Need some recorder recommendations.

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

If you want to do HIGH SPEED COPY then the frame accurate editing will be changed to the nearest "I" frame so no re-encoding will be done. Hence HIGH SPEED COPY is possible since no re-encoding is done.

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Yes, that is what happens.

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Makes sense to me.

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

I am a bit pissed that my 531 doesn't burn anymore. Seems a lot of people have had this problem but I never heard of any of the newer models having this problem.

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

My 633 (same generation as yours) has burned about 1000 discs and is still going strong. I did have a hard drive crash about 18 months after I bought it (which was fixed under extended credit card warranty), but so far the burner is fine [knock wood].

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I think it is often a crap shoot with a lot of these components. I have a Pio 108 burner in my computer, which has been under heavy use for at least a couple years now. If it goes tomorrow, I wouldn't be terribly bummed, since I have a spare burner or two waiting in the "on deck circle." But it just keeps going and going. I must say that my luck with hard drives and burners has been quite good, so I really can't complain.

In John's place, I would go ahead and replace the burner as a Do It Yourself project. If the burner is no longer working, what is there to lose ? The first thing to do is to i.d. what burner the 533 used. If you don't want to open the case to do this, the optical drive type should be listed in the specs section of the 533 SERVICE MANUAL (not the User Manual), which should be available as a free download. Then, see what that burner is going for used on Ebay. Up to this point, it costs nothing, and at least one has the info to consider.

I have bought many components of all sorts on Ebay -- even motherboards and CPUs. With patience and some careful research, you can find some pretty cheap deals, and items that were very lightly used. The appropriate service disk can be obtained for little more than the postage. It may be possible to borrow one of the remotes that can be programmed to impersonate the Pioneer service remote, and the software for this is a free download.

Just a thought . . . .

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Originally Posted by Seeker47

The first thing to do is to i.d. what burner the 533 used. If you don't want to open the case to do this, the optical drive type should be listed in the specs section of the 533 SERVICE MANUAL

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The service manual states that the drive is Pioneer part number VXX2987, which isn't really that helpful. Going inside the unit would probably be required to actually ID the drive.

I have been watching the prices of working 531H's on eBay. The last one went for only about $113 another $150. One with a 500 GB hard drive upgrade went for over $400. I have had mine since late 2005 and just this past week burned 100 copies of home videos with it. It seems to be just the luck of the draw.

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

The service manual states that the drive is Pioneer part number VXX2987, which isn't really that helpful.

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More info: The description for the part is "Drive Assy R9R". Also, the service manual has a picture of the interior which is clear enough to see the following on the DVD burner: "CODE DVR-R09-XA".

And it looks like there's an archived thread that discusses replacement of the burner:
https://www.videohelp.com/forum/archive/my-pioneer-dvr-531h-s-has-developed-burning-pro...r-t304500.html

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

The service manual states that the drive is Pioneer part number VXX2987, which isn't really that helpful.

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More info: The description for the part is "Drive Assy R9R". Also, the service manual has a picture of the interior which is clear enough to see the following on the DVD burner: "CODE DVR-R09-XA".

And it looks like there's an archived thread that discusses replacement of the burner:
https://www.videohelp.com/forum/archive/my-pioneer-dvr-531h-s-has-developed-burning-pro...r-t304500.html

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Good work, Sean !
The 520 used the 107-XA. I'd have to check my notes or the Service Manual, but I think the 640's is listed as R-111. Somewhere between the 520 and the 640, they seem to have gone over to this R-series (whatever that is) . . . but they sound like variants on the 109 and the 111, respectively. Possibly just different audio connectors ? In other threads, it was mentioned that the incompatible connectors might be SPDIFs, which aren't really needed anyway ?

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Originally Posted by Seeker47

. . . but they sound like variants on the 109 and the 111, respectively. Possibly just different audio connectors ? In other threads, it was mentioned that the incompatible connectors might be SPDIFs, which aren't really needed anyway ?

