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Poll: Would you buy your DVD/VHS collection again on HD DVD/BluRay?

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  1. I'm a MEGA Super Moderator Baldrick's Avatar
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    YES!

    Thanks to waheeeeeeeeed for the poll! https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1341781#1341781
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  2. Why would we buy them over again, the PQ on most regular dvd's are poor for that medium.

    Just like dvd, most movies will be ported over in hast... leaving a poor transfer for the masses.


    " OH OH it's a HD-DVD... yippie yippie"

    Meanwile there will be no standard of PQ. We will be left with garbage transfers of movies that in all reality, may not look any better than their older brother... standard dvd's.
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  3. Member yoda313's Avatar
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    Hi,

    I'll probably wait on the next gen dvds as I don't have a hdtv yet. But whenever I do get them I'll only buy the "must have" discs. The big ones like LOTR and Star Wars. The extra space will allow more and more bonuses to be put on them without a loss in movie quality.

    But since the next gen players will be backward compatible will I want to buy a hd/bluray version of Beverly Hills Ninja if I already have the dvd??? Hell no!

    Kevin
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  4. Member kkmike's Avatar
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    Nope, not until the transfer quality is better. Right now it will probably be like watching a HBO movie broadcast in HD that is from 1980. Just sharper noise.
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  5. I own less than a dozen DVD's, as I mostly rent. I've actually been waiting for a higher resolution format, such as HD. When DVD's first came out, I couldn't believe they settled on MPEG2 for compression. Not all frames are preserved from the original film. I would like to have a video format, that preserves ALL frames, like DV,HDV or Laserdisc. MPEG2 does not, it interpolates. This causes artifacts, and also some stuff to look static and not animate.

    Personally for HD discs(Blu-Ray/HD-DVD), I wish they would use a compression that preserves all frames, instead of MPEG2/MPEG4/DiVX. Laserdisc was better in this area, even though it was analog video. Blu-Ray has enough storage space for two hours of DV and HDV, so I don't know why they are using crappy MPEG2/MPEG4. I could care less about extras on a disc.

    Transfer Quality...
    Yes, this needs to get better too. Too many DVD's being released that are not being restored. Even new films. They just transfer them to DVD, without taking all the dust/specks/streaks out. I have several new releases, and they all show film flaws, such as the dust. They need to start using Digital ICE on film to DVD transfers.

    I'm also not going to buy a so-called "HD-DVD/Blu-Ray" disc, that has a re-interpolated upscaled DVD MPEG2 movie on it. Studios need to re-scan the films in, at a much higher recolution for HD format. They should've done this in the first place, to start preserving films. Kodak Cineon system was a start. Film studios need to scan in their films, frame-by-frame, at a super-high resolution. High enough resolution, where the film could be shown on the big screen digitally, in the future. (1920x1080 HD will not be high enough.)

    If they only scan the film in for HDTV, then in 30 years when people have "SuperHDTV", the HDTV scan will not be enough. Studios need to get their act together, and start preserving films digitally at a SUPER-HIGH Resolution, ready for the digital big screen! So what if it will take TERABYTES to store the film digitally? In the future, terabytes will look like KiloBytes. Storage space will always be increasing.

    Will I buy HD-DVD/Blu-Ray discs? Probably, yes, if it is a higher resolution scan, and if they actually digitally restored the film, taking all dust/specs out of the frames. Do I like MPEG compression used? NO.
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    Originally Posted by kkmike
    Just sharper noise.
    More like just sharper crap. 99% of the garbage produced isn't even worth distributing on VHS, let alone DVD.

    Its not like HD is going to somehow magically improve Duece Bigelow.
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  7. Member yoda313's Avatar
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    Hi,

    Originally Posted by wile_e
    Personally for HD discs(Blu-Ray/HD-DVD), I wish they would use a compression that preserves all frames, instead of MPEG2/MPEG4/DiVX. Laserdisc was better in this area, even though it was analog video. Blu-Ray has enough storage space for two hours of DV and HDV, so I don't know why they are using crappy MPEG2/MPEG4.
    I'm sure the main reason they stuck with the mpeg format was to make it easier for backward compatibility. If they were to go to a different compression scheme they'd have to make the players more versatile and have more chips on it to read the formats. By sticking with mpeg they have less to deal with and can easily playback the "old" formats.

