Pal + Ntsc on same disc ?

[Roderz]

Why won't TMPGEnc DVD Author let me put Pal + Ntsc on same disc?
Pal on track 1, ntsc track2 , then complains at build time.

Stupid thing is I know it can be done because the menus that TMPGEnc DVD Author makes are ALWAYs in ntsc(4:3) even with pal content (16:9)

Anyone recommend a workaround? free/easy alternative?

Cheers

[Gees]

Stupid thing is I know it can be done because the menus that TMPGEnc DVD Author makes are ALWAYs in ntsc(4:3) even with pal content (16:9)

I'm not so sure about that. :c* I don't use it, but use similar and what it'd actually do is convert PAL streams to NTSC, then author/burn. Not the same as saying you can stick PAL on an NTSC DVD.

[Roderz]

I opened a previously aurtherd (PAL) dvd in info edit and that said the menus were NTSC and main movie was PAL!
Plus it has been noted on the TMPGEnc DVD Author BBS

Confused

[Gees]

:cO Me too!

And this mystery Pal vid... it's 25 frames/sec and 720 x576?

Hmm maybe you can have menu of one and vid of another (which I don't see any purposeful use for) , but I never thought you could have both types of vids.


edit=typo

[non-linear]

Why would you want to do this? If you have a video in PAL, you can convert it to NTSC. PAL is the format used in the UK, Australia, and some other countries. I think the video format for the disc is determined in the .ifo file (as well as the resolution and framerate of the video).

Not all players will play PAL video (ones sold in NTSC countries), so I don't understand why you would even attempt to mix 2 different broadcast standards together.

I suggest if you want NTSC and PAL, make 2 discs. One in the NTSC format, then the other in PAL. Otherwise, use the format that your country uses and convert the video that isn't in that format to match (I don't know what format the "armpit of the midlands" uses, so I can't help you there).

[TBoneit]

Why won't TMPGEnc DVD Author let me put Pal + Ntsc on same disc?
Pal on track 1, ntsc track2 , then complains at build time.

Stupid thing is I know it can be done because the menus that TMPGEnc DVD Author makes are ALWAYs in ntsc(4:3) even with pal content (16:9)

Anyone recommend a workaround? free/easy alternative?

Cheers

To correct you slightly:
NTSC is not tied to 4:3 and PAL isn't tied to 16:9

You can have either ratio in either format.

If they must be mixed, then you have to fool tmpgenc dvd author...

Disclaimer: I haven't tried this but it should work, depends on your player.

Use dvdpatcher to patch the PAL title to NTSC

add to TMPGenc DVD

Author

Repatch the PAL title back to PAL settings with dvdpatcher (*.vobs) for the PAL title set. You may or may not have to patch the entire file, some testing needed to determine. If you look at the created DVD you'll see title sets are numbered consecutively.

Test before patching by playing off of the hard disk with your software player to be sure you have the right title. In PowerDVD just click the VOB form the title set to test and it'll play.

You may also have to play with Ifoedit for the PAL titleset, I can't help there, you're on your own. I'm no ifoedit guru.

Burn to RW format disk and see if it works for testing purposes.

I suspect that if your player supports VCD & SVCD this might work for them to be added to the same disk too.

Good Luck & please let us know how you make out.

Cheers

[Roderz]

And this mystery Pal vid... it's 25 frames/sec and 720 x576?

Yep it is.
I live in the UK hence using PAL but I've also got some NTSC footage from the net.
The files in question are dvd compliant mpeg2 file's
most players in the uk will play both PAL + NTSC,
I don't want to re-encode although I could just throw them on a dvd-iso which my players will play, but I want to give them to my brother and he's only got a PS2.
Just trying to save a disc.

Just seems odd that TDA always makes the menu's as NTSC regardless of content (but content can't be mixed)

Me thinks I'll have toe experiement wiv some other softwares

[Roderz]

To correct you slightly:
NTSC is not tied to 4:3 and PAL isn't tied to 16:9

I never implied that they were, that’s just what they are after authoring with TDA. (menu was in NTSC 4:3)

As for useing dvdpatcher I'll try that tonight, I've used it before to get SVCD's into TDA and that worked ok

Cheers for the reminder

If it works it'l probably kill the PS2 anyway (all this just to save a disc!)

experimentation is the mother of innovation.[/quote]

[mazinz]

their was an offical dvd made, that did in fact feature both ntsc and pal versions of the film (one of those fun cannibal films, tempe video offered it a while ago), so it definetly can be done, it's just a matter of finding an app that will allow it

[lordsmurf]

NTSC and PAL on the same disc is not supported by the DVD spec.

