The New York Times calls for death penalty for hackers

[BJ_M]

Worse Than Death

Last year a German teenager named Sven Jaschan released the Sasser worm, one of the costliest acts of sabotage in the history of the Internet. It crippled computers around the world, closing businesses, halting trains and grounding airplanes.


Which of these punishments does he deserve?

A) A 21-month suspended sentence and 30 hours of community service.

B) Two years in prison.

C) A five-year ban on using computers.

D) Death.

E) Something worse.

If you answered A, you must be the German judge who gave him that sentence last week.

If you answered B or C, you're confusing him with other hackers who have been sent to prison and banned from using computers or the Internet. But those punishments don't seem to have deterred hackers like Mr. Jaschan from taking their place.

I'm tempted to say that the correct answer is D, and not just because of the man-years I've spent running virus scans and reformatting hard drives. I'm almost convinced by Steven Landsburg's cost-benefit analysis showing that the spreaders of computer viruses and worms are more logical candidates for capital punishment than murderers are.

Professor Landsburg, an economist at the University of Rochester, has calculated the relative value to society of executing murderers and hackers. By using studies estimating the deterrent value of capital punishment, he figures that executing one murderer yields at most $100 million in social benefits.

The benefits of executing a hacker would be greater, he argues, because the social costs of hacking are estimated to be so much higher: $50 billion per year. Deterring a mere one-fifth of 1 percent of those crimes - one in 500 hackers - would save society $100 million. And Professor Landsburg believes that a lot more than one in 500 hackers would be deterred by the sight of a colleague on death row.

I see his logic, but I also see practical difficulties. For one thing, many hackers live in places where capital punishment is illegal. For another, most of them are teenage boys, a group that has never been known for fearing death. They're probably more afraid of going five years without computer games.

So that leaves us with E: something worse than death. Something that would approximate the millions of hours of tedium that hackers have inflicted on society.

Hackers are the Internet equivalent of Richard Reid, the shoe-bomber who didn't manage to hurt anyone on his airplane but has been annoying travelers ever since. When I join the line of passengers taking off their shoes at the airport, I get little satisfaction in thinking that the man responsible for this ritual is sitting somewhere by himself in a prison cell, probably with his shoes on.

He ought to spend his days within smelling range of all those socks at the airport. In an exclusive poll I once conducted among fellow passengers, I found that 80 percent favored forcing Mr. Reid to sit next to the metal detector, helping small children put their sneakers back on.

The remaining 20 percent in the poll (meaning one guy) said that wasn't harsh enough. He advocated requiring Mr. Reid to change the Odor-Eaters insoles of runners at the end of the New York City Marathon.

What would be the equivalent public service for Internet sociopaths? Maybe convicted spammers could be sentenced to community service testing all their own wares. The number of organ-enlargement offers would decline if a spammer thought he'd have to appear in a public-service television commercial explaining that he'd tried them all and they just didn't work for him.

Convicted hackers like Mr. Jaschan could be sentenced to a lifetime of removing worms and viruses, but the computer experts I consulted said there would be too big a risk that the hackers would enjoy the job. After all, Mr. Jaschan is now doing just that for a software security firm.

The experts weren't sure that any punishment could fit the crime, but they had several suggestions: Make the hacker spend 16 hours a day fielding help-desk inquiries in an AOL chat room for computer novices. Force him to do this with a user name at least as uncool as KoolDude and to work on a vintage IBM PC with a 2400-baud dial-up connection. Most painful of all for any geek, make him use Windows 95 for the rest of his life.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/12/opinion/12tierney.html?hp&oref=login

[JohnnyCNote]

Several paragraphs reveal the author's intent:

I'm tempted to say that the correct answer is D, and not just because of the man-years I've spent running virus scans and reformatting hard drives. I'm almost convinced by Steven Landsburg's cost-benefit analysis showing that the spreaders of computer viruses and worms are more logical candidates for capital punishment than murderers are. . .

I see his logic, but I also see practical difficulties. For one thing, many hackers live in places where capital punishment is illegal. For another, most of them are teenage boys, a group that has never been known for fearing death. They're probably more afraid of going five years without computer games.

So that leaves us with E: something worse than death. Something that would approximate the millions of hours of tedium that hackers have inflicted on society.

In other words, the author does not truly mean for his premise to be taken seriously....

[nzjacob]

In My world "Hackers" and Virus creators are two different types. Hackers point out flaws in systems, and Virus writers are evil little buggers. I would hope that the author might also differentiate the two groups.

[tacoman97x]

Let's try giving the Death penalty to rapists and child molestors before we god damn petty hackers... In some states you can go to jail longer for having an oz of weed then raping a child.. rediculous..

[JohnnyCNote]

Very good! As the victim of a violent crime I can't tell you how it burns me up when I hear that violent criminals are released to make room for non-violent drug offenders serving mandatory minimum sentences...

[Sifaga]

Hackers point out flaws in systems

thats one way of looking at it

[BJ_M]

on a slightly related note - there were a whole bunch of new raids and busts today on many more groups ...

[junkmalle]

on a slightly related note - there were a whole bunch of new raids and busts today on many more groups ...

Yeah, like Intel!

http://money.cnn.com/2005/07/12/news/international/intel.reut/index.htm

[edDV]

Well, assuming violent criminals are somehow dealt with ...

Sven Jaschan should be sentenced to offering his arm for injection of whatever substance anyone should choose to inject. Then, he can hope for an antidote.

They could make it a reality series on TV.

Sven needs to realize real people face financial and/or physical harm from his actions.

[ROF]

If they killed the hackers, what would be the state of security software? It would still be needed because as capital punishment has shown, it's no detterent to murder, so it wouldn't deter people from creating and distributing a computer virus or other malicious attacks on technology.