    Kevin
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  8. Originally Posted by mbellot

    More like just sharper crap. 99% of the garbage produced isn't even worth distributing on VHS, let alone DVD.

    Its not like HD is going to somehow magically improve Duece Bigelow.

    I won't update my collection because I'm happy with 720x480 and I don't plan on buying an HDTV with HDMI for a long time.
    Now if the next generation DVD players will support DVD-Audio/SACD/DVD-MP3/Divx/WMV/-R DL/+R DL/"wizbangmusthave" format...I might buy one.
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  9. Banned
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    The sooner the better. We're HD ready here.

    Compression, transfer, BLAH! Nothing is perfect. If you want perfect, I guess you'll have to live on a movie set.
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  10. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Wile_E
    ....
    Transfer Quality...
    ...
    Studios need to re-scan the films in, at a much higher recolution for HD format. They should've done this in the first place, to start preserving films. Kodak Cineon system was a start. Film studios need to scan in their films, frame-by-frame, at a super-high resolution. High enough resolution, where the film could be shown on the big screen digitally, in the future. (1920x1080 HD will not be high enough.)

    If they only scan the film in for HDTV, then in 30 years when people have "SuperHDTV", the HDTV scan will not be enough. Studios need to get their act together, and start preserving films digitally at a SUPER-HIGH Resolution, ready for the digital big screen! So what if it will take TERABYTES to store the film digitally? In the future, terabytes will look like KiloBytes. Storage space will always be increasing.
    For good old NTSC/PAL, the film transfer standards evolved roughly as follows.

    1960s-mid 1970s - 2" Quaruplex videotape
    mid 1970's to late 1980's - 1" Type C and later some D2 composite.
    late 1980s to ~2003 - D1 (uncompressed 4:2:2) or Digital Betacam (2x compressed 4:2:2)

    Laserdisc used 1" Type C (early) or D1 (later) masters.

    HDTV transfers are now supposed to be 1080p (1920x1080 progressive) to a datarecorder.
    These will be used for HD DVD formats at 1080p.

    Current release tapes off this database for HDTV broadcast are 1080i.
    ABC may be getting 720p tapes directly or they are deinterlacing the 1080i tapes.

    Digital theater prints (future production) are on the order of 4kx2k (like Star Wars 3) or 4kx4k.
    Old movies will probably be upscaled from the D1 (480i) or 1080p data.
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  11. Member Xylob the Destroyer's Avatar
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    i ticked "only the collectibles", but i will eventually back-up most of my DVD collection to whichever format 'wins the war' just to save shelf space
    "To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from many is research." - Steven Wright
    "Megalomaniacal, and harder than the rest!"
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  12. No, most of my DVD collection is vintage British Television drama; much of this has had to be cleaned up for DVD release. I can't see that there can be much further improvement than has already been done on stuff that is twenty to fifty years old.

    Heck; most of my DVD's soundtracks are in mono!
    Cole
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  13. With the "No"* hovering around 50% I think the movie studios and retailers are going to have a tough sell,sort of like DVD-Audio or SACD.
    I wish the studios would remaster the old titles and add DTS before releasing them on HD-DVD/Blu-Ray.

    *I know this isn't a scientific poll but it gives a general idea.
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  14. Banned
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    Originally Posted by MOVIEGEEK
    With the "No"* hovering around 50% I think the movie studios and retailers are going to have a tough sell,sort of like DVD-Audio or SACD.
    They've already got a tough sell. Do you buy an HD-DVD device or a Blu-Ray Device? Certainly the studios that support one or the other will not be releasing their movies in the opposing format, although there are certain studios (Sony anyone) who will support one format (BetaMax) and distribute movies on an opposing format (VHS). Of course, Sony is the same company who sued to have MP3's illegal while selling MP3 Walkmans.
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  15. Mod Neophyte redwudz's Avatar
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    What Wile_E said. When HD quality approaches cinema quality, I'll replace some of my favorites.

    Hope this is not off-topic, but some commercial cinema movies are now on digital media for theater projection. Does someone have a link to their format, size, info on them. Just curious on how they do it.
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  16. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by redwudz
    What Wile_E said. When HD quality approaches cinema quality, I'll replace some of my favorites.

