4:3 DV -> 16:9 DVD

[chazzie]

Hi guys!

We're planning to make a movie this summer and could use some advice on the 16:9 aspect ratio issue.

We're going to shoot the movie with DV-cams and via FireWire capture it. My question now...

With a 4:3 source, how do I prepare the MPEG files to be used in Scenarist? Do I simply change the aspect ratio setting when creating the scenario file? As the source is 4:3, I'll be adding black borders under and over the video at editing.

Regards,
Chazzie

[BJ_M]

why dont you get a anamorphic adaptor for your camera -- that would be the proper way -- plus you get max resolution using the whole image panel

[FulciLives]

Hello

I use TMPGEnc to do my MPEG1 and MPEG2 encoding and there is a feature that allows you to mask the image you are importing into it. So if your DV cam does not offer a 16x9 mode (some do ... some don't) you can still just "chop off" the top and bottom of the image to achieve the same effect (when doing the MPEG2 encoding in TMPGEnc).

However, you must make sure that you "FRAME" your video properly when shooting any footage ... in other words make sure that you don't have anything near the top or bottom of the image since it will end up getting choped off in the end.

I suggusted this in another thread ...

If your DV cam has a flip out LCD screen you can copy a widescreen movie to it (I'm sure you DV cam as analog imputs) and then play it back and "mimic" the widescreen on your LCD screen by masking the screen with say black electrical tape (covering just the top and bottom to mimic the BLACK BANDS of the widescreen image). This way when you look at your LCD screen when shooting you will be seeing exactly what you will see on the TV once you process (cut off) the top and bottom of the image (to make it widescreen). This will ensure that your are framing your shots properly.

Anyways, to mimic a 16x9 aspect ratio you will want to cut off exactly 64 pixels at the top and 64 pixels at the bottom of your image. This way it will fill up a widescreen TV (with no black) but will be letterboxed on a standard 4x3 TV

Please note that is for NTSC format ... for PAL you would cut off 77 pixels from the top and bottom.

What I would do ... take any full screen clip and mask the top and bottom according to the specs above then copy it back out to your DV cam. Then play that back for your guide to mask the LCD screen. Also, it is better to perhaps slightly undermask than overmask the LCD screen if you don't think you can get it "just right".

Just make sure that whatever DVD authoring package you use that you set it to 16x9

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Actually I just thought of something ... you don't want to use MASK in TMPGEnc ... you need to actually CUT OFF the pixels. This is probably best done in an AVS script. Crop the image accordingly (720x352 for NTSC and 720x422) then in the AVS script insert the AddBorders command (this goes after the CROP command) to bring the height back up to normal (so you would add a 64 top and bottom border for NTSC getting it back to 720x480 or add a 77 top and bottom border for PAL to get it back to 576).

So for NTSC the AVS script lines for this would be like this:

crop(0,0,720,352)
AddBorders(0,64,0,64)

This is assuming a DV source has a resolution of 720x480 (I think it does but I've never done DV captures).

Good Luck

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
If your DV cam has a 16x9 mode then by all means USE it. Makes your life much easier. You process it just like a 4:3 clip ... nothing special ... except of course you select 16x9 in the authoring stage.

[FulciLives]

why dont you get a anamorphic adaptor for your camera -- that would be the proper way -- plus you get max resolution using the whole image panel

Do you mean some type of lenz attachment?
If such a thing like that exists then yes that would make life much easier plus yeah the overall quality of resolution would look better. I bet they aren't cheap though hehehe

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[BJ_M]

why dont you get a anamorphic adaptor for your camera -- that would be the proper way -- plus you get max resolution using the whole image panel

Do you mean some type of lenz attachment?
If such a thing like that exists then yes that would make life much easier plus yeah the overall quality of resolution would look better. I bet they aren't cheap though hehehe

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

they are not that expensive and some places will even rent them to you ..

here is a popular one that even has mounts for minidv cams (some) ..
http://www.optexint.com/digivid/anamorph.htm

lot of info here http://www.megameme.com/vx1609.htm

and also on the creativecow forum (which seems to be down right now) and on other DV forums ..

[chazzie]

Doesn't TMPGEnc have the feature to just add a black border over the existing video track?

[geek rock]

Doesn't TMPGEnc have the feature to just add a black border over the existing video track?

yes, but that's besides the point.

if you want your footage to appear correctly you'll need to crop the top and bottom of the image, and encode the MPG, then when you come to the authoring, set the MPG to have a 16:9 tag. (this will be done in whatever authoring program you use.)

this way the borders needed for 16:9 footage on 4:3 TVs are added by the DVD player, and you can use up your video bitrate for just the moving images and not the black borders which will fill up a good proportion of the screen.

as fulcilives said.. just make sure you've framed everything correctly.

-Mark

[chazzie]

I've been playing around with TMPGEnc, I think I've got it now.

[erik1185]

if you have after effects you can add the black bars to the top and bottom on a different layer, then on the layer you vieo is on you can adjust were you want it withen the black bars

[chazzie]

Got it working! Thanks guys!

So, I cut 77 pixels on top and bottom (PAL) now, how do I cut to make the cuts for the other aspect ratios?

1.85:1 ?
2.35:1 ?
2.11:1 ?

Also, what will happen if I choose 2.11:1 in the MPEG settings in TMPGEnc ?

Chazzie