If JVC and PIONEER are the best, then why are they not being sold??????????

[mikej3131]

ok most people on this forum agree that JVC and PIONEER dvd recorders are top of the line. How come i dont seem them at mainstream stores like best buy or circuit city?

[SLK001]

Because stores like that only sell cheap crap.

[ejai]

I don't know much about Pioneer models but the JVC M10 fell short in my mind as a good quality recorder. I now own a Toshiba and the quality is awesome, the JVC doesn't come close. I'm not saying that this is why some oultets may not have them in stock, I'm sure there is a pratical reason for this.

I'm just stating my opinion.

[wayne421]

In my experience (I'm a video professional), I find that JVC and Pioneer market certain product lines to the professional field more than the consumer field.

I have an older Pioneer DVD recorder here and it's been rock solid for hundreds of recordings.

It may also have something to do with cash layout for retail shelf space, but I'm not sure about that one.

Another thing to consider is re-badging. You rarely see Lite-on name-brand products on the shelves, but they are still there under different names (I believe Sony has been known to use Lite-on drives under their name). This is true for a Pioneer DVR-105 I bought years ago in a Cyberdyne box. I knew what it was because I'd read online that Cyberdyne sells other brands under their retail name.

Just some thoughts.

[mikej3131]

hey wayne, since your a professional maybe you can help me here. what is the best brand dvd recorder, is it pioneer?

[oldandinthe way]

It may have to do with the fact that American Consumers no longer associate japanese brands with quality or innovation.

With old japanese brands on products built all over the world in many different factories with differing factory owners, it may be that they cannot command a higher price across the board.

Retailers often choose brands which they can offer multiple types of products from, increasing their discounts, market development funds and coop advertising dollars.

Just how many products from JVC and Pioneer command a premium over other alternatives?

[DVWannaB]

ok most people on this forum agree that JVC and PIONEER dvd recorders are top of the line. How come i dont seem them at mainstream stores like best buy or circuit city?

Because you can get them cheaper on-line

Last I checked, I didnt see Avid products at those stores either.

[trhouse]

Most people never visit this forum before they buy and have ever overheard the kind of comments made when consumers buy video products like " I am going to buy brand x because it matches my decor".

Please do not assume I am deriding that as a reason. On the contrary, it is just an example that for the consumer, there are criteria other than the ones we assume to be important.

[wayne421]

AH - the word 'best' is a matter of opinion, so I can never say which is 'best'. I can say that Pioneer and JVC, as you mentioned, are known as solid brand names. I've worked with our Pioneer for a few years and it's been solid, and we have a Panasonic in another office that has been fine.

For what it's worth, Consumer Reports rates Panasonic, Pioneer, JVC, and Philips as their highest DVD recorder brands. Again though, this can vary by model and features, so there are no absolutes.

Best thing is to do some research into the features you want, find a model that has those features, poke around the forums and see what others are saying, and finally buy it somewhere that has a good return policy (read: they won't give you a hard time because you don't like it).

It's tough buying something that is potentially complicated, especially when you're really anal about every little thing. I went through 7 different HDTVs in a 3 month period before I finally settled on one that I really liked (it's a Panasonic). Needless to say, by the end of it all Circuit City wasn't thrilled to see me walk through the door. Gotta love that No-Hassle Return Policy (which has since been updated with a restocking fee, I believe).

Hope this helps.

[SingSing]

JVC is sold at sears. Pioneer at walmart, some models at bestbuy, and circuit city.

[lordsmurf]

Because stores like that only sell cheap crap.

My sentiments exactly.

Be it DVD recorders, VCRs, digital cameras or video cameras, not going to find it at Best Buy or Circuit City or any of those similar garbage consumer stores. About all they're good for is DVD releases and blank discs.

You'll never see these sorts of quality products in a Best Buy-type store:
DVD recorder: JVC SR-DVM70
VCR: JVC SR-V10U S-VHS
Digital Camera: Nikon D2H
Video Camera: Canon GL-2

Most people are completely oblivious to the concept of professional a/v/photo stores. They have only learned of these places searching the Internet in the past few years, and because they're not a "big name" store, they're scared to buy from them. For example, B&H Photo and Video has been in business for decades. They're a favorite store among professional photographer and videographers. In the "old days" they were often referred to as a "mail order house" who sent you a thick catalog (and advertised big lists in the back of photo magazines) and you made a phone call if you wanted to buy something. These days, catalogs are not needed, telephone operators are not needed, you just go online and buy it 24/7/365 at your convenience.

