Being Quiet is important to me

[nsdn]

Hi There, I have always wanted one, but never been able to justify it until now.

My wife bitched about her VCR last night, after we turn out the light, the head spins for about 20 minutes before the machine shuts itself down with a LOUD clunk. Now I don't have the heart to tell her if she actually turns it off it will solve the problem, this is a good excuse to purchase a DVD recoder with a Hard drive I think.

BUT it HAS to be QUIET, which means no FAN and a quiet hard drive!!!

I am in Australia, so it needs to be PAL, and available here. Idealing I would like a upgradable Hard drive...so I can spend as little as I can then put a 200 or something in it. I looked at the Samsung DVD-HR720 but noticed it had a FAN....

Can anyone please recmmend a machine for me, I took a look and searched for quietest...etc....but I bet no one has ears like my mrs...

[trhouse]

I cannot think of any model with a hdd without a fan. In fact there are few models without hdd that do not have fans. The Panasonic DMR-ES10 is one but it is discontinued.

The reason seems to be that the extra features like a VCR in combos or a hdd puts more strain on the power supply which then needs the fan to keep sufficiently cool.

[nsdn]

Thanks for your reply.

I do own a PVR which has a HDD in it, bit it does not have a fan. I don't think a CDROM drive would add so much that the power supply requires a fan. that said the PVr runs quite hot. I just wish the PVR had analogue inputs!!! Don't even really need the DVD recorder. Are there any PVRs with analogue inputs? I know real time MPEG compression requires a lot of CPU grunt...is that the real reason for the fan? This would explain why DVD recorders require a fan even without a HDD

[guns1inger]

I have a PVR that doesn't have a fan, but when you finish recording or watching something from the HDD, the disc doesn't spin down for around 10 minutes, is audible until it does, and shutdown with quite a click. I suspect that most HDD models, even without fans, won't be whisper quiet anyway.

Then again, I don't have it (or a TV) in the bedroom.

[TBoneit]

And even when quiet while new they'll get nosier with use. IMHO of course.

Maybe my hearing is going but I have a Pioneer 531h DVD recorder in my bedroom and despite complaints about noise from others I never found it obtrusive. It makes the most noise when burning a disc, I also had a Dishnetwork DVR hooked up to it the was quiet unless you did commercial skips and FF/F Rev then you could hear the HDD seeking. I just replaced that with a new Dual tuner model 622 (HDTV model). Means I now need a bedroom sized HDTV. 200 hours of SDTV recording. Actually I have four DVRs hooked up in the house. Every TV has a DVR feeding it.

Back on topic. I would expect anything without a fan to run hot and have reduced lifespan.

Solution get one of thos eTV extenders that also carries the IR remote signal back.
Put the DVD recorder elsehwere and feed the bedroom TV through the TV extender. Total silence then.

Other possibility , I don't know if they make them though, a DVD recorder that uses wireless UHF remote and put it in another room and feed the signal back to bedroom.

Good Luck

[davideck]

Perhaps there is a PAL version of the Toshiba RD-XS52. This vintage does have a fan, but it is only on when the machine is ON (instead of all the time or intermittently when OFF) and it is quiet. The drive is also quiet. Definitely softer than my VCR.

[trhouse]

I am not familiar with PVR's never having owned one, but I cannot think of any hdd dvd recorder that does not have a fan.

I have measured mpeg encoder temperatures in a number of models and they differ quite a lot. The Panasonic ES10 encoder is just warm to the touch, but the latest models with DV input have encoders that require heatsinking and fan. LSI makes a number of encoders which in the JVC M10S and Polaroid DRM-2001G have heatsinks and a fan and still reach 55 to 58 degree C temperatures measured on the heatsink.

The reason I mentioned the power supply as needing the fan is because encoders like the LSI use about four voltages, such as +1.8V, +2.5V, +3.3V, and +5V. The manufacturers regulate down the +5V to supply the lower voltages with inefficient linear regulators. The increase in power disspated by the power supply to create these can be greater than the power consumed by the chip needing them.

On this thread,
https://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=279460

I photographted the insides of the Panasonic ES35V, Pioneer 420, 531H, Polaroid 2001G, and Sony GX315. In all these units, the fan can be seen right behind the power supply except in the case of the Pioneer 420 in which the fan is just to the right.

[lordsmurf]

Time for a new wife? Sounds like that's a big part of the noise problem too.

In all seriousness, turn off the VCR.

If you want a fan-less DVD recorder, I hope you don't plan on it lasting long. It will melt down like so many others. Heat is a problem.

[nsdn]

Just want to say thanks for all your replies. This remains oneof the best forums around

I went and had a look at some, it seems that DVD recorders don't have fans generally but those with hard drives do....Saw a LG 80gig for 350AUD which is interesting.

[daamon]

I recently bought the LG RH7823W from "The Good Guys" for AUS$630 - very user friendly, great functions, great features, 160Gb HDD and pretty quiet.

[nsdn]

I know where I can get a RH1777 for $349 on special....which I think is this guys little brother. Can you upgrade the Hard drives in these guys?

[daamon]

I know where I can get a RH1777 for $349 on special....which I think is this guys little brother. Can you upgrade the Hard drives in these guys?

Nice...!

I don't know - I've not thought about it. With a 160Gb HDD and recording stuff on TV at SQ (Standard Quality), I can get about 80 hours - I've currently got 66 hours free!!! That's plenty for me - but I don't have cable or kids...

So, with a 80Gb HDD, you'll get around 40 hours at SQ. There are two quality settings lower than SQ, but you do notice the drop in quality - but it's still watchable.