[adam]

Well, I thought mixing PAL and NTSC was supported in the DVD standard, but after checking the Scenarist manual it says all assets in any volume must have the same framerate, so I guess its not supported.

Seems strange since both the SVCD and VCD 2.0 specs support mixing of PAL and NTSC content.

[dog-god]

u can do it in dvd lab
ive done it for putting svcds onto dvd where 1 film is ntsc and another pal
ive use ifo edit to create vob files for each of the cds
and loaded into dvd lab and elected the option not to demux
it tells me that the disc may not be playable but my sony standalone has no prob
however the people living in ntsc areas may have probs unless their standalones play pal

[mazinz]

Lordsmurf wrote


NTSC and PAL on the same disc is not supported by the DVD spec.



im not disagreeing with you on that, but it can be done and as i mentioned was done on an official made dvd. I guess it flows along the same lines of using mpeg audio which isnt standard either but many apps, etc still support it

[dog-god]

i guess u just have to do 1 and check if your hardware will play it
funny thing about dvd specs is that maestro gives me an error each time i make a dvd using audio converted from svcd disc that there should be at least 1 ? audio(? ive forgotton what the name is) track but the disc plays fine anyway

now that i think about it would it be possible in maestro if u used that same trick for putting chapters on 29.97 drop fame movies
if i get time ill try during the week

[FulciLives]

Lordsmurf wrote


NTSC and PAL on the same disc is not supported by the DVD spec.



im not disagreeing with you on that, but it can be done and as i mentioned was done on an official made dvd. I guess it flows along the same lines of using mpeg audio which isnt standard either but many apps, etc still support it

I'm aware of a DVD of a cannibal film that had NTSC on SIDE A and PAL on SIDE B (or vice versa) but the point is it was a dual sided DVD (I think each side was single layer) and each side was ALL NTSC or ALL PAL.

The film was EMANUELE AND THE LAST CANNIBALS

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[mazinz]

I'm aware of a DVD of a cannibal film that had NTSC on SIDE A and PAL on SIDE B (or vice versa) but the point is it was a dual sided DVD (I think each side was single layer) and each side was ALL NTSC or ALL PAL.

The film was EMANUELE AND THE LAST CANNIBALS

Yes thats correct, thats the one. I really thought they dual layered the disc, whoops mistake on my part then. At any rate now that the topic has been brought up, for the fun of it, i will try to make a pal/ntsc disc and see what happens. I have done this in the past with putting vcd material onto a dvd. It worked fine, but naturally it did not convert the pal format over (to ntsc), unless you se a converter deck.

However i will give it a shot with a regular film and see what happens----

[Roderz]

Got it to work - 1pal film + 1ntsc film on one disc
Used dvdpatcher to patch (first header only) as suggested by TBoneit
Patched the NTSC mpeg title to PAL size & frame rate, then loaded it into TDA, made vob's + burnt = worked
It didn't matter if I re-pached the vob back to ntsc (althought I did try this and it to workedalso )
So there you go neice little bodge/workaroud (if your player supports it)

Cheers to everyone for their input

[FulciLives]

Got it to work - 1pal film + 1ntsc film on one disc
Used dvdpatcher to patch (first header only) as suggested by TBoneit
Patched the NTSC mpeg title to PAL size & frame rate, then loaded it into TDA, made vob's + burnt = worked
It didn't matter if I re-pached the vob back to ntsc (althought I did try this and it to workedalso )
So there you go neice little bodge/workaroud (if your player supports it)

Cheers to everyone for their input

But you have to make a choice with the menu correct? So eventhough you can have PAL and NTSC video clips or movies or whatever on a single disc you still have to set the menu to either PAL or NTSC which pretty much makes it worthless for those that don't have a multi-system DVD (that converts) or a multi-system TV.

For instance if you only have a NTSC system and the menu is PAL then good luck trying to select the NTSC video from the menu you can't really see. Same thing if the menu is set to NTSC but you have a PAL system ... again good luck trying to navigate that NTSC menu to get to the PAL clips.

Am I crazy here or am I making sense

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[adam]

You are making sense but it would only apply to the NTSC user. 99% of PAL tv/dvd player combo's can play NTSC material just fine.

I'm sure if you got creative you could find a way to make it work. You could write on the dvd cover, ex. on title screen hit #1 if NTSC and #2 if PAL. From there it would take you to the appropriate main menu. You could also do the same via little opening pics on the disk. First pic goes by and its b+w and garbled(PAL) but then next pic pops up saying, ignore previous screen and hit #1 on following screen. The PAL clip would have said the opposite.

Not ideal but it could work, but again technically it appears this disk wouldn't be DVD compliant though most dvd players would probably still play it.