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The service manual shows that the only electrical connections between the DVD drive and the rest of the machine are the 4-pin power connection and the 40-pin ATAPI connection. Of course there could still be other differences between this and a standard drive. There could, for example, be different firmware in the drive.

Another interesting tidbit: the manual states that the service life of the LED used for read/write of DVDs is 4700 hours, and the LED for CDs is 11000 hours.

I have instructions on how to replace the burner but I can't imagine doing it ... the entire process is very complicated.

1.) I'd be lucky to find the proper replacement DVD burner for a reasonable price.
2.) Even if I find one the process is very convoluted and requires a service remote which last time I checked is over $100 alone not to mention the price of the DVD burner.
3.) The process is not an "easy" one to do. Nothing like popping in an internal DVD burner into a computer.

I'll probably just buy a new one this Christmas ... most likely one of the Asian models ... I do have some PAL VHS videos that I'd like to put onto DVD. I have the "uncut" and widescreen PAL VHS video of THE DEVILS and although I keep hearing rumors of a Warner Bros USA DVD release it has yet to happen. That's just one example of a gem I have that is exclusive to PAL VHS.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

Even if I find one the process is very convoluted and requires a service remote which last time I checked is over $100 alone not to mention the price of the DVD burner.

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Just as an FYI, I picked up a Pioneer service remote (GGF1595) for Cdn$69.00 at the local authorized Pioneer service centre here in Vancouver. It was cheaper than buying something like a Harmony that I could download codes into.

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

The process is not an "easy" one to do. Nothing like popping in an internal DVD burner into a computer.

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I couldn't swear to this, but I think that it's relatively straightforward as long as you don't have to replace the hard drive.

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

Even if I find one the process is very convoluted and requires a service remote which last time I checked is over $100 alone not to mention the price of the DVD burner.

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Nah -- I picked up a used Palm on Ebay (older model, but a Full Kit and in great condition) for 50 bucks. There were pages and pages of listings, and some sold cheaper than that. (I probably could have borrowed a Palm or a Pronto from someone, with no cost involved, but there was no known time frame on when it might be needed, so I decided it was easier just to buy something so I'd have it on hand, whenever.) I've bought burners on Ebay for as little as $25., including shipping.

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

Just as an FYI, I picked up a Pioneer service remote (GGF1595) for Cdn$69.00 at the local authorized Pioneer service centre here in Vancouver. It was cheaper than buying something like a Harmony that I could download codes into.

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Sean, is that Pioneer Service Remote model specific, or is it supposed to work on all of their models ?

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

The process is not an "easy" one to do. Nothing like popping in an internal DVD burner into a computer.

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True . . . but some of the stuff you've mentioned doing with various video editing programs gives me a lot more pause than attempting this. But I have to agree that the HDD or burner replacement process here is convoluted.

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Originally Posted by Sean Nelson

I couldn't swear to this, but I think that it's relatively straightforward as long as you don't have to replace the hard drive.

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Assuming that the firmware in the 109 does not put up any roadblocks, I think you would still need to use the service remote (a real one or an impersonator), to deal with that ID code in the Pioneer, so that the DVR would accept the replacement burner. Or maybe not, if we are just talking about transplanting the laser assembly. (That's why I think it would be very desirable to discuss this in more detail with one of the people who has already done this, and succeeded.)

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Originally Posted by Seeker47

Sean, is that Pioneer Service Remote model specific, or is it supposed to work on all of their models ?

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To the best of my knowledge it is good for all the models. I had actually ordered the GGF1381, but it has apparently been replaced by the GGF1595. Although I haven't swapped out any hardware, I have used the remote on a 533, 633 and two 640s to check firmware versions, HDD on time, etc. and it works perfectly with all of them.

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Originally Posted by Seeker47

Assuming that the firmware in the 109 does not put up any roadblocks, I think you would still need to use the service remote (a real one or an impersonator), to deal with that ID code in the Pioneer, so that the DVR would accept the replacement burner.