[nsdn]

Actually I found that it was a RH7521W for 349, They have them on at Clive peeters for 349, I rang Bing lee and asked if they would match it rather than drive all the way over there, after verifying they said ok...so I went a bought one, even though the reviews are not that great...I doubt my wife will be stretching the envelope.

Worst case I will sell it on Ebay, going price sems like its over 400 bucks anyways

[daamon]

The RH7521W on LG's OZ site: RRP: $749

I'd say you got a good deal... Enjoy!

[nsdn]

Ok well I have just been playing with my new toy, and although I have it in my office and there is a bit of ambiant noise, it seems very quiet. Of course this will have to be assessed in the dead of night, but even taking that into consideration it seems very quiet.

Seems to work well as well, although the fact u have to stop recording then start recording again before you can time slip off the hard drive is a bit stupid if you START recording in time slip u can, but then u end up with no file on the hard drive!!....annoying but not insurmountable, on my PVR you just simply hit picture search backwards and it imediately goes into time slip. I hope she likes it, never know I might get lucky....with any luck I will get some sex...oops i mean sleep earlier because she can fast forward through the adds faster.

Hmmm also I found this site http://www.addison-net.co.uk/dvd/ looks like I can bung in a 200gig for 100 dollars, the RH7500W looks near enough to this one I bet it will work. Wait to see if she needs it first....or I might buy another one for moi.

[daamon]

Seems to work well as well, although the fact u have to stop recording then start recording again before you can time slip off the hard drive is a bit stupid if you START recording in time slip u can, but then u end up with no file on the hard drive!!....annoying but not insurmountable

With my LG, once I'm timeslipping I have to get it to where I want to record from and then press "REC" - this records the timeslip to HDD. Press "REC" (I think) or "STOP" to stop. I'm hoping it'll be basic functionality that is common to LG's...

Hmmm also I found this site http://www.addison-net.co.uk/dvd/ looks like I can bung in a 200gig for 100 dollars, the RH7500W looks near enough to this one I bet it will work. Wait to see if she needs it first....or I might buy another one for moi.

Let us know how you get on - I'd be interested to know. Just in case...

If you swap out the HDD, can it be easily connected to the PC?

P.S. Good luck with the sex / sleep...

[nsdn]

I could not resist, I inspected the unit there are no warranty seals on it, so I had a peak, it is Identical to the one in that link. Now I have it home I can hear the fan in a quiet room. I may even disable it and see how hot it runs, its a very small fan and the unit runs cool to touch, by comparison my PVR runs very hot. Its not near anything with a heat sink....so I might just see how it goes. hey if it blows up, I will just plug it back in and take it back under warranty.....its not like its sitting on a CPU....or blowing on a heat sink, I get the impression its a regulation issue.

[TBoneit]

Do you really think they'd have spent the money to put in a fan if it wasn't needed?

Just think of the money a car maker could save if they didn't bother putting that optional not really needed engine cooling device called a radiator in the front of the car. Plus the saving in fan and fan belt/motor and cost of coolant.

Every part put into something is there because testing has determined it is needed. They'd rather save the money.

Unpluging it and then taking it back for warranty when it breaks costs everybody in the long run.

Or maybe the rest of us will get lucky and unplugging the fan will only shorten the life of the unit until after its waranty has run out.

[davideck]

The amount of cooling provided by an imperceptible airflow is amazing.
A tiny fan can make a BIG difference.

[nsdn]

Hi there, I appreciate your concerns. Please understand I have worked in electronics design for many many years...and I KNOW what the deal is here. I have handled STB that have gotten so hot that they have scorched cabinets, not my design but I have had to deal with the consequences and subsequent recovery....and this cost a shitload

I am fully aware of the fact that a small air flow can make a very big differance and also that ambiant temperature can also result in thermal runaway on a hot day where the unit may otherwise be ok. This was one of our MAJOR design considerations for the next gen VOD STB we were specifying, believe it or not the question of the fan was a very important one. The sales and marketing fokes definitly did not want a fan...and I understand why!

The temperature rise is noticable, but not something I would panic over. I am goinf to buy some soft rubber grommets and see if siting the fan on those reduces the vibration as I have asertained that its not the fan making the noise but rather vibration on the case.

Running 8-10 degrees warmer may have a small effect on MTBF but I doubt its significant, unless your running above 75C, (which is automotive spec for semiconductors). The surface temp of the top of the case where the fan is warmest, and it would lucky to be at 30 C, warm to touch, certainly warmer than before (maybe 25C), a 5 deg rise is accepable. My only concern is that the top of the case as no vents, so on a hot day things could get rough

In anycase I would prefer to have a fan as this as you say is how this was speced, so I will only remove it as a last ditch.

But one thing I will say, don't be too sure about your statement they would only include a fan if it was absolutely necessary. This DVD recorder is most probably a referance design which included a fan, thats why the guts of these types of appliances are always so similar. Its just as likely the engineer could not be bothered to test to see if the fan is not necessary. When your on the borderline this kind of testing is very expensive and engineers always err on the conservative side, and rightfully so! I have seen stranger even in mass production with millions of units and $$ involved. the other thing to remember with this particular unit is that it HAS to be Ok in a unventilated canbinet with stuff piled on top of it AND potentially under it (heating it from below), now I have this unit in its own space, with no heat source under it or above it with pleanty of ventilation, BTW our solution at the time for the scorched cabinet was to put larger rubber feet on it (I kid you not) and a slightly differant power supply.

Returning the unit under warranty is said as tongue in cheek as I won't be blowing it up anyway. That said, not puting a warranty seal sticker is a invitation to fiddle as far as I am concerned, especially for something that people WILL be tempted to upgrade!! Plus the fan is attached by 2 self tappers...I did not even have to open the case to take it off!!