    Hope this is not off-topic, but some commercial cinema movies are now on digital media for theater projection. Does someone have a link to their format, size, info on them. Just curious on how they do it.
    4Kx2k and 4kx4k

    Some links:

    http://www.etcenter.org/extranet_files/NAB05/Aoyama_NAB_2005.pdf

    http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Digital-cinema

    http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/digital-cinema1.htm

    http://www.infocomm.org/Newsnetwork/index.cfm?objectID=C9207E3C-55AA-4BE2-9A1D29A8187E438B


    And then there is Mark Cuban's Landmark Theater Digital conversion (prototype)
    PS: Mark Cuban owns HDNet

    http://www.landmarktheatres.com/AboutLandmak/AboutIndexB.htm
    http://www.showbizdata.com/contacts/picknews.cfm/38074/LANDMARK_THEATERS_TO_GO_DIGITAL
    http://www.indiewire.com/biz/biz_050316land.html
    http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2003/apr03/04-03LandmarkTheatresPR.mspx
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  17. Mod Neophyte redwudz's Avatar
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    Thanks, edDV, just what I was looking for.
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  18. Member ricardouk's Avatar
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    just another way for the studios to get more money
    I love it when a plan comes together!
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  19. Considering that I've probably spent $1000 to transfer VHS to DVD.... And given that the only new(?) DVDs I buy are clearance from rental stock at a local video store, no I won't be replacing them.

    TBC + JVC HR-S9911U + Pioneer DVR-531H, the 1st a while ago, the other 2 recently. All from reccomendations/opinions/reviews in messages here. Thanks!

    I'm generally happy with the results, will I go HDTV, When I have/am forced to.

    Why did I spend that money that I had to pinch elsewhere to free up? Many of my VHS collection are not and/or will not be available on DVD in any forseeable future. IE Home movies, Specials, out of print VHS etc.

    Down the road if/when a HDTV type of system that can also record/play DVDs becomes affordable I may replace them onto new media to save shelf space.

    OTOH doing that will mean new covers that look good and can display however many DVD titles that fit onto the new media. So I may not do that either for esthetic reasons.

    Cheers
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  20. Member
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    If the price for HD-DVD are good I may consider buying HD-DVD instead of standard DVD like I've been doing in the last 4 years buying DVD instead of VHS. A lot of VHS tapes I still own still hasn't been released in DVD format yet! grrr...
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  21. Member
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    Only if the images are HD.
    I'm a visual person and many of my DVD's bother me due to their low quality images/encoding.

    Many people perfer mp3 over SACD/DVD-A, and I'm sure Divx-iPod will be just as popular as mp3-ipod.
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  22. Originally Posted by zleepy
    Only if the images are HD.
    I'm a visual person and many of my DVD's bother me due to their low quality images/encoding.
    I agree... problem is What IS "HD". I don't know of any "standard". And even if there is one, what's to keep them from encoding the hell out of a transfer.
    Don't give in to DVD2ONE, that leads to the dark side.
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  23. Member ricoman's Avatar
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    No, I have a 50" Sony LCD rear proj. HDTV, along with my LG upconverting DVD player, the picture and sound is fantastic, near HD quality. As a matter of fact it is every bit as good as the the average (say network) HD broadcasts, just not quite as good as the 2 or 3 great channels. I can't see spending, what I'm sure will be very high prices, for a slightly better newer technology.
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  24. Member Weapon's Avatar
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    Nope. I would exchange them if Hollywood would come out with a program to "UPGRADE", but I don't think that will ever happen!!
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  25. I'll buy them when I know I can rip them and back them up to whatever format I desire.

    Both HD and Blu-Ray are going to be huge bombs. Having two incompatible formats, a hefty price tag and no reason for the average Joe to upgrade spells disaster and tons of losses for the industry. DVD is still young and sales are still surging for the format. Other than a perceived increase in picture quality there is no reason to upgrade. Most people still don't have HDTV sets with the HDMI interface.

    I think Blu-Ray will be successful for data storage for computers but neither of these formats are going to succeed in the consumer electronics space. At least not in the near future.
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  26. Member ricoman's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by CaptainVideo
    I'll buy them when I know I can rip them and back them up to whatever format I desire.

