JUST SAY NO (to pre-movie ads)

[AlecWest]

Feb. 27, 2005 - Times-Argus, Montpelier, VT

Audiences Strike Back at Pre-film Ads

A long time ago in a galaxy not so far, far away, theatergoers knew movies would start on time. There would be some previews, of course, but no TV-style ads to hold up the show.

Nowadays, pre-movie advertising rakes in hundreds of millions of dollars each year for theater owners. But with some movies starting nearly half an hour after theaters say they will, and ticket prices as high as ever, lawmakers and citizens across the country are fighting back. Their demand: that theaters tell them when movies actually start, giving customers the option of arriving after the ads.

"To steal people's time in the way that movie theaters are doing, it is as bad as stealing their money," said Mark Weinberg, a Chicago lawyer who took the Loews Cineplex Entertainment Group to court for consumer fraud.

In January, Andrew Fleischmann, a Democratic state representative from West Hartford, Conn., proposed legislation to make theaters announce precisely when movies, not ads and previews, begin. Unlike most bills proposed in Connecticut, Fleischmann's has already been selected to receive a public hearing from the general law committee. He expects it to pass easily.

"I probably introduced 20 bills this year, including some on very important topics like expanding coverage for health insurance and improving education, and this bill has received more attention than all the rest of them combined," said Fleischmann, who wrote the bill in a few spare minutes after being approached by a pair of exasperated constituents. "There's a lot of ticked-off people."

Weinberg's quest has proved more difficult. His case was thrown out of Cook County Circuit Court two years ago, but he is to bring it before the Illinois Appellate Court in April.

His friends wonder why he has devoted so much time to this issue, and in response Weinberg recalls the words of an elderly friend: "I'm 76 years old. Ten or 15 minutes is a long time to me!"

But both Weinberg and Fleischmann believe the issue is not simply about lost minutes. It also involves popular discontent with the ubiquity of advertising.

"People are generally quite frustrated over the level of commercialism in today's culture," Fleischmann said. "You go to the movies for a couple hours of escape, to sit in the dark and be swept away, and to have that space invaded has upset a lot of people."

High ticket prices also heighten consumer dissatisfaction with lengthy pre-movie delays, said Gary Ruskin, executive director of the consumer watchdog group Commercial Alert. "People get especially mad because they spend eight, nine, 10 dollars for the so-called privilege of being force-fed commercials," Ruskin said.

Early in January, after the organization's 5,000 members chose pre-movie ads as their No. 1 complaint, Ruskin started a campaign urging citizens to boycott offending theaters and complain to local officials.

Theater companies, however, argue that revenues from pre-movie advertising — which, according to the Cinema Advertising Council, is growing faster than any other part of the advertising industry, with revenues increasing to $315 million in 2003 from $212 million in 2002 — are necessary for their survival.

"We're in a challenging time," said Cliff Marks, president of marketing and sales at Regal Cinemedia, the nation's largest theater operator. Because most of the cost of a movie ticket is paid to studios, and amenities like stadium seating and extra-large screens are so expensive, cash-strapped theaters end up "walking a fine line between creating new revenue streams and honoring our patrons."

Marks said Regal sympathizes with complaints that commercials are invasive and movies start too late. In response, the company has installed projection systems that begin movies at precisely their advertised start time.

"We actually agree with consumers who feel commercials should not be airing on their dime," Marks said. "We just think the notion of being regulated by the government is unnecessary."

Regal Cinemedia is the industry exception, however, and on a recent night at the AMC Empire 25 theater in New York's Times Square, patrons were almost uniform in expressing their annoyance at pre-movie advertising.

"I try to close my eyes and block out the sound," said Grace Welch, 80, of Long Island, who declared that she would soon contact her own elected officials. "I've always wondered what I could do to stop it."

BTW, an Illinois state legislator, Jack Franks, has proposed a new law making it mandatory for Illinois theaters to list two show times --- the time the trailers/ads start, and the time the movie really starts.

[redwudz]

Now if we can just get them to take all the crap off DVD's. Disney seems to put an endless bunch of previews before their movies. A good reason to backup with Shrink, main movie only, and use that version for viewing.

[BSR]

And they say it's the pirates that are making them lose money.
Maybe it's more like the bull$hit they put out that consumers just don't want to put up with. But those studies were never taken into account, now were they.

Yes, Disney DVD's. Backup up with Shrink and it makes it easier for your child to just put the movie in the DVD player and hit that big button with the sideways triangle on it to watch his movie, simple but effective.

[Shadow57]

Now if we can just get them to take all the crap off DVD's. Disney seems to put an endless bunch of previews before their movies. A good reason to backup with Shrink, main movie only, and use that version for viewing.

We rented Taxi and the same thing happened. We had to watch Laverne
and Shirley skipping and singing.....
.....One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.
.....Sclemeel, schlemazel, hasenfeffer incorporated.

I tried to skip to the main Taxi menu but I pressed the wrong
menu button. We had to watch Laverne and Shirley again!

As for DVDShrink, once when doing a back-up of a DVD that we own, I
deleted those opening snippets, but then the DVD wouldn't properly play.
I probably deleted a small file that had to be there.

Not all of the preview stuff is boring though. One video company has taken
a humorous approach to the FBI warning. They have a picture of J Edgar,
but that's all I'll say. If you've seen it you know what I mean!

[Shadow57]

[quote="AlecWest"]

Feb. 27, 2005 - Times-Argus, Montpelier, VT

Audiences Strike Back at Pre-film Ads

Theater companies, however, argue that revenues from pre-movie advertising — which, according to the Cinema Advertising Council, is growing faster than any other part of the advertising industry, with revenues increasing to $315 million in 2003 from $212 million in 2002 — are necessary for their survival.

If the theaters need more money they should
raise the price of popcorn and soda pop!

[RottenFoxBreath]

in the uk ,thats the last bloody thing that needs a price hike.
its already super dear to buy,i usually take some haribo sweets and a bottle of coke with me.

[cal_tony]

I don't go to movie theaters because of the advertising and all of the other inconveniences involved in the process that waste my time. It's a lot easier to like a 2 hour movie if it only takes up two hours of your life I like movies and see a lot of them. So, all of the extra wasted time adds up. Now, with large screen Hi def screens and Dvds, I feel very little need to visit a theater. With modern technology, I can provide to myself as good a picture and sound as most theaters. To further accommodate my preferences, I backup all of my movies so they play the way I want them to. I never shrink a movie, However I do shrink all of my episodic Dvds. I have a dvd changer so 1 disk would follow the other with no need on my part to get up and change the disk. But even without the changer, I would still do two disks for a larger movie. The price of blank disks on average runs 35 to 40 cents apiece-- so why not.
Further, I redo all of my movies to skip the menus and extras. I want 5.1 sound and subtitles in english and I want the movie to start without any further intervention. Using Shrink, I put all of the extras at the end of the movie. If I want to see them, there they are at the end where they belong. One after the other in the order that I want them without having to review countless menus to pick out each extra feature.
I have the complete 7 years of "Buffy". Nice to watch over and over again and also good as background sound when I'm doing something else. But what's with all the menus to go from episode to episode and the same music score for seven years worth that pups up for each episode about 2 min. in. Thank goodness for some of the free programs that can clean up this mess in just a few minutes--much less time than it takes to shrink.

I don't like all of the ads on my Dvds, but at least the ads are done to generate income. And to some extant, that's the way it is less understandable, and much more unforgivable are all the companies the put out Dvds without taking the time to understand what it is that they shipping out their doors. All the menus all the user intervention. A lot of companies turn a good or OK movie into a horrible Dvd.

I'm surprised not to find more complaining about this issue. A lot of the posters that help with technical issues seem to be in the bis. of putting out one off Dvds. By their advice and their interest in the product itself, I can just imagine them cringing when they play a new commercial Dvd and saying to anyone who would listen--what garbage.

[BSR]

If they are barely surviving, don't you think the movie industry should somehow help them? Charge less for the movie to the theater? Don't know for sure, but do know movies make lots of money.

Don't agree with raising the price of popcorn and soda.
The current prices deter a lot of people from buying either now a days. So instead of getting less money and selling more, they get more money and sell less. So it's a wash, except that now the garbage cleanup is less, so the theaters make out for the better,

[Shadow57]

Don't agree with raising the price of popcorn and soda.

I was only kidding, but I think everybody is taking me seriously!

I should have used a smiley when I said that.

[schunn99]

I have no problem with trailers on movie just put them on a seperate menu that can be selected at will instead of before the main menu. As for the trailer before movies, I don't have a problem with that, even though I know people that do, why not do have the previews start 5-8 minutes before the movie starts in the time that is normal used to watch boring ad space that repeat itself endlessly and at the movie start time, start the movie.

[waheed]

I dont mind watching a few trailers for upcoming movies in the threatres, but the ads i cant stand. Usually, my local threatre shows ads for approx 30 minutes, so i arrive 25 minutes after the stated times.

I would agree with cal_tony to some extent, watcging movies in the comfort of your own home, but its the wait that kills to see the movie released on DVD.

And one further point, High Definition hasn't taken off in the UK yet.

[giantsmurf]

I love going to the theatre. Even if I had a great setup at home I'd still go. And I don't mind the previews. There have been a few times where I've seen previews for movies that I'd never heard about that I then went to see. And I can understand theatres showing ads before a movie. But instead of showing ads and then previews and then the movie, I think they should show the ads during the time when everyone is entering. Most times people get to a screen 10 - 15 minutes early. Show the ads then, when they are waiting for the start of the film. Then start the film on time. I'd just as soon watch the ads then watch those lame movie trivia bits they show.

[cal_tony]

Waheed:
I know what you mean but,
I want what I want and I'm willing to wait to have it my way.
Thank goodness for this new technology, and thank you to those individuals who have made the new technology more useful and more friendly.[/u]

[kirpen]

I love going to the theatre. Even if I had a great setup at home I'd still go. And I don't mind the previews. There have been a few times where I've seen previews for movies that I'd never heard about that I then went to see. And I can understand theatres showing ads before a movie. But instead of showing ads and then previews and then the movie, I think they should show the ads during the time when everyone is entering. Most times people get to a screen 10 - 15 minutes early. Show the ads then, when they are waiting for the start of the film. Then start the film on time. I'd just as soon watch the ads then watch those lame movie trivia bits they show.

I'm sure that wouldnt make as much cash if the ad ran befor showtime. How would hey sale that when everyone knows most people arent there to see them.
As far as ads on dvds go I cant wait for the first blu-ray disney disc. I betting on half an hour of ads atthe least.

[hudsonf]

Shadow57, I know you were kidding about the popcorn and soda pop. I just hope no theater owners see your post and get any ideas. Popcorn and soda pop cost more than the movie. If it wasn't for my wifes large pocketbook we couldn't afford to go to the movies. I'm not saying I'm old but I remember when all you got before the movie was a preview and a cartoon.

[Shadow57]

Shadow57..........
If it wasn't for my wifes large pocketbook we couldn't afford to go to the movies.

For some reason I like that sentence!

[guns1inger]

Wife + 2 kids = $50 just for tickets. Throw in a drink and popcorn and it's a $75 outing. We now go once a year - the latest Pixar release. Everything else is on disk unless it is a definate cinema must see (LOTR). And no-one watches the bloody ads anyway. They talk, thow food, act like ********. I can get 3 DVDs and a lot less agravation for the same price, so screw 'em.

[jbenj01]

Respects previews on DVD titles, can't you usually bypass them if you double-up on hitting 'Stop' after first play begins, then hit 'Play'.. This usually leads me straight to the movie/main title. Don't recall whether this works on Disney titles..

I think Paramount DVD's extend the courtesy of playing previews or going straight to main menu.. which is nice.

[AlecWest]

If the theaters need more money they should raise the price of popcorn and soda pop!

I know you're being tongue in cheek here, hehe. But, in case there's someone out there who doesn't know this, here's the bitter truth ... and this comes from 12 years experience managing theaters (mostly drive-ins). The theater business is not part of the entertainment industry. It's part of the "fast-food" industry. Almost every penny spent on the ticket price goes back to Hollywood (or film distributors). The reason why popcorn, soda, candy and such are priced so high is because THAT is what pays the salaries of theater employees.

Anyhoo, the reason tickets are so high-priced is due to bloated film budgets ... partly due to greedy actors who demand millions to star in a film ... and partly due to increased production costs (special effects, for example). This whole issue is a double-edged sword. If we see laws enacted forcing theaters to publish movie times vs. "show" times, ad companies will wise up and advertise elsewhere ... causing ticket prices to go up even further. Or, this may cause some film companies to get "clever" ... and start splitting films with previously unannounced intermissions (filled with on-screen ads). And, if they do that and can get away with it, expect the next step ... that some pointy head in Hollywood will suggest that these same intermissions be incorporated into DVDs.

As much as I agree with the sentiments of those who want to curb pre-movie advertising, I can't help but ask myself where (and how) the next shoe will drop. Whether it's higher movie ticket prices or mid-film advertising, it ain't gonna be pretty.

[BJ_M]

Alec -- you are oh so correct ... I couldnt agree more ..




one thing that hasnt been mentioned -- and people dont seem to really mind , is product placement IN films ...

This is huge bussness and its going to get bigger ..

[dphirschler]

I am tired of product placement IN films. It's so predictable nowdays.

[BJ_M]

I am tired of product placement IN films. It's so predictable nowdays.

whats funny - is how some of those products change between the film and the dvd ...

spiderman is a good case in point ... though there is so many errors in that film i can't stand to watch it to remember what they all are ..

[ViRaL1]

In the end, somebody's got to pay. If the advertsiers don't pay, then consumers will in the form of higher ticket prices. Same thing goes for DVDs, when it gets so easy that nearly everyone can remove the ads or skip them on their DVDs, they'll raise the prices to cover the loss. Ads don't really bother me as long as they're targeting the audience that will be watching the film.

I am tired of product placement IN films. It's so predictable nowdays.

Would it really improve the moviegoing experience if the actors were drinking 'Cola' instead of Coke?

[AlecWest]

one thing that hasnt been mentioned -- and people dont seem to really mind , is product placement IN films ...

This is huge bussness and its going to get bigger ..

Isn't it true that the film, "Close Encounters Of the Third Kind," was re-edited to include in-film advertising that wasn't there before (ie., McDonalds)??? You didn't see it at the theater ... but you did see in in the VHS tape or DVD.

Trivia P.S. - Prior to the film, "E.T.," the market for Reese's Pieces was marginal. But following the film's release, sales skyrocketed. So, in-film advertising does work. Also, FWIW, the production company first approached the makers of "M&Ms" to see if they wanted in-film presence. Some marketing person there (who probably ended up looking for a new job) said they weren't interested ... which is when Reese's Pieces came into play.

BTW, in-film advertising has been around in TV for years ... though it's more subtle. Example - remember the old TV series with Efram Zimbalist, Jr. - THE FBI??? In the series, all the agents drove Fords (grin). The bad guys drove Chevys and such.

[adam]

[? In the series, all the agents drove Fords (grin). The bad guys drove Chevys and such.

Should have been the other way around.

[AlecWest]

I am tired of product placement IN films. It's so predictable nowdays.

Would it really improve the moviegoing experience if the actors were drinking 'Cola' instead of Coke?

It would improve the experience if writing decisions were left up to writers, not advertising executives.

[ViRaL1]

I am tired of product placement IN films. It's so predictable nowdays.

Would it really improve the moviegoing experience if the actors were drinking 'Cola' instead of Coke?

It would improve the experience if writing decisions were left up to writers, not advertising executives.

Maybe if there's some significance, especially if the product is written in because of some specific relation to the movie, but if it's just that 'Bob drinks a pop, do we care if it's Coke or Pepsi or some off brand?

[BJ_M]

one thing that hasnt been mentioned -- and people dont seem to really mind , is product placement IN films ...

This is huge bussness and its going to get bigger ..

Isn't it true that the film, "Close Encounters Of the Third Kind," was re-edited to include in-film advertising that wasn't there before (ie., McDonalds)??? You didn't see it at the theater ... but you did see in in the VHS tape or DVD.

Trivia P.S. - Prior to the film, "E.T.," the market for Reese's Pieces was marginal. But following the film's release, sales skyrocketed. So, in-film advertising does work. Also, FWIW, the production company first approached the makers of "M&Ms" to see if they wanted in-film presence. Some marketing person there (who probably ended up looking for a new job) said they weren't interested ... which is when Reese's Pieces came into play.

BTW, in-film advertising has been around in TV for years ... though it's more subtle. Example - remember the old TV series with Efram Zimbalist, Jr. - THE FBI??? In the series, all the agents drove Fords (grin). The bad guys drove Chevys and such.

in the film ET , they promoted a Kuwahara bicycle as the bmx bike -- there was a huge tie in and Kuwahara made millions ..

[AlecWest]

Maybe if there's some significance, especially if the product is written in because of some specific relation to the movie, but if it's just that 'Bob drinks a pop, do we care if it's Coke or Pepsi or some off brand?

Well, screenplay and teleplay writers have their characters use brand name products occasionally. The trend that gets my goat is that, during (or following) the writing process, the film's advertising gurus come in and say things like, "OK, we want a scene that shows McDonalds' golden arches, another scene showing the face of a Rolex watch, another scene, etc., etc..." even if those products, much less brands, aren't even part of the script. And, if the film's budget demands a certain time-limit be assigned to the film, the ads escape the editor's scissors ... forcing editors to overcut scenes germane to the film's plot.

I don't really care whether a character drinks "Cola," "Coke," or "Pepsi" unless the pop-drinking was never part of the screenplay to begin with ... and if seeing that scene deprives me of seeing another scene providing a better understanding of the film.

[ViRaL1]

I don't agree with changing the fabric of the film just to incorporate advertising, but it doesn't bother me one way or another if there's placement of a specific brand when a product is used. In the end though, don't you think something WOULD be taken out if those advertising dollars were lost?