Some of the medium-end stuff, often referred to as "prosumer" devices because they fall between consumer and professional quality/features, you may get lucky and find in those warehouse-style stores (Fry's Electronics) or all-audience specialty shop (Wolf Camera).

For example, these could be considered prosumer items:
DVD recorder: JVC DR-M100S
VCR: JVC HR-S5900U
Digital Camera: Nikon D70

[mikej3131]

It's tough buying something that is potentially complicated, especially when you're really anal about every little thing. I went through 7 different HDTVs in a 3 month period before I finally settled on one that I really liked (it's a Panasonic). Needless to say, by the end of it all Circuit City wasn't thrilled to see me walk through the door. Gotta love that No-Hassle Return Policy (which has since been updated with a restocking fee, I believe).

Thats funny youmentioned that bcuz im getting a tv in a week or two. So circuit has a restocking fee if i dont like the tv? how much would a restocking fee on a $3000 tv be? what about best buys policy?


hey lordsmurf

For example, these could be considered prosumer items:
DVD recorder: JVC DR-M100S
You'll never see these sorts of quality products in a Best Buy-type store:
DVD recorder: JVC SR-DVM70

so i take it the JVC SR-DVM70 is a better recorder than the JVC DR-M100S ? im asking because that is what ive narrowed it down to and maybe acouple pioneer's also.

[p_l]

The Pioneer 533/633 have apparently been pulled from the shelves by Pioneer until they can fix the annoying problems with their EPGs. My 633 EPG continues to give me grief. It's a shame, because otherwise I have an awesome unit. (He-he, I said "awesome unit.")

[lordsmurf]

The JVC SR-DVM70 is a $1,500 USD pro DV/DVD deck. I was just using that as an illustration.

The JVC DR-M100S is a fine machine, runs about $150-200, depending on where you get it. Fry's has it for $165 or so.

[wayne421]

I believe Circuit City revamped their return policy to prevent (or discourage) multiple return items. Not sure of the details; you should check the website. Ditto for Best Buy.

[bnbhoha]

My sister bought at camera for $390 at CC. I made her return it because it was waaaay overpriced. They charged her a 15% restocking fee because she opened the box, which wasn't even sealed.

[trhouse]

This must be a very recent change if Circuit City is charging a restocking fee. I returned a dvd drive on 03/16/06 and there was no fee.

[budz]

My sister bought at camera for $390 at CC. I made her return it because it was waaaay overpriced. They charged her a 15% restocking fee because she opened the box, which wasn't even sealed.

A lot of retailers such as Sears Dept. store are charging restocking fees. Read the fine print when purchasing electronic components. CompUsa will only do a exchange on a dvd player if it's defective. They have their techs check it out and if it works they won't give you a refund. I had this happen to me about a year ago. I spoke to a floor manager who authorized a full refund. From that experience I never buy electronic components from them. Computer hardware is different because you have 21 days to return the item.

[FulciLives]

The Pioneer 533/633 have apparently been pulled from the shelves by Pioneer until they can fix the annoying problems with their EPGs. My 633 EPG continues to give me grief. It's a shame, because otherwise I have an awesome unit. (He-he, I said "awesome unit.")

I absolutely love my Pioneer DVR-531H-s

The EPG doesn't really work all that well but so what? There is no need to use it as you can program a recording very easily without it.

I never used VCR + to "simplify" VHS programming in the past ... I don't need EPG now.

Anyways Pioneer is simply between models at present ... they stopped making the current line so they have a chance to sell out before the new line comes out ... which as I understand it is any day now.

Nothing uncommon about that now is there?

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[p_l]

I love it, too. But there is indication that Pioneer pulled it from the shelves because of the EPG problems. The new model, the 640H-S, is supposed to be out in June.

One nice feature of programming via the EPG rather than manually, is that if you program it to record a show "regularly" rather than "weekly," it'll only record new episodes. It'll skip weeks that have repeats.

[SingSing]

Walmart and Kmart has both Toshiba and Pioneer DVD recorders.

http://www.kmart.com/catalog/thumbnail.jsp?Ne=125&N=803&categoryId=803&pCategoryId=125...CategoryId=117

I think restocking fee started when students buy and return laptop for examine, and viewers buy and return Large TV after superbowl. The elelctronics margin is also pretty thin now a day.