Most hackers graduate to working at anti-virus companies or other software security firms. Without the knowledge of what can be done, we'd never be protected.

[junkmalle]

as capital punishment has shown, it's no detterent to murder..

It's a deterrent to further murders by that same individual.

[ROF]

Not really. Since most capital punishment takes decades to occur this inmate has plenty of time to pass along their "trade secrets" to others who may not recieve the death penalty.

[junkmalle]

Not really. Since most capital punishment takes decades to occur this inmate has plenty of time to pass along their "trade secrets" to others who may not recieve the death penalty.

So you're arguing for a swifter death penalty.

[ROF]

Nope. No death penalty for hackers. Give them a security job instead. That's what happens to most of them anyways.

[junkmalle]

Nope. No death penalty for hackers. Give them a security job instead. That's what happens to most of them anyways.

Maybe we should give murders jobs too. We could put their skills to use as executioners. No wait, if all murderers got jobs as executioners there'd be nobody for them to execute. LOL

[Swanick]

Resistingtheurgeresistingtheurgeresistingtheurgere sistingtheurgeresistingtheurgeresistingtheurgeresi stingtheurge.......

[yoda313]

Hi,

Most painful of all for any geek, make him use Windows 95 for the rest of his life.

I thought WIN ME was the bain of all windows users??????

Kevin

[draganong]

Resistingtheurgeresistingtheurgeresistingtheurgere sistingtheurgeresistingtheurgeresistingtheurgeresi stingtheurge.......

Have them join the Army. I hear we are needing some soldiers.

[ROF]

Nope. No death penalty for hackers. Give them a security job instead. That's what happens to most of them anyways.

Maybe we should give murders jobs too. We could put their skills to use as executioners. No wait, if all murderers got jobs as executioners there'd be nobody for them to execute. LOL

Ever hear of "Go to War or Go to Jail"?? The combat arms professions in the military is the perfect place for people who enjoy killing. Back before Kennedy was in office, it was a good place for assassins too.

[Redd]

Putting things into perspective...Death for Hackers, but know child molesters with convictions of violent felony’s against children get released from jail for $1500, then go out and kill and molest/rape more children. Hmmm, what's wrong with this picture.

If hackers are to get death, then child molesters get the Chipper, and I get to be Chipper operator for the first one. And I choose to use a slow RPM Chipper. Maxium pain, maxium torture.

[canadateck]

Let's try giving the Death penalty to rapists and child molestors before we god damn petty hackers... In some states you can go to jail longer for having an oz of weed then raping a child.. rediculous..

I heard a few years ago there was One and Only "One" put to death for Raping a child. They should all die.

[ROF]

If hackers are to get death, then child molesters get the Chipper, and I get to be Chipper operator for the first one. And I choose to use a slow RPM Chipper. Maxium pain, maxium torture.

A chipper with rusty, dull blades that is prone to breakdowns after a few feet of bone chipping. Parts to bring it back online are scarce and could require up to 72 hours or more before replacement parts are shipped.

Torture these sickos I say. Torture them in ways that make Vietnam POW Camps look like Romper Room.

[junkmalle]

When Redd gets tired of operating the chipper the poor murderers can take over.

[ROF]

When Redd gets tired of operating the chipper the poor murderers can take over.

That's what "hackers" are for.

[Bondiablo]

Personally I always thought the best thing to do with violent offenders was use them for medical experiments instead of animals. Two birds with one stone, no more debate on the death penalty and the PETA people can finally get a life.

Now, hackers in the army could be a lot more useful, they could certainly do more damage to a country than an assassin.

Also, I wouldn't be so sure the author of the story isn't serious. After all, it's become painfully obvious that money is the absolute number one priority to the people making decisions for us and the safest way to broach a subject when you're afraid of the response is to bring it up as a joke first to gauge reactions.

[MeDiCo_BrUjO]

HACK THE PLANET!!!

[BSpielbauer]

While the discussion regarding the issue of what society should do with hackers is interesting, it seems that quite a few above are still missing the real point. As JohnyC pointed out early on in this thread, the New York Times writer has his tongue firmly placed in his cheek, and is clearly using the fine and ancient art of satire. To repeat, he is NOT in any way really advocating a death sentence.

Try to recall Mr. Swift's treatise "A Modest Proposal," and be sure to remember what Swift's real motive was.

Just trying to keep things in perspective...

-Bruce

[edDV]

While the discussion regarding the issue of what society should do with hackers is interesting, it seems that quite a few above are still missing the real point. As JohnyC pointed out early on in this thread, the New York Times writer has his tongue firmly placed in his cheek, and is clearly using the fine and ancient art of satire. To repeat, he is NOT in any way really advocating a death sentence.

Try to recall Mr. Swift's treatise "A Modest Proposal," and be sure to remember what Swift's real motive was.

Just trying to keep things in perspective...

-Bruce

Remember when Mitnik (sp?) cracked the NYT they sent him to prison for 3-5yrs. No sympathy when they are the victim.

[JohnnyCNote]

I'd be satisfied if all violent criminals were exiled to an island, like in Escape from New York, but in Greenland, or Antartica, or somewhere equally harsh.

More realistically, I think there needs to be a maximum security prison system for violent criminals, where they'd be kept until they're too old to be a threat to anyone else. People who are mentally ill and violent need to be in psychiatric hospitals, but should not be released, since they can't be as closely monitored and may not take their medication and relapse into more violent episodes.

Non-violent offenders could, depending on the severity of the crime, either do community service, or be confined in facilities where they're allowed to improve themselves or paid back what they've stolen, etc.

But I think I'll file that under F for Fat Chance....

[BJ_M]

i think all the people that live in greenland (which is really turning green with global warming) wouldn't buy into that idea to much ,,,,