Quick question about recording speeds on Panny E-100.

[godbeer]

Hi guys,

I have several 2 hour VHS tapes (MST3K episodes) that I need to archive to disc with the E100. After editing out commercials, the run time is about 1:32.

There are two ways I can do this:

1.) Record to the hard drive in SP, edit, and high speed dub to disc in SP.
2.) Record to the hard drive in XP, edit, and dub to the disc using FR.

Both have drawbacks: #1 will burn in high speed with no re-encoding, but will only fill 3/4 of the disc. #2 will use all available space on the disc but involves a re-encode.

#2 will obviously take longer because it has to dub in real-time, but if the quality is better I don't really mind that. Anyone have an opinion on which method will result in the best possible quality?

Thanks for any advice.

[quasar1963]

Good question .. I'm curious what experienced users think about this too

[houtx67]

I actually use method #2 to convert my MST3K episodes from the SciFi channel (I end up with 1:32 also). I am using an E-100 also.

I personally feel that this method produces better quality (also given the excess space left over in an SP dub that could be utilized by the FR dub). I would use method #1 if the final product was in the 1:50-2:10 range though (you gain more time in a HS (high speed) dub because it is not limited to 4 GB of data).

Probably the best thing is to maybe try it once on a RAM disc and decide which you like better. You'd only have to do a full dub on the RAM with #2 as you can easily just do a small segment of an SP HS dub.

[thoots]

I've used #2 -- record in XP, cut commercials, and then dub via FR -- and I was quite happy with the results. That's how I'll be handling the 2-hour stuff in the future....

thoots

[godbeer]

Thanks for the advice guys - I wanted to get some reassurance before I started burning stacks of discs, only to find out later I could have gotten better quality by doing it differently.

I guess it all boils down to one question: how much quality is lost in the re-encode process? I'm guessing not very much - just based on the fact that if there was a major loss, there would be a lot of postings/comments about it on this and other message boards. So far, I haven't come across any major complaints about it.

The sp>sp HS dub would be lossless, but the bitrate would be lower - while the xp>fr method may take a minor hit in quality during the re-encode, but will be recorded at the highest possible bitrate.

Based on this (and the opinions you guys posted), I think #2 is probably the best method also (though as houtx67 suggested, I will do a RAM test first to compare).

Thanks Again

P.S. - One more quick guestion - Is the TBC function that is supposed to clean up VHS tapes through the composite input always active, or does it have to be turned on somewhere in the setup menu? I'm guessing this is the "3-D Y/C separation" option in the menu (which I have set to "on"), but I just want to make sure.

[humbled]

I'd like to expand the last question. Does the E100 TBC cleanup work only via composite input? I have SVHS deck and intended to use S video link.

[spiderman2k1]

I have the E80H Alway record at XP and dubb at FR. I have a question for you E100HS owner's do you have any problem with 4X media crashing. I was think about buying out but read some bad thing about 4X having problem's

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=346927

I also read some E80 user have had problem but I think Panasonic changed the burner's in them or did a firmware update. So far ever brand I put in the E80H works with no problem's

[houtx67]

I'd like to expand the last question. Does the E100 TBC cleanup work only via composite input? I have SVHS deck and intended to use S video link.

I don't know about S-Video, but it works even on the coaxial plug on mine. I know it's lesser quality than composite, but I use it to pass through to my TV and it gives me a better cable signal than when going directly to my TV (even when the Panasonic is off).

I have the E80H Alway record at XP and dubb at FR. I have a question for you E100HS owner's do you have any problem with 4X media crashing. I was think about buying out but read some bad thing about 4X having problem's

I have ordered some 4X DVD-Rs, so I cannot reply until I get them. However, my E-100H has recorded on every 1X disc I've put in it (mainly Accu, Ritek, and Beall). It did burn a TDK 2X at 1X though. I read that the unit rejects the disc if it can't burn at maximum speed, but this didn't seem to hold true for the TDK.[/quote]

[tider]

I have several 2 hour VHS tapes (MST3K episodes) that I need to archive to disc with the E100. After editing out commercials, the run time is about 1:32.

Wouldn't a better alternative to using the xp to fr method be using fr method and high speed dub to dvd-r.

Since the tapes are 2 hours long and would be around 1:32 after editing, it seems to me the thing to do is to set the fr recording to 3:04 and stop the recording at 2:00. Put the second tape in and set the fr recording to 3:04 and once again stop it at the 2:00 mark. Once on the dvd recorder you can edit both of the programs down to 1:32 which would add up to 3:04 . You could use the divide feature to get the recording at 1:32 each and burn to two seperate disc at high speed.

Correct? or am I confused about this?

