Harddrive or no harddrive?

[Vovin]

I'm thinking about buying a standalone DVD recorder, wich will be a first for me and I'm faced with a difficult and uninformed decision. I've noticed that some DVD recorders include harddrives with 80GB or 120GB storage. These ofcourse costs more than the regular ones.

What I was wondering is what sort of features does the harddrive versions usually provide that the "normal" DVD recorders doesn't?
And do you think it's worth the extra $$?

I'm currently looking at a Panasonic DMR-E85H, I know nothing about this recorder outside the specs but the cost is very reasonable (it includes an 80GB harddrive).

[handyguy]

They are kind of TIVO. I think they use Guide Plus for programming, which one guy said he couldn't get it to recognize anything over channel 100.

They cost more & if you don't have a HD you can use dvdram & get 4.7 gigs.

[BobK]

One of the biggest advantages is that you can record 10-20 hours (depends on how big the hard drive is). This is especially handy if you're out of town for a month and want to record several TV shows. Without a HD you're limited to 2-6 hours on a disk (depending on what resolution you use).

> And do you think it's worth the extra $$?

That's up to you. At the moment it's not worth the extra $$ to me- but I'm not going to buy a stand-alone until the price with HD comes down. Then it'll be worth the extra $$.

[TeeeRex]

Hi,

Having been lucky enough to own an E85 now for about 3 weeks I recommend a hard drive unit over a non HD unit (and not just because I have one!).

There is one reason for this above all else - and that is PRACTICABILITY.

For recording your fav weekly shows, one off films etc - no more VHS tapes or video recorder, No more DVD-R's to look after (label, make a case for blah blah).

You wanna record something on TV 'Now' - great - press Record - no more 'have I got enough blank disk space, is this a reliable DVD-R, sh*t I can't find a blank DVD-R'...

It's just sheet convienance - and if you do want to keep something - then great - dub it onto DVD-R when you've got the time.

I see it as the same concept as a PC - you don't save all your documents and load all your programs from your PC via CD/DVD do you - so why do it with video programs ...

Anyway - (as you can probably tell) I am VERY glad I bought a HDD model ...

Cheers,

TeeeRex

[verchad]

Look at it this way, if you just want straight to dvd recording, no editing, then get the dvd recorder without a harddrive. If you want to take out commercials, scenes, rearrange the order of clips, then get the dvd recorder with the harddrive. As previously mentioned, you then also get increased recording time for programs, even the stuff you just want to watch ater and not record. If at some pont you want to get fancy and you have a pc dvd burner that suppports these formats, buy a recorder that records to dvd-rw or dvd-ram. Then you can record from standalone to dvd-rw/ram, take the disc to the computer, then edit, add titles, do whatever you want to the footage.

[Vovin]

First off, thank you all for replying.
One of my concerns about a normal DVD recorder would be that the disk might have some invisible or by me overlooked flaw, in wich it stops recording, ruining what could be my only chance to record the program or movie in question.
I think I'll buy the E85H that I mentioned before.

A more general question, wich format is generally better for burning? DVD-RAM or DVD+/-R(W)?
And how does 9.4GB discs differ from 4.7GB discs apart from the space. Wich should I be using?

[donpedro]

Definitly get one with HD. You can then stop using VCR for recordings that you don't want on DVD at all. Also you can usualy "pre" edit or cut on HD and than you can fit recordings better to DVD.

[kzod]

Vovin,

I own the Pioneer 510 which is extremely similar to the panasonic. 80 GB HD, but this one burns on dvd-rw for a rewritable. DVD-rw's can be read by most newish DVD players (haven't had onbe rejected yet). DVD-ram is much more rare, only a few panasonic players support it.

Saying that, if the recorder will be your m,ain playback device, and portability isn't an issue DVD-ram is supposed to be superior in terms of longevity.

The advantage of the e-85 is a full TV guide system similar to TIVO, or satelite systems. where you can see what will be on, click it and tell it to record. My Pioneer requires VCR type programming. Although, while I was really hoping for a guide originally, once I programmed all of my weekly shows, I realized not a huge difference. Only real advantage of the guide is if you have the time to waste scrrolling through all the channels looking for a special gem to record.

If the media isn't a concern I'de probably go with the e-85 for the extra guide functionality. If you want to burn discs that you can lend out and then reburn the disc when done, stick with a pioneer or other dvd-rw unit,

[lordsmurf]

If you don't want burning errors, then buy good discs. Only get a hard drive if you want to edit first, or if you want to use it like a TIVO with temp storage.

And beyond that, I'd suggest any other machine, as the Panasonic recording quality is rather low after 2-hour mode.

[Vovin]

ok... I'm back. I've been battling three viruses and various malicious bugs and reinstalled windows.


Anywho, apart from movies I'll probably use the DVD-recorder to record normal programs, not meant to store for long and the DVD's will be played pretty much only be me.
I was wondering about the 9.4GB discs though, how do they work compared to 4.7GB discs?

[handyguy]

9.4gig disks are double sided, you have to flip them to use the other side.

I saw a Panasonic E55 at Target for $349, it records 16 hours on one of those, although i don't know about the quality.

I also saw it at buydig.com for $272!

[ejai]

I own a Panasonic E50 and use it to capture video only. I was planning to buy a recorder with a hard drive and decided not to because I like to author using my computer. On the computer I am able to create beautiful menus and buttons and better compatibility.

The Panasonic recorders create disks that have problems playing on some dvd players, to remedy this problem I prefer to use the computer. My compatibilty moves from around 65% to at least 95%.

I will get a hard drive unit once the authoring compatibility issue is solved, and better menu designs are included. I am not against buying a hard drive unit, but you have to first decide how you plan to use it.

[Tearren]

Harddrive.

It is worth the extra dollars.

Only thing I would consider now if I was buy a standalone recorder is whether or not it is worth it to wait until DVD dual layers are supported. And then if that feature will be worth the extra dollars. By that time though Blue-Ray or HD-DVD will probably be out.

Tearren

[lordsmurf]

Trying to edit some Panasonic DVD's recently, I notice the AC3 files are pretty corrupt.

[Tearren]

lordsmurf wrote:
Trying to edit some Panasonic DVD's recently, I notice the AC3 files are pretty corrupt.

Interesting. The only time I had an issue with sound was when I either...

(1) Edited the video on the Panasonic and then transfered to the PC without burning to DVD-RAM (or DVD-R) from the Panasonic at 1x.

or

(2) Recorded with the "Hybrid VBR Resolution" set to Automatic instead of Fixed.

Do you know if either of these are the case?

Tearren

[lordsmurf]

I get a lot of weird work. All kinds of random source. They come to me for restoration, so I do my best. I've seen so many bad weddings that I'm starting to understand why people just go to Vegas real quick.

Recently, I've had people bring me Panasonic-made discs. Those Panasonic machines sure can jack things up. As far as settings, I never really know beyond what my PC can tell me from filesize and bitrates, etc.

The Panasonic's do a really poor job with interlace, and then the AC3 files are often quite screwed up. I never saw these kinds of things on the units I tested (E50 and another one), but some units out there obviously have such errors. Early models were hell with IRE and even YUV values.

While other companies took their time perfecting units, Panasonic dumped a bunch of shit on the market in a frenzy to grab early market share. Philips too. With all these good recorders coming out now, we're really seeing how inferior the Panasonics are. Maybe some of the newer ones are better, but I'm not holding my breath just yet.

Lots of owners of these machines don't want to agree, but I see what I see, and there's no way around that.

To answer you question, I do not think they were flex mode. Simply a 4-hour VBR standard.