one last thing to note is that ALL of them were givin' to me within a month or two and came from DIFFERENT purchases, so they were NOT from the same batch. Amazingly though, the FUJI's still play from beginning to end, perfectly, ...AT LEAST FOR NOW...but either tonight, or tomorrow, I am going to transfer the music to my hard drive and reburn with those big, bad, Imations, unsing RECORDNOW Max of course!

[Valnar]

Defense,
Load up one of those Fuji's and look at the ATIP with CDRIdentifier.exe. I'd be curious to know who made them for Fuji, since they have a couple different manufacturers.

The current ones "made in Japan" are really Taiyo Yuden's, and some of the best.

Robert

[DVD ER]

I prefer Taiyo Yuden CDR's. I get the lowest defective rate from using this type of media. I would recommend them to anyone. I get my Taiyo Yuden's from http://www.cdrsolutions.com They seem to have a steady supply and are never on backorder. They also have the lowest posted price around.


DVD ER

[ZippyP.]

You can get the cd maker info. in Vcdeasy as well.
tools>cdrao tools>disc info

[Super Warrior]

i want to build a collection on vcds and svcds, but i want to use media that i know will work the best w/ dvd players.
so i decided to take a poll... what's the best cd media available for vcds? and where can i get it?

also i've seend all of these sony and memorex media designed especially f/ music cds... they're a lot more expensive as well... does anyone know if they're better f/ vcds?

all replies appreciated

The white labeled,700MB Memorex CD-Rs are definitly the best CD-Rs around.I've always used them,not just in VCD/SVCD burning,but in everything.And they've always burned and played perfect.They are decently cheap as well,i can find 50 packs of memorex CD-Rs for $15 at wal-mart.

As far as 700MB CD-Rs are concerned,nothing beats these

[defense]

@ valnar, no prob...where can I get that cdidentifier? I have ADVDINFO, but i'm sure cdidentifier is something similar, but for cd's. I will load up the fuji's and let you know. I still thing it is extremely interesting that those are the ONLY ones that has happened to.

[furball6969]

If you ask me, the best cd's are the cheapest ones. Currently they are about 30.00 CAD for a 100 spindle. The only discs I ever had a problem with were some Verbatim's that I paid $15.00 a peice for about 7 years ago.

[David K]

No one has mentioned Maxell CD-R Pro which claim to have a unique triple coating process to protect them. Their CD identifier is Taiyo Yuden. I've been using these for certain Discs that I really want to preserve for the ages (my digital photos for example). They're a bit more expensive, but are still around a dollar each, and they do occasionally go on sale.

(The CD FAQ website notes that the identifier names only refer to the master disc origin and only indicate how the Disc was supposed to be put together, not how it was actually put together.)

I've never had my CD burner reject or not sucessfully write any brand of CD-R or CD-RW. I buy a lot of cheap K hypermedia media on sale in its various marketing names (After rebate, Staples is currently literally giving it away under the "Optmum" label.) Nor have I ever had any problem with my DVD player reading any CD media.

The only discs I have ever had any physical deterioration with are Jensen high speed CD-RWs. After only a few re-writes, the data layer begain peeling off from the edges. I've never had that problems with any other CD-RW brand, be it "cheap " K Hypermedia or more expensive Memorex.

But the truth of the matter is we have no way of knowing how individual media wil hold up in the long run. For anything you really care about make two copies.

[Faustus]

The best? Taiyo Yuden or Mitsui

[RacerXRed]

I used to use the PNY black-coated CDR's 'till Best Buy stopped carrying them. Now I use the black-coated TDK's or Memorex's.

[puertorican138]

Fuji Film (the ones made by Taiyo Yuden) and Verbatim are the highest quality of CD-R.

[defense]

puertorican138 said:

Fuji Film (the ones made by Taiyo Yuden) and Verbatim are the highest quality of CD-R.

I guess the fuji disks I have mentioned above were NOT made by Taiyo Yuden, huh? Also, I'm curious as to "where" you rate "IMATION" CD-R's and RW's for that matter? I ONLY buy Imation CDR's and RW's over the last few years, because I have NEVER had a SINGLE problem with ANY of them. I have made probably around 600 or so. I would have to rate those disks as the BEST. At least for me they are. But what would make your Taiyo Yuden's or your Verbatim's better then the Imations which I have NEVER had a problem with? What's even better for me, is that those Imations are very inexpensive, usually. I'm just curious though as to what would make those other disks BETTER then the Imation CDR's and more specifically, where do those Imations rate?

[defense]

Ok, I finally ran CDRidentifier on several types of CDR media. I think there are some interesting results. First, those SHIT FUJI disks that I have...boy am I glad I only have 3, because not only is the die coming off on the bottom of the disk...but it is also chipping and peeling on the top. UNREAL! I was VERY hesitant to even put those Shit disks in my DRU500a to let them be read, but I made sure that there were no loose chips and brushed off any pieces of loose die.

Anyway, here are the results. For the FUJI media, then manufacturer is NOT Taiyo Yuden, at least not on mine. The manufacturer is: FUJI PHOTO FILM CO. LTD & the dye information says: DYE: Long Strategy, e.g. Cyanine, Azo, etc.


Now for some other manufacturer's disks. Those Memorex that have been photo'd above are NOT made by Memorex. At least not the ones I have. I have about 5-10 Memorex disks, most of them, exactly like the ones listed above, and a couple of them are GOLD on the non-write side or the "top." BOTH Memorex disk types are manufacturered by:

CMC Magnetics Corp.

Dye: Short Strategy, e.g. Phtyalocyanine

What is interesting is that for the IMATION disks which I have been praising, from BOTH the NEW batch which I currently have, as well as old Imation disks I purchased a couple of years ago..the manufacturer ID is ALSO CMC Magnetics Corp, and the die is the EXACT same. I think that is pretty interesting that the same company makes the Memorex & the Imation disks. All I can say is that CMC magnetics does an AMAZING job because ALL of my Imation disks look the same now, as the day I bought them. Those crap Fuji's I have look like they were run over by Large Marge! No wonder they aren't making their own disks anymore..lol.

Now, for a couple of other manufacturer's info. I have a couple of Maxell disks from 3 or 4 years ago. They are a nice, shiny Goldish on the top, not a DULL Gold like a lot of other manufacturers. Anyway, their info is as follows:

Manufacturer: Hitachi Maxell, Ltd
Dye: Long, e.g. Cyanine, Azo, etc.


Next, those Verbatim disks that puertorican138 said were the best. At least the couple of Verbatim disks that I have from a couple of years ago, which are still in perfect condition as well...their info is as follows:

Manufacturer: Mistsubishi Chermicals Corp.
Dye: Long, e.g. Cyanine, Azo, etc.


@ Anyone, or puertorican138, with this information, I am even more confident that my Imations are the best. If they aren't the best, then they are right up there with the best, and it would be difficult for anyone to tell me how they couldn't be the best when I've never had a single problem with any of them, and they play and look as smoothly now, as they did the first day I bought them.

[weeyoo]

I concur with the guy above that suggested the memorex cd-r's, but do
NOT use the ones produced in TAIWAN, only use the discs from JAPAN. The Japanese produced ones have a blue coating. The packaging states where they came from. If you use the Taiwan disc, IT WILL HAVE ERRORS ON OVERBURN. But i agree that memeorex is the best i have used.

[puertorican138]

The reason why I choose Verbatim and Fuji Film as the best (The FujiFilm's made by Taiyo Yuden) is because they use special dyes for burning. Verbatim especially. :P

[gmatov]

This is a most interesting thread. No one agrees with anyone about anything, and I'm no exception. I have name brand, expensive (relatively) disks that won't burn to rated speed. I have had ( can't get 'em anymore ) absolutely no marking, CompUSA, 5 bucks a stack, no rebate, unrated disks that burn at 48X with my LiteOn, I have Fuji 24X, limit 16, PNY 32X, limit 16, ATT 40X, burn at 48X everytime. Maxell, Memorex, Imation? Who cares? Where is there a chart that tells you " This brand will do this...."?
The identifying numbers and letters returned with Info tool don't seem to be that much help, as no 2 of my disks has the same group of identifiers, if they are, indeed, even identifiers. 2 disks, same process, same dye, same everything, burn at different speeds. Is it Smartburn? Does the manufacturer tell the burner that, well yes, we claim 48X, but we'd feel better if you burned at 16X?
You can't tell what you bought till you open the stack and run Info tool, or something else, and even that doesn't help me, because, sonomagun, this stack won't burn at speed. What, I take an open spindle back and say, I don't want them, because they don't deliver. I'm using up the ones limited to 16X to get done with them, but who's to say the next 48X spindle will, actually, do 48?
Personally, I'll go with furball on this one. If the damn things won't do the rated speed, and do burn data reliably, why pay top dollar to sit and wait for them to burn at half or less of the speed you thought you paid for.
And, too. Who wrote the rule that says the disk brand you swear by this month will be made by the same factory next month? If factory B can undercut Factory A by a penny a disk, you can be pretty damn sure Company A is gonna brand Factory B's disks next month. Hey, bottom line is bottom line, and us peons are always looking for a bargain. They'll sell 'em, and we're the ones who will sit and twiddle our thumbs waiting. And waiting. And waiting. If I wanted 16X, Ida bought another 16X instead of this 48. And why go to 52? Because it's there? Gimme a break!!!

[gmatov]

David K,
Most interesting post about the Optimum media that Staples is giving away.I bought a couple spindles, for 2 cents apiece after rebate, who could resist?
However, my Khypermedia disks ID as CMC Magnetics products, code 97m26s66f, whatever that means. My Optimum disks ID as Mitsubishi, code 97m34s23f. I haven't the foggiest f'in notion what this means.
My Khypermedia is Dye Type 6, Short Strategy, Phthalocyanine.
My Optimum is Dye Type 3, Long Strategy, Cyanine AZO.
No, if you are right, and I am also not bullshitting anyone, is it possible that a brand needs X million disks for this month, no factory can provide X million this month, so Brand? says send what you can, with our label, and we'll spindle and wrap with our logo?
Are you and I buying the same disk, just because we are buying the same brand, from the same retail house, with the same rebate, at the same time?
Or are we getting whatever they were able to buy to fulfill the demand their marketing department said they were going to have to meet? Which is a whole 'nother animal, as I'm sure you've hustled down to get them Sunday afternoon, right after the Sunday paper came out, and found that they are already sold out. Man, they sure do move them disks, don't they?
Can anyone tell me just what the hell the msf numbers mean?
George

[SatStorm]

After many tests, for VCD/SVCD, I only use black media, like Prodisc, TDK (it is the same CD, only the label change). Cost more, but last longer

[gmatov]

SatStorm,
What does lasts longer mean? They supposedly do advanced testing on these things, but I would say it's like giving a rat 2 barrells a day of sacharrin. It is said to cause cancer. Do they put the disks in an oven at 300 degrees and say that's the equivalent of 100 years at 88 degrees. You don't know, and I don't know how long they are going to last. We hear rumors, but is it so?
A few posts back, Defense said the die is "literally chipping off". Well, the die substrate is supposedly sandwiched between 2 layers of lexan polycarbonate or some such, or, as one post I had read elsewhere, was actually a kind of foil stuck onto the top of the disk, and the plastic only under it as a protective shield. And some supposedly had bad adhesive, and delaminated. I have never seen any of this, and my disks, burned with a 2x1x6X? JVC, SCSI, external, are still readable, and those disks were 3,4,5 bucks apiece. You made a coaster then, and it was valuable enough to put on your coffee table.
It seems like everything we hear is anecdotal, I heard, someone said, etc. And, especially, I think.... NO ONE knows, or I should say, no one is telling, how long they last. I can pret' near guarantee you, they will last longer than magnetic media, especially the way most of us keep our floppies, Zips, or whatever at home. Hell, since you rarely use it, put your boot disk in the floppy and let it sit till you need it. The stray magnetic flux from the 'puter has probably ruined it. I know I've had the problem from my kids machines when I went to re-install, and they said "Oh, no, Dad, my boot disk is always right here on top of my computer." It's unreadable, but the OS disk it was atop of is still good. And, Juke Boxes, commercial, in bars, play the same disks, play CDs hundreds, if not thousands of times. Sound as good today as X years ago.
I'm a mill hunk. No connection with any CD company. I'm probably more pissed at them than you are because I'm probably older than most of you and expect to get what they sold me. I'm not a product of this generation, which, were they Eskimos, ( I'm sorry. PC says I should say Innuits.) would buy ice because Michael Jordan was the pusher.
Out of curiosity, since you have "done many tests, and the black media last longer", how old are you, and how long have the tests run? And is the laser degrading the reflective and diffractive areas on the disks, which represent the 1s and 0s. I'm curious as to how you have determined that. I'd like to try to reproduce the tests.
Thanks much.
George

[SatStorm]

I am a practical user, honnestly I don't care what technologie is behind my CD-Rs. I just care to use them and not have to copy them every 2 - 3 years. I just care not to loose my data. So, I willing to pay more to keep them more.
Many VCDs/SVCDs I made the last 3 - 4 years (don't mention data CDs the last 5 years), from well known brands, start having stuff like holls in the surface, unreadable tracks, etc, in a year or two...
Just imagine how stupid this looks, while my early 1980 VHS tapes, still plays wonderfull (Recordings 23 years back!)
After using black media, no coasters, no holles, no easy scratches, nothing. More compatible with DVDs (even some stupid Sony standalones recornize them), better looking (black is always in fashion) and better overall working. So, I prefer them. And I suggest them. For VCD/SVCD I found them most compatible of all.
In my country, I have only 2 choices: TDK and Prodisc. It is the same disc, with the same price. There are no other choices here...
Call it fashism if you want, but it is the true

[SatStorm]

And I am almost 30 years old, I work in a local technology magazine (EISA member) as the basic editor, my salary is 595 Euros per month (more than the average local salary) and I live in a country which one room cost to rent 300 euros, is a part of EE, in theory has anything and in praxis you can't even feed yourself.

[gmatov]

SatStorm,
My condolences for the conditions you live under. Sometime, probably in some other forum, I'd like to talk to you about what things cost in your country, and in other places in Europe. I have trouble understanding how, say, Nike, can pay 18 cents an hour and the workers can at least afford some of the basic necessities. Or how there can be 1.6 million Turkish lira to the dollar.
Anyhow, if you only have 2 choices in blank CDs, you almost have to like what you can get, or you say "What's the use. Nothing I can get is any good, so why bother?"
My point is, you don't know what you are buying, here, till you have bought it and tried it. No one seems to put out the same disk, under the same label, as a regular practice, so why buy Brand A religiously, when next spindle is only Brand A in label, and not in content?
I have not tried all the disks there are, but what I have used are as good today as they were 5, 6, 7 years ago. I do nothing special to keep em safe. Most are in envelopes, but bunches are just stacked together, also. Many are pretty scratched up, but I've run scandisk (Nero) on some, and no unreadable data, or mebbe 1 block that wasn't written to because the burner knew the area was bad. I don't know.
I buy the cheapest available, and my only complaint is burn speed.
You have very good English, by the way. I wish my Serbian was as good. Most everybody I was able to speak it with has died off. Kids don't want to learn it, growing up, and now they're grown, wish you'd insisted.
Gotta go to work, now. Check back when I get home tonight.

[SatStorm]

Thanks, just to add that I have only 2 choices in Black Blank media. Black colour CD-Rs. We have plenty of CD-Rs here, but not black ones (sometimes some black "smart buy" discs arrive and once there was "thats" black, but nowdays, there is only TDK and Prodisc in black CD-Rs.

To realise the situation in Europe, you have to imagine how the mix of water, sugar and cofee have to be made to create coffee....
Coffee is the expensive part (like the countries with good economy), sugar is a valuable part (like the rest western european countries) and the water is the cheapest part but without it, you have no coffee (the former Easter european countries).
Now, to create one United Europe, you need to mix all those up (same currency, one market, no boarders), burn them up (wars to move the economy...) and before all this, you need to determine how much coffee, sugar and water to use.
The problem with all this, is that someone have to decide how to make this coffee. And, it is more than certain that most of those who gonna taste the coffee, gonna find it more or less sweet, more or less heavy.

Nowdays we taste this ******* coffee.
Now, we have to adjust our taste to it.
After sometime, we won't bother (15 - 20 years) with the taste. But now... phoewww.... It sucks!

[Super Warrior]

Hmmm

[kenmo]

I find this discusion ironic. I'm converting my TV vhs recordings (Star Trek, X-Files, Outer Limits, etc) to CD-R thinking I will be helping to perserve them. Yet CD-R media appears to have the same dilema of video tapes.

Perhaps we rely too much on the "marketing" of these newer technologies....

[gmatov]

Kenmo,
Netscape 7.0 just crashed on me, so I have to try to recreate the note I had compiled. One of the points was a sci-fi story, a short, about auctions in which people bought books just to burn, and one quote (mebbe a paraphrase ) was "How were we supposed to know that CDs would only last 7 years?"
No-one knows how long any medium will last. Manufacturers will, naturally, tell you " Good for a 100 years!!!" Has anyone tried to read an InCD disc from a year ago? Nero says it's unreadable with their last version. It's theirs, f'christ's sake. If 5.5.2 won't read 5.5.1, what hope do you have?
I have half a dozen SyQuest 3.5 drives, IDE, 270 meg, that work well. They fit in a floppy slot, withn an IDE cable, and the disks are very portable. StQuest folded and the going price, the last time I looked was about 70 bucks. Well, no thanks.
If you really want to keep your data, write it down on a piece of good parchment, or lambskin, or something. After all we have scrolls a couple 1000 years old that are still readable. Well, mebbe there's some scholastic license involved, but they say that's what it says, Pharoah actually did say you had to have a non snoking section, and if someone complained the whole nightclub would be declared non smoking. The scientists said so, not me. I mean, you can't tell me the glyph got corrupted over the last 3 or 4000 years!!! That's absurd!!!