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I expect that would be the case, but if you don't replace the HDD then I wouldn't expect you to have to worry about the ID disk and the Linux-based procedure to get the firmware copied onto the replacement HDD. That's the tricky part, as far as I'm concerned.

Well by the time I buy the remote and a new burner I might as well just buy a new unit.

Unless someone living in the Pittsburgh, PA USA area can let me borrow a remote ... well I can dream can't I?

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

Do you really need to do a special procedure to change the IDE drive inside the recorder?
I think it would be a good idea to get a newer Pioneer IDE drive, because if you have an 8x burner you will soon have trouble burning 16x media (when 8x isn´t available anymore in the near future)

I have an Pioneer A06 drive in my PC and it has trouble burning and reading 8 media.

I changed the drive to my Hyundai standalone DVD player (an el cheapo drive) and it nows reads all kinds of discs (installed a Toshiba drive, after making itt region free in my PC with firmware downloaded from www.rpc1.org)

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Originally Posted by RabidDog

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My trusty Panasaonic E100 has finally bit the dust after almost 4 years of faithful service.

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Hardly all that trusty if it crapped out on four years . Unless you use it for a dog sled?

Which bit went wrong? 10 years should be the expected minimum lifetime for stuff like this, with a 3year mfr gtee (that would ensure good reliability). You should be mentioning your CE stuff in your will! :evil:

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That's the silliest thing I've ever heard. My Panasonic recorder died after 3 years and the average dvd player these days (if used almost every day), well, you'll be lucky if they last over a year these days. Build quality in home electronics sure as hell ain't what it used to be.

RE: Panasonic DMR-E85H stuck in "Please Wait" (posted by Kgriffin2523, and lots of others around the web)

I fixed my DVD Recorder, it turned out to be a power supply issue. There are two capacitors that fail in the power supply (the power supply is located under the hard drive holding bracket). I easily observed the failed capacitors because they appeared slightly bloated, with a slight leakage of
substance on the top. By replacing them with spares de-soldered from a functioning but useless electronic device, I was able to completely restore my unit. So, with a basic knowledge of DC Circuits and fair soldering skills, I have resurrected my recorder.

The "Please Wait" message is caused by the hard drive not spinning up. Most people would naturally assume this is a bad hard drive, but even bad hard drives spin up (they just make lots of bad noises if they are failing). The issue was that the power supply was not delivering the proper power to the hard drive. Don't replace your hard drive, you will lose your recordings. Test the power first.

If you are not comfortable or electronic circuit savoy, then you can get your unit fixed for a flat rate of $130 by Panasonic. There is a special number to call:

1-888-439-2676
Panasonic Service Center
1590 Touhly Ave
Elk Grove Village, IL 60007

Another post had this number, 1-847-468-5543, but when I called them, they gave me the above information.

Good luck. Considering the unavailability of any other units like this on the market, and the high price of buying one used, I think that $130 flat rate isn't too awful.

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Originally Posted by yescool2002

Do you really need to do a special procedure to change the IDE drive inside the recorder?

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Yes, if you meant the HDD, this is well documented in various places online. See, for example
https://forum.videohelp.com/topic253998-240.html
I believe it also applies to the burner, which has to be a particular model.

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Originally Posted by yescool2002

I think it would be a good idea to get a newer Pioneer IDE drive, because if you have an 8x burner you will soon have trouble burning 16x media (when 8x isn´t available anymore in the near future)

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Won't really help you -- this is governed by the firmware in the DVDR. Since there is no updated firmware for most of the Pioneer recorder models (*), an older one like my 520 won't have appropriate write strategies for 16x media anyway; in that case, it drops down to a default write strategy for 4x media. So much for "High Speed Copy" . . . but at least you can still burn them. This is another good reason to stock up on your favorite 8x media. The Verbatim 8x is pretty much a thing of the past now, I think, but you can still get the 8x TYGO2's, and that is about as good as it gets. My 520 loads those blanks faster than any others -- no wait while it figures out "What the Hell is this disc ?" -- which probably tells you something right there -- and burns them with great results.

{* There was a firmware update for the 640, though not officially released to the general public. It fixed a couple of firmware design oversights, and could have updated some other things we don't know about, such as write strategies, at the same time.}

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Originally Posted by trhouse

The hard drive recorders of almost every brand have nearly vanished from the US market. Panasonic and Pioneer's last models have been selling at list or higher prices on eBay.

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Why? What is going on?

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/archive/dvd-recorders-with-hdd-are-disappearing-t327523.html

I'm tempted to order one of these Pioneers, but need to make sure it can do what I need first. I want to use it mainly for transferring old VHS, Beta, laserdiscs, CED videodiscs and whatever other analog formats I may come across; don't care at all about recording TV.

On the 640H-S, can you put chapters anywhere you want, and does it create disc menus that show a still frame from each title and allow you to change it? Just as importantly, do discs out of this recorder play with little or no problems on older DVD players?

I'm going nuts trying to find a suitable replacement for my Philips DVR985, which I was reasonably satisfied with until it died. I've tried 3 recorders so far, a new Philips with hard drive which works great except the discs' menus don't work on my old DVL-909 player. The video plays fine, but on the menu it forces itself up to the disc information screen at the top, if you try to scroll down to the titles it keeps going back to the info screen. Copying the disc on a computer using CloneDVD doesn't fix the problem, and DVDShrink can't open the disc at all. I also tried a Samsung basic model with no tuner, recording quality was also good and it had no problems on the 909, BUT you CANNOT set the index picture on the disc menus! It shows just the first frame of what you've recorded, and there's no way to change it. That's just ridiculous. Today I picked up an RCA with hard drive on clearance at Wal-Mart, and so far all the discs give the "Cannot Be Played" message on the old player.

I hate to say it but I bought one of those SV2000 units (model WV10D6) at WALMART the other day for all of $49.97 + sales tax and the thing really is not that bad quality wise. I'm actually impressed with the image quality when recording from my Comcast cable (using the cable box as a tuner).

The WALMART I went to had stacks and stacks of these things. I'm actually thinking of picking up a 2nd one as a back-up unit. As cheap as it is I don't expect it to last long.

I've heard it sucks though unless you have a good strong signal so I wouldn't use it for videotape to DVD conversion but for cable or satellite TV this thing rocks for the price.

If I had the money though I'd buy a Pioneer with a HDD. I still might get one in the near future depending on my financial condition come the end of the year.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

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Originally Posted by 8traxrule

I'm tempted to order one of these Pioneers, but need to make sure it can do what I need first. I want to use it mainly for transferring old VHS, Beta, laserdiscs, CED videodiscs and whatever other analog formats I may come across; don't care at all about recording TV.

On the 640H-S, can you put chapters anywhere you want, and does it create disc menus that show a still frame from each title and allow you to change it? Just as importantly, do discs out of this recorder play with little or no problems on older DVD players?
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Bearing in mind that we're mostly talking about models no longer available, except on Ebay: I've used a Pioneer 520 to xfer some Beta tapes, but did not get satisfactory results until I put a DataVideo TBC-1000 in between. Not sure why the video sync signal was a problem there, but it was. I've also done some VHS xfers, using my 640, and these came out a bit better than I expected. There, I have not needed to use the TBC (yet), and could not say 'why' either. I never had laserdisc, and so cannot personally vouch for that, but a friend has used a Pioneer 631 (? -- not sure about the model) to xfer a laserdisc as a test, and that came out rather well. I believe you would have enough flexibility on the chaptering, but negatory on the disc menus: that feature is fairly primitive; you must choose from a fixed selection of thumbnail templates, although a (non-selectable) still from that title -- from a short distance into the video -- does get incorporated into the menu. From what I've read, the better series of older Toshiba HDD models of DVD recorder offered much more in the way of Menu options. It may be possible to redo those menus on the computer with appropriate software. That's more of a job than I've been willing to tackle, so far, but someone around here would likely be able to answer that. I think the Pioneers have been way above average, in terms of the compatibility of the discs they make. But as I said in another thread, I think that DVD "standardization" is kind of a joke, any you are always going to run into some issues with some standalone players -- particularly older players -- no matter what recorder you are using. And that probably goes for making a dvd on the computer, as well.

Yeah, I do have computer authoring software but setting chapters on those is actually less accurate (when transferring old TV broadcasts, some as old as 1976, I like to chapter EVERYTHING, including 2-second station bumpers) The Philips machine that died was fairly accurate, I could hit the button on the remote and know that's where the chapter would go. On the ULead DVD Factory program on the computer, you have to enter the chapter a second or so later than where it will actually be on the disc. That program also has a problem with some transfers where there are tape dropouts- at the point of the dropout, the sound will go out of sync. I may just need to find a better authoring program for the computer.

At this point I'm leaning towards keeping the new Philips with the hard drive, and just re-authoring the discs on the computer to make them compatible with my old Pioneer 909- I use that player to test my discs because if they work fine there, they'll probably work on most other players. The RCA I picked up yesterday is going back today; for fun I tried transferring a CED videodisc to it that showcases RCA's 1984 video products, but the transfer kept stopping about 9 minutes in. I'll leave that on the hard drive for whoever gets the machine next though, ought to confuse them a little :)

The Pioneer 520 and other older models had trouble with videos that had dropouts like VHS videotape. Pioneer fixed that with the 531/533/633 models. The 640 also did not have that problem. I can't imagine any of the newer Pioneer models having the problem.

I did many VHS to DVD with my Pioneer 531 and was always very happy with it's performance ... until the DVD drive died on me.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

The Pioneer 520 and other older models had trouble with videos that had dropouts like VHS videotape. Pioneer fixed that with the 531/533/633 models. The 640 also did not have that problem. I can't imagine any of the newer Pioneer models having the problem.

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O.K., but dropouts were not the problem, in the xfers I referred to. It was sudden, random speed changes, and what looked like jump cuts. This went away when I put the TBC into the chain, so it must have been some flaw in the video sync signal. Curiously enough, some standalone players (mostly older models) were far more sensitive to this, until I corrected it during the recording. Later players -- and of course the 520 recorder itself -- ignored the defect, much of the time.

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Originally Posted by Seeker47

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Originally Posted by FulciLives

The Pioneer 520 and other older models had trouble with videos that had dropouts like VHS videotape. Pioneer fixed that with the 531/533/633 models. The 640 also did not have that problem. I can't imagine any of the newer Pioneer models having the problem.

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O.K., but dropouts were not the problem, in the xfers I referred to. It was sudden, random speed changes, and what looked like jump cuts. This went away when I put the TBC into the chain, so it must have been some flaw in the video sync signal. Curiously enough, some standalone players (mostly older models) were far more sensitive to this, until I corrected it during the recording. Later players -- and of course the 520 recorder itself -- ignored the defect, much of the time.

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Probably the same issue i.e., related to the built-in TBC which Pioneer seemed to have "beefed up" or "perfected" as of the 531/533/633 model production year.

To give you an idea of how the TBC in the 531 works ... I have a Hauppauge PCI card and it cannot record from VHS when connected directly to the VCR but if I run the VCR through my Pio 531 first then out of the 531 to the Hauppauge the Hauppauge can record without any TBC issues. So apparently the TBC in the 531 works in pass-through mode because without all I get is a very "jittery" recording.

The nice thing about a Full Frame TBC like the DataVideo units is that they filter out analog video protection methods like Macrovision etc.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman