Is a laptop fast enough for editing, recommend a Dup Tower

[jbLACKtd]

Good Day, Coalman, Bobkart, everyone!.

Thanks for all the help in the forum thus far, Very Empowering.

Now seeking to hand out finished DVDs within an hour of race completion.

Question 1: Is there a super-fast portable computer out there, such that I could compile the race as it occurs, for example, pre-create credits, intro, outro, and compile to DVDRW on the laptop, between the races? (Plenty of time to spare during the events).

So that is question one: Is there a portable computer that could quickly handle Studio 10 editing, and rendering, or is this too much to expect? Any reason to buy a fast laptop, if only burning in order to transfer to a controller-type duplication tower?


Question 2: Am seriously seeking a duplication tower in addition to above notebook. The type with an internal hard disk, (but not EXACTLY sure why need HDD).

Can you recommend a given duplication tower (with a controller, not requiring a monitor) if what I seek is a stable, durable, tower? (Are pioneer, Sony, or Sansui, etc, most widely durable and compatible with the range of standalone DVD players?)

I figure 4 to 6 copies for the tower.

I have about 9 days to find, buy, learn to use, above equipment.

Mike aka JBlackTD

[edDV]

What format is the camcorder?

This is a complex project. The entire process needs to be designed.

A laptop might work, but if your business becomes successful, you will quickly ditch it for a desktop and a large LCD display*. Why pay more for laptop packaging?

If you expect to get any volume, encoding times will consume the most time. Consider a hardware encoder.

Poor man's solution may be a standalone DVD recorder that can accept a computer at 1x speed over IEEE-1394. Few models do this.

Better solution is a hardware MPeg2 encoder like one of these
http://www.canopus.com/products/mpegencoding.php


*after watching some of the race photo guys working out of RV's, I see that the clients are sold when they see their photos/videos previewed in high quality on big screens. In an RV, a big screen might be 32-42". Don't make it so big that it shows the flaws. They won't be impressed squinting at a laptop screen.

[jbLACKtd]

Camcorder Format: 8mm DV

Disseminated Disc type: DVDR, plus or minus, do not know.

I already pre- OR post produce the show at home on PC destop, as you describe. Intro, Credits, Titles, Outro. I'd like to mix these finished parts inbetween the live content as the racing day progresses.

If possible, just lay one track after the other (intro, Raw DV, Title, Raw DV, Outro) one after the other, finalizing at the end of the racing day, laying in pre-made titles as the races go from Qualifying, Trophy dash, Main Event, etc is the unobtainable dream. Then I could simply burn the finished disc into five copies. Done.

Thus far in practice for last many years (final consumer product on VHS), I only can pre-load the DV 8mm tapes with the Intro titles, music, and then no more credits, post voice overs, just a segue into the raw DV racing. Hey, it worked!. I have an editing machine at home (Studio 10) . It would be massively time saving to have the DVDs finished each racing night rather than driving home across several states, taking the time in Post, then sending when nobody is that interested anymore (a week or so later).

The objective is to hand out finished DVDs at the very earliest moment, eg, one hour after show ends, just after the interested parties see the original or disc verson, which the final track has just been laid onto and the disc finalized.

The hardware encoder for DV.. any chance of it being used in a notebook? I have no RV, but in the sponsors RV there are many TVs, clean power, etc. I use their 48 inch LCD to display the show just after it ends.

Thanks EDDV- I can tell you are thinking of my best interests, but in reality, I will never make a profit, or even plan to. It is the nature of this sport that few really want to buy a disc to what they just saw.. And each driver wants a cameo in the finished disc.

[edDV]

Camcorder Format: 8mm DV

If possible, just lay one track after the other (intro, Raw DV, Title, Raw DV, Outro) one after the other, finalizing at the end of the racing day, laying in pre-made titles as the races go from Qualifying, Trophy dash, Main Event, etc is the unobtainable dream. Then I could simply burn the finished disc into five copies. Done.

Thus far in practice for last many years (final consumer product on VHS), I only can pre-load the DV 8mm tapes with the Intro titles, music, and then no more credits, post voice overs, just a segue into the raw DV racing. Hey, it worked!. I have an editing machine at home (Studio 10) . It would be massively time saving to have the DVDs finished each racing night rather than driving home across several states, taking the time in Post, then sending when nobody is that interested anymore (a week or so later).

The objective is to hand out finished DVDs at the very earliest moment, eg, one hour after show ends, just after the interested parties see the original or disc verson, which the final track has just been laid onto and the disc finalized.

The difference between VHS and DVD is the output needs to be encoded to MPeg2. This can be done on a fast notebook or desktop at greater than realtime but very fast notebooks are much more expensive than similar performing desktops. The hardware encoders will work from realtime playback as will a DVD recorder fed from the computer.

If you can encode a segment at a time, the final DVD can be assemblesd in a program like TMPGENC DVD Author from MPeg2 segments and then burned.

Consider a minitower or one of these Shuttles (below) with the fastest Core2Duo and plenty of cooling for best bang for the buck.


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16856101009
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp?Submit=ENE&N=50001465&Manufactory=1465

[jbLACKtd]

edDV: Massively Helpful! Thank You!

Does it seem to you that pre-creation (creation done before leaving for the live event) of intro, titles, pre-encoded in MPEG2, can be ....dropped... onto a drive based (in the laptop) DVD disc image, then I put the live DV clips in, encoded, onto the image, at the track... since a half hour is usually in between each race I tape, there is time for encoding each discrete 20 lap race. Then at the Main Event (the last event) I only have to encode 40 laps, maybe 22 minutes.. as the last TMPGENC segment?

If I did all the above... could I take that finished disc and plunk it into the minitower duplicator and start burning?

If yes, then it would all work... I could use the notebook image to play the image file for the sponsors, as the duplicator burns the DVDs. Done!

Sorry I am not more knowledgeable. Seems you have defined and solved the problem from the laptop view, if my understanding is correct. Happen to know which is the truly powerful laptops for the intentioned purposes?

[edDV]

Yes the templates or MPeg2 segments can be premade, live elements encoded and then arranged in a sequence in TMPGEnc DVD Author for DVD authoring. Note this is authoring, not encoding so it will go faster than re-encoding the full length. You will be creating the Mux (VOB, IFO, BUP) and disk image only. Then burn the DVDR.*
http://tmpgenc.pegasys-inc.com/en/product/tda20.html

Laptops are expensive and run hot. That is why I suggest a desktop if the quantity is high or power for the buck is important.

*or the disk image could be transferred to a DVD duplicator.

[jbLACKtd]

Thank you edDV. TMPGEnc DVD author... Have been reading and studying... I like how "simple" it is, the tutorial helpful too.

Still contemplating notebook.. lack of 110 in the birds' nest (where the camera shoots the race) is the main reason, as well as poor power when available (Very Dirty Power).

Is there a latest greatest laptop for exactly the kinds of demands of Studio 10? Is it the same as a smoking fast gaming machine, say, the Alienware Aurora m9700 SLI? (best guess)

Is the Core2 duo critically helpful? What about these solid state hard drives (32 Gb) in mobile computers?

Thank you.

[edDV]

Thank you edDV. TMPGEnc DVD author... Have been reading and studying... I like how "simple" it is, the tutorial helpful too.

Still contemplating notebook.. lack of 110 in the birds' nest (where the camera shoots the race) is the main reason, as well as poor power when available (Very Dirty Power).

Is there a latest greatest laptop for exactly the kinds of demands of Studio 10? Is it the same as a smoking fast gaming machine, say, the Alienware Aurora m9700 SLI? (best guess)

Is the Core2 duo critically helpful? What about these solid state hard drives (32 Gb) in mobile computers?

Thank you.

Core2duo will spped encoding but probably not with Studio10. Check for Multi-Core support. Higher end encoders do support multi-core and next generation consumer products are likely to as well.

Raw processing power is important for video encoding. Games require expensive display card technology that goes unused for video editing. Try to max the computer for CPU power but basic display chips, unless gaming is also a requirement.

[jbLACKtd]

Hello edDV!
Thanks for your help.
Took the leap, got (not here yet) a Qosmio AV660 notebook.
Question: Should I only be getting the TMPGEnc DVD Author, or do I also have use for the 4.0 Xpress?

Remember, am pre- creating DVD tracks, bringing to race track, laying the pre-created alongside the just-DV-ed (no pun), encoding either immediately, or in some cases, all at once immediately AFTER the race.

In many cases, it seems there will not be time to turn away from the live action and download/encode the DV content.

Is it still best to use TMPGnc DVD Author in cases where the image is complete on the HDD, and the entire image is burnt to DVD at once?

Sorry for Noob question, clock ticking down, little internet access at the racetrack.

THANK YOU!

[edDV]

Not following you. I assume your pre-produced content will be MPeg2, your menu structure will be an authoring program template and your new stuff will be DV format that needs encoding to MPeg2.

You need an MPeg2 encoder to encode DV to MPeg2, then you need a program like TMPGEnc DVD Author to convert the template and MPegs to a Video_TS folder. Next step is creation of the DVD image for the burn.

Qosmio AV660 notebook??? You never mentioned a need for HD did you?

For SD DVD, you could have done near equally well at one third the price.

You haven't considered how long it takes to author and burn HD. Figure 4x plus times for editing+encoding and 10x times for burning.

If you are "buying for the future" you are wasting your money. You will never put up with the slowness of this equipment once mainstream notebooks are running 5x faster at half the cost.


PS: I just read the drive specs. This is only a 1x HD DVD-ROM playback drive. For writing, it is only 8x write for DVD+/- R. Most of this notebook's purpose is playback of HD DVD prerecorded media.

[jbLACKtd]

EdDV:
I salute you for your candor. Beyond that... POW! Right between the eyes! LOL.

Your first paragraph seems an accurate portrayal of what I am trying to do, but at times will create all content immediately after the live shoot, encoding everything subsequently. Want both capabilities if possible.

Ultimately, seeking to just change the date, location, from the race the week before, then copy that into Studio thus creating the present week's credits, show, ending from last weeks show. In other words each show is exactly the same, except for live content and a couple of credit details like the date, location.

Seeking to be done with the whole live/postproduction/encoding/burning within an hour or two of the end of the actual race.

Misc:

A) I have no need for HD. Takes a fast notebook to run HD, my thought was this would ensure a fast-throughput computer. Oops.
(Dual raid HDDs, 4 Gb RAM, Core 2 Duo, 2Ghz, GeForce Go 7600) Also, an external 320G HDD and an external 16x Super Multi burner to help empower the notebook. Will this help speed things up? (operating Studio, encoding, etc)(Studio boasts the VIIV intel logo, if that matters)

B) I know a good bit about video production, but have only created VHS up to this year. Utterly ignorant about MPEG2, but I WILL pick this up. It is not easy.

The point is it will take some time to understand your responses in these respects.

Is your answer: You need Both TMPGEnc Express AND TMPGEnc DVD Author?

C) May I also ask: Is it wiser to use TMPGEnc rather than Studio for MPEG2 encoding? (compatibility is paramount)

D) What format is the DV turned into when it enters a computer for playback? If I save the raw DV file? (Guess: AVI). Could I burn this to a DVD in Data form for archiving and later access? (seeking to understand DVD creation for distribution via this question)

E) THANK YOU for your no-BS, shoot from the hip response.

Mike

[edDV]

Misc:

A) I have no need for HD. Takes a fast notebook to run HD, my thought was this would ensure a fast-throughput computer. Oops.
(Dual raid HDDs, 4 Gb RAM, Core 2 Duo, 2Ghz, GeForce Go 7600) Also, an external 320G HDD and an external 16x Super Multi burner to help empower the notebook. Will this help speed things up? (operating Studio, encoding, etc)(Studio boasts the VIIV intel logo, if that matters)

B) I know a good bit about video production, but have only created VHS up to this year. Utterly ignorant about MPEG2, but I WILL pick this up. It is not easy.