    Both HD and Blu-Ray are going to be huge bombs. Having two incompatible formats, a hefty price tag and no reason for the average Joe to upgrade spells disaster and tons of losses for the industry. DVD is still young and sales are still surging for the format. Other than a perceived increase in picture quality there is no reason to upgrade. Most people still don't have HDTV sets with the HDMI interface.

    I think Blu-Ray will be successful for data storage for computers but neither of these formats are going to succeed in the consumer electronics space. At least not in the near future.
    I agree whole heartedly, I have an HDTV with HDMI and I still don't see a need or demand for it.
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  27. Member yoda313's Avatar
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    Hi,

    Originally Posted by captainvideo
    DVD is still young and sales are still surging for the format
    Well there were stories out the other week about slowing sales for dvd. Of course they probably aren't factoring in the STAR WARS release last year that would scew the data for this year. That was a mega release that would be hard to repeat this year. EDIT - (except for the episode 3 release on nov 1st of course )

    Kevin
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  28. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Weapon
    Nope. I would exchange them if Hollywood would come out with a program to "UPGRADE", but I don't think that will ever happen!!
    If Hollywood would just offer upgrade at a reasonable price, they would have a moral standing for their encryption philosophy.

    Instead they want us to buy the same title from scratch with no discount for previous purchase in each new format.

    Take Star Wars as an example.

    VHS - great in 1980s, sucks on a 1990s TV

    Laserdisc - great on a 1990s quality TV, noisy and NTSC/PAL artifacts on EDTV/HDTV

    DVD (full screen pan and scan) - looks good on a 1990s TV. On a widescreen EDTV/HDTV how do you get rid of those black side bars? Oh, you want me to buy the widescreen version again at full price? Are you kidding?

    DVD (Widescreen) - wow that's better! ... but as I look closer 480p looks like crap compared to the HBO 1080i channel. What? you say wait for HD vs Blue-Ray to be settled?

    Time passes.
    More Time passes.

    HD DVD or Blue-Ray version intoduced 1080p quality! - You can buy it again ($50?) but to play it you need a new HDTV with HDMI/HDCP encryption. Forget trying to play it on your top tier early adopter $15,000 HDTV projector that only connects VGA or analog component.

    Imagine if software was sold this way. Wait a minute ... isn't a movie just software?
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  29. Member yoda313's Avatar
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    Hi,

    Originally Posted by edDV
    Forget trying to play it on your top tier early adopter $15,000 HDTV projector that only connects VGA or analog component.
    If you bought a first generation hdtv at $10,000 or higher I think your in the group of people that will buy the newest dvd player whatever the format. As for a new tv I don't think that would be a problem for them either if they bought one for 10 grand - thats insane in my opinion even if you had the means to do so. But that class of people wouldn't blink an eyelash at buying a movie again at an inflated next generation price tag.

    Kevin
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  30. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by yoda313
    Hi,

    Originally Posted by edDV
    Forget trying to play it on your top tier early adopter $15,000 HDTV projector that only connects VGA or analog component.
    If you bought a first generation hdtv at $10,000 or higher I think your in the group of people that will buy the newest dvd player whatever the format. As for a new tv I don't think that would be a problem for them either if they bought one for 10 grand - thats insane in my opinion even if you had the means to do so. But that class of people wouldn't blink an eyelash at buying a movie again at an inflated next generation price tag.

    Kevin
    Well if that doesn't work for you, how about the guy (me) that bought the best HDTV I could afford in March 2004. It was a 27" CRT capable of ~1080x1080 over VGA or wideband analog component. The price was a bit of a stretch, but I could justify that I was investing for the next 10 years of "HD Ready".

    Months later, Hollywood proposes the "broadcast record flag" to limit TV sets without HDCP to 480i for certain ATSC HDTV broadcasts. Next they announce future HDTV DVD players will ONLY work for HDCP equipped sets*. Other sets will only get 480i/480p that we already get from current DVD.

    Are you still supporting Hollywood?


    * Actually, they still haven't announced this to the general public. I discovered the HDCP 480i/480p restriction while reviewing HDTV DVD player chipsets from Sigma Designs and others. People buying "HD Ready" HDTV sets today are not informed about HDCP restrictions and how it will affect their future system interconnects.
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