Added subtitles to DVD, going out of sync?

[wubikens]

Alright, so there are these DVDs I'm trying to add subtitles to. There are four DVDs in total, all of them are R2 from Japan, and each DVD has two ~30 minute episodes. I'm using the method outlined in this guide here to add my subtitles:

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/277950-How-to-add-new-subtitles-to-an-existing-DVD

Now when I use this method, my subtitles work perfectly for the first episode of each disc. However, the subtitles are out of sync for the second episode of each disc, and I can't figure out why. I've tried aligning the subtitles to the chapter points on the DVD to be absolutely sure that they're correctly timed, but they'll still go out of sync (sometimes gradually, sometimes immediately).

Any ideas as to what could be causing this issue?

[wubikens]

Figured out the issue was with the mismatched frame rate between my subtitles and my DVDs. Subtitles were at 59.94 whereas the video was at 29.97.

I've tried converting my subtitles to that frame rate, but it screws the timings and durations all up. I'm wondering, after I convert the frame rate of the subtitles, is there an easy fix for syncing them up to the DVDs?

[wubikens]

Seems I found some more stuff out about my issue. I've been reading about non-drop frames and drop frames, and how it can create delays as much as 4 seconds over the course of an hour of footage. So it sounds like that might be the reason why my subtitles are going out of sync.

Is there any way to have my subtitles account for this, so they don't gradually get out of sync?

[wubikens]

Sorry for the constant bumping/posting, just thought I should add some more info if anyone wants to help:

When I load the video files and subs into Subtitle Workshop, they are completely synced up for every episode. However, when I author the video files and the subs into a DVD format, they still gradually go out of sync. Any idea why that is?

[manono]

Well, if it's a drop-frame issue then you might make the subs for 30fps instead of 29.97fps. Or for 29.97fps if for some reason they're 30fps.

But the main thing you haven't given us is the amount they're off by the end of a 25 (?) minute long episode. And also what you said about some going out of synch immediately (a constant asynch) and some getting worse as the episode goes along (progressive asynch) doesn't make a whole lot of sense. And some of what you said was just plain silly:

Subtitles were at 59.94 whereas the video was at 29.97.

So, the subs for a given episode ended half-way through the episode? I don't think so, not unless you royally screwed something up somewhere along the way.

Okay, these Japanese DVDs had no subs at all? If they do you can use the already existing timings with your new subs. Where did your subs come from? Did you create them yourself? Download them from somewhere? Ordinarily downloaded subs going out of synch have more to do with PAL/NTSC issues.

When I load the video files and subs into Subtitle Workshop, they are completely synced up for every episode. However, when I author the video files and the subs into a DVD format, they still gradually go out of sync. Any idea why that is?

I don't use Subtitle Workshop myself but, again, how much are the episodes off by the end? A second and a half, a minute? What? And the guide doesn't use Subtitle Workshop? What are you using it for?

[wubikens]

I'll try to explain the best I can!

But the main thing you haven't given us is the amount they're off by the end of a 25 (?) minute long episode. And also what you said about some going out of synch immediately (a constant asynch) and some getting worse as the episode goes along (progressive asynch) doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Sorry, I'll try to clarify. They go out of sync gradually, not immediately. What I meant to imply was that it goes out of sync immediately once it hits the second episode of the DVD, but it gradually gets to that point from the first episode.

So to simplify what I mean, it starts off fine but gradually gets worse the longer it plays. About halfway through the first episode is when I start to notice syncing issues (ten minutes in, about half a second off by that point). By the end of the first episode (twenty minutes) it's off by almost an entire second. By the end of the second episode (forty minutes) it's off by around two seconds.

So, the subs for a given episode ended half-way through the episode? I don't think so, not unless you royally screwed something up somewhere along the way.

Here's what I did:

1. I ripped the DVDs by chapter through DVD Decrypter, and combined the chapters with VOBMerge for each episode to form two files per DVD.

2. This gave me the episodes in a .vob format, which I converted to .mkv through mkvtoolnix.

Now the original frame rate of the DVDs is 29.97, however, the frame rate of the .mkv's I made is 59.94. My subtitles are synced up properly when I play them through the .mkv's, but they gradually go out of sync when playing them through the DVDs.

That's why I assumed my subtitles were at 59.94.

Okay, these Japanese DVDs had no subs at all? If they do you can use the already existing timings with your new subs. Where did your subs come from? Did you create them yourself? Download them from somewhere? Ordinarily downloaded subs going out of synch have more to do with PAL/NTSC issues.

The DVDs have no subs. I made these subs myself, and I timed them accordingly to the .mkv rips I mentioned above.

I don't use Subtitle Workshop myself but, again, how much are the episodes off by the end? A second and a half, a minute? What? And the guide doesn't use Subtitle Workshop? What are you using it for?

I wasn't following the guide when I used Subtitle Workshop, I was just testing some stuff out. Basically, just trying anything to find a way to get the subtitles to sync up properly.

While using Subtitle Workshop though, I noticed my subtitles are synced up right in the video preview. But when I author my subs through SubtitleCreator, they end up being out of sync.

Also, when I use a subtitle overlay program like Greenfish Subtitle Player to play my .srt subs externally, while my DVD is up and running, the subs are completely in sync. It's only when I try to load the subs onto the DVD itself that they become out of sync.

[manono]

Based on the timings you've given it is a drop-frame issue. You didn't mention if the subs play faster than the audio, or lag behind the audio. You can adjust them from 30fps to 29.97fps in SubtitleCreator if the subs play before the audio by the end of the episode. You adjust them from 29.97->30fps if the subs lag the audio by the end.

No guarantees, but that's what I'd try next. Although I've used most of the tools in the guide, I don't follow the guide myself when adding subs to DVDs so it's mostly educated guesses. I don't really understand why it might be a drop-frame issue.

[wubikens]

Based on the timings you've given it is a drop-frame issue. You didn't mention if the subs play faster than the audio, or lag behind the audio. You can adjust them from 30fps to 29.97fps in SubtitleCreator if the subs play before the audio by the end of the episode. You adjust them from 29.97->30fps if the subs lag the audio by the end.

No guarantees, but that's what I'd try next. Although I've used most of the tools in the guide, I don't follow the guide myself when adding subs to DVDs so it's mostly educated guesses. I don't really understand why it might be a drop-frame issue.

Just wanted to say you made my day! 30 -> 29.97, the subs lagged a bit. But 29.97 -> 30, they turned out perfect.

Thanks!