The point is it will take some time to understand your responses in these respects.

Is your answer: You need Both TMPGEnc Express AND TMPGEnc DVD Author?

C) May I also ask: Is it wiser to use TMPGEnc rather than Studio for MPEG2 encoding? (compatibility is paramount)

D) What format is the DV turned into when it enters a computer for playback? If I save the raw DV file? (Guess: AVI). Could I burn this to a DVD in Data form for archiving and later access? (seeking to understand DVD creation for distribution via this question)

E) THANK YOU for your no-BS, shoot from the hip response.

Mike

A) The main things that affects what you are doing are the Core2 Duo processor and DVD writer. There isn't a huge difference yet (other than price) between the low and high end Core2 Duo processors and quad core is a month away.

Everything else has small if any benefit so long as the basics are covered. The DVD writer in that laptop is slower than most at 8x but the laptop configuration also limits external drive throughput. 12x would probably be safe, 16x might generate coasters.

B) You need to go through the process with what you have to understand what is important.

Yes you need to encode the fresh DV from the camcorder to MPeg2 for the DVD. This assumes you have everything else pre-encoded but that requires an MPeg encoder too. You can use any MPeg2 encoder that meets DVD spec. See https://www.videohelp.com/dvd . TMPGEnc_Xpress is reported to be good but somewhat slow. Studio 10 is not high end and slower. I'd say start with the TMPGEnc encoder and athoring tool because they are well supported with tutorials and forum helpers. Then experiment with other encoders if you want more performance.

I'm not expert at DVD authoring. Normally you can create a template (menus, graphics, video placeholders) offline and pre-encode MPeg video elements, but you need to do the final authoring after you add the fresh material. It may be possible to partially render the disc image offline. I don't know how. Others can comment.

C) Pinnacle Studio is a consumer level product with a buggy reputation and little expert help. Just ask a question in their forum and evaluate what you get for an answer (or excuse?). Step up to a product with support. TMPGEnc, CCE (Basic to $$$$) and Mainconcept have better internet support following.

D) MiniDV camcorders allow first generation DV transfers to a DV-AVI file on the hard disk. (Use WinDV ). You can edit in DV format (many ways) and then encode the result to MPeg2 (see C). This is the time consuming step. Then add the MPeg2 to your DVD authoring template and create the Video_TS directory for the DVD. Then either burn the DVD or create a DVD image to burn later.

E) I'd suggest you perfect your process before you spend money. You can spend your money as you please, but if you were spending my money, I'd be upset by the decision to buy the $3500 Toshiba laptop When a $1200 laptop or $800 desktop+monitor would do the job.

[jbLACKtd]

edDV:
Thank you for your considered replies.

I understand almost all of what you said. I will not ask any more questions to respect your efforts, time, instead will do some reading about TMPGEnc products. Your hacking out the jungle enough for me to get started is really kewl.


I kept mentioning Studio 10 on a hunch you might educate me. Thanks for the tip. You say CCE as an editing solution, so my understanding is get all of the following:

DVD Author
DVD Express
CCE

I did study the product matrix at TMPGEnc. It is unclear if I am best served by purchasing only DVD author and DVD Express. Also seems plausible I need one more of the TMPGEnc products.


Again, your candor cuts through all the bull. Thanks


I am REALLY grateful, EdDV.
Mike

[edDV]

TMPGEnc 4.0 XPress is an MPeg2 encoder so you don't need CCE right away if at all. The TMPGEnc Encoder and DVD Author 2 will get you started with easy to learn affordable products.

If you later decide you need more there are other step up paths to take and that may include CCE or Mainconcept. You may instead decide to step up to Adobe Premiere Pro or Sony Vegas, both include a full Mainconcept encoder. All of these products have demos available so you can see if they fit your workflow.

You won't know what you need until you push the TMPGEnc products to the limit. They are also instructional introductory products that are well supported with tutorials many of which you can find to the left here, or on Google. Plus there are many people here in the forum that can help.