I'm referencing to the "lying to the e-80 method"

[houtx67]

Good point TIDER...

I've often thought about doing this but I usually am working with TV shows on timer recording. I can usually get 3 x 1 hr (before commercials) SP show recordings after the commercials have been edited onto 1 high speed dub. However this does seem like a potential option #3 though since it cuts done on the time needed for the redub on #2 and provides better quality than option #1.

[godbeer]

I have several 2 hour VHS tapes (MST3K episodes) that I need to archive to disc with the E100. After editing out commercials, the run time is about 1:32.

Wouldn't a better alternative to using the xp to fr method be using fr method and high speed dub to dvd-r.

Since the tapes are 2 hours long and would be around 1:32 after editing, it seems to me the thing to do is to set the fr recording to 3:04 and stop the recording at 2:00. Put the second tape in and set the fr recording to 3:04 and once again stop it at the 2:00 mark. Once on the dvd recorder you can edit both of the programs down to 1:32 which would add up to 3:04 . You could use the divide feature to get the recording at 1:32 each and burn to two seperate disc at high speed.

Correct? or am I confused about this?

I'm referencing to the "lying to the e-80 method"

Wouldn't that result in each 1:32 recording being recorded with a target bitrate of 3:04? That's pretty low, approaching LP quality. Since the end result is 1:32, wouldn't it be better to set the fr recording for around 1:35 (to allow a little breathing room) and stop around the 1 hour mark (during a commercial break or something), then record the second hour with the same method. After editing both programs, they can be high speed dubbed to disc with no re-encode, and the bit rate will be maximized (give or take a minute or so) for the dvd-r. The downside is you end up with 2 segments for the program instead of one.

Of course, I may be confused too. This really gets a little mind-boggling when you think about it too much.

[Roll Tide]

tider,
I think there's a flaw in your reasoning. Think about it, if you set FR to 3:04, you're recording at a bit rate such that 3:04 will fit on a single DVD-R. Your method will in effect allow 2 1hr32m programs to fit one disc.

The only way I can think of to do what you're suggesting is set FR to 1:32, and when it runs out (in the middle of the 2hr show), start another FR cycle at 1:32 and record the rest of the show and stop recording when it ends. After editing, the total time for the two segments should be 1:32, and together should just fit on a single disc.

Hope this makes sense. BTW, I like your screen name. Bama fan???

[Roll Tide]

I have several 2 hour VHS tapes (MST3K episodes) that I need to archive to disc with the E100. After editing out commercials, the run time is about 1:32.

Wouldn't a better alternative to using the xp to fr method be using fr method and high speed dub to dvd-r.

Since the tapes are 2 hours long and would be around 1:32 after editing, it seems to me the thing to do is to set the fr recording to 3:04 and stop the recording at 2:00. Put the second tape in and set the fr recording to 3:04 and once again stop it at the 2:00 mark. Once on the dvd recorder you can edit both of the programs down to 1:32 which would add up to 3:04 . You could use the divide feature to get the recording at 1:32 each and burn to two seperate disc at high speed.

Correct? or am I confused about this?

I'm referencing to the "lying to the e-80 method"

Wouldn't that result in each 1:32 recording being recorded with a target bitrate of 3:04? That's pretty low, approaching LP quality. Since the end result is 1:32, wouldn't it be better to set the fr recording for around 1:35 (to allow a little breathing room) and stop around the 1 hour mark (during a commercial break or something), then record the second half with the same method. After editing both programs, they can be high speed dubbed to disc with no re-encode, and the bit rate will be maximized (give or take a minute or so) for the dvd-r. The downside is you end up with 2 segments for the program instead of one.

Of course, I may be confused too. This really gets a little mind-boggling when you think about it too much.

Wow, I guess great minds do think alike. I feel better about my response now.

BTW, if you're doing mostly timer recordings, I'd definitely do what thoots suggested: Record in XP, edit, then dub in FR mode. This is what I do with college football games, as you can't really predict the final edited runtime exactly.

[mazinz]

about the TBC
i own the older dmr-hs2 panny deck and im sure they did not change much with the tbc for their newer models. so to answer a question in one of the above post. The TBC works on all inputs for the machine.

[tider]

tider,
I think there's a flaw in your reasoning. Think about it, if you set FR to 3:04, you're recording at a bit rate such that 3:04 will fit on a single DVD-R. Your method will in effect allow 2 1hr32m programs to fit one disc.

Thanks for clearing that up. I'm fairly new to this and that does make sense, about the bit rate being set for 1 disc instead of 2. I guess there's not a way to do the fr method the way I was thinking.

BTW, long time bama fan here. "Roll Tide" Roll Tide.
Looking forward to a much better upcoming season, we've had some good